Apple Maps is excellent, in certain countries and downright crap in others. It's great that Apple Maps works for you, but for a large percentage of Apple's customers world wide (who likely pay more than you do for their phones) the experience is sub par.
I never thought of that, but you are perfectly correct. It is particularly annoying to see just how inferior the experience of the customers who on average pay most is. Siri sucks out of the USA, particularly because of its deep integration to Apple software that is not that good outside of the USA ("Siri, ai-je besoin d'un manteau à Zandvoort ce soir?", "Siri, trouve moi un itinéraire de Amsterdam Central à Rokinstraat 77"), because some software just does NOT work at all, probably because of USA-only agreements (that the rest of the world still pays for... the logic of 'the product is more expensive because of added cost' doesn't apply to 'the product is less expensive because of reduced costs'). Not to mention the ridiculousness of SiRi not being able to pronounce street names in the local language when responding to a query, making route directions, even if it does find them, entirely useless.
Case in point, iTunes Radio never hit outside of the USA.
Also, Siri takes ages to start up, it regularly eats up the first few words of my requests, which invariably results in... searching for (random misunderstood query) on the Internet.
Siri is a fun gimmick, it's great for a few very simple tasks, but for a personal assistant? Google Now (or whatever it is called?) does a much better job on my colleagues non-Apple phones. I hope Apple Watch comes with improved Siri...
Apple Maps is excellent, in certain countries and downright crap in others. It's great that Apple Maps works for you, but for a large percentage of Apple's customers world wide (who likely pay more than you do for their phones) the experience is sub par.
Apple Maps in UK is absolute rubbish. Chooses crazy routes, it may suck you into thinking it has worked out a good route - then you find it has taken you to completely the wrong place and you're lost! Thanks Apple. If you discover it's taking you the wrong way, you take it back in the direction you know it should be going in - then all you get is re-calculating, re-calculating, re-calculating, re-calculating.........It doesn't even recognise my address correctly, keeps taking me back home to wrong address! Never use it anymore, it's embarrassing.
Haven't yet seen a post from someone who's actually used Here maps on iOS. I use both maps and Drive regularly and they're top quality products. The rendering is uncluttered and the download/use offline facility works well and saves a bundle of data charges when roaming. Though obviously you lose the realtime traffic info.
I've no idea what the company is worth but given Apple's problems with maps in the past I can see how Here embedded into iOS would make sense. Poke in the eye for Android too.
Unlike Apple or Google Maps, Nokia Here allows the user to download an entire countries map data for free. Not only that but it has a fantastic navigational system, that includes local transportation and best routes for walking. It's also free to use so don't take my word for it, try it yourself, you won't be dissapointed.
I couldn't work out just WHY would mapping application be so expensive.
It would properly take Apple 320 Million and a few more years to get there.
Why spend 3.2 Billion now?
And I dont think HERE does great in China Mapping either.
You don't understand the complexity and effort it takes to build an up-to-date global digital map. It would take $5B, 5,000+ people and 5+ years to build a full stack map. Apple has been doing this for 5 years already. HERE is the only full stack *independent* navigation-grade mapping asset out there. While it is a expensive operational cost center, it is a must have strategic asset for IOT, Connected Car and mobile ecosystems.
Or Apple can continue to build their 'franken map' and use TomTom data - we know where that got them. And Apple outside the USA, is even worse. no automotive grade (if apple builds a car for example - they need this), no public transport (yet), quality and reliable data (pois are good though).
The scenario becomes worse if the asset is taken off the table to a competitor, never to be had again.
Regarding China or a Japan/Korea, no commercial global mapping company does the regions well due to government regulations and this is where Open Street Maps does far better.
Apple should buy Nokia Here maps and I think they probably will.
Apple already hired the head guy of Here Maps for Apple Maps.
Here maps data can help Apple Maps compete better. Here Maps is used in many built-in car navigation systems so it is trusted by car makers and can help CarPlay be trusted more.
I am living in Europe now (Spain) and have found Apple Maps to be much better than Google Maps...I have both on my iphone and always choose Apple Maps.
It could provide a good foundation for places where Apple don't have complex maps, but since Here maps are just as spotty as Apple's original sources, detractors would paint this as mapgate 2.0
The question is simple: Use Here to provide a basic level of Apple Maps in places which Apple is yet to roll out. Or wait for Apple to roll out their higher quality maps in those regions.
As a reminder the reason why original Apple Map's roll out was so spotty was because the maps they sourced: TomTom, et. al. were not up to par.
Heck here in Australia, our own government gazette had the wrong location for Mildura, leading to a fiasco blaming Apple.
You have no idea how bad apple maps on this side of Atlantic (especially in Eastern Europe and former-USSR, which account for ~300mln ppl). If I were in any position to vote in this matter - I would strongly advice to buyout HERE
You can see bellow some examples of different quality of Apple maps. Satelite one is from German/Czech border. Basic maps are from Apple maps and loacal App Mapy.cz. The difference is several levels.
On other hand local maps has not so sophisticated navigation. No turn by turn etc.
Maps problem is by my opinion only about how much is Apple willing to pay for them.
I couldn't work out just WHY would mapping application be so expensive.
It would properly take Apple 320 Million and a few more years to get there.
Why spend 3.2 Billion now?
And I dont think HERE does great in China Mapping either.
There's only two big suppliers of mapping data in the world and Nokia owns one of them through its acquisition of NAVTEQ. The application side of HERE is a very minor part of HERE's value.
My street name has been misspelled since a Day 1. It's in a well-known northern New England town.
I've complained/written to Apple in over a dozen times. I finally gave up a few months ago. (I checked again just before posting this, to make sure that it did not magically change. Sure enough, it had not).
I never thought of that, but you are perfectly correct. It is particularly annoying to see just how inferior the experience of the customers who on average pay most is. Siri sucks out of the USA, particularly because of its deep integration to Apple software that is not that good outside of the USA ("Siri, ai-je besoin d'un manteau à Zandvoort ce soir?", "Siri, trouve moi un itinéraire de Amsterdam Central à Rokinstraat 77"), because some software just does NOT work at all, probably because of USA-only agreements (that the rest of the world still pays for... the logic of 'the product is more expensive because of added cost' doesn't apply to 'the product is less expensive because of reduced costs'). Not to mention the ridiculousness of SiRi not being able to pronounce street names in the local language when responding to a query, making route directions, even if it does find them, entirely useless.
Case in point, iTunes Radio never hit outside of the USA.
Also, Siri takes ages to start up, it regularly eats up the first few words of my requests, which invariably results in... searching for (random misunderstood query) on the Internet.
Siri is a fun gimmick, it's great for a few very simple tasks, but for a personal assistant? Google Now (or whatever it is called?) does a much better job on my colleagues non-Apple phones. I hope Apple Watch comes with improved Siri...
Wrong, iTunes Radio is available in Australia. Don't blame Apple for your country's stupid laws. Siri does not take ages to startup either. Google Now, now that's garbage, which is also designed to ignore anti-Google items.
I couldn't work out just WHY would mapping application be so expensive.
It would properly take Apple 320 Million and a few more years to get there.
Why spend 3.2 Billion now?
And I dont think HERE does great in China Mapping either.
There's only two big suppliers of mapping data in the world and Nokia owns one of them through its acquisition of NAVTEQ. The application side of HERE is a very minor part of HERE's value.
And location services are a major part of where Apple wants to go!
Mama Cass said it best ...
Words of love, so soft and tender
Won't win a girl's heart anymore
If you love her then you must send her
Somewhere where she's never been before
Worn out phrases and longing gazes
Won't get you where you want to go, no
Wrong, iTunes Radio is available in Australia. Don't blame Apple for your country's stupid laws. Siri does not take ages to startup either. Google Now, now that's garbage, which is also designed to ignore anti-Google items.
1- You have a point that iTune Radio is available in Australia.
2a- However, Apple still doesn't care enough to fix it in other major markets. If they really wanted to, they would have fixed it. They are big and rich enough. Not fixed? Lack of interest. That simple.
2b- Country laws are designed for good reasons (which may or may not be related to industry lobbying or pressure). They're very rarely stupid. Whether or not they're good for the general public is quite another question, and a very difficult one to answer. It might be that record companies, for example, have a vested interest in preventing Apple from pushing iTunes Radio to countries which currently lack it. How should I know? (Answer: I don't know, all I see is that Apple did not push hard enough for me to get iTunes Radio on my iPhone).
3- Not sure if Now is designed to avoid anti-Google items. I only run Apple hardware (stil waiting for my Watch )
4- Siri takes ages to start on my iPhone 6+, as I have described earlier. It's a fact. Denying it is pointless... I wish it was different, but Siri is currently useless to me. If you are happily using it everyday, good for you. For now, and until an update that fixes all these little issues, Google Now on my colleagues' phones does a much better job than Siri on mine.
Do I use google maps the answer is no need because Apple's is just as good.
That's a stretch. Apple Maps is good now, but has many ways it could be better. Google Maps too, but its data is more consistent and it offers functions like transit information and discovery option which I find compulsory. Also, I'd love if Apple added the possibility to always see favorite places on the Maps like on Gmaps : that way when I'm someplace, a quick look will suffice to see if there's a place I've saved closeby.
That's a stretch. Apple Maps is good now, but has many ways it could be better. Google Maps too, but its data is more consistent and it offers functions like transit information and discovery option which I find compulsory. Also, I'd love if Apple added the possibility to always see favorite places on the Maps like on Gmaps : that way when I'm someplace, a quick look will suffice to see if there's a place I've saved closeby.
Another fabulous feature that Apple Maps doesn't have: remember the map. When I went to Turkey last month, it was invaluable to have saved the whole region to the Google Maps app while walking between mountains.
If they don't buy it, "not invented here" is still alive and kicking at Cupertino....however, if they do buy it, then that could be a sign TC has made long lasting changes to the Apple culture.
Comments
Does HERE do public transit?
Apple Maps is used all the time and it is good.
Do I use google maps the answer is no need because Apple's is just as good.
Well, our experiences differ wildly.
Apple Maps is excellent, in certain countries and downright crap in others. It's great that Apple Maps works for you, but for a large percentage of Apple's customers world wide (who likely pay more than you do for their phones) the experience is sub par.
I never thought of that, but you are perfectly correct. It is particularly annoying to see just how inferior the experience of the customers who on average pay most is. Siri sucks out of the USA, particularly because of its deep integration to Apple software that is not that good outside of the USA ("Siri, ai-je besoin d'un manteau à Zandvoort ce soir?", "Siri, trouve moi un itinéraire de Amsterdam Central à Rokinstraat 77"), because some software just does NOT work at all, probably because of USA-only agreements (that the rest of the world still pays for... the logic of 'the product is more expensive because of added cost' doesn't apply to 'the product is less expensive because of reduced costs'). Not to mention the ridiculousness of SiRi not being able to pronounce street names in the local language when responding to a query, making route directions, even if it does find them, entirely useless.
Case in point, iTunes Radio never hit outside of the USA.
Also, Siri takes ages to start up, it regularly eats up the first few words of my requests, which invariably results in... searching for (random misunderstood query) on the Internet.
Siri is a fun gimmick, it's great for a few very simple tasks, but for a personal assistant? Google Now (or whatever it is called?) does a much better job on my colleagues non-Apple phones. I hope Apple Watch comes with improved Siri...
Apple Maps is excellent, in certain countries and downright crap in others. It's great that Apple Maps works for you, but for a large percentage of Apple's customers world wide (who likely pay more than you do for their phones) the experience is sub par.
Apple Maps in UK is absolute rubbish. Chooses crazy routes, it may suck you into thinking it has worked out a good route - then you find it has taken you to completely the wrong place and you're lost! Thanks Apple. If you discover it's taking you the wrong way, you take it back in the direction you know it should be going in - then all you get is re-calculating, re-calculating, re-calculating, re-calculating.........It doesn't even recognise my address correctly, keeps taking me back home to wrong address! Never use it anymore, it's embarrassing.
Haven't yet seen a post from someone who's actually used Here maps on iOS. I use both maps and Drive regularly and they're top quality products. The rendering is uncluttered and the download/use offline facility works well and saves a bundle of data charges when roaming. Though obviously you lose the realtime traffic info.
I've no idea what the company is worth but given Apple's problems with maps in the past I can see how Here embedded into iOS would make sense. Poke in the eye for Android too.
Unlike Apple or Google Maps, Nokia Here allows the user to download an entire countries map data for free. Not only that but it has a fantastic navigational system, that includes local transportation and best routes for walking. It's also free to use so don't take my word for it, try it yourself, you won't be dissapointed.
I couldn't work out just WHY would mapping application be so expensive.
It would properly take Apple 320 Million and a few more years to get there.
Why spend 3.2 Billion now?
And I dont think HERE does great in China Mapping either.
You don't understand the complexity and effort it takes to build an up-to-date global digital map. It would take $5B, 5,000+ people and 5+ years to build a full stack map. Apple has been doing this for 5 years already. HERE is the only full stack *independent* navigation-grade mapping asset out there. While it is a expensive operational cost center, it is a must have strategic asset for IOT, Connected Car and mobile ecosystems.
Or Apple can continue to build their 'franken map' and use TomTom data - we know where that got them. And Apple outside the USA, is even worse. no automotive grade (if apple builds a car for example - they need this), no public transport (yet), quality and reliable data (pois are good though).
The scenario becomes worse if the asset is taken off the table to a competitor, never to be had again.
Regarding China or a Japan/Korea, no commercial global mapping company does the regions well due to government regulations and this is where Open Street Maps does far better.
Apple should buy Nokia Here maps and I think they probably will.
Apple already hired the head guy of Here Maps for Apple Maps.
Here maps data can help Apple Maps compete better. Here Maps is used in many built-in car navigation systems so it is trusted by car makers and can help CarPlay be trusted more.
Apple should buy them once and for all.
The question is simple: Use Here to provide a basic level of Apple Maps in places which Apple is yet to roll out. Or wait for Apple to roll out their higher quality maps in those regions.
As a reminder the reason why original Apple Map's roll out was so spotty was because the maps they sourced: TomTom, et. al. were not up to par.
Heck here in Australia, our own government gazette had the wrong location for Mildura, leading to a fiasco blaming Apple.
You have no idea how bad apple maps on this side of Atlantic (especially in Eastern Europe and former-USSR, which account for ~300mln ppl). If I were in any position to vote in this matter - I would strongly advice to buyout HERE
You can see bellow some examples of different quality of Apple maps. Satelite one is from German/Czech border. Basic maps are from Apple maps and loacal App Mapy.cz. The difference is several levels.
On other hand local maps has not so sophisticated navigation. No turn by turn etc.
Maps problem is by my opinion only about how much is Apple willing to pay for them.
I couldn't work out just WHY would mapping application be so expensive.
It would properly take Apple 320 Million and a few more years to get there.
Why spend 3.2 Billion now?
And I dont think HERE does great in China Mapping either.
There's only two big suppliers of mapping data in the world and Nokia owns one of them through its acquisition of NAVTEQ. The application side of HERE is a very minor part of HERE's value.
I've complained/written to Apple in over a dozen times. I finally gave up a few months ago. (I checked again just before posting this, to make sure that it did not magically change. Sure enough, it had not).
Apple Maps has a ways to go. Period.
Wrong, iTunes Radio is available in Australia. Don't blame Apple for your country's stupid laws. Siri does not take ages to startup either. Google Now, now that's garbage, which is also designed to ignore anti-Google items.
And location services are a major part of where Apple wants to go!
Mama Cass said it best ...
Words of love, so soft and tender
Won't win a girl's heart anymore
If you love her then you must send her
Somewhere where she's never been before
Worn out phrases and longing gazes
Won't get you where you want to go, no
Words of love, soft and tender
Won't win her ...
Wrong, iTunes Radio is available in Australia. Don't blame Apple for your country's stupid laws. Siri does not take ages to startup either. Google Now, now that's garbage, which is also designed to ignore anti-Google items.
1- You have a point that iTune Radio is available in Australia.
2a- However, Apple still doesn't care enough to fix it in other major markets. If they really wanted to, they would have fixed it. They are big and rich enough. Not fixed? Lack of interest. That simple.
2b- Country laws are designed for good reasons (which may or may not be related to industry lobbying or pressure). They're very rarely stupid. Whether or not they're good for the general public is quite another question, and a very difficult one to answer. It might be that record companies, for example, have a vested interest in preventing Apple from pushing iTunes Radio to countries which currently lack it. How should I know? (Answer: I don't know, all I see is that Apple did not push hard enough for me to get iTunes Radio on my iPhone).
3- Not sure if Now is designed to avoid anti-Google items. I only run Apple hardware (stil waiting for my Watch
)
4- Siri takes ages to start on my iPhone 6+, as I have described earlier. It's a fact. Denying it is pointless... I wish it was different, but Siri is currently useless to me. If you are happily using it everyday, good for you. For now, and until an update that fixes all these little issues, Google Now on my colleagues' phones does a much better job than Siri on mine.
Apple Maps is used all the time and it is good.
Do I use google maps the answer is no need because Apple's is just as good.
That's a stretch. Apple Maps is good now, but has many ways it could be better. Google Maps too, but its data is more consistent and it offers functions like transit information and discovery option which I find compulsory. Also, I'd love if Apple added the possibility to always see favorite places on the Maps like on Gmaps : that way when I'm someplace, a quick look will suffice to see if there's a place I've saved closeby.
That's a stretch. Apple Maps is good now, but has many ways it could be better. Google Maps too, but its data is more consistent and it offers functions like transit information and discovery option which I find compulsory. Also, I'd love if Apple added the possibility to always see favorite places on the Maps like on Gmaps : that way when I'm someplace, a quick look will suffice to see if there's a place I've saved closeby.
Another fabulous feature that Apple Maps doesn't have: remember the map. When I went to Turkey last month, it was invaluable to have saved the whole region to the Google Maps app while walking between mountains.
If they don't buy it, "not invented here" is still alive and kicking at Cupertino....however, if they do buy it, then that could be a sign TC has made long lasting changes to the Apple culture.