What is the APR for Apple's program if not paid off in 24 months? Looks like Motorola's was 28.99%. Also is this exactly the same program? I don't see anywhere on Moto's site where you can trade in your device for a new one after 12 months.
This is becuase in the Apple program the phone trade in is the finance payment in the case of Motorola you get to keep the phone and they hoped that most people will fail to pay on time and get hit with the 28% interest charge. Yes, more people than not do not pay off in time to avoid the finance charges. Personally I never paid any finance charges expect on my house. Therefore, I do not mind using someone else money for a period of time espeically if they will not drop the price any further if I pay up front.
I have not looked into this, but in the Apple program if you do not upgrade after a year and keep the phone for the full two yrs, do you still have to trade in at the end of do get to keep it.
Apple's program, unlike AT&T etc., is the iPhone is UNLOCKED, meaning you can use it with ANY carrier. It's a huge bonus for those who travel internationally. On top of that, AppleCare+ is part of the package... at the normal cost of the plan. To say it's included is a bit misleading, as Apple makes it required to buy on top of the phone payment price. It's just broken up into 24 payments.
Where carriers can be better with this is in the credit department. Carriers are usually more forgiving with less than perfect credit, whereas Apple's is through a finance company who probably demands close to a 700 credit score or better.
Sprint does seem to be the most forgiving, overall. I know several people who got plans and financing without a ton of money upfront.
The above is probably true, and Apple is not the one financing they forcing the debt onto Citi, to your point when my son went to college we did the free financing for student purchases for 18 months on his macbook pro, and I want the credit card in his name, not mine and Barclay would not give him the credit, so I have to co-sign for him. But we know that most apple customers all have money so this is not a program for people who can not manage their finances.
Apple's plan is through a specific finance company/credit card, not just any of your own personal credit cards. There is no service contract, obviously, but the financing is for 24 months. Once you pay it off, you own it... or turn it in in 12 months and start over with the remaining balance wiped clean. I found something that was clearly marked "with approved credit..." somewhere on Apple's site.
AT&T Next also states that it requires credit approval. Both are basically interest free monthly loans. Apple includes AppleCare+ but AT&T allows you to choose their protection programs or a third parties. Basically when you turn it in to either company it needs to function and most of all it can't have a cracked screen. AT&T protection covers lost or stolen phones where Apple Care+ doesn't.
AppleCare+ covers accidental damage where as when you buy from a carrier you don't have that!
But you only get 2 accidents with the plan and for each accident you need to pay $99. This is what it typically costs to replace a broken screen which is the most common accident. Not a good deal!
AT&T Next also states that it requires credit approval. Both are basically interest free monthly loans. Apple includes AppleCare+ but AT&T allows you to choose their protection programs or a third parties. Basically when you turn it in to either company it needs to function and most of all it can't have a cracked screen. AT&T protection covers lost or stolen phones where Apple Care+ doesn't.
I'm curious what Apple/Citi does with less than satisfactory credit. The carrier I worked for would just require a down payment. Still 0% interest.
Of course Samesung followed Apple's model. As much as we've grown tired of Samesung's blatant disregard for the intellectual property of other companies this is really about (rightly) getting carriers out of bogus schemes that made some people think they were actually getting handsets at lower prices, which they weren't. Samesung really had no choice. This was brought on by carriers no longer amortizing handset costs over two year service contracts. At the end of the day product choice should be driven by the product qualities that are most desired by product customers, not by creative or gimmicky financing schemes. Apple's plan is straightforward and gimmick free so any of Apple's competition who follow a similar no frills approach neither benefit or suffer by implementing their own carrier independent program. Breaking the ball and chain of the carriers is a huge win for Apple customers, whether or not it is exclusive.
Take a step back and consider the depths to which Samesung has descended to try to tease customers away from Apple. Schemes like buy-on get-one free, free tablets, the recent test drive program, product copying, feature copying, version number syncing, feature name copying, product launch and announcement style copying, advertising theme copying, etc. Whatever can possibly be copied, they will copy. It is rather sad and pathetic to see them struggle to be something that they can never be but they valiantly keep on copying away while hoping that they will someday be worthy. Perhaps with time and therapy they can someday be themselves and come up with an original and innovative idea of their own. Never quite good enough, but such is the fate of the copy cat.
How exactly is this Apple's lead when Apple is essentially implementing what carriers are already doing. I'm currently on AT&T Next which is very similar to Apple's upgrade program.
You're not following the narrative. Apple now invented installment plans.
AT&T Next also states that it requires credit approval. Both are basically interest free monthly loans. Apple includes AppleCare+ but AT&T allows you to choose their protection programs or a third parties. Basically when you turn it in to either company it needs to function and most of all it can't have a cracked screen. AT&T protection covers lost or stolen phones where Apple Care+ doesn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64
The above is probably true, and Apple is not the one financing they forcing the debt onto Citi, to your point when my son went to college we did the free financing for student purchases for 18 months on his macbook pro, and I want the credit card in his name, not mine and Barclay would not give him the credit, so I have to co-sign for him. But we know that most apple customers all have money so this is not a program for people who can not manage their finances.
It's not always a matter of someone not being responsible with finances. Have you never hard of someone's place of employment going out of business, or someone falling critically ill who can't work, and trying to get disability can take YEARS? When your income suddenly stops, it's beyond one's control. That can severely damage credit, and many creditors only care about one thing - their money. They claim they'll work with you, but when it comes down to it, they still throw all the negatives on your credit report.
You're partially correct, but just because someone has troubled credit, it doesn't mean they're deadbeats.
Because Apple is the first handset maker to offer this without a carrier.
AppleCare+ covers accidental damage where as when you buy from a carrier you don't have that!
Motorola has been doing this before Apple, so no, Apple is not the first. Apple followed Motorola.
Actually I think it's broader than that. Americans have a distorted view of what the real costs of "subsidized" Phones is. Amazingly there are still americans who think it's a free lunch and resist the temptation to do the math. In ALL cases that I have seen and where I have done the Math .. the subsidized phone is substantially more expensive than outright buying ... and there is the added overhead that the providers actually also factor in a profit margin, higher in many cases than credit charges, for the financial service of providing the subsidy ... practically an extra "product" that they want to turn a profit on.
Industry Pundits .. and I*m thinking of Tomi Ahonen and a couple of others, have been saying for years that the subsidized Phone model is doomed because the Providers hate it and rational customers reject it, and the Math doesn't add up. One reason the providers hate it is that it creates the perception that their services are more expensive than they really are ... and that Apple's devices in particular are cheaper than they really are ... so in a sense the providers are fed up with taking the flak for apple.. So if there's any "Desperation" to be seen, its an american phenomenon ... outside the US it's pretty much the rule.
Apple's plan is through a specific finance company/credit card, not just any of your own personal credit cards. There is no service contract, obviously, but the financing is for 24 months. Once you pay it off, you own it... or turn it in in 12 months and start over with the remaining balance wiped clean. I found something that was clearly marked "with approved credit..." somewhere on Apple's site.
I wonder if with each installment statement you will get special offers on Apple products and services, free music, or apps...etc...Apple sweetening the pot while making it possible for you to "be one with the ecosystem.."
I wonder if with each installment statement you will get special offers on Apple products and services, free music, or apps...etc...Apple sweetening the pot while making it possible for you to "be one with the ecosystem.."
"Samsung plans to launch a smartphone leasing program "[B][SIZE=4]in the next several months," [/SIZE][/B]or perhaps sooner."
[COLOR=blue]Or how about "or later..."
I suspect Samsung let this rumor loose to figure out how they can finance their program. Their local Tong banks have onerous terms in case of non-performance. "First the fingers, then the toes; you know how it goes."[/COLOR]
[SIZE=4]Also, financing options may just have to wait in line until other promised upgrades arrive, like 64-bit devices... [/SIZE]
It's not always a matter of someone not being responsible with finances. Have you never hard of someone's place of employment going out of business, or someone falling critically ill who can't work, and trying to get disability can take YEARS? When your income suddenly stops, it's beyond one's control. That can severely damage credit, and many creditors only care about one thing - their money. They claim they'll work with you, but when it comes down to it, they still throw all the negatives on your credit report.
You're partially correct, but just because someone has troubled credit, it doesn't mean they're deadbeats.
First my statement was really against Apple, since as I have said Apple is not interested in everyone buying their products only those who can afford them. To your point. my son did not qualified since he has no credit history. It was the classic example of can not get credit history if no one will give you credit. But today he building it on his own.
Your example is only a small percentage of the people with bad credit, I too been out of a job for 9 months, but I had enough money put away to cover me plus I went out and got any work I could to cover my bills. You would be surprised how many people just sit at home hoping someone will call them becuase the put their resume on a website. I meet lots of them while I was looking. Also my son got jobs paying a lot more than McDonnalds pays and reason why, the companies told him most people did not want to do the job, people are lazy these day. My son co-op job at a trucking company and they start Drivers at $55K per yr and they can not get people to work for them they have 70 open jobs today and no one want to apply for them. The company will pay for training and everything you need to get a CDL and most people come in try it for a day or week and then leave becuase it hard work. Today this company average age of a drive is 55.
I am tired of people making excuse about why someone has debt issue, there are jobs out there and they pay well you just have to be willing to work. To your point about creditors not willing to work with you, I can not speak to CC companies but morgages, they have been required to work with by law long before the issue back in 2008. My buddy works in banking and he said if a morgage holder comes in before they default on loan and say they want to work out a new payment plan the bank is required to work with them. He will tell you most people way until they miss a number of loan payments and the morgage goes into default then they want help. At that point the banks hands were tied you defaults and there is not much they can do since it is now a legal action. Because of all the defaults in 2008 banks have to do more to help people out of their situation.
So yes most people do not know how to manage their money, I personally seen more of this than someone you ran into some unforeseen circumstance totally outside their controls. Plus if you can not pay your bill you should not be walking around with a $100 per month cell phone. You can get a life line from your phone company for $10 per month.
Comments
What is the APR for Apple's program if not paid off in 24 months? Looks like Motorola's was 28.99%. Also is this exactly the same program? I don't see anywhere on Moto's site where you can trade in your device for a new one after 12 months.
This is becuase in the Apple program the phone trade in is the finance payment in the case of Motorola you get to keep the phone and they hoped that most people will fail to pay on time and get hit with the 28% interest charge. Yes, more people than not do not pay off in time to avoid the finance charges. Personally I never paid any finance charges expect on my house. Therefore, I do not mind using someone else money for a period of time espeically if they will not drop the price any further if I pay up front.
I have not looked into this, but in the Apple program if you do not upgrade after a year and keep the phone for the full two yrs, do you still have to trade in at the end of do get to keep it.
Apple's program, unlike AT&T etc., is the iPhone is UNLOCKED, meaning you can use it with ANY carrier. It's a huge bonus for those who travel internationally. On top of that, AppleCare+ is part of the package... at the normal cost of the plan. To say it's included is a bit misleading, as Apple makes it required to buy on top of the phone payment price. It's just broken up into 24 payments.
Where carriers can be better with this is in the credit department. Carriers are usually more forgiving with less than perfect credit, whereas Apple's is through a finance company who probably demands close to a 700 credit score or better.
Sprint does seem to be the most forgiving, overall. I know several people who got plans and financing without a ton of money upfront.
The above is probably true, and Apple is not the one financing they forcing the debt onto Citi, to your point when my son went to college we did the free financing for student purchases for 18 months on his macbook pro, and I want the credit card in his name, not mine and Barclay would not give him the credit, so I have to co-sign for him. But we know that most apple customers all have money so this is not a program for people who can not manage their finances.
This reminds me of the old joke about Microsoft's R&D department was called 'Apple'.
AT&T Next also states that it requires credit approval. Both are basically interest free monthly loans. Apple includes AppleCare+ but AT&T allows you to choose their protection programs or a third parties. Basically when you turn it in to either company it needs to function and most of all it can't have a cracked screen. AT&T protection covers lost or stolen phones where Apple Care+ doesn't.
But you only get 2 accidents with the plan and for each accident you need to pay $99. This is what it typically costs to replace a broken screen which is the most common accident. Not a good deal!
Logical move: the carriers say they want out? Cut them out and bring in banks.
Could Apple lock your phone if you miss a payment?
AT&T Next also states that it requires credit approval. Both are basically interest free monthly loans. Apple includes AppleCare+ but AT&T allows you to choose their protection programs or a third parties. Basically when you turn it in to either company it needs to function and most of all it can't have a cracked screen. AT&T protection covers lost or stolen phones where Apple Care+ doesn't.
I'm curious what Apple/Citi does with less than satisfactory credit. The carrier I worked for would just require a down payment. Still 0% interest.
I'm assuming this a hard credit pull too.
Take a step back and consider the depths to which Samesung has descended to try to tease customers away from Apple. Schemes like buy-on get-one free, free tablets, the recent test drive program, product copying, feature copying, version number syncing, feature name copying, product launch and announcement style copying, advertising theme copying, etc. Whatever can possibly be copied, they will copy. It is rather sad and pathetic to see them struggle to be something that they can never be but they valiantly keep on copying away while hoping that they will someday be worthy. Perhaps with time and therapy they can someday be themselves and come up with an original and innovative idea of their own. Never quite good enough, but such is the fate of the copy cat.
No no no, Apple copied Motorola, therefore Samsung didn't copy Apple. Samsung: defended.
How exactly is this Apple's lead when Apple is essentially implementing what carriers are already doing. I'm currently on AT&T Next which is very similar to Apple's upgrade program.
You're not following the narrative. Apple now invented installment plans.
AT&T Next also states that it requires credit approval. Both are basically interest free monthly loans. Apple includes AppleCare+ but AT&T allows you to choose their protection programs or a third parties. Basically when you turn it in to either company it needs to function and most of all it can't have a cracked screen. AT&T protection covers lost or stolen phones where Apple Care+ doesn't.
The above is probably true, and Apple is not the one financing they forcing the debt onto Citi, to your point when my son went to college we did the free financing for student purchases for 18 months on his macbook pro, and I want the credit card in his name, not mine and Barclay would not give him the credit, so I have to co-sign for him. But we know that most apple customers all have money so this is not a program for people who can not manage their finances.
It's not always a matter of someone not being responsible with finances. Have you never hard of someone's place of employment going out of business, or someone falling critically ill who can't work, and trying to get disability can take YEARS? When your income suddenly stops, it's beyond one's control. That can severely damage credit, and many creditors only care about one thing - their money. They claim they'll work with you, but when it comes down to it, they still throw all the negatives on your credit report.
You're partially correct, but just because someone has troubled credit, it doesn't mean they're deadbeats.
Because Apple is the first handset maker to offer this without a carrier.
AppleCare+ covers accidental damage where as when you buy from a carrier you don't have that!
Motorola has been doing this before Apple, so no, Apple is not the first. Apple followed Motorola.
Actually I think it's broader than that. Americans have a distorted view of what the real costs of "subsidized" Phones is. Amazingly there are still americans who think it's a free lunch and resist the temptation to do the math. In ALL cases that I have seen and where I have done the Math .. the subsidized phone is substantially more expensive than outright buying ... and there is the added overhead that the providers actually also factor in a profit margin, higher in many cases than credit charges, for the financial service of providing the subsidy ... practically an extra "product" that they want to turn a profit on.
Industry Pundits .. and I*m thinking of Tomi Ahonen and a couple of others, have been saying for years that the subsidized Phone model is doomed because the Providers hate it and rational customers reject it, and the Math doesn't add up. One reason the providers hate it is that it creates the perception that their services are more expensive than they really are ... and that Apple's devices in particular are cheaper than they really are ... so in a sense the providers are fed up with taking the flak for apple.. So if there's any "Desperation" to be seen, its an american phenomenon ... outside the US it's pretty much the rule.
Yes, Apple gets your old iPhone.
I wonder if with each installment statement you will get special offers on Apple products and services, free music, or apps...etc...Apple sweetening the pot while making it possible for you to "be one with the ecosystem.."
I wonder if with each installment statement you will get special offers on Apple products and services, free music, or apps...etc...Apple sweetening the pot while making it possible for you to "be one with the ecosystem.."
I would be surprised if you get a statement.
[COLOR=blue]Or how about "or later..."
I suspect Samsung let this rumor loose to figure out how they can finance their program. Their local Tong banks have onerous terms in case of non-performance. "First the fingers, then the toes; you know how it goes."[/COLOR]
[SIZE=4]Also, financing options may just have to wait in line until other promised upgrades arrive, like 64-bit devices... [/SIZE]
Yes, Apple gets your old iPhone.
At the end of the second year though when it's been fully "paid for" I expect the person would get to keep it.
It's not always a matter of someone not being responsible with finances. Have you never hard of someone's place of employment going out of business, or someone falling critically ill who can't work, and trying to get disability can take YEARS? When your income suddenly stops, it's beyond one's control. That can severely damage credit, and many creditors only care about one thing - their money. They claim they'll work with you, but when it comes down to it, they still throw all the negatives on your credit report.
You're partially correct, but just because someone has troubled credit, it doesn't mean they're deadbeats.
First my statement was really against Apple, since as I have said Apple is not interested in everyone buying their products only those who can afford them. To your point. my son did not qualified since he has no credit history. It was the classic example of can not get credit history if no one will give you credit. But today he building it on his own.
Your example is only a small percentage of the people with bad credit, I too been out of a job for 9 months, but I had enough money put away to cover me plus I went out and got any work I could to cover my bills. You would be surprised how many people just sit at home hoping someone will call them becuase the put their resume on a website. I meet lots of them while I was looking. Also my son got jobs paying a lot more than McDonnalds pays and reason why, the companies told him most people did not want to do the job, people are lazy these day. My son co-op job at a trucking company and they start Drivers at $55K per yr and they can not get people to work for them they have 70 open jobs today and no one want to apply for them. The company will pay for training and everything you need to get a CDL and most people come in try it for a day or week and then leave becuase it hard work. Today this company average age of a drive is 55.
I am tired of people making excuse about why someone has debt issue, there are jobs out there and they pay well you just have to be willing to work. To your point about creditors not willing to work with you, I can not speak to CC companies but morgages, they have been required to work with by law long before the issue back in 2008. My buddy works in banking and he said if a morgage holder comes in before they default on loan and say they want to work out a new payment plan the bank is required to work with them. He will tell you most people way until they miss a number of loan payments and the morgage goes into default then they want help. At that point the banks hands were tied you defaults and there is not much they can do since it is now a legal action. Because of all the defaults in 2008 banks have to do more to help people out of their situation.
So yes most people do not know how to manage their money, I personally seen more of this than someone you ran into some unforeseen circumstance totally outside their controls. Plus if you can not pay your bill you should not be walking around with a $100 per month cell phone. You can get a life line from your phone company for $10 per month.