Ok I'm confused. I thought the whole point of the Surface was to show you could have your cake and eat it too, that a "tablet" could replace your laptop. Yet today Microsoft announces a Surface laptop. What happened to that whole convergence thing?
Convergence is so 2013, today we're going with divergence.
I agree that Surface is simply a form factor play on the touch screen notebook PC. If you need a highly portable PC and can live with a floppy keyboard, smallish screen, fan noise, and the need to use it on a hard surface rather than a lap, the Surface will fit you nicely. But nothing looks more dorkish than a Surface sitting on a desk with wires coming out of all of its orifices so it can function as a desktop PC with mouse, keyboard, and big screen. I hope the Surface Pro 4 addresses the issues I listed above. I've seen quite a few people using Surface Pro PCs and I've found that once the wow factor associated with "look how much PC they've been able to stuff into the slab" wears out they' realize they'd actually be happier with a traditional form factor PC that's exacly like the MacBook Air or the new MacBook.
I think Apple could decimate much of Surface's market potential by updating the MacBook Air with better specs, force touch, Touch ID, and of course Retina. Yes, Touch ID. No reason not to have Touch ID on Macs for logging in, app passwords, and online purchases using Apple Pay. Adding Touch ID + NFC initiated tethering between MacBooks and iPhones would round out the perfect storm to cripple Surface. Even more than it already is.
I'm not sure where the iPad Pro fits in the mix. I'm more inclined to believe that it's going to be the perfect platform for applications and workflows that are heavily or even exclusively touch, gesture, and drawing based. I still don't see the need for a dedicated keyboard with an iPad. When I really need a keyboard I want a really good keyboard and none of the cover based ones that I've tried has impressed me. The standard Apple Bluetooth keyboard has been fine since iOS supported Bluetooth. But we'll have to wait to see whether the iPad Pros fabric keyboard rises to the challenge.
I agree that Surface is simply a form factor play on the touch screen notebook PC. If you need a highly portable PC and can live with a floppy keyboard, smallish screen, fan noise, and the need to use it on a hard surface rather than a lap, the Surface will fit you nicely. But nothing looks more dorkish than a Surface sitting on a desk with wires coming out of all of its orifices so it can function as a desktop PC with mouse, keyboard, and big screen. I hope the Surface Pro 4 addresses the issues I listed above. I've seen quite a few people using Surface Pro PCs and I've found that once the wow factor associated with "look how much PC they've been able to stuff into the slab" wears out they' realize they'd actually be happier with a traditional form factor PC that's exacly like the MacBook Air or the new MacBook.
I think Apple could decimate much of Surface's market potential by updating the MacBook Air with better specs, force touch, Touch ID, and of course Retina. Yes, Touch ID. No reason not to have Touch ID on Macs for logging in, app passwords, and online purchases using Apple Pay. Adding Touch ID + NFC initiated tethering between MacBooks and iPhones would round out the perfect storm to cripple Surface. Even more than it already is.
I'm not sure where the iPad Pro fits in the mix. I'm more inclined to believe that it's going to be the perfect platform for applications and workflows that are heavily or even exclusively touch, gesture, and drawing based. I still don't see the need for a dedicated keyboard with an iPad. When I really need a keyboard I want a really good keyboard and none of the cover based ones that I've tried has impressed me. The standard Apple Bluetooth keyboard has been fine since iOS supported Bluetooth. But we'll have to wait to see whether the iPad Pros fabric keyboard rises to the challenge.
I agree with Macs getting TouchID. That's an idea whose time has come.
On a side note, after seeing the Surface Book that was released today, I have to say that product looks phenomenal. I never cared much for the Surface Pro but the Surface Book looks great. Kudos to MS.
"Anyone want a hot cup of "Toxic Hellstew"? Check out some of our recent security issues like with Xcode."
You mean when some Chinese hackers posted a MODIFIED VERSION of XCode onto a 3rd party cloud share that was then illegally downloaded by developers and used to write apps that were infected? That security issue? That was due to factors entirely external to Apple (although still scratching my head about how the apps made it through the App store approval process).
What's telling is that they still don't get it: it's the software, stupid. Apple's iPad Pro is a tablet, with software built for a tablet. The Slate is a desktop OS grafted to a mobile OS. Frankenputer.
Exactly. It's all about the OS being built for a purpose. iPad Pro does not try to to. OSX.
"Anyone want a hot cup of "Toxic Hellstew"? Check out some of our recent security issues like with Xcode."
You mean when some Chinese hackers posted a MODIFIED VERSION of XCode onto a 3rd party cloud share that was then illegally downloaded by developers and used to write apps that were infected? That security issue? That was due to factors entirely external to Apple (although still scratching my head about how the apps made it through the App store approval process).
A lot of MS hate in this thread. As a user of both platforms, I have to admit I'm pretty taken with my Surface 3 Pro. I use it as my daily work machine, and with a docking station it works great as a full desktop, and when travelling it's an outstanding mobile device. I had used Macbook Pros for quite a few years prior, but frankly I like the Surface Pro experience more. I had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor.
That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me. I also prefer iPad for entertainment, but have never found it to be a compelling productivity device.
A lot of MS hate in this thread. As a user of both platforms, I have to admit I'm pretty taken with my Surface 3 Pro. I use it as my daily work machine, and with a docking station it works great as a full desktop, and when travelling it's an outstanding mobile device. I had used Macbook Pros for quite a few years prior, but frankly I like the Surface Pro experience more. I had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor.
That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me. I also prefer iPad for entertainment, but have never found it to be a compelling productivity device.
Not gonna lie, that Surface Book looks pretty sweet. Arguably the best thing in the keynote today.
Too bad they couldn't have chosen a name without "Book" in it.
Regardless of the name it looks like a really nice piece of kit.
Yeah, to your point there will always be security issues with any vendor; however, my point is simply that compared to the many issues in the Android and Windows worlds, iOS malware has always been VERY limited in scope and barely a blip on the radar.
So basically Microsoft is once again turning their OEM partners into the providers of cheap junk. These aren't 'reference' devices. This is a real business for Microsoft that they intend to make money off of. So Dell, HP, Lenovo etc. are left fighting for scraps. And OEMs that aren't in the enterprise space are really screwed.
Convergence is so 2013, today we're going with divergence.
I don't get the point of the Surface Pro and this new device. Seems like with both of them the screen detaches and it's touch and running the same OS. Where is the product differentiation?
Wait, what? Is the unnamed guy at MS saying the iPad Pro is a "converged" device? If so, it's not. It's running iOS, not Windows desktop shoehorned into a tablet.
Convergence is so 2013, today we're going with divergence.
I don't get the point of the Surface Pro and this new device. Seems like with both of them the screen detaches and it's touch and running the same OS. Where is the product differentiation?
It is the "throw everything against the wall and hope something will stick" approach.
Curious, does it's 2x faster speed have to do with it using the latest Intel chips and the MBP simply not being updated yet?
I'm not understanding your comment including a reference to the MBP not being updated because Skylake not being available for its TDP class at this point.
A lot of MS hate in this thread. As a user of both platforms, I have to admit I'm pretty taken with my Surface 3 Pro. I use it as my daily work machine, and with a docking station it works great as a full desktop, and when travelling it's an outstanding mobile device. I had used Macbook Pros for quite a few years prior, but frankly I like the Surface Pro experience more. I had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor.
That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me. I also prefer iPad for entertainment, but have never found it to be a compelling productivity device.
" had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor."
Couldn't agree more.
"That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me."
Comments
i was just thinking how 3 year ago i said it was 2012, how bloody wrong I was, I just checked the calendar and its 2015 !!
Convergence is so 2013, today we're going with divergence.
I think Apple could decimate much of Surface's market potential by updating the MacBook Air with better specs, force touch, Touch ID, and of course Retina. Yes, Touch ID. No reason not to have Touch ID on Macs for logging in, app passwords, and online purchases using Apple Pay. Adding Touch ID + NFC initiated tethering between MacBooks and iPhones would round out the perfect storm to cripple Surface. Even more than it already is.
I'm not sure where the iPad Pro fits in the mix. I'm more inclined to believe that it's going to be the perfect platform for applications and workflows that are heavily or even exclusively touch, gesture, and drawing based. I still don't see the need for a dedicated keyboard with an iPad. When I really need a keyboard I want a really good keyboard and none of the cover based ones that I've tried has impressed me. The standard Apple Bluetooth keyboard has been fine since iOS supported Bluetooth. But we'll have to wait to see whether the iPad Pros fabric keyboard rises to the challenge.
I agree that Surface is simply a form factor play on the touch screen notebook PC. If you need a highly portable PC and can live with a floppy keyboard, smallish screen, fan noise, and the need to use it on a hard surface rather than a lap, the Surface will fit you nicely. But nothing looks more dorkish than a Surface sitting on a desk with wires coming out of all of its orifices so it can function as a desktop PC with mouse, keyboard, and big screen. I hope the Surface Pro 4 addresses the issues I listed above. I've seen quite a few people using Surface Pro PCs and I've found that once the wow factor associated with "look how much PC they've been able to stuff into the slab" wears out they' realize they'd actually be happier with a traditional form factor PC that's exacly like the MacBook Air or the new MacBook.
I think Apple could decimate much of Surface's market potential by updating the MacBook Air with better specs, force touch, Touch ID, and of course Retina. Yes, Touch ID. No reason not to have Touch ID on Macs for logging in, app passwords, and online purchases using Apple Pay. Adding Touch ID + NFC initiated tethering between MacBooks and iPhones would round out the perfect storm to cripple Surface. Even more than it already is.
I'm not sure where the iPad Pro fits in the mix. I'm more inclined to believe that it's going to be the perfect platform for applications and workflows that are heavily or even exclusively touch, gesture, and drawing based. I still don't see the need for a dedicated keyboard with an iPad. When I really need a keyboard I want a really good keyboard and none of the cover based ones that I've tried has impressed me. The standard Apple Bluetooth keyboard has been fine since iOS supported Bluetooth. But we'll have to wait to see whether the iPad Pros fabric keyboard rises to the challenge.
I agree with Macs getting TouchID. That's an idea whose time has come.
On a side note, after seeing the Surface Book that was released today, I have to say that product looks phenomenal. I never cared much for the Surface Pro but the Surface Book looks great. Kudos to MS.
Let's see... the XBox One and the Surface 3 Pro were both very big hits.
"Anyone want a hot cup of "Toxic Hellstew"? Check out some of our recent security issues like with Xcode."
You mean when some Chinese hackers posted a MODIFIED VERSION of XCode onto a 3rd party cloud share that was then illegally downloaded by developers and used to write apps that were infected? That security issue? That was due to factors entirely external to Apple (although still scratching my head about how the apps made it through the App store approval process).
Exactly. It's all about the OS being built for a purpose. iPad Pro does not try to to. OSX.
"Anyone want a hot cup of "Toxic Hellstew"? Check out some of our recent security issues like with Xcode."
You mean when some Chinese hackers posted a MODIFIED VERSION of XCode onto a 3rd party cloud share that was then illegally downloaded by developers and used to write apps that were infected? That security issue? That was due to factors entirely external to Apple (although still scratching my head about how the apps made it through the App store approval process).
Yep. That security issue.
See post #17.
That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me. I also prefer iPad for entertainment, but have never found it to be a compelling productivity device.
Therein lies the rub.
A lot of MS hate in this thread. As a user of both platforms, I have to admit I'm pretty taken with my Surface 3 Pro. I use it as my daily work machine, and with a docking station it works great as a full desktop, and when travelling it's an outstanding mobile device. I had used Macbook Pros for quite a few years prior, but frankly I like the Surface Pro experience more. I had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor.
That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me. I also prefer iPad for entertainment, but have never found it to be a compelling productivity device.
Not gonna lie, that Surface Book looks pretty sweet. Arguably the best thing in the keynote today.
Too bad they couldn't have chosen a name without "Book" in it.
Regardless of the name it looks like a really nice piece of kit.
Yeah, to your point there will always be security issues with any vendor; however, my point is simply that compared to the many issues in the Android and Windows worlds, iOS malware has always been VERY limited in scope and barely a blip on the radar.
Not gonna lie, that Surface Book looks pretty sweet. Arguably the best thing in the keynote today.
Too bad they couldn't have chosen a name without "Book" in it.
Regardless of the name it looks like a really nice piece of kit.
Yeah, I agree. The name is terrible... I mean, we know they're trying to steal Apple's thunder, they really don't have to be so obvious about it.
Convergence is so 2013, today we're going with divergence.
I don't get the point of the Surface Pro and this new device. Seems like with both of them the screen detaches and it's touch and running the same OS. Where is the product differentiation?Convergence is so 2013, today we're going with divergence.
I don't get the point of the Surface Pro and this new device. Seems like with both of them the screen detaches and it's touch and running the same OS. Where is the product differentiation?
It is the "throw everything against the wall and hope something will stick" approach.
Not gonna lie, that Surface Book looks pretty sweet. Arguably the best thing in the keynote today.
Curious, does it's 2x faster speed have to do with it using the latest Intel chips and the MBP simply not being updated yet?
I'm not understanding your comment including a reference to the MBP not being updated because Skylake not being available for its TDP class at this point.
A lot of MS hate in this thread. As a user of both platforms, I have to admit I'm pretty taken with my Surface 3 Pro. I use it as my daily work machine, and with a docking station it works great as a full desktop, and when travelling it's an outstanding mobile device. I had used Macbook Pros for quite a few years prior, but frankly I like the Surface Pro experience more. I had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor.
That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me. I also prefer iPad for entertainment, but have never found it to be a compelling productivity device.
" had been tempted by the new Macbook, but the new Surface Book just won me over. Far more power, more connectivity, in a small and compelling form factor."
Couldn't agree more.
"That said, MS will have a hard time prying my iPhone away from me."
That makes two of us.