First look: Apple Smart Keyboard for iPad Pro

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 60
    steveau wrote: »
    Input speed depends on lots of factors, particularly training. According to Wikipedia average typing speeds are 40 wpm and gun typists achieve 120 wpm. The average handwriting speed seems to be around 25-30 wpm, but stenographists can achieve 350 wpm. Thanks for promoting me to look that up, but I don't think that speed is the point. If you want speed you'll use a laptop or desktop with a key board, the iPad is for fun and creativity and now the iPad Pro is adding the ability to be an intelligent clipboard. So for iPads handwriting recognition (HWR) should be more than enough.

    nope. a typist on an iPad keyboard will be faster than non-stenographers writing with a pencil on it. always.
  • Reply 22 of 60
    friedmud wrote: »
    @steveau No. I can type a bajillion times faster than I can hand write words. Keyboards are still a useful tool.

    And, the notes I do take with my Pencil I don't want converted to text.... they are drawings and graphs and math: stuff I can't type.

    Handwriting OCR is one thing I don't miss at all on the iPad Pro.

    I'm not suggesting that people who want a keyboard shouldn't be able to have one, I'm simply saying that some of us would like to have handwriting recognition as an option.
  • Reply 23 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member

    I thought they sweated the details. It feels better than it looks, or sounds in the descriptions. I heard "cloth" but it feels like it's something else. Hopefully something very durable over time.

    It's a woven nylon, or some such material, which is very durable. Likely it's impregnated with a chemical that waterproofs it and resists dirt. From some pics of the tear down, it also looks as though the back has a thin layer of something bonded to it that also prevents water intrusion.
    dreyfus2 wrote: »
    If thin and light are one's priorities there is nothing wrong with Apple's keyboard (other than lack of international layouts and, less important, color choices).

    Personally, I have not used a keyboard with the iPad (regular size) a lot, but I did return my Logitech slim cover at that time, because without backlighting it proved to be useless in many situations (typing in bed, typing in a pub etc.) and got the Zagg keyboard instead. Using that I also came to appreciate the 135 degrees of screen adjustment; you simply want a different angle on your lap, a couch table or a bistro table. Having learned that lesson, I will wait for their model.

    You're not supposed to be trying in a pub. You're supposed to be drinking, considering which, typing would be a hopeless task anyway.
  • Reply 24 of 60
    nolamacguy wrote: »
    nope. a typist on an iPad keyboard will be faster than non-stenographers writing with a pencil on it. always.
    If you are using it as a laptop replacement OK, but not if you're standing up or lounging on a sofa using the iPad like a tablet.
  • Reply 25 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    mr o wrote: »
    The iPad Smart Keyboard Cover should actually be a Smart Keyboard Case where the keyboard flips into the case when on the go. Notice how the flat cover would eridacte - if the keyboard sinks into the case - the unsightly bulge of the Smart Keyboard Cover you got now:

    <img alt="" class="lightbox-enabled" data-id="65612" data-type="61" src="http://forums.appleinsider.com/content/type/61/id/65612/width/350/height/700/flags/LL" style="; width: 350px; height: 350px">
     VS <img alt="" class="lightbox-enabled" data-id="65615" data-type="61" src="http://forums.appleinsider.com/content/type/61/id/65615/width/350/height/700/flags/LL" style="; width: 350px; height: 62px">


    The iPad should also be used flat -see picture -  at all times, not upright at a fixed angle. Flat surfaces offer a better affordance for touch interfaces, obliterating the need of a mouse. Imagine a keyboard which you can fold out of the case. The smart case would put the keyboard in an angle: 

    <img alt="" class="lightbox-enabled" data-id="65610" data-type="61" src="http://forums.appleinsider.com/content/type/61/id/65610/width/350/height/700/flags/LL" style="; width: 350px; height: 350px">

    I don't understand what you're saying. How would the keyboard "sink" into the case? For typing, the partly horizontal position is great, but it's not good for everything. Viewing video isn't great that way. Drawing is great. Games are so so, esp. with the controllers.

    I've got a different way of doing in my dining room table that would make most people shiver. If the software on the site would cooperate, I'd take a pic and show it, but I've haven't been able to use pics here from iOS for a while.
  • Reply 26 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    steveau wrote: »
    Input speed depends on lots of factors, particularly training. According to Wikipedia average typing speeds are 40 wpm and gun typists achieve 120 wpm. The average handwriting speed seems to be around 25-30 wpm, but stenographists can achieve 350 wpm. Thanks for promoting me to look that up, but I don't think that speed is the point. If you want speed you'll use a laptop or desktop with a key board, the iPad is for fun and creativity and now the iPad Pro is adding the ability to be an intelligent clipboard. So for iPads handwriting recognition (HWR) should be more than enough.

    This is difficult to say. Keyboards have changed drastically over the last 150 years. Hard to believe they've been around that long. My mom's old Underwood, has (yes, I've still got it) a keyboard that was considered to be a standard for almost 50 years. But today, almost no one would want to type on it.

    Stenographers can type 350 because they're not typing words.
  • Reply 27 of 60
    mr omr o Posts: 1,046member
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by melgross View Post





    I don't understand what you're saying. How would the keyboard "sink" into the case? For typing, the partly horizontal position is great, but it's not good for everything. Viewing video isn't great that way. Drawing is great. Games are so so, esp. with the controllers.



    I've got a different way of doing in my dining room table that would make most people shiver. If the software on the site would cooperate, I'd take a pic and show it, but I've haven't been able to use pics here from iOS for a while.



    If the Smartcase would have a slightly higher edge, then it will encompass the keyboard if you flip it over into the case. When you want to use the ipad, you flip out the keyboard. 

     

    I love the horizontal typing position. Especially during meetings, it is a lot friendlier than the laptops with their upright screens covering the face of the participants.

  • Reply 28 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member

    My dining room iPad, and now, iPad Pro, set-up. Hopefully some people here will recognize what its sitting on.

     

  • Reply 29 of 60
    virtuavirtua Posts: 209member
    I wasn't going to buy one until I tried one in store - think it's really good and went and bought one. Think you have to try it to understand how good it is :)
  • Reply 30 of 60
    Originally Posted by Steveau View Post

    If the iPad Pro had built-in handwriting recognition it wouldn't need a keyboard, only an aPencil.



    Typing is still faster than writing.

     

    Wouldn't hand writing that converted to text on the fly, like the Newton 2100, be much more natural than hunching over a keyboard and pecking away at the keys?


     

    Typing on the screen is probably better than this, even.

  • Reply 31 of 60
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by melgross View Post





    This is difficult to say. Keyboards have changed drastically over the last 150 years. Hard to believe they've been around that long. My mom's old Underwood, has (yes, I've still got it) a keyboard that was considered to be a standard for almost 50 years. But today, almost no one would want to type on it.



    Stenographers can type 350 because they're not typing words.

     

    Stenography is the machine version of being able to type at the speed required to transcribe someone speaking (courts are the most famous).  There is of course a shorthanded writing standard that was common for secretaries.   Originally stenographic transcripts had to be retyped so people can read it... of course it is all technology now.  Stenography though is not widely used outside of very specific use cases.  

     

    Typing on a Qwerty keyboard by an expert can reach 120 words per minute.

    Typing on a Dvorak keyboard is more like 200 words per minute.  

    Stenography obviously would be faster since it is short-hand.  

     

    I don't type long documents so my speed tops out at around 60 words per minute.

     

    I would guess I could maybe write between 25 and 30 words a minute, but it would not last long since I suffer from cramping while writing... something I do not suffer from while typing.   Writing on a tablet of course would be slower....  Then on top of that they handwriting recognition would be error prone -- which would additionally slow things if you require transcription into unicode.  

     

    Where handwriting is a benefit is when you want to doodle or draw, or if you were not sitting at a table since you would typically have to hunt and peck with one hand while holding the tablet for another.  

     

    It all really depends on the use case.  

     

    Also understand that some people have never really been able to type (though less so now) -- so handwriting for the older generation that did not grow up with computers in the workplace would be better than typing.  

     

    I would find a use for both.  I like having the ability to correspond with a remote meeting (technical) using my iPad as a remote eWhiteboard and writing and drawing on a whiteboard/display half way around the world.  

  • Reply 32 of 60
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

     



    Typing is still faster than writing.

     

    Typing on the screen is probably better than this, even.




    Typing on screen means that I have to give almost 100% attention to the screen or I mistype (on screen there are no tactile reminders for the home keys, "F" & "J", as there are on physical keyboard). With handwriting recognition on the Newton I could give at least 50% of my attention to the speaker, because I can write without looking at the page/tablet all the time. The speaker's body language, and the body language of others in the room are very important to me. I could record the whole conversation and use speech-to-text, but then I would have to spend time reviewing the whole transcript and cutting it down to the essentials and I would still have to take notes about ideas, tactics, etc. by pen and paper. As I've said before, I'm happy if what you are using gives you the power to be your best, but - somewhat selfishly - I also want Apple to give me the power to be my best. I'm not asking for pie in the sky, just what the Newton used to give me two decades ago, enhanced for 2015.

  • Reply 33 of 60
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bkkcanuck View Post

     

     

    Stenography is the machine version of being able to type at the speed required to transcribe someone speaking (courts are the most famous).  There is of course a shorthanded writing standard that was common for secretaries.   Originally stenographic transcripts had to be retyped so people can read it... of course it is all technology now.  Stenography though is not widely used outside of very specific use cases.  

     

    Typing on a Qwerty keyboard by an expert can reach 120 words per minute.

    Typing on a Dvorak keyboard is more like 200 words per minute.  

    Stenography obviously would be faster since it is short-hand.  

     

    I don't type long documents so my speed tops out at around 60 words per minute.

     

    I would guess I could maybe write between 25 and 30 words a minute, but it would not last long since I suffer from cramping while writing... something I do not suffer from while typing.   Writing on a tablet of course would be slower....  Then on top of that they handwriting recognition would be error prone -- which would additionally slow things if you require transcription into unicode.  

     

    Where handwriting is a benefit is when you want to doodle or draw, or if you were not sitting at a table since you would typically have to hunt and peck with one hand while holding the tablet for another.  

     

    It all really depends on the use case.  

     

    Also understand that some people have never really been able to type (though less so now) -- so handwriting for the older generation that did not grow up with computers in the workplace would be better than typing.  

     

    I would find a use for both.  I like having the ability to correspond with a remote meeting (technical) using my iPad as a remote eWhiteboard and writing and drawing on a whiteboard/display half way around the world.  




    It's not about speed, it's about flexibility, convenience, quality. The flexibility to use an on screen keyboard, a physical keyboard or a stylus (plus your finger when fine lines are not required), the convenience to take notes with a pen in almost any location or position (standing, lounging, in meeting with the pad on your lap, whatever, and the ability to concentrate on the idea (as you say doodles with words, diagrams, sketches, mind maps, whatever tumbles out of your head when you are in creative mode. Remember "The Power to Be Your Best!"

  • Reply 34 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    bkkcanuck wrote: »
    Stenography is the machine version of being able to type at the speed required to transcribe someone speaking (courts are the most famous).  There is of course a shorthanded writing standard that was common for secretaries.   Originally stenographic transcripts had to be retyped so people can read it... of course it is all technology now.  Stenography though is not widely used outside of very specific use cases.  

    Typing on a Qwerty keyboard by an expert can reach 120 words per minute.
    Typing on a Dvorak keyboard is more like 200 words per minute.  
    Stenography obviously would be faster since it is short-hand.  

    I don't type long documents so my speed tops out at around 60 words per minute.

    I would guess I could maybe write between 25 and 30 words a minute, but it would not last long since I suffer from cramping while writing... something I do not suffer from while typing.   Writing on a tablet of course would be slower....  Then on top of that they handwriting recognition would be error prone -- which would additionally slow things if you require transcription into unicode.  

    Where handwriting is a benefit is when you want to doodle or draw, or if you were not sitting at a table since you would typically have to hunt and peck with one hand while holding the tablet for another.  

    It all really depends on the use case.  

    Also understand that some people have never really been able to type (though less so now) -- so handwriting for the older generation that did not grow up with computers in the workplace would be better than typing.  

    I would find a use for both.  I like having the ability to correspond with a remote meeting (technical) using my iPad as a remote eWhiteboard and writing and drawing on a whiteboard/display half way around the world.  

    I was never a very fast typist. My speed was a bit over 70 WPM. It's slower now, as I no longer do the publishing work that I used to. Still, I can type 2,000 words a day just from all the posting I do in various forums. The words add up more quickly than one might think. I do most of my typing on my iPad, and now, on the Pro. My speed, as measured on the iPad was about 45 WPM, but now that I've had the Pro since Thursday evening, last week, I've gotten used to the new virtual keyboard, which is much better. I'm now typing at 55 WPM. That's fast enough for me. Possibly with more practice on this new keyboard, I'll pick up a few more WPM. How much faster would I type on a mechanical keyboard? I'll find out if I decide to buy one for this. For my Mac Pro, I can type just a bit faster, about 62 WPM. Not a big enough difference that it matters to me.
  • Reply 35 of 60
    melgross wrote: »

    What in the world is that?
  • Reply 36 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    And, hey! My pencils just now came in. Opening up one box now.
  • Reply 37 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    What in the world is that?

    Shame on you! That's the bottom of an old E-Mac. My friend needed to take the drive out, which was buried inside. The unit had stopped working, and so it was going out. After I took it apart, I found the two speakers were mounted in nice polycarbonate chambers connected together. I bought a stereo amp kit, and I had a nice power supply. So I took it to my shop downstairs and cut the case the way you see, in the front. I mounted the power supply and amp on the bottom, in the back. I made a couple of struts out of the aluminum of the unneeded chassis, and my iPad sits where you see it. I plug the amp in instead of the built in speaker. Now, I really don't need it. I'm going to make a simple stand for the Pro.

    When I type, I have this about 7 inches back from the edge of the table, and rest my forearms on the rounded edge. It's works pretty well, surprisingly.
  • Reply 38 of 60
    melgrossmelgross Posts: 33,510member
    The Pencil is great. It's just like using a real one, except for the feel across the screen, which is pretty nice. I can do whoever I can do with a real drawing Pencil. I'm really impressed. I've just tried in quickly in Notes though. So no brush, though the pen and marker work very well.
  • Reply 39 of 60
    melgross wrote: »
    The Pencil is great. It's just like using a real one, except for the feel across the screen, which is pretty nice. I can do whoever I can do with a real drawing Pencil. I'm really impressed. I've just tried in quickly in Notes though. So no brush, though the pen and marker work very well.

    I recommend the apps Procreate and Sketch Club.
  • Reply 40 of 60
    melgross wrote: »
    Shame on you! That's the bottom of an old E-Mac. My friend needed to take the drive out, which was buried inside. The unit had stopped working, and so it was going out. After I took it apart, I found the two speakers were mounted in nice polycarbonate chambers connected together. I bought a stereo amp kit, and I had a nice power supply. So I took it to my shop downstairs and cut the case the way you see, in the front. I mounted the power supply and amp on the bottom, in the back. I made a couple of struts out of the aluminum of the unneeded chassis, and my iPad sits where you see it. I plug the amp in instead of the built in speaker. Now, I really don't need it. I'm going to make a simple stand for the Pro.

    When I type, I have this about 7 inches back from the edge of the table, and rest my forearms on the rounded edge. It's works pretty well, surprisingly.

    I have no personal experience with the E-Mac. Never saw one in real life.
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