It is not a 'standard', it is an entry level. I suspect many people, especially young non-techie, just need four or five apps, Phone, Messages, Facebook, or what ever is socially 'in' at the moment, iTunes, and the Camera app, and since most photos will be selfies, they aren't as large and probably get deleted from the phone on a regular basis. 16GB can work just fine for a lot of people.
Don't get all "small, medium, large, super-size, king-size" on us. I am not stuck on nomenclature, just the miserly level of storage Apple is continuing to offer at the first price point.
The phones are the same except for the storage capacity, and 16 GB of storage runs me $4.97 at Walmart. Joe Six-pack knows that.
I have 25+ 16 GB iPads at work, and they do work well. But, just like the Edu iMacs used to be, the 16 GB iOS devices should be the Business/Edu exception, not the standard size. Normal users dont like to have to delete their data just to clear enough space to install an iOS update...
I will just say this on the storage. If they upped it to 32GB, that's a lot more apps, iAds, and purchasable media people can buy and use on their iPhone out of that gate. Someone who maxs out their size 6 months from now will just manage down, not buy a new phone until the next cycle. Looks like a solid amount of revenue left on the table to me...
This is a great point.
I never thought about it until you mentioned it, but I have a few friends who have chosen not to buy apps and such that I have recommended to them because they are out of space with 16 gigs. Not because they are $.99 or $2.99 or whatever. They are just out of space.
It would seem like Apple would make more on app/music/etc. if the minimum was 32 gigs.
The folks at Apple must have done the math and calculated that the customer who opts for the 16 gig version will generally not spend $100 on apps, etc. over the life of their phone if they had 32 gigs (or 64 since that's the next size up) for the same price as 16.
Not sure if their calculations are right or wrong, but 16 gigs does seem stingy these days for a flagship.
Do you really not understand this? The majority of the people that buy the 16 GB model DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH STORAGE IT HAS.
Do you have no concept of the consumer market at all? A fraction of buyers even know or give a shit at all about that. All they see is "$199, $299, $399. I'll take the $199."
Why on earth would Apple give up a $2-3/device margin when they don't need to? This decision of theirs has absolutely positively 100% zero effect on sales volume, and means probably half a billion in revenue.
I'm not sure how you're calculating your figures, but I suspect the gain is far more than that. It's not $2-3 per device. It's $100 or $200 for the millions and millions and millions who pay up for the 64GB and 128GB. As a partial owner of the business, I love it.
Yeah it stinks with the 16GB. I reduced my apps down to 3 pages, I have no photos or videos, I reduced media stored in mail and messages, and I still have < 1GB free.
Simple solution: BUY THE 64BG STORAGE OPTION.
Seriously, someone as frugal as you is certainly going to keep that phone for at least two years, if not longer. So it adds up to about $4 per month...or two gallons of gasoline...or a latte at Starbucks...or 2/3 of a pack of cigarettes. Per month. It's just absurd the whining about a few bucks spent on what for many people is now the single most important material good they own.
Seriously, someone as frugal as you is certainly going to keep that phone for at least two years, if not longer. So it adds up to about $4 per month...or two gallons of gasoline...or a latte at Starbucks...or 2/3 of a pack of cigarettes. Per month. It's just absurd the whining about a few bucks spent on what for many people is now the single most important material good they own.
commoncents, it is about value.
Why has Apple doubled the value of iCloud storage, but decreased the value of iPhone storage?
16GB is still fine to most people. That's it. Apple doesn't need to give to charity, which is basically what the whiners whine about. Jobs said people should buy less stuff, but of higher quality. If people really want the higher quality, they'll have to skimp on something else, maybe one less latte per week, and get the Iphone.
Please provide your source or indication it is fine with most of the 500 million iOS users. You 'assume' Apple knows.
However, other people, as has been strongly stated by other posts, think that this moves smells of greed. That gets to perception of the company and products
Your quality analogy makes no sense in this context.
Charity is another 'red herring'. As is well known, price is what 'market will bear' but also 'perception of the product and company' of how far to take that. There are many examples of that such as 'loss leader' or entry.
Basically what you are saying is Tim Cook should of publicly told Taylor Swift to 'pound sand'. Or that they should not offer the music service for 3 months for free(charity as you call it).
Or that Photo's or Pages etc should not be free or that iOS updates should not be free.
The performance scores are really impressive. I do wonder if Apple will make the base storage 32GB for the iPhone 7.... but everyone has been wondering that for the past 4 years with each model that comes out.
I have a few friends who have chosen not to buy apps and such that I have recommended to them because they are out of space with 16 gigs. Not because they are $.99 or $2.99 or whatever. They are just out of space.
They would eventually run out of space even if they had 32GB.
Most people don't manage their storage very well. They take thousands of pictures and keep them all on their phone forever (without any backup... but that's another problem)
Your phone should not be permanent storage for photos... yet that's what people do. Every day they're snapping photos which slowly decrease the free space on their phone until it is full. Or they carry around an extraordinary amount of songs.
Larger capacity isn't exactly the answer... although it might help in the short term.
I would love for Apple to make 32GB the entry-level capacity (simply to shut people up on the forum )
But people will still need to learn how to manage their storage.
If someone can fill up a 16GB iPhone... they can fill up a 32GB iPhone too.
So explain why Apple felt 32GB wasn't enough and decided to replace it with 64GB? I'm sure there were plenty of 32GB device owners that didn't have storage issues and were perfectly happy with their device.
Why is 16 > 64 good but 16 > 32 or 32 > 64 bad? Of course these are all rhetorical questions on my part. I know why. I'm just baffled as to why others don't get it.
I completely get a reasoned argument. 64gb was the high-end at some point (at a $200 premium), then "trickled down " to become the mid-range. So on the face of it, it seems perfectly logical to expect the formerly-high-end-then-midrange 32gb to "trickle down" to the low end.
But as a shareholder, I trust Apple to know what they are doing here. I don't actually know, but I would guess that market research and chip availability have all conspired to maintain the status quo; that there's more downside for Apple to move to 32 than staying where they are... for now. At some point, that balance will surely tip, but we're not there yet.
I love the people that have to harp on 16 GB entry level model. Its the ENTRY LEVEL model. There are two more models, with lots more storage.
If you think 16 GB isn't enough...buy the other ones. Oh, you'd rather save a few bucks than get what you actually need? Not Apple's problem. Or anyone else's.
I did buy 64GB version this time. However, 16GB on 6 Plus was straining. You try to live with 16GB on 6s/Plus. I don't think many will be satisfied with the capacity. Why produce a phone where most would complain about? That's not Apple - that's Samsung. Just do away with 16GB and raise it up to 32GB, already.
What actually needs to happen is that the dimwit douchebro at Verizon Wireless needs to pull his head out of his butt and properly assess customer needs before recommending a product. Stores need to properly carry the 64gb models without direct fulfilling them. They also need to stop talking about base models with a degree of inevitability. "The 64 gig model is only $3 more a month on your bill and ensures you'll never have to worry about pictures filling up your space" is not a hard upsell. If they weren't so concerned about padding their commission checks by always going for the lowest priced options to wow a customer, they'd actually sell a product a customer needs. If customer's a truly fretting over $3 or $5 increases on their financing options, they need to get their priorities in order before purchasing an iPhone.
I have a few friends who have chosen not to buy apps and such that I have recommended to them because they are out of space with 16 gigs. Not because they are $.99 or $2.99 or whatever. They are just out of space.
They would eventually run out of space even if they had 32GB.
Most people don't manage their storage very well. They take thousands of pictures and keep them all on their phone forever (without any backup... but that's another problem)
Your phone should not be permanent storage for photos... yet that's what people do. Every day they're snapping photos which slowly decrease the free space on their phone until it is full. Or they carry around an extraordinary amount of songs.
Larger capacity isn't exactly the answer... although it might help in the short term.
I would love for Apple to make 32GB the entry-level capacity (simply to shut people up on the forum )
But people will still need to learn how to manage their storage.
If someone can fill up a 16GB iPhone... they can fill up a 32GB iPhone too.
Your assumption is not unfair, but your assumption could not be more wrong from my point of view with what I personally see.
The phones are mostly filled with apps, then music/podcasts, then maybe a TV show. Photos are almost never the problem.
But that is just my circle of friends. So we all will have differing opinions.
The storage is an absolute joke at this point. And it's not 16GB, it's 12 if you're lucky. Somehow Apple can sell a TV unit for $149 with 32GB but can't sell an iPhone with that much for $649.
why are you buying the entry-level model if you need more?
if you arent, why are you complaining about it? not understanding the hardship youre experiencing.
Yeah it stinks with the 16GB. I reduced my apps down to 3 pages, I have no photos or videos, I reduced media stored in mail and messages, and I still have < 1GB free.
im not sure how that is, but it sounds like you need more than the entry-level model.
The 16GB iPhone is about one thing: keeping iPhone ASPs high. And yes Apple cares about that as much as it does customer sat. It's not just about whether 16GB is enough (I would argue it's not others disagree). If 16GB is enough than wouldn't 32GB be enough too? Yet Apple somehow felt giving you more storage in the mid tier for the same price was the right thing to do. Of course everyone knows why. There's more margin to play with at the higher end and the more people Apple can get to spend a $100 more the higher the iPhone ASPs which is what Wall Street wants. Once Apple feels enough of the install base has moved to the middle tier (and won't go back down) then they'll maybe raise the entry level storage to 32GB.
a company wants to make money? so what? why does this cause so much butthurt for the usuals? since youre not an entry-level user, it's not your problem.
32 GB is the starting point for the Samsung S6 and the same should be the case for the iPhone 6S. It would be fine if the storage was expandable via micro SD card.
oh, so because samsung does it that lays it down, huh? riiiight. lets think of some other shit samsung has done too.
So explain why Apple felt 32GB wasn't enough and decided to replace it with 64GB? I'm sure there were plenty of 32GB device owners that didn't have storage issues and were perfectly happy with their device.
Why is 16 > 64 good but 16 > 32 or 32 > 64 bad? Of course these are all rhetorical questions on my part. I know why. I'm just baffled as to why others don't get it.
why does apple have to do it the way you want them to? thats the baffling part.
Normal users dont like to have to delete their data just to clear enough space to install an iOS update...
In iOS 9 Apple has mostly fixed this problem with a number of measures that reduce the size of the archive from around 4.5 GB to 1.3 GB and also used a process of app thinning that only downloads the parts of the app that are required for the user's particular device. Furthermore Apple also can uninstall apps automatically to create enough room and then reinstall the apps after the upgrade. Of course if you have a computer with iTunes you can let the computer do the downloading, extracting and installing without having to worry about the free space issue.
Please provide your source or indication it is fine with most of the 500 million iOS users. You 'assume' Apple knows.
However, other people, as has been strongly stated by other posts, think that this moves smells of greed. That gets to perception of the company and products
Your quality analogy makes no sense in this context.
Charity is another 'red herring'. As is well known, price is what 'market will bear' but also 'perception of the product and company' of how far to take that. There are many examples of that such as 'loss leader' or entry.
Basically what you are saying is Tim Cook should of publicly told Taylor Swift to 'pound sand'. Or that they should not offer the music service for 3 months for free(charity as you call it).
Or that Photo's or Pages etc should not be free or that iOS updates should not be free.
Bullshit. The whiny minority that actually post online claim that. It's asinine to think the few who complain are representative of the entire iOS user base.
The fact 16GB models have, and still continue to sell, shows that consumers are happy with them. With a large chunk of the iPhone user base being those who upgraded from previous iPhones, if there was a problem with many of them running out of storage, then we should see a sharp decline of 16GB models and a sharp rise of 64GB models.
Comments
It is not a 'standard', it is an entry level. I suspect many people, especially young non-techie, just need four or five apps, Phone, Messages, Facebook, or what ever is socially 'in' at the moment, iTunes, and the Camera app, and since most photos will be selfies, they aren't as large and probably get deleted from the phone on a regular basis. 16GB can work just fine for a lot of people.
Don't get all "small, medium, large, super-size, king-size" on us. I am not stuck on nomenclature, just the miserly level of storage Apple is continuing to offer at the first price point.
The phones are the same except for the storage capacity, and 16 GB of storage runs me $4.97 at Walmart. Joe Six-pack knows that.
I have 25+ 16 GB iPads at work, and they do work well. But, just like the Edu iMacs used to be, the 16 GB iOS devices should be the Business/Edu exception, not the standard size. Normal users dont like to have to delete their data just to clear enough space to install an iOS update...
I will just say this on the storage. If they upped it to 32GB, that's a lot more apps, iAds, and purchasable media people can buy and use on their iPhone out of that gate. Someone who maxs out their size 6 months from now will just manage down, not buy a new phone until the next cycle. Looks like a solid amount of revenue left on the table to me...
This is a great point.
I never thought about it until you mentioned it, but I have a few friends who have chosen not to buy apps and such that I have recommended to them because they are out of space with 16 gigs. Not because they are $.99 or $2.99 or whatever. They are just out of space.
It would seem like Apple would make more on app/music/etc. if the minimum was 32 gigs.
The folks at Apple must have done the math and calculated that the customer who opts for the 16 gig version will generally not spend $100 on apps, etc. over the life of their phone if they had 32 gigs (or 64 since that's the next size up) for the same price as 16.
Not sure if their calculations are right or wrong, but 16 gigs does seem stingy these days for a flagship.
Do you really not understand this? The majority of the people that buy the 16 GB model DON'T EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH STORAGE IT HAS.
Do you have no concept of the consumer market at all? A fraction of buyers even know or give a shit at all about that. All they see is "$199, $299, $399. I'll take the $199."
Why on earth would Apple give up a $2-3/device margin when they don't need to? This decision of theirs has absolutely positively 100% zero effect on sales volume, and means probably half a billion in revenue.
I'm not sure how you're calculating your figures, but I suspect the gain is far more than that. It's not $2-3 per device. It's $100 or $200 for the millions and millions and millions who pay up for the 64GB and 128GB. As a partial owner of the business, I love it.
Yeah it stinks with the 16GB. I reduced my apps down to 3 pages, I have no photos or videos, I reduced media stored in mail and messages, and I still have < 1GB free.
Simple solution: BUY THE 64BG STORAGE OPTION.
Seriously, someone as frugal as you is certainly going to keep that phone for at least two years, if not longer. So it adds up to about $4 per month...or two gallons of gasoline...or a latte at Starbucks...or 2/3 of a pack of cigarettes. Per month. It's just absurd the whining about a few bucks spent on what for many people is now the single most important material good they own.
Simple solution: BUY THE 64BG STORAGE OPTION.
Seriously, someone as frugal as you is certainly going to keep that phone for at least two years, if not longer. So it adds up to about $4 per month...or two gallons of gasoline...or a latte at Starbucks...or 2/3 of a pack of cigarettes. Per month. It's just absurd the whining about a few bucks spent on what for many people is now the single most important material good they own.
commoncents, it is about value.
Why has Apple doubled the value of iCloud storage, but decreased the value of iPhone storage?
ie the principle, not the $$
16GB is still fine to most people. That's it. Apple doesn't need to give to charity, which is basically what the whiners whine about. Jobs said people should buy less stuff, but of higher quality. If people really want the higher quality, they'll have to skimp on something else, maybe one less latte per week, and get the Iphone.
Please provide your source or indication it is fine with most of the 500 million iOS users. You 'assume' Apple knows.
However, other people, as has been strongly stated by other posts, think that this moves smells of greed. That gets to perception of the company and products
Your quality analogy makes no sense in this context.
Charity is another 'red herring'. As is well known, price is what 'market will bear' but also 'perception of the product and company' of how far to take that. There are many examples of that such as 'loss leader' or entry.
Basically what you are saying is Tim Cook should of publicly told Taylor Swift to 'pound sand'. Or that they should not offer the music service for 3 months for free(charity as you call it).
Or that Photo's or Pages etc should not be free or that iOS updates should not be free.
They would eventually run out of space even if they had 32GB.
Most people don't manage their storage very well. They take thousands of pictures and keep them all on their phone forever (without any backup... but that's another problem)
Your phone should not be permanent storage for photos... yet that's what people do. Every day they're snapping photos which slowly decrease the free space on their phone until it is full. Or they carry around an extraordinary amount of songs.
Larger capacity isn't exactly the answer... although it might help in the short term.
I would love for Apple to make 32GB the entry-level capacity (simply to shut people up on the forum
But people will still need to learn how to manage their storage.
If someone can fill up a 16GB iPhone... they can fill up a 32GB iPhone too.
Quote:
So explain why Apple felt 32GB wasn't enough and decided to replace it with 64GB? I'm sure there were plenty of 32GB device owners that didn't have storage issues and were perfectly happy with their device.
Why is 16 > 64 good but 16 > 32 or 32 > 64 bad? Of course these are all rhetorical questions on my part. I know why. I'm just baffled as to why others don't get it.
I completely get a reasoned argument. 64gb was the high-end at some point (at a $200 premium), then "trickled down " to become the mid-range. So on the face of it, it seems perfectly logical to expect the formerly-high-end-then-midrange 32gb to "trickle down" to the low end.
But as a shareholder, I trust Apple to know what they are doing here. I don't actually know, but I would guess that market research and chip availability have all conspired to maintain the status quo; that there's more downside for Apple to move to 32 than staying where they are... for now. At some point, that balance will surely tip, but we're not there yet.
I love the people that have to harp on 16 GB entry level model. Its the ENTRY LEVEL model. There are two more models, with lots more storage.
If you think 16 GB isn't enough...buy the other ones. Oh, you'd rather save a few bucks than get what you actually need? Not Apple's problem. Or anyone else's.
I did buy 64GB version this time. However, 16GB on 6 Plus was straining. You try to live with 16GB on 6s/Plus. I don't think many will be satisfied with the capacity. Why produce a phone where most would complain about? That's not Apple - that's Samsung. Just do away with 16GB and raise it up to 32GB, already.
I have a few friends who have chosen not to buy apps and such that I have recommended to them because they are out of space with 16 gigs. Not because they are $.99 or $2.99 or whatever. They are just out of space.
They would eventually run out of space even if they had 32GB.
Most people don't manage their storage very well. They take thousands of pictures and keep them all on their phone forever (without any backup... but that's another problem)
Your phone should not be permanent storage for photos... yet that's what people do. Every day they're snapping photos which slowly decrease the free space on their phone until it is full. Or they carry around an extraordinary amount of songs.
Larger capacity isn't exactly the answer... although it might help in the short term.
I would love for Apple to make 32GB the entry-level capacity (simply to shut people up on the forum
But people will still need to learn how to manage their storage.
If someone can fill up a 16GB iPhone... they can fill up a 32GB iPhone too.
Your assumption is not unfair, but your assumption could not be more wrong from my point of view with what I personally see.
The phones are mostly filled with apps, then music/podcasts, then maybe a TV show. Photos are almost never the problem.
But that is just my circle of friends. So we all will have differing opinions.
why are you buying the entry-level model if you need more?
if you arent, why are you complaining about it? not understanding the hardship youre experiencing.
im not sure how that is, but it sounds like you need more than the entry-level model.
my dad is real happy w/ 16gb tho.
a company wants to make money? so what? why does this cause so much butthurt for the usuals? since youre not an entry-level user, it's not your problem.
oh, so because samsung does it that lays it down, huh? riiiight. lets think of some other shit samsung has done too.
why does apple have to do it the way you want them to? thats the baffling part.
Normal users dont like to have to delete their data just to clear enough space to install an iOS update...
In iOS 9 Apple has mostly fixed this problem with a number of measures that reduce the size of the archive from around 4.5 GB to 1.3 GB and also used a process of app thinning that only downloads the parts of the app that are required for the user's particular device. Furthermore Apple also can uninstall apps automatically to create enough room and then reinstall the apps after the upgrade. Of course if you have a computer with iTunes you can let the computer do the downloading, extracting and installing without having to worry about the free space issue.
they dont. they was resolved w/ iOS 9. smaller install, and auto-deletes-reinstalls apps in the event that it needs to.
what else ya got?
Please provide your source or indication it is fine with most of the 500 million iOS users. You 'assume' Apple knows.
However, other people, as has been strongly stated by other posts, think that this moves smells of greed. That gets to perception of the company and products
Your quality analogy makes no sense in this context.
Charity is another 'red herring'. As is well known, price is what 'market will bear' but also 'perception of the product and company' of how far to take that. There are many examples of that such as 'loss leader' or entry.
Basically what you are saying is Tim Cook should of publicly told Taylor Swift to 'pound sand'. Or that they should not offer the music service for 3 months for free(charity as you call it).
Or that Photo's or Pages etc should not be free or that iOS updates should not be free.
Bullshit. The whiny minority that actually post online claim that. It's asinine to think the few who complain are representative of the entire iOS user base.
The fact 16GB models have, and still continue to sell, shows that consumers are happy with them. With a large chunk of the iPhone user base being those who upgraded from previous iPhones, if there was a problem with many of them running out of storage, then we should see a sharp decline of 16GB models and a sharp rise of 64GB models.