Apparently it doesn't get cheaper for Apple or they choose not to pass the savings on to consumers?
It does get cheaper; however, the iPhone overall does not. The savings is invested in some other part or the flash storage type is upgraded (faster) and it ends up the same price or more expensive.
Apple has grown Revenue and EPS by about 50% since 2012.
Yet the market cap of Apple is down $40,000,000,000 since Sept 2012
Who cares if Apple sells 90,000,000 iPhones at all time high margins in the Dec quarter.
Wall Street azzholes will just say this is peak iPhone and they won't be able to beat it next year.
I'm so sick of this shiit
I risk my hard earned money on the stock and made the right call that Apple would destroy Samsung and the rest of the phone market. I was correct on all accounts and EPS exploded 50% growth. Yet I get rewarded with a return slightly worse than inflation. Sick of this shitt.
I totally understand your frustration - Because I also don't get it! As Icahn said it - Market doesn't understand Apple at all. I too feel that it is artificially pushed down. Apple can do everything right and constantly prove all those ANAL-yst wrong, but it is working against some evil force. I too am getting sick of them asking a brand new category of product. People are still complaining about Apple Watch (Whatever the whisper number might be - 14M is still darn good for Gen 1 product) I too am getting sick of people saying they are just bringing features from Android. Whatever it maybe it, the profit margin on Apple products are crazy good. People don't still get the ecosystem play they are planning (oh by the way, Google is now trying to copy that also) Yes - The stock is going to break out when next quarter is reported in 2016Q1.
It does get cheaper; however, the iPhone overall does not. The savings is invested in some other part or the flash storage type is upgraded (faster) and it ends up the same price or more expensive.
This must be the case, because the price of an iPhone has remained stable over the years, despite all the (expensive?) goodies they keep adding to each subsequent new model.
But even if they blowout 2016 Q1 Wall Street can simply kick the can down the road. They can simply say the results were so GREAT that no way Apple can beat it next year.
I know people say consumer tech prices always go down. That is true. But not true for cutting edge tech. Look at TV's. Cutting edge TV's cost more than they were in 1990's. Cutting edge speaker and amps cost more than in the 1990's. iPhone is cutting edge tech. Its the most advanced computer device on the planet.
Tell that to a former customer of mine who paid $14,000 for a 42" Fujitsu plasma 15 years ago, that most $500 42" models positively smoke today.
...if Apple line up 64/128/256GB, I would go for 128GB instead save $100 at 64GB.
A 256GB iPhone?!? That would be interesting. Though, it would seem to run counter to their cloud philosophy.
Ya' know ...
Since you mentioned iCloud -- it would be "it just works" brilliant if Apple offered enough free iCloud storage to backup every iDevice you buy (currently own).
They could [easily *] incorporate that into the iPhone Upgrade Program.
* I say easily because we bought 4 iPhone 6S (twice) using the iPhone Upgrade Program -- there was nothing easy about it.
IMO, as an Apple Customer and AAPL Shareholder, the Upgrade Program is a brilliant concept, but [almost everything about it] is poorly implemented. I spent several hours on the phone to Apple Support and told them I wouldn't post any details until they had a chance to get their kit together -- when the Rose Gold becomes available, we plan on buying another.
but,but,but,but,but, no one buys 16GB phones anymoore......
Actually all the negative press and crybabying from the tech media about the 16GB phone may have actually helped Apple sell more high margin phones.
Do you understand trends? Popularity of the 16GB model declined 17.5% year over year. It's good for Apple, though, since those sales will go into the higher-margin models.
128gb - wealthy; media hoarders; early adopters; enthusiasts
You forgot 16gb - "gold tax". I'm sure there are people who would have bought the 6 instead of the 6S because it's $100 cheaper, and not much of a compromise for the average user, except they can't get it in gold -- which is more important than any other aspect of the phone to them.
It's the Black MacBook all over again.
What's even more interesting to me is that the 5C continued to be offered in 5 colors after it became the "giveaway" phone, but they eliminated the gold option in the 5S, reserving it solely for the flagship, despite introducing the rose gold option.
16gb - gov/education/business users; kids; old people who only use email/web
64gb - tech savy users; media/app/gaming consumers
128gb - wealthy; media hoarders; early adopters; enthusiasts
128gb - how about media creators; 4k is known to take up more than a few bits and bytes of space ya know. Also portfolios, PDFs, assorted project files and media collections like Lightroom.
That beef aside... or a side of beef... I do agree that Apple has the market rather cleverly covered from snout to the tip of the fly (Android) swattering tail. This should be a running bull market, not what we're experincing.
what proof? Flash is cheaper for sure and that needs no proof. About top tier users, look at the number of top tier users last year vs this year (12%-16%). That means even more enter top tier. That also means top tier users didn't drop back to mid tier but stay at the top tier. No need for more proof?
128gb - how about media creators; 4k is known to take up more than a few bits and bytes of space ya know. Also portfolios, PDFs, assorted project files and media collections like Lightroom.
And that's why there needs to be a 256gb model. If Apple made it now, I'm sure a lot of those 128GB 6S customers would have bought it. And you can add disgruntled iPod Classic users to that category as well.
16GB clearly makes no sense for the capabilities of the 6S. Honestly, anybody who buys a 16GB 6S does not care what's extra under the hood over the $100 cheaper 6, and in my mind is mainly buying it to get the Gold and Rose Gold options only. I'd love to see the individual model data, but I know that will never happen, so I guess we'll never really know for certain.
This is very poor on Apple's part. They know 16 GB is not enough these days. They just want the extra $100 the 64 GB model beings. I suspect the only people buying the 16 GB versions are those who are really having a hard time even affording the base model, or first-time buyers who haven't learned, yet. Really bad form on Apple.
This is very poor on Apple's part. They know 16 GB is not enough these days. They just want the extra $100 the 64 GB model beings. I suspect the only people buying the 16 GB versions are those who are really having a hard time even affording the base model, or first-time buyers who haven't learned, yet. Really bad form on Apple.
One THIRD of Apple iPhone 6s series customers disagree with you about 16GB being "not enough".
And that's why there needs to be a 256gb model. If Apple made it now, I'm sure a lot of those 128GB 6S customers would have bought it. And you can add disgruntled iPod Classic users to that category as well.
16GB clearly makes no sense for the capabilities of the 6S. Honestly, anybody who buys a 16GB 6S does not care what's extra under the hood over the $100 cheaper 6, and in my mind is mainly buying it to get the Gold and Rose Gold options only. I'd love to see the individual model data, but I know that will never happen, so I guess we'll never really know for certain.
Nope. Not true at all.
While a 256gb might very well be purchased by some users, first and foremost I'm sure there's other technical or supply considerations why Apple doesn't offer this yet. Technical, since ask yourself why Apple would turn down a possible $200 upgrade? Oh... you thought only $100 extra? I doubt that very much.
As for the 16gb debate, I have more a few clients that fit in the category that @schlack listed that are more than happy and don't want/need/use anymore than a few GBs. The 6s fits their needs and use perfectly, including that they can be fashionable and have the best mobile OS and spead at the same time.
Here's what Apple needs to do: keep on letting their knowledge of the numbers and their engineers create the matrix. There's not a person here unless they work at Apple with both those resources at their fingertips that has a clue... or even a say... what "Apple should do". We're not talking about a shoddy, unprofitable, throw it at the wall and see what sticks, company here like you would like them to be for some strange reason.
One last comment and I'm through with this rather pitiful debate.
Considering that just one function of the iPhone is kicking the bejezus out of another technology market, namely camera DSLR manufacturers... using optics, processors and overall component size 100's of times smaller, and against prices 3-6 times that of the iPhone, that also does literally 1000's of things rather than just 2...well...
...you're all just about the most despicable bunch of non-grateful, lack of understanding, whiners and wieners group of consumers on the planet. Truly clueless and lacking in the ability to be amazed at any price. What a sad existense.
Comments
Apparently it doesn't get cheaper for Apple or they choose not to pass the savings on to consumers?
It does get cheaper; however, the iPhone overall does not. The savings is invested in some other part or the flash storage type is upgraded (faster) and it ends up the same price or more expensive.
Does not mean a damn thing.
Apple has grown Revenue and EPS by about 50% since 2012.
Yet the market cap of Apple is down $40,000,000,000 since Sept 2012
Who cares if Apple sells 90,000,000 iPhones at all time high margins in the Dec quarter.
Wall Street azzholes will just say this is peak iPhone and they won't be able to beat it next year.
I'm so sick of this shiit
I risk my hard earned money on the stock and made the right call that Apple would destroy Samsung and the rest of the phone market. I was correct on all accounts and EPS exploded 50% growth. Yet I get rewarded with a return slightly worse than inflation. Sick of this shitt.
I totally understand your frustration - Because I also don't get it! As Icahn said it - Market doesn't understand Apple at all. I too feel that it is artificially pushed down. Apple can do everything right and constantly prove all those ANAL-yst wrong, but it is working against some evil force. I too am getting sick of them asking a brand new category of product. People are still complaining about Apple Watch (Whatever the whisper number might be - 14M is still darn good for Gen 1 product) I too am getting sick of people saying they are just bringing features from Android. Whatever it maybe it, the profit margin on Apple products are crazy good. People don't still get the ecosystem play they are planning (oh by the way, Google is now trying to copy that also) Yes - The stock is going to break out when next quarter is reported in 2016Q1.
It does get cheaper; however, the iPhone overall does not. The savings is invested in some other part or the flash storage type is upgraded (faster) and it ends up the same price or more expensive.
This must be the case, because the price of an iPhone has remained stable over the years, despite all the (expensive?) goodies they keep adding to each subsequent new model.
only problem with making 32GB $650 is it will sell to well. Probably 50%+ will buy the 32GB phone.
Plus there are other costs that go up: shipping, direct labor, admin, R&D, ect.
16GB is fine right now. It was never meant to be a phone for everyone.
While this may be true, the 16GB option will eventually go away just like all those 20GB 3.5" HDDs.
Hope you are right.
But even if they blowout 2016 Q1 Wall Street can simply kick the can down the road. They can simply say the results were so GREAT that no way Apple can beat it next year.
Damned if you do. Damned if you don't.
I know people say consumer tech prices always go down. That is true. But not true for cutting edge tech. Look at TV's. Cutting edge TV's cost more than they were in 1990's. Cutting edge speaker and amps cost more than in the 1990's. iPhone is cutting edge tech. Its the most advanced computer device on the planet.
Tell that to a former customer of mine who paid $14,000 for a 42" Fujitsu plasma 15 years ago, that most $500 42" models positively smoke today.
Thats why I said cutting edge tech. You need to compare cutting edge tech from 1990's to cutting edge tech of 2015.
Cutting edge tech of the 1990's was a flat screen 50 inch plasma. $15,000
Today cutting edge tech is 8k TV that cost $100,000
You can't compare prices of old technology to current technology. Just like an iPhone 3G is going to cost you only $100 today.
Smartphones have a long way to go until innovation no longer yields tangable benefits to the general population:
1. better battery life. Long way to go here.
2. Smaller footprint. Small bezel and Touch ID built into screen.
3. Faster CPU/GPU. Still got a ways to go to reach speeds that people want
4. Stronger screens
I wasn't disagreeing with you, just relaying a story.
Regarding smartphones, I would also agree that there's still some worthwhile innovations left to be discovered/implemented/perfected.
To me all signs point up.
Good post.
Today's AAPL gives a new meaning to the famous "reality distortion field" at Apple:
Reality = High profit + High growth + Exciting R&D targets
Distortion Field (Wall Street) = "Doomed"
Ya' know ...
Since you mentioned iCloud -- it would be "it just works" brilliant if Apple offered enough free iCloud storage to backup every iDevice you buy (currently own).
They could [easily *] incorporate that into the iPhone Upgrade Program.
* I say easily because we bought 4 iPhone 6S (twice) using the iPhone Upgrade Program -- there was nothing easy about it.
IMO, as an Apple Customer and AAPL Shareholder, the Upgrade Program is a brilliant concept, but [almost everything about it] is poorly implemented. I spent several hours on the phone to Apple Support and told them I wouldn't post any details until they had a chance to get their kit together -- when the Rose Gold becomes available, we plan on buying another.
Tick-tock tick-tock tick-tock tick-tock ...
Do you understand trends? Popularity of the 16GB model declined 17.5% year over year. It's good for Apple, though, since those sales will go into the higher-margin models.
16/64/128 is killer market positioning for apple.
16gb - gov/education/business users; kids; old people who only use email/web
64gb - tech savy users; media/app/gaming consumers
128gb - wealthy; media hoarders; early adopters; enthusiasts
You forgot 16gb - "gold tax". I'm sure there are people who would have bought the 6 instead of the 6S because it's $100 cheaper, and not much of a compromise for the average user, except they can't get it in gold -- which is more important than any other aspect of the phone to them.
It's the Black MacBook all over again.
What's even more interesting to me is that the 5C continued to be offered in 5 colors after it became the "giveaway" phone, but they eliminated the gold option in the 5S, reserving it solely for the flagship, despite introducing the rose gold option.
128gb - how about media creators; 4k is known to take up more than a few bits and bytes of space ya know. Also portfolios, PDFs, assorted project files and media collections like Lightroom.
That beef aside... or a side of beef... I do agree that Apple has the market rather cleverly covered from snout to the tip of the fly (Android) swattering tail. This should be a running bull market, not what we're experincing.
128gb - how about media creators; 4k is known to take up more than a few bits and bytes of space ya know. Also portfolios, PDFs, assorted project files and media collections like Lightroom.
And that's why there needs to be a 256gb model. If Apple made it now, I'm sure a lot of those 128GB 6S customers would have bought it. And you can add disgruntled iPod Classic users to that category as well.
16GB clearly makes no sense for the capabilities of the 6S. Honestly, anybody who buys a 16GB 6S does not care what's extra under the hood over the $100 cheaper 6, and in my mind is mainly buying it to get the Gold and Rose Gold options only. I'd love to see the individual model data, but I know that will never happen, so I guess we'll never really know for certain.
Nope. Not true at all.
While a 256gb might very well be purchased by some users, first and foremost I'm sure there's other technical or supply considerations why Apple doesn't offer this yet. Technical, since ask yourself why Apple would turn down a possible $200 upgrade? Oh... you thought only $100 extra? I doubt that very much.
As for the 16gb debate, I have more a few clients that fit in the category that @schlack listed that are more than happy and don't want/need/use anymore than a few GBs. The 6s fits their needs and use perfectly, including that they can be fashionable and have the best mobile OS and spead at the same time.
Here's what Apple needs to do: keep on letting their knowledge of the numbers and their engineers create the matrix. There's not a person here unless they work at Apple with both those resources at their fingertips that has a clue... or even a say... what "Apple should do". We're not talking about a shoddy, unprofitable, throw it at the wall and see what sticks, company here like you would like them to be for some strange reason.
Hate to say it, but that last sentance is one of the most asinine things I've ever read on these forums.
Pat yourself on the back for a job well done :rolleyes:
Considering that just one function of the iPhone is kicking the bejezus out of another technology market, namely camera DSLR manufacturers... using optics, processors and overall component size 100's of times smaller, and against prices 3-6 times that of the iPhone, that also does literally 1000's of things rather than just 2...well...
...you're all just about the most despicable bunch of non-grateful, lack of understanding, whiners and wieners group of consumers on the planet. Truly clueless and lacking in the ability to be amazed at any price.