@theothergeoff Quote: I need a phone - and if I need a laptop, then why buy an iPad?
That's fair enough, Geoff. In that case, no need for an iPad. And Apple probably don't care one bit - as long as you buy Apple.
But, given the choice of an iPhone 6/6+, an iPad or a MacBook to surf the net and do email - I'll reach for the iPad every time. That's just me, though.
Tablet for $99 is still a tablet as long as it competes with iPad, that it is if an average Joe buys one and not the other.
Name a $99 tablet that really competes with iPad. There're many of them competing with each others in JunkDroid field, not with iPad. When you say "compete", that device must at least perform close to level of iPad. Don't bring a Geo Metro to compete with BMW car, any.
Name a $99 tablet that really competes with iPad. There're many of them competing with each others in JunkDroid field, not with iPad. When you say "compete", that device must at least perform close to level of iPad. Don't bring a Geo Metro to compete with BMW car, any.
As I said, car market is a different thing... Joe could easily afford $499 iPad if there was NO $100 tablet available around. And not every one would go and buy real tablet after experiencing frustration with the cheap and crappy one. I knew people who were buying $100 Nokia touch-screen phones after 2007 that had a resistive screen which you would have to click several times to get something reacting. They were telling me iPhone is crap because touch screens are crap.
Just one more useless data point, but I love my iPad and it works in ways that my 6 (or a 6+) never could. It also works in many ways a 12" tablet never could-- it fits into my generic portfolio along with a notepad and other materials. It also does things a laptop doesn't work well for.
Today I was at multiple job sites. My iPad was my camera, 30x42" drawing viewer, VPN gateway, file server gateway, note editor, and a few other things. The form factor is perfect for my needs.
That said, I do have an iPhone 6, MacBook Air, iMac, AirPort Extreme, apple watch, Mac mini, and a few other toys, so I am well locked into the ecosystem.
My iPad is on a 3+ year replacement cycle though, barring breakage. It was $1,000... it isn't just something I throw away when it isn't shiny anymore, although touchID would be nice. My annualized spend on Apple products is around $3,000.
In my mind, Apple really needs to work on the productivity front. Why they haven't advertised the hell out of GoodReader is beyond me: a full library of hospital blueprints at my fingertips, with full annotation capability! I blame the App Store for why people still don't understand the iPad, and why they have lost ground to the Surface in the enterprise.
So make the thing more useful! For crying out loud, Apple. I love you guys, but as an iPad 3 owner since 2012, I find that SIRI (at least here in Japan, anyway) is utterly brain dead, and even the liberation that you plan to give us in iOS 9 won't hold a candle to what we can do on the Mac.
Give iPads a minimum of 4GB of RAM so apps don't reload all the time (man I hate when 1Password does that), and ease up on app restrictions such that I can actually use my iPad to get real work done, rather than make me feel it's a throw-back to Multi-Finder.
If you give consumers something really useful (that's also aesthetically pleasing and of high quality %u2014 points Apple has already nailed), they'll buy it (if they have the money). But why should I upgrade to an iPad AIR 2 right now when iOS really isn't going to give me a quantum leap in usability? I see no compelling reason, and the same applies to a lot of other tablet owners too, hence the decline.
Again, I love my iPad as a CONSUMPTION device, but overall...
Usability Matters.
I'm not suggesting iPads should run OS X or go that far, but iOS needs some major rethinking when it comes to the iPad.
Tell you what, large screen phones can play the role of tablets, but can never replace tablets. This is when user experience becomes important because the damn 9.7" Air can blow the shit iPhone 6+ out of water anytime for many tasks at home: reading, browsing, video, doc editing, writing and tons more things.
When I need quick information one something at home, I use my 6+ in my pocket, but if I need to browse it for a little while, my Air or Min 2 will be used.
On the flip side, a 12" rMB can blow the shit out of the 9.7" iPad Air for the same tasks that you just mentioned. I think for most consumers, a phablet, an ultrabook / thin & light notebook, and now quite possibly an Apple Watch would suffice for their computing, or more specifically, their mobile computing needs.
So those people you know don't have smartphones now? Are they using flip phones?
Switched to Lumia for the same $100 but now with capacitive screen.
My point was that one need to really try a quality product before making justified decision to buy it. I believe most of the android/pc users are Apple-blind - they have no idea what they are missing because they never tried it in the first place.
I hope the Surface Pro 3 starts to kick Apple's ass and is a wake up call for Apple to put to rest their "our way or the highway" mentality and, yes, make a desktop league tablet with actual i/o...not this minimalist crapola. while they are at it, they can quit telling the sheeple that they need an iwatch for whatever use the damnthing to begin with. I know what i am saying will make all the armchair analysts and bigshot shareholders here at Appleinsder forums bristle with rage and condescending righteousness.
next will be an apple car...what a fucked up, robot future they have in store for the masses...pay to play
"Get a Surface..." Cruel and unusual punishment, I say. And yes, I own one. that assessment is based on owning one. I would rather carry an iPad and an MBA than one surface
Through iOS 8 there hasn't been a compelling reason to upgrade one's iPad to a newer version, as all the new iPad versions seem pretty much alike to people. iOS 9, with multitasking, finally represents a break-away point in compellingness, with a good reason to upgrade to an iPad with more power, to run more. We shall see what this does to iPad sales by the end of the year, with some additional boost if Apple releases a new iPad incarnation with further external differentiation from past versions.
Give iPads a minimum of 4GB of RAM so apps don't reload all the time (man I hate when 1Password does that), and ease up on app restrictions such that I can actually use my iPad to get real work done, rather than make me feel it's a throw-back to Multi-Finder.
[…]
But why should I upgrade to an iPad AIR 2 right now when iOS really isn't going to give me a quantum leap in usability?
Because with iOS 9, it gives you exactly what you ask for up above.
Because with iOS 9, it gives you exactly what you ask for up above.
In the "above" I asked for 4GB RAM. iOS, being an OS, does not have anything to do with RAM. :-)
And no, RAM aside, iOS 9 isn't the magic cure for the feature gap between OS X and iOS. iOS still feels like MultiFinder to me. It's a step in the right direction, but it probably won't be what I seek until about iOS 15. That's a bit of a wait.
And to the fellow who suggests I need a $1300 "MacBook," maybe next year. It's a bit lackluster now, but maybe SkyLake and another port might make it worthy of a buy. :-)
In the "above" I asked for 4GB RAM. iOS, being an OS, does not have anything to do with RAM. :-)
And no, RAM aside, iOS 9 isn't the magic cure for the feature gap between OS X and iOS. iOS still feels like MultiFinder to me. It's a step in the right direction, but it probably won't be what I seek until about iOS 15. That's a bit of a wait.
And to the fellow who suggests I need a $1300 "MacBook," maybe next year. It's a bit lackluster now, but maybe SkyLake and another port might make it worthy of a buy. :-)
I think it's evident that the evolutionary endpoint of the PC is the tablet (for a while at least).
Who needs a cumbersome extremely expensive MacBook while you can have an A4 iPad for $500 that can do the same (but easier).
Of course the iPad must have 4GB of RAM or more and iOS must be more like a real OS for this to work.
But I do think that this is relatively easy to achieve by porting Mac OS to the ARM.
The point is that this already works perfectly for web apps (safari) without much special support, so it should also work for the complete OS.
(I use a remote desktop app on my iPad3 to be able to use my Mac, and this works perfectly with the exception of two things: the iPad screen is to small and the time lag because of network delays. Both issues are gone with the A4 iPad.)
I think it's evident that the evolutionary endpoint of the PC is the tablet (for a while at least).
Who needs a cumbersome extremely expensive MacBook while you can have an A4 iPad for $500 that can do the same (but easier).
Of course the iPad must have 4GB of RAM or more and iOS must be more like a real OS for this to work.
But I do think that this is relatively easy to achieve by porting Mac OS to the ARM.
The point is that this already works perfectly for web apps (safari) without much special support, so it should also work for the complete OS.
(I use a remote desktop app on my iPad3 to be able to use my Mac, and this works perfectly with the exception of two things: the iPad screen is to small and the time lag because of network delays. Both issues are gone with the A4 iPad.)
Porting Mac OS X to ARM and making it touchscreen-based is EXACTLY what Apple did in 2007. They left out the portions that didn't make sense for a touch-based interface, and they continue to leave out the portions that don't make sense for a touch-based interface.
And if you honestly think that "this already works perfectly for web apps without much special support", then you haven't used a non-touch optimized website in a while. Unless they are designed with touch in mind (or have a completely alternative interface for either), many sites are pretty useless on iOS devices and simply don't work right. (Remember how mouse-over effects and menus were completely standard in the 2000's? Complete redesign right there.)
I cannot operate Logic Pro or Final Cut Pro in their current incarnations via a touchscreen. I cannot operate OS X in its current incarnation via a touchscreen - not fully and organically. Sure, stuff can be kind of arranged to work. No reason to use either a Mac, or iOS, for that.
Not until Generation #2. :-) Skylake plus one more USB-C port (pretty please, Apple?) will trigger my "use credit card now" button.
But even then, it will still be an OS X Mac, not a mobile Tablet device. If iOS devices had 4GB of RAM and if iOS itself was a tad more powerful, even more schools would use them over stupid Chromebooks, and people like myself would find the tablet of more use too. And no, that would not mean I would no longer ditch Macs. In fact, I am still trying to count my pennies and figure out how to afford a Mac Pro. (Yes, the iMac is faster than the Pro in some cases, but the Pro has better cooling, which means less throttling of CPU clock speed on the Pro.)
I think Tablets, Phones and Macs (desktops and notebooks) all have their important place and they will for the foreseeable future.
Comments
Quote: I need a phone - and if I need a laptop, then why buy an iPad?
That's fair enough, Geoff. In that case, no need for an iPad.
And Apple probably don't care one bit - as long as you buy Apple.
But, given the choice of an iPhone 6/6+, an iPad or a MacBook to surf the net and do email - I'll reach for the iPad every time.
That's just me, though.
Tablet for $99 is still a tablet as long as it competes with iPad, that it is if an average Joe buys one and not the other.
Name a $99 tablet that really competes with iPad. There're many of them competing with each others in JunkDroid field, not with iPad. When you say "compete", that device must at least perform close to level of iPad. Don't bring a Geo Metro to compete with BMW car, any.
Name a $99 tablet that really competes with iPad. There're many of them competing with each others in JunkDroid field, not with iPad. When you say "compete", that device must at least perform close to level of iPad. Don't bring a Geo Metro to compete with BMW car, any.
As I said, car market is a different thing... Joe could easily afford $499 iPad if there was NO $100 tablet available around. And not every one would go and buy real tablet after experiencing frustration with the cheap and crappy one. I knew people who were buying $100 Nokia touch-screen phones after 2007 that had a resistive screen which you would have to click several times to get something reacting. They were telling me iPhone is crap because touch screens are crap.
And that is why it is a lost sale for Apple.
Today I was at multiple job sites. My iPad was my camera, 30x42" drawing viewer, VPN gateway, file server gateway, note editor, and a few other things. The form factor is perfect for my needs.
That said, I do have an iPhone 6, MacBook Air, iMac, AirPort Extreme, apple watch, Mac mini, and a few other toys, so I am well locked into the ecosystem.
My iPad is on a 3+ year replacement cycle though, barring breakage. It was $1,000... it isn't just something I throw away when it isn't shiny anymore, although touchID would be nice. My annualized spend on Apple products is around $3,000.
In my mind, Apple really needs to work on the productivity front. Why they haven't advertised the hell out of GoodReader is beyond me: a full library of hospital blueprints at my fingertips, with full annotation capability! I blame the App Store for why people still don't understand the iPad, and why they have lost ground to the Surface in the enterprise.
Pretty much all high end mobile devices are. It's awesome that it's come to this but it's just not the iPad.
Give iPads a minimum of 4GB of RAM so apps don't reload all the time (man I hate when 1Password does that), and ease up on app restrictions such that I can actually use my iPad to get real work done, rather than make me feel it's a throw-back to Multi-Finder.
If you give consumers something really useful (that's also aesthetically pleasing and of high quality %u2014 points Apple has already nailed), they'll buy it (if they have the money). But why should I upgrade to an iPad AIR 2 right now when iOS really isn't going to give me a quantum leap in usability? I see no compelling reason, and the same applies to a lot of other tablet owners too, hence the decline.
Again, I love my iPad as a CONSUMPTION device, but overall...
Usability Matters.
I'm not suggesting iPads should run OS X or go that far, but iOS needs some major rethinking when it comes to the iPad.
Tell you what, large screen phones can play the role of tablets, but can never replace tablets. This is when user experience becomes important because the damn 9.7" Air can blow the shit iPhone 6+ out of water anytime for many tasks at home: reading, browsing, video, doc editing, writing and tons more things.
When I need quick information one something at home, I use my 6+ in my pocket, but if I need to browse it for a little while, my Air or Min 2 will be used.
On the flip side, a 12" rMB can blow the shit out of the 9.7" iPad Air for the same tasks that you just mentioned. I think for most consumers, a phablet, an ultrabook / thin & light notebook, and now quite possibly an Apple Watch would suffice for their computing, or more specifically, their mobile computing needs.
So those people you know don't have smartphones now? Are they using flip phones?
Switched to Lumia
for the same $100 but now with capacitive screen.
My point was that one need to really try a quality product before making justified decision to buy it. I believe most of the android/pc users are Apple-blind - they have no idea what they are missing because they never tried it in the first place.
next will be an apple car...what a fucked up, robot future they have in store for the masses...pay to play
"Get a Surface..." Cruel and unusual punishment, I say. And yes, I own one. that assessment is based on owning one. I would rather carry an iPad and an MBA than one surface
I think there's more than a few posters here that will be inspired by this... or at least find it funny in parts... :smokey:
[VIDEO]
Edited to add: it's even "multi-user friendly"!!! Woot!
Give iPads a minimum of 4GB of RAM so apps don't reload all the time (man I hate when 1Password does that), and ease up on app restrictions such that I can actually use my iPad to get real work done, rather than make me feel it's a throw-back to Multi-Finder.
[…]
Because with iOS 9, it gives you exactly what you ask for up above.
Very well done
Because with iOS 9, it gives you exactly what you ask for up above.
In the "above" I asked for 4GB RAM. iOS, being an OS, does not have anything to do with RAM. :-)
And no, RAM aside, iOS 9 isn't the magic cure for the feature gap between OS X and iOS. iOS still feels like MultiFinder to me. It's a step in the right direction, but it probably won't be what I seek until about iOS 15. That's a bit of a wait.
And to the fellow who suggests I need a $1300 "MacBook," maybe next year. It's a bit lackluster now, but maybe SkyLake and another port might make it worthy of a buy. :-)
I think it's evident that the evolutionary endpoint of the PC is the tablet (for a while at least).
Who needs a cumbersome extremely expensive MacBook while you can have an A4 iPad for $500 that can do the same (but easier).
Of course the iPad must have 4GB of RAM or more and iOS must be more like a real OS for this to work.
But I do think that this is relatively easy to achieve by porting Mac OS to the ARM.
The point is that this already works perfectly for web apps (safari) without much special support, so it should also work for the complete OS.
(I use a remote desktop app on my iPad3 to be able to use my Mac, and this works perfectly with the exception of two things: the iPad screen is to small and the time lag because of network delays. Both issues are gone with the A4 iPad.)
Porting Mac OS X to ARM and making it touchscreen-based is EXACTLY what Apple did in 2007. They left out the portions that didn't make sense for a touch-based interface, and they continue to leave out the portions that don't make sense for a touch-based interface.
And if you honestly think that "this already works perfectly for web apps without much special support", then you haven't used a non-touch optimized website in a while. Unless they are designed with touch in mind (or have a completely alternative interface for either), many sites are pretty useless on iOS devices and simply don't work right. (Remember how mouse-over effects and menus were completely standard in the 2000's? Complete redesign right there.)
I cannot operate Logic Pro or Final Cut Pro in their current incarnations via a touchscreen. I cannot operate OS X in its current incarnation via a touchscreen - not fully and organically. Sure, stuff can be kind of arranged to work. No reason to use either a Mac, or iOS, for that.
Must suck seeing Apple dominate? Right?
You yearn for the late 90's when Microsoft dominated while you watched an episode of Miami Vice.
I tell you your bitter tears of defeat are delicious.
It was X-Files.
I remember how Internet speeds used to pick up here in Australia when it came on in the US.
just get a Macbook
You are hoping for something that already exists
Not until Generation #2. :-) Skylake plus one more USB-C port (pretty please, Apple?) will trigger my "use credit card now" button.
But even then, it will still be an OS X Mac, not a mobile Tablet device. If iOS devices had 4GB of RAM and if iOS itself was a tad more powerful, even more schools would use them over stupid Chromebooks, and people like myself would find the tablet of more use too. And no, that would not mean I would no longer ditch Macs. In fact, I am still trying to count my pennies and figure out how to afford a Mac Pro. (Yes, the iMac is faster than the Pro in some cases, but the Pro has better cooling, which means less throttling of CPU clock speed on the Pro.)
I think Tablets, Phones and Macs (desktops and notebooks) all have their important place and they will for the foreseeable future.
Well if it dispensed beer it might be worth it. Ya there is probably as app for than but you'll never get a cool frosted mug full of beer from it.