Lawsuit seeks more than $5M from Apple for slowing older iPhones with iOS 9 upgrade

124

Comments

  • Reply 61 of 91
    People are focusing on the software but what about the hardware? iPhone 6 and 6 Plus absolutely should have come with 2GB RAM. Same with the first iPad Air. How many of these devices run poorly because Apple has been stingy with RAM?
    The 9.2.1 beta is the first one to finally fix the animation lags on the iPad Air (and I presume the Mini 2 as well). Shame it took so long. And yeah, RAM pressure is tight. 
  • Reply 62 of 91
    1. You weren’t forced to update.

    2. Old hardware can’t run new software as fast as new hardware can.

    3. These people should be individually fined the full price of their phones for being this stupid.
    I work mostly as an enterprise iOS developer, currently on a project with 400 deployed iPad AIR 1 devices in an enterprise environment. iOS9 on these units is horrible and the users are constantly reminded to upgrade to iOS9 even though we don't want them to. iOS 9 is clearly targeted at devices with 2GB+ RAM and that's mostly the problem. They've made it backward compatible with older devices but they probably should have forked iOS development for older devices but didn't presumably for cost reasons. I'm afraid this is Apple's cost-cutting for the sake of their bottom line coming back to bite them in the butt - they should have been adding more RAM to the iPhone devices a while back, at a minimum of iPhone 6. And I say that as someone who both works with Apple products and owns quite a lot of Apple stock.
  • Reply 63 of 91
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 7,478member
    To all those commenters hoping Apple loses this one... what are you going to do with that $5 iTunes coupon you will get as a settlement?
  • Reply 64 of 91
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member
    tomhayes said:
    1. You weren’t forced to update.

    2. Old hardware can’t run new software as fast as new hardware can.

    3. These people should be individually fined the full price of their phones for being this stupid.
    Or Apple should just allow people to revert to earlier iOS versions.

    Make it something where you have to click 6 "I'm sure" buttons, but make it possible.

    I could be destructive and reset the entire phone - might even lose contacts in the cloud or backups, but just let it happen. If they click "I'm sure" 6 times then let them revert.

    Oh sure and then let users sue when their devices running iOS Ancient get hacked. Nope.

    Users are the last people on earth that should be deciding what version of the OS they are running at any given time.
  • Reply 65 of 91
    pmzpmz Posts: 3,433member

    It seems like most of their arguments are basically conspiratorial in nature.  That is, they require Apple to be a sort of underhanded "evil" corporation to be true and repeat conspiracy theory nonsense about Apple's purported intentions and aims.  

    The funny part is, I'm sure its true...its just not "evil" as they pretend. Apple is going to write new software and deliver to as many devices as possible. Newer hardware will run it the best. Oldest the worst. Apple knows and accepts this. If it causes some people to upgrade because they like the new software and want to run it as fast as possible...aww what a shame.
  • Reply 66 of 91
    lkrupp said:
    To all those commenters hoping Apple loses this one... what are you going to do with that $5 iTunes coupon you will get as a settlement?
    I don't support lawsuit, mostly because I don't think Apple intentionally tries to screw over users of older models. But let's face it, Apple LOVES showing off that pie chart where 80%+ of the iOS install base is running the latest software and Android and Windows 10 are under 20%. There is no question that Apple executives want as many devices on the latest software as possible. Of course it's not all marketing reasons but that's all the more reason to make the hardware as future proof as possible so more older devices can get software updates. 
  • Reply 67 of 91

    pmz said:

    It seems like most of their arguments are basically conspiratorial in nature.  That is, they require Apple to be a sort of underhanded "evil" corporation to be true and repeat conspiracy theory nonsense about Apple's purported intentions and aims.  

    The funny part is, I'm sure its true...its just not "evil" as they pretend. Apple is going to write new software and deliver to as many devices as possible. Newer hardware will run it the best. Oldest the worst. Apple knows and accepts this. If it causes some people to upgrade because they like the new software and want to run it as fast as possible...aww what a shame.
    What if it causes someone to say 'screw it' and go Android instead? I applaud Apple wanting to support as many devices as possible but not if there is a severe degradation in performance and user experience.
    dasanman69
  • Reply 68 of 91
    mac_128mac_128 Posts: 3,453member

    pmz said:

    The funny part is, I'm sure its true...its just not "evil" as they pretend. Apple is going to write new software and deliver to as many devices as possible. Newer hardware will run it the best. Oldest the worst. Apple knows and accepts this. If it causes some people to upgrade because they like the new software and want to run it as fast as possible...aww what a shame.
    What if it causes someone to say 'screw it' and go Android instead? I applaud Apple wanting to support as many devices as possible but not if there is a severe degradation in performance and user experience.
    Such concern trolling for Apple, spreading FUD. You know what that makes you, right?

    Do you really think you know better what to do than Apple? Clearly you must based on your comments in this thread.
    edited December 2015
  • Reply 69 of 91
    jdw said:
    I remember watching a guy Kawasaki speech once where he mentioned having to buy a new Mac about once every year because he personally felt it was slowing down and time to get a new one. He wasn't saying anything negative about the Mac, of course. He said it as an observation of fact, for him. I myself have been a Mac user since my 128K in 1984. I don't feel my experience has been quite as bad as Mr. Kawasaki's has apparently been, but I will agree that if you continue to update MacOS year by year, at some point your Mac will begin to feel slower and slower. And after about six years of doing that, performance can become quite painful. But the pain comes more swiftly and is perhaps more pronounced in the iOS world. I purchased my iPad 3 in 2012. Performance and responsiveness were acceptable through iOS 6. But from iOS 7, I began to experience lags and other performance slowdowns that were not resolved in iOS 8 or in iOS 9. In fact, iOS 8 and iOS 9 made performance slightly worse, despite the advertising. Unsurprisingly, I read similar experiences from others over and over again in the media.


    I have two iPads. iPad3 and whatever they call the latest one. The performance issues you allude to are exaggerated and/or can be fixed. What people fail to understand is that each iOS iteration is more efficient than the last. The performance drop you notice is the ADDITION of features and new functionality. Most of this stuff can be TURNED OFF through some options. I feel Apple users, in general, don't explore under the hood enough to tailor the tech for their specific need. You'll be surprised how easy it is to get a boost in performance and battery with a simple toggle. Also, whenever their is a major OS update, it is always wise to wipe your device clean and do a fresh install. Too many  old apps and settings will gum your stuff up. Imagine the size of the wifi or website password list stored on you devices. It has to scan all this useless stuff constantly. As if I'm ever going to need the wifi pw for the Double Tree in St Louis ever again, or the bluetooth for the rental car that week.
  • Reply 70 of 91
    The real problem device is the iPad 2. It is now extremely slow after many iOS updates. The original iPad which still runs iOS 5 feels positively zippy compared to the iPad 2 which used to run circles around it. This would not be a big deal if you could downgrade the iPad 2 to an earlier version of iOS but Apple does not allow that. Everything now feels slow on the iPad 2 even just browsing the App Store or scrolling through the home pages. It is quite hard to use. The iPhone 4s may be slower running iOS 9 but the iPhone 4 is positively glacial running iOS 7 which is where the big slowdown happened.
  • Reply 71 of 91
    eriamjheriamjh Posts: 1,148member
    1. You weren’t forced to update.
    Actually, some were.  If you had to restore or wipe a phone, iOS8 was no longer being signed and one could NOT restore to an older version.

    I don't what other people's experiences are, iOS9 was a total piece of sh*t on my 6+.  Rotation bugs, interface lags, utter. f*cking. crap.  It wasn't until 9.2 that it finally became as usable as iOS8.4.x was.  It's still not as good.  No added feature is worth degrading the ENTIRE experience.  

    I love my +, but iOS9 made me hate it.  

    I'm not upgrading my phone's OS for iOS10.  I'll let the new owner go through that hell.
  • Reply 72 of 91
    It was an Apple supported update by which in no means did they say it would slow your iPhone 4S down to a crawl, otherwise they would not have supported the 4S.
  • Reply 73 of 91
    honestly this is like the fifth time this has happened. I really don't see why Apple keeps pushing software that far back. Just release it for the new hardware and 2-3 back and screw folks that are mad that they aren't getting the latest tricks. They can get them when they update their hardware. Course that would probably get them sued as well
    Marketing.
    "70% of iPhone users have upgraded to iOS 9."
    "iOS 9 is the fastest upgrade in iOS history."
    etc...
  • Reply 74 of 91
    cropr said:
    I agree with the first 2 points.  But with the 3rd?  You cannot blame people for being stupid
    Of course you can. External forces are hardly the only way to get an education. 
  • Reply 75 of 91
    First, I would never dream of joining such a class-action lawsuit. A product sale is based on how the product performs now in its current condition and not how it is projected to perform in the future under entirely different conditions. Basically, the product should be judged on how it performed on the operating system that it was released with, iOS 5, plus any updates to correct any major functional or security issues. Second, no one buys a smartphone expecting to use it for like 10 years anyway. Smartphones aren't cars or refrigerators or even desktop computers. This product performed fine during the expected lifetime of the device. Even though they are very expensive, people buy smartphones expecting to replace them every 2-3 years, and many people get a new smartphone each year. That being said, I do have some sympathy for them. When my iPad 2 (2nd gen) updated to iOS 9, it slowed to a crawl and was almost unusable. Doing a factory reset and then a restore of my previously installed apps has it just barely fast enough to use. Meanwhile, another iPad 2 in my household - owned by a family member who is suspicious of updates due to a ton of bad experiences with them on Windows devices - remained on iOS 7 and it runs 3 times as fast. So, I gave my iPad away - with instructions to delete all the apps from the thing that weren't absolutely needed to give it another small performance boost - and got a cheap Android tablet to tide me over until I am in the market for a new tablet (which will be about a year or two). But even the person that I gave it to is reporting that iOS 9 causes occasional - just enough to be annoying - Internet interruptions on the thing, something that I confirmed that other iOS 9 users on the iPad 2 2nd gen are experiencing by doing searches. Alas, maybe an update will fix the wi-fi issue, but it almost certainly won't make the thing run faster. Yes, I could have used the same approach as my more cautious - and in retrospect wiser - family member and refused to upgrade, but I was excited about the new features, plus the upgrade from iOS 7 to iOS 8 only caused a slight (noticeable but small) performance hit. Another thing: the device sent reminders, notifications etc. to update constantly so I would have eventually done it anyway just to make them stop. Finally, Apple did not warn anybody that upgrading to iOS 9 would hammer the performance! So that's the somewhat frustrating part. They do all that they can to get you to upgrade without telling you that doing so will make your device run as slow as a 1997 Dell desktop AND without warning you. If they didn't prompt and encourage you to update all the time OR if warnings that updating will hammer the performance of older devices, it wouldn't have left me miffed in the least. As it is, this is definitely one thing that Apple could have - and should have - done better. I know the inevitable response: get a new device. But remember: Apple devices having a longer lifespan is one of the main selling points that Apple promotes in the first place. It costs more than competing devices upfront but you more than make up for it on the back end because it performs better for a lot longer, remember? That was a major selling point of theirs against Wintel for years and it has been shifted to the battle against Android now. And speaking of Android, Apple is quick to remind you that unlike the competition their devices actually get updates. To brag about how Apple devices last longer than Microsoft devices - and how old Apple devices outperform new Windows ones - on one had PLUS actually get updates when Android devices don't only to turn around on the other and tell an actual person in the wild who actually possesses and is trying to uses the same old, updated device that Apple promoted as a big enough advantage over the competition to justify the higher - and in some cases much higher - price but can't to "just buy a new device" is foul. That person could respond "If I wanted to get a new device every 3 years I could have gotten a Moto X for half the price!" and be to a degree justified, especially if that person is one of the vast majority of iPhone owners who uses their device in the same way as the owners of the better Android devices do: social networking, web surfing, email, casual photography and gaming, streaming music and movies etc. Oh, and if that person doesn't own a Mac or an Apple TV, which again the vast majority of iPhone owners do not.
  • Reply 76 of 91
    This one's an easy candidate for dismissal.


    tallest skil
  • Reply 77 of 91
    jddcjddc Posts: 10member
    1. You weren’t forced to update.

    2. Old hardware can’t run new software as fast as new hardware can.

    3. These people should be individually fined the full price of their phones for being this stupid.
    1. You weren’t forced to update.

    2. Old hardware can’t run new software as fast as new hardware can.

    3. These people should be individually fined the full price of their phones for being this stupid.
    this really does sum it up nicely if people found their old devices were running slower upon installation of the new iOS, then they could have downgraded to the older iOS before Apple stopped signing it but seriously.... you have an 'old technology' device and you think it will perform as well as new devices with an OS update? can these people walk and chew gun at the same time??
  • Reply 78 of 91
    jddcjddc Posts: 10member
    snova said:
    Its gotten quite bad now.. If only I would have known that they were going to bug me every single day to upgrade to latest iOS 9 update, then I would not have upgraded from iOS 8.  Very annoying. No way to turn it off as far as I can tell.  If iOS 10 comes out with this nagware, I won't upgrade. I am sick of the nagging and hopefully it will stop when they stop updating iOS 9. 
    you could have downgraded back to iOS 8 before Apple stopped signing it - its not Apple's fault that you thought by putting a new engine in a 1964 VW, that it would perform as well as a new VW... get serious people
  • Reply 79 of 91
    jddc said:
    snova said:
    Its gotten quite bad now.. If only I would have known that they were going to bug me every single day to upgrade to latest iOS 9 update, then I would not have upgraded from iOS 8.  Very annoying. No way to turn it off as far as I can tell.  If iOS 10 comes out with this nagware, I won't upgrade. I am sick of the nagging and hopefully it will stop when they stop updating iOS 9. 
    you could have downgraded back to iOS 8 before Apple stopped signing it - its not Apple's fault that you thought by putting a new engine in a 1964 VW, that it would perform as well as a new VW... get serious people
    JDDC:

    The real questions is WHY DOES APPLE STOP SIGNING OLDER VERSIONS????

    Forget the "Users are dumb" argument put forth above.
    What are the reasons? Marketing? Security? Less support costs?
  • Reply 80 of 91
    tomhayes said:
    The real questions is WHY DOES APPLE STOP SIGNING OLDER VERSIONS????

    Forget the "Users are dumb" argument put forth above.
    What are the reasons? Marketing? Security? Less support costs?
    I don’t see why any of that has to matter, as Apple allows the reinstallation of any older OS X version… forever. Anything that could have been installed on a given model of computer is able to be reinstalled.\

    Just state the software you support plainly on your site (by simply not giving users the option to select anything else when submitting requests or whatever) and be done with it, Apple. No one stupid is going to waste their time reinstalling an old OS, and it’s not like you don’t have a great user base with THEIR OWN FORUMS *cough* to handle troubleshooting for the people who want to do this and still have questions.
Sign In or Register to comment.