Another possible advantage of having a built in GPU is that they could be used with iOS devices. Could also have Airplay built into the display as well.
Agreed. I think it possible, perhaps likely, Apple is working on a whole new product category here. It makes sense they abandon "monitors" since the race to the bottom in those products is underway.
A USB-C plug from the monitor to the laptop that would provide power and USB connections via the monitor would be the perfect companion to the Macbook. But if it's price similar to the existing Apple display, it would be hard to see people spending $1300 on a laptop and then $1000 on a display.
It'd be great to see Apple release not only a large (27" or greater) 5K monitor, but also a "little brother" 4K monitor at, say 24" or so geared towards the average consumer. I would think the right price could net a lot of sales for those looking for an external for their Macbook or Mini.
Another possible advantage of having a built in GPU is that they could be used with iOS devices. Could also have Airplay built into the display as well.
Another possible advantage of having a built in GPU is that they could be used with iOS devices. Could also have Airplay built into the display as well.
Agreed. I think it possible, perhaps likely, Apple is working on a whole new product category here. It makes sense they abandon "monitors" since the race to the bottom in those products is underway.
Doesn't Apple TV already fill this need? At least in terms of gaming on a large screen using A9 processors? How would anyone benefit from a 5k monitor running a 1080p game? All iOS software would have to be written for 5k in order to see any benefits. Or are you getting at something else?
Another possible advantage of having a built in GPU is that they could be used with iOS devices. Could also have Airplay built into the display as well.
This is a thought I really like. I have always wanted to do multiple displays with my iPad Pro for example. Even if it was only 1 it would be an improvement. Right now I can do everything at work on my iPad Pro. The only thing I am missing is a larger monitor or multiple monitor support.
How many people will be interested in one of these?
Good question! It really depends upon implementation, I'd be very reluctant to buy a monitor that can only work with Apple products for example. Then you have the question of how much acceleration is actually in the display. We all know how stingy Apple can be with GPU performance.
Agreed. I think it possible, perhaps likely, Apple is working on a whole new product category here. It makes sense they abandon "monitors" since the race to the bottom in those products is underway.
Doesn't Apple TV already fill this need? At least in terms of gaming on a large screen using A9 processors? How would anyone benefit from a 5k monitor running a 1080p game? All iOS software would have to be written for 5k in order to see any benefits. Or are you getting at something else?
It's not a TV, but a perhipheral for a computing device. Not specifically for gaming or use as a TV.
How many people will be interested in one of these?
Enough to warrant producing one. Did we really think Apple would leave all that potential monitor money on the table during checkout online and in brick and mortar stores on a permanent basis? I certainly did not.
I'd honestly consider selling my notebook and iMac 5K if this new MBP is thin and light enough and the new 5K Apple Display was a great enough combination product.
I don't see this as a slam dunk with users! It is going to depend very much upon implementation, cost and so forth.
As for Apple leaving the monitor market, yes I can actually see them doing that! There isn't much benefit to them when most of the market they are after uses laptops. Apple would need to capture a significant portion of the laptop market that demands external monitors. For the rest of the hardware line up you have other issues. The Mini is for the inexpensive market, something that Apple has never supported monitor wise. The Mac Pro goes in the opposite direction serving the needs of professionals with highly mixed monitor needs.
As far as selling your current stuff well that might be something to consider. Why? Mainly because I suspect the new machines will be huge steps forward even if the rumored monitor never appears.
A USB-C plug from the monitor to the laptop that would provide power and USB connections via the monitor would be the perfect companion to the Macbook. But if it's price similar to the existing Apple display, it would be hard to see people spending $1300 on a laptop and then $1000 on a display.
Exactly! Apple has a huge problem with the high prices on its monitors and the described device won't be significantly cheaper. In fact the monitor might end up being more expensive. Essentially you have to build a computer into the monitor and such a build wouldn't be cheap. Remember these monitor would need to perform as a dock also.
Unless of of course Apple has an "A" series processor lined up for the monitor. Apple could go two ways here. One would be to connect this mystery chip to an AMD GPU, the other would be to massively beef up the built in GPU. Apple has the talent to go either way here. This wouldn't be your run of the mill A series chip as it would need a TB3 port. I suspect though that TB3 will eventually come to all iOS devices.
Here red is the thing with TB3 and iOS, a smart monitor like this could allow a cell phone to act as a personal computer. Plugging it into a monitor would transform the machine allowing for desktop like usage. I would have to think somebody at Apple has to see this as the long term strategy for iOS.
Another possible advantage of having a built in GPU is that they could be used with iOS devices. Could also have Airplay built into the display as well.
Agreed. I think it possible, perhaps likely, Apple is working on a whole new product category here. It makes sense they abandon "monitors" since the race to the bottom in those products is underway.
Doesn't Apple TV already fill this need? At least in terms of gaming on a large screen using A9 processors? How would anyone benefit from a 5k monitor running a 1080p game? All iOS software would have to be written for 5k in order to see any benefits. Or are you getting at something else?
Going to 4K or even 5K will happen in gaming no matter what. It is just a matter of time.
How many people will be interested in one of these?
I would love one...Why not? If you have a 12" MacBook, its the perfect desk display to connect to, especially if it retains the docking station as well. And, you'll have an external graphics card to drive the display. Or, if you have a 15" Retina MBP with the Intel graphics you can connect this and get a nice discrete graphics card when plugged in.
I really like this concept. With the technology that Apple has worked with to power graphics in iPad and iPhone, it feels to me they can develop a custom solution to drive this at a reasonable cost versus putting a true "graphic card" inside a monitor. It would also allow the monitor to be sleek and sexy like its laptops.
First, a rumor with unnamed sources.
Kids this days. The way these particular "unnamed sources" are presented (and their secondary source), makes the news 100% legit (not to mention intentionally leaking) to us experienced Apple-lers.
Back in the iPod/Jobs days we had to differentiate and evaluate between all kinds of rumors.
And places like AppleInsider etc were called "Rumor Sites" for a reason. The ease (and naivety) with which current AI readers seem to scorn all "rumors" amazes me...
It hardly makes sense to imagine them selling a 5K Thunderbolt 3 external display with an integrated graphics card without offering one without the graphics card. Mainly due to the Mac Pro, not to mention the iMac 5K, and the coming Thunderbolt 3 versions of each.
So I would look for a Thunderbolt 3 "Retina" 5K Display with an optional integrated graphics card for use with MacBook Pros and iPad Pros.
It hardly makes sense to imagine them selling a 5K Thunderbolt 3 external display with an integrated graphics card without offering one without the graphics card. Mainly due to the Mac Pro, not to mention the iMac 5K, and the coming Thunderbolt 3 versions of each.
So I would look for a Thunderbolt 3 "Retina" 5K Display with an optional integrated graphics card for use with MacBook Pros and iPad Pros.
Agreed. While it would make sense that you could purchase without the graphics card, if they slotted it, you could buy it without, and those who bought it with a graphics card, could even upgrade it later. Sadly, Apple doesn't really do upgradeable these days.
I'd be quite cautious about buying the first or even second gen. No idea how often it would get updated if the past display and current Mac updates are any indication (hint: they should be a big indicator).
The cycle seems to be slowing everywhere except the graphics card market. That market still sees notable gains in performance on a surprisingly short scale compared to other areas these days (rivaled only by mobile CPU/GPUs I'd bet).
I understand Apple's position on this, the ink for the standard to drive >4K displays isn't even dry yet there is demand already. The solutions available now all seem pretty "hacky", even this monitor+GPU combo idea.
Better to wait and embrace the standard first rather than to forge ahead with a product that will be at the bottom of it's class in short order.
Speaking of putting a GPU in a display... How exactly will that be cooled? Apple has a pathological obsession with thinness. Such a display is either going to be underpowered compared to a Mac Pro (which is underpowered compared to today's GPUs) or it's going to be subject to the same suicidal heat dissipation design of all compact Apple hardware. Or both (I did play Half-Life 2 entirely on a MacBook Pro 3,1, and it ran fine, but that game wasn't exactly demanding, and I'm sure that's part of what eventually killed the GPU).
I'll believe it when it's announced (and then likely have to continue to question the design sensibility of such a product as Apple of today would engineer it). The fact that Apple still doesn't have a native high-ppi display for desktop use suggests that while they are developing custom hardware for handhelds and wearables, they're relying too damn much on Intel and the PC industry for desktops. They had to design a custom display driver chip for the iMac 5K, because the PC industry Apple gets its hardware from hasn't gotten off its bloated ass and finished doing it yet (the PC industry and PC users still think "retina is pointless"). Does that mean Apple will go custom chips and interface design for an external display/interface, to stop relying on Intel, or will Apple just not provide such product at all until Intel eventually makes it available?
Who's creating computer tech today? Just Intel? I remember when there was this thing called competition. Standards were rare, but at least new tech got built without everyone waiting for one single vendor to enable everyone else to go to the next incremental step. And what's the use of standards being finalized when the single source of chipsets doesn't have any priority to implement them?
[Bitter rant notice]
For now, I just feel like my waiting for this industry to give me a solid product is wasted time. I'm sick of "it mostly works, if you're not attentive to details, and if you have the willpower to continue to be a tech support agent for your own stuff (or can afford to hire a tech support employee to fix stuff for you while you do something less maddening)".
Yet, I don't have the financial freedom to do anything else BUT wait. It's too damned wasteful to buy short-lived product. The upgrade cycle has accelerated to ridiculously short periods of use and the choices are few. This is still the industry of geeks that use computers for the sake of using computers, or the rest of us (non-tech people, or, like me, techs sick to death of being techs) buying luxury items with short lifespans.
Want the most recent hardware? Must use Windows (no way in hell am I going back) or build a Frankenstein's monster Hackintosh (utterly defeating the entire point of Macs). Want the OS? Must buy hardware that isn't up to spec for heavy production work (or gaming), or build a Hackintosh (see above). Macs are the best consumer/office/home computers, no doubt, but, for heavy GPU/CPU production work... :-P
If I was wealthy enough to waste money (or had reliable income from my work), I'd just get an iMac 5K right now and replace it when it dies or better hardware comes along. But I'm not, and I can't. I did the "inexpensive" PC building thing all my life and learned to hate it (and the mindless tech memes promoting it); the hardware clusterfrell sucks and I hate the OS "options".
i hate this industry. There was so much promise for one brief moment in time, but Apple followed the largest market and ignored the rest, instead of following both the consumer and professional markets concurrently. There's no reason to do that other then satisfying shareholders.
While the rest of the industry has been trying to compete with Apple on mobile devices (making their offerings actually improve), production workstations are the same as always: Windows sucks (it sucks least today than ever before but it still sucks), humongous cases and noisy (if you want decent cooling), hot (my PC substitutes for a heater in my studio, even when it's not doing anything!), and still hasn't figured out high-ppi (displays, text and GUI), or basic usability (it's utterly disgusting how much is broken in Windows that gets a free pass by both Microsoft and tech people; it's like these people are conditioned to accept broken inconsistency as a norm).
Having no good choices makes me angry. Seeing people justify junk as "acceptable choices" just doubles it. Maybe I'm just too old. Is 40 too old?
Doesn't Apple TV already fill this need? At least in terms of gaming on a large screen using A9 processors? How would anyone benefit from a 5k monitor running a 1080p game? All iOS software would have to be written for 5k in order to see any benefits. Or are you getting at something else?
It's not a TV, but a perhipheral for a computing device. Not specifically for gaming or use as a TV.
It would be a retina 1080p game or playing a 4k movie as a second screen. Split-screen or PIP is an option too. I'm not suggesting that this would be its primary purpose. Just a nice feature.
Comments
As for Apple leaving the monitor market, yes I can actually see them doing that! There isn't much benefit to them when most of the market they are after uses laptops. Apple would need to capture a significant portion of the laptop market that demands external monitors. For the rest of the hardware line up you have other issues. The Mini is for the inexpensive market, something that Apple has never supported monitor wise. The Mac Pro goes in the opposite direction serving the needs of professionals with highly mixed monitor needs.
As far as selling your current stuff well that might be something to consider. Why? Mainly because I suspect the new machines will be huge steps forward even if the rumored monitor never appears.
Unless of of course Apple has an "A" series processor lined up for the monitor. Apple could go two ways here. One would be to connect this mystery chip to an AMD GPU, the other would be to massively beef up the built in GPU. Apple has the talent to go either way here. This wouldn't be your run of the mill A series chip as it would need a TB3 port. I suspect though that TB3 will eventually come to all iOS devices.
Here red is the thing with TB3 and iOS, a smart monitor like this could allow a cell phone to act as a personal computer. Plugging it into a monitor would transform the machine allowing for desktop like usage. I would have to think somebody at Apple has to see this as the long term strategy for iOS.
I would love one...Why not? If you have a 12" MacBook, its the perfect desk display to connect to, especially if it retains the docking station as well. And, you'll have an external graphics card to drive the display. Or, if you have a 15" Retina MBP with the Intel graphics you can connect this and get a nice discrete graphics card when plugged in.
Back in the iPod/Jobs days we had to differentiate and evaluate between all kinds of rumors.
And places like AppleInsider etc were called "Rumor Sites" for a reason. The ease (and naivety) with which current AI readers seem to scorn all "rumors" amazes me...
Now get the fuck out of my lawn...
So I would look for a Thunderbolt 3 "Retina" 5K Display with an optional integrated graphics card for use with MacBook Pros and iPad Pros.
Agreed. While it would make sense that you could purchase without the graphics card, if they slotted it, you could buy it without, and those who bought it with a graphics card, could even upgrade it later. Sadly, Apple doesn't really do upgradeable these days.
The cycle seems to be slowing everywhere except the graphics card market. That market still sees notable gains in performance on a surprisingly short scale compared to other areas these days (rivaled only by mobile CPU/GPUs I'd bet).
I understand Apple's position on this, the ink for the standard to drive >4K displays isn't even dry yet there is demand already. The solutions available now all seem pretty "hacky", even this monitor+GPU combo idea.
Better to wait and embrace the standard first rather than to forge ahead with a product that will be at the bottom of it's class in short order.
I'll believe it when it's announced (and then likely have to continue to question the design sensibility of such a product as Apple of today would engineer it). The fact that Apple still doesn't have a native high-ppi display for desktop use suggests that while they are developing custom hardware for handhelds and wearables, they're relying too damn much on Intel and the PC industry for desktops. They had to design a custom display driver chip for the iMac 5K, because the PC industry Apple gets its hardware from hasn't gotten off its bloated ass and finished doing it yet (the PC industry and PC users still think "retina is pointless"). Does that mean Apple will go custom chips and interface design for an external display/interface, to stop relying on Intel, or will Apple just not provide such product at all until Intel eventually makes it available?
Who's creating computer tech today? Just Intel? I remember when there was this thing called competition. Standards were rare, but at least new tech got built without everyone waiting for one single vendor to enable everyone else to go to the next incremental step. And what's the use of standards being finalized when the single source of chipsets doesn't have any priority to implement them?
[Bitter rant notice]
For now, I just feel like my waiting for this industry to give me a solid product is wasted time. I'm sick of "it mostly works, if you're not attentive to details, and if you have the willpower to continue to be a tech support agent for your own stuff (or can afford to hire a tech support employee to fix stuff for you while you do something less maddening)".
Yet, I don't have the financial freedom to do anything else BUT wait. It's too damned wasteful to buy short-lived product. The upgrade cycle has accelerated to ridiculously short periods of use and the choices are few. This is still the industry of geeks that use computers for the sake of using computers, or the rest of us (non-tech people, or, like me, techs sick to death of being techs) buying luxury items with short lifespans.
Want the most recent hardware? Must use Windows (no way in hell am I going back) or build a Frankenstein's monster Hackintosh (utterly defeating the entire point of Macs). Want the OS? Must buy hardware that isn't up to spec for heavy production work (or gaming), or build a Hackintosh (see above). Macs are the best consumer/office/home computers, no doubt, but, for heavy GPU/CPU production work... :-P
If I was wealthy enough to waste money (or had reliable income from my work), I'd just get an iMac 5K right now and replace it when it dies or better hardware comes along. But I'm not, and I can't. I did the "inexpensive" PC building thing all my life and learned to hate it (and the mindless tech memes promoting it); the hardware clusterfrell sucks and I hate the OS "options".
i hate this industry. There was so much promise for one brief moment in time, but Apple followed the largest market and ignored the rest, instead of following both the consumer and professional markets concurrently. There's no reason to do that other then satisfying shareholders.
While the rest of the industry has been trying to compete with Apple on mobile devices (making their offerings actually improve), production workstations are the same as always: Windows sucks (it sucks least today than ever before but it still sucks), humongous cases and noisy (if you want decent cooling), hot (my PC substitutes for a heater in my studio, even when it's not doing anything!), and still hasn't figured out high-ppi (displays, text and GUI), or basic usability (it's utterly disgusting how much is broken in Windows that gets a free pass by both Microsoft and tech people; it's like these people are conditioned to accept broken inconsistency as a norm).
Having no good choices makes me angry. Seeing people justify junk as "acceptable choices" just doubles it. Maybe I'm just too old. Is 40 too old?