<strong>...groverat, do you ever say anything intelligent?
Have you used 10.2? There are so many new features and upgrades I couldn't even begin to list them all. Its a much much much bigger jump than from 10.0 to 10.1.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You must have bad reading comprehension, because if you read my post again it sounds an awful lot like I'm saying Jaguar is a big release.
Meaning: If this is 10.2 and not 10.5 then this release really is playing catch-up to what OSX should be and Apple has been overcharging for not-ready-for-primetime operating systems.
It's the same old, same old. I bet anybody who doesn't plan to pay for Jaguar hasn't paid for any of the past OS updates other than with computer purchases.
In the Apple world, 1 year = 1 full retail priced update. This is why I joined the student ADC while I was a student. It's clockwork.
TechTV idiots. Geez go ahead and suggest that Jaguar will be pirated. I'll be sure to thank them when OSX has a scheme like MS Product Activaton.
People use your brains. One size does not fit all here. If you don't have the Hardware to run jaguar to full advantage then wait. If you plan to take advantage of these features then kick out the cash. Honestly I can't complain the typical American probably spend more at MacDonalds per year than this .mac service.
As for releases. It's obvious that Apple doesn't want to rip through the 10's and face the inevitable do we call it XI or what? TechTV was VERY irresponsible. No wonder I find their site rather dull and boring.
While I agree that the money is kind of steep, the TechTV gurus obviously have little to no knowledge of *nixes or NeXT or they wouldn't makes snide comments about it being a point release.
I don't think TechTV is being unfair. Apple has certainly angered a large portion of its user base with the recent announcements regarding .Mac and OS X upgrade pricing. I'm not angry (except about the dropping of iTools), I just won't be buying this stuff anytime soon as there is other software I'd rather buy and I have another free pop mail account which is now my main emial account. But for those who have recently purchased new Macs or new copies of 10.1, to be told that they have to pay full price to bring their OS up to date, and that their included-at-no-extra-charge iTools is now cancelled and replaced with .Mac for which they have to shell out another 100 bucks ... you can understand why they would be angry. The cancellation of iTools service may even be illegal as this was a part of the original computer purchase, and the implication was that these included products were not temporary.
i have a feeling apple may "force" users to update. for example, maybe itunes 3.1 may require OS X 10.2, thus making you upgrade if you want the software.
this will surely be done with ical, isync, maybe even the new ipod software, some features of .mac, and if you want to use bluetooth
i don't mind TOO much cause i think this is a freikn' awesome upgrade; i just there wasn't such a steep price
however, those who don't want to upgrade may be "forced" to upgrade in due time. it's a matter of WHEN, not IF, you upgrade.
<strong>Besides which if you don't like .Mac for $100 a year then don't join (or sign up before September 30). If all you want is a free email they will still be offering that.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I haven't found ANYTHING on Apple's site stating email will still be free (beyond the "60 day trial"
pardon my ignorance, i didn't tune into the keynote until after jaguar was discussed. is it at all possible that $129 is retail price for the 80% that haven't switched to os x yet and that there will be an upgrade (at a lesser price) for those who have? since the release date is a ways off yet and this was supposed to be a demonstration of the features not a marketing discussion, a point like this could have been omitted.
We'd only be "forced" to upgrade if our current OS becomes unuseable. Why do I need iTunes 3.1 when iTunes 2 is working so well? Why do I need Sherlock 3 when I have Sherlock 2 and Watson? Why do I need iChat when I have Fire? I don't own any Bluetooth devices and if I pay for 10.2 and .Mac, it will be that much longer before I do own any Bluetooth devices. Now, if say, iTunes 2 or any of my other apps suddenly stopped working with 10.1.5, then I'd call that "forced", but it'd be a class action lawsuit that would be "forced".
<strong>Apples mistake is not calling this OS X 10.5.
No one would have bitched then.
Well, then again, maybe not. </strong><hr></blockquote>
No, then we would be at XI just a little too soon. Forget that it simply adds a .2 and concentrate on everything the is new and improved. This is much more significant than the improvements made in .1 after all. Sadly these TechTV guys have about as much common sense as Dvorack.
I haven't found ANYTHING on Apple's site stating email will still be free (beyond the "60 day trial"
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I haven't seen anything about it either. SpyMac claimed it would be but Apple sure hasn't said a word to that effect. Maybe this is why Apple was so busy trying to force people not to cover the keynote.
Maybe there is some hope for common sense to break out. I hope there is a way to keep your email address for free. I'll probably pay for the first year just to keep my site and email address in the same place but after that I'll probably move off of it if I can find a viable alternative. It's really aggravating since Verizon is pulling out of here so I have been giving out my mac.com email address so that when I moved to a new ISP there'd be no issues with people losing track of me. Now it appears its all for naught.
After taking a few deep breaths and spending some time away from the keyboard, I think I'd pay $3-5 a month for what Apple offers. As far as Jag goes I am fortunate in that I am a student and can buy it for $69. I just think if Apple was thinking ahead to getting these technologies adopted it'd do an AOL and send Jaguar CD sets to every registered OS X user. But Apple needs to make their money and keep their margins at 27% today more than ensuring the long term viability of the platform I guess. <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" />
Apple wants to keep people saying OSX for as long as possible. Like it or not, psychologically and popularly this is OS 'X' not OS 'ten.' 'X' is cool, it sounds like sex, but can be anything, it sounds sophisticated, scientific (variable), unknown and mysterious... Anything with an 'X' in it is better than the same thing without the 'X'. Don't believe me? Ask someone in marketing.
On that note, I would go one further than the .5 suggested by others here and say that as far as OS'X' is concerned the numbering scheme has shifted over a full decimal space to the left.
OSX (10) = version 0, beta
OSX.1 = version 1
OSX.1.2 = version 1.x
OSX.2 = version 2
I fully expect that in a couple of years OS'ten' will just be OS'X' and the .x will be verions of it. It may take as long to go from 10 to 11 as it did to go from 1 to 9. Just a thought.
TechTV is promoting pirating software? Geez, what bad influences. I mean do they not know how much some programmers work to make things work faster? Or how much it costs to pay programmers to make things like Jaguar work?
By buying software you support their cause and allow them to go on. By pirating software you benefit but the company loses and has to raise prices on other things. It's sad that a show that is watched by a lot of people is telling people that they will not buy it because it is expensive. Sure it is, but that's the price. Pay it or don't use it.
true they couldn't "force" you to upgrade, but i'd rather get the new software. i'm sure there are people out there who are still running OS 8.x, but eventually, many people do come around.
we'll see. it's a personal choice and i choose to upgrade now and appearently you (Scooterboy) will choose not to
<strong>I bet anybody who doesn't plan to pay for Jaguar hasn't paid for any of the past OS updates other than with computer purchases.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You are exactly right with this. To me, as someone who doesn't even own a mac capable of running Jaguar, it seems like a huge update.
<strong>TechTV is promoting pirating software? Geez, what bad influences. I mean do they not know how much some programmers work to make things work faster? Or how much it costs to pay programmers to make things like Jaguar work?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Are they? Didn't they just say that they thought people we're gunna pirate it? Is that actually promoting it?
Comments
<strong>...groverat, do you ever say anything intelligent?
Have you used 10.2? There are so many new features and upgrades I couldn't even begin to list them all. Its a much much much bigger jump than from 10.0 to 10.1.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You must have bad reading comprehension, because if you read my post again it sounds an awful lot like I'm saying Jaguar is a big release.
Meaning: If this is 10.2 and not 10.5 then this release really is playing catch-up to what OSX should be and Apple has been overcharging for not-ready-for-primetime operating systems.
No one would have bitched then.
Well, then again, maybe not.
<strong>Apples mistake is not calling this OS X 10.5.
No one would have bitched then.
Well, then again, maybe not.
People still would've bitched, just not as much
1997 - Mac OS 8 - $99
1998 - Mac OS 8.1 - free
1998 - Mac OS 8.5 - $99
1999 - Mac OS 8.6 - free
1999 - Mac OS 9.0 - $99
2000 - Mac OS X Public Beta - $29
2000 - Mac OS 9.1 - free
2001 - Mac OS X 10.0 - $129
2001 - Mac OS 9.2 - free
2001 - Mac OS X 10.1 - free
2002 - Mac OS X 10.2 Jaguar - $129
It's the same old, same old. I bet anybody who doesn't plan to pay for Jaguar hasn't paid for any of the past OS updates other than with computer purchases.
In the Apple world, 1 year = 1 full retail priced update. This is why I joined the student ADC while I was a student. It's clockwork.
People use your brains. One size does not fit all here. If you don't have the Hardware to run jaguar to full advantage then wait. If you plan to take advantage of these features then kick out the cash. Honestly I can't complain the typical American probably spend more at MacDonalds per year than this .mac service.
As for releases. It's obvious that Apple doesn't want to rip through the 10's and face the inevitable do we call it XI or what? TechTV was VERY irresponsible. No wonder I find their site rather dull and boring.
this will surely be done with ical, isync, maybe even the new ipod software, some features of .mac, and if you want to use bluetooth
i don't mind TOO much cause i think this is a freikn' awesome upgrade; i just there wasn't such a steep price
however, those who don't want to upgrade may be "forced" to upgrade in due time. it's a matter of WHEN, not IF, you upgrade.
<strong>Besides which if you don't like .Mac for $100 a year then don't join (or sign up before September 30). If all you want is a free email they will still be offering that.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I haven't found ANYTHING on Apple's site stating email will still be free (beyond the "60 day trial"
Welcome to Apple$oft
<strong>Apples mistake is not calling this OS X 10.5.
No one would have bitched then.
Well, then again, maybe not.
No, then we would be at XI just a little too soon. Forget that it simply adds a .2 and concentrate on everything the is new and improved. This is much more significant than the improvements made in .1 after all. Sadly these TechTV guys have about as much common sense as Dvorack.
<strong>
I haven't found ANYTHING on Apple's site stating email will still be free (beyond the "60 day trial"
</strong><hr></blockquote>
I haven't seen anything about it either. SpyMac claimed it would be but Apple sure hasn't said a word to that effect. Maybe this is why Apple was so busy trying to force people not to cover the keynote.
Edit follows:
Found this on another thread here:
<a href="http://help.apple.com/mac/17/help/mail/pgs/mac43.htm"; target="_blank">Apple instructions for an email only account</a>
Maybe there is some hope for common sense to break out. I hope there is a way to keep your email address for free. I'll probably pay for the first year just to keep my site and email address in the same place but after that I'll probably move off of it if I can find a viable alternative. It's really aggravating since Verizon is pulling out of here so I have been giving out my mac.com email address so that when I moved to a new ISP there'd be no issues with people losing track of me. Now it appears its all for naught.
After taking a few deep breaths and spending some time away from the keyboard, I think I'd pay $3-5 a month for what Apple offers. As far as Jag goes I am fortunate in that I am a student and can buy it for $69. I just think if Apple was thinking ahead to getting these technologies adopted it'd do an AOL and send Jaguar CD sets to every registered OS X user. But Apple needs to make their money and keep their margins at 27% today more than ensuring the long term viability of the platform I guess. <img src="graemlins/hmmm.gif" border="0" alt="[Hmmm]" />
Edited for new info and additional reflection.
[ 07-17-2002: Message edited by: BobtheTomato ]</p>
On that note, I would go one further than the .5 suggested by others here and say that as far as OS'X' is concerned the numbering scheme has shifted over a full decimal space to the left.
OSX (10) = version 0, beta
OSX.1 = version 1
OSX.1.2 = version 1.x
OSX.2 = version 2
I fully expect that in a couple of years OS'ten' will just be OS'X' and the .x will be verions of it. It may take as long to go from 10 to 11 as it did to go from 1 to 9. Just a thought.
By buying software you support their cause and allow them to go on. By pirating software you benefit but the company loses and has to raise prices on other things. It's sad that a show that is watched by a lot of people is telling people that they will not buy it because it is expensive. Sure it is, but that's the price. Pay it or don't use it.
we'll see. it's a personal choice and i choose to upgrade now and appearently you (Scooterboy) will choose not to
<strong>I bet anybody who doesn't plan to pay for Jaguar hasn't paid for any of the past OS updates other than with computer purchases.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You are exactly right with this. To me, as someone who doesn't even own a mac capable of running Jaguar, it seems like a huge update.
<strong>You guys need to have a contact in education. My mom is a school board member, so I can get 10.2 for $69!!!</strong><hr></blockquote>
It's great isn't it? I placed my $69 order for Jaguar earlier tonight. My dad's a teacher/college professor.
<strong>TechTV is promoting pirating software? Geez, what bad influences. I mean do they not know how much some programmers work to make things work faster? Or how much it costs to pay programmers to make things like Jaguar work?
</strong><hr></blockquote>
Are they? Didn't they just say that they thought people we're gunna pirate it? Is that actually promoting it?