The last "tax holiday" was granted by the US in 2004 for multinational companies. The rate was heavily reduced to a mere 5.25%. I as a small business owner pay about 35% on my profits. Corporations like Apple expect another Reparation tax holiday sooner or later so there is little incentive to bring this money back to the US until Congress caves in. How did this all happen? Well look at the people we citizen elect to political office, who funds their campaigns, who are they in debt to when the get into office? It is not the US citizen but these huge corporations. Laws are written to make these tax havens possible as a pay back for a cushy seat in Congress. Are corporations like Apple breaking the law? Not as the law is written. Is Apple morally wrong for taking advantage of these laws? Yes. Tax breaks and incentives were originally designed to help small to large businesses grow and have positive impact on a local or regional area. These incentives often have time limits unlike these tax haven laws. I am a big fan of Apple's products and services and have been for decades but don't let you love admiration of this company blind you to the fact they are positioned as many huge international corporations above the tax laws most citizens must follow.
Apple also pays 35% tax on ALL USA profits. You are in the same boat. You are barking up the wrong tree. The problem is the ridiculously high 35% tax rate in the USA. By far the highest tax rate in the world.
But Apple also has operations in other countries like China, Japan, and Europe. In those countries Apple pays all the taxes that are earned on profits in THOSE countries. In China they pay about a 15% corporate tax. So why should Apple pay the USA DOUBLE TAX on income EARNED in China? It makes ZERO sense. There is no logical reason why Apple needs to pay the FULL TAX BURDEN of China profits and then pay tax again in the USA. Profits generated and EARNED in China have no business being taxed in the USA.
When the tax holiday happenned those corporations were not paying a 5% tax on USA profits. They were paying a 5% tax IN ADDITION to the foreign taxes they ALREADY PAID. So Apple would have paid 15% taxes on China generated profits and then an ADDITIONAL 5% tax to the US government for the right to bring the cash back into the USA.
Basically you have a very shallow understanding of US and foreign tax laws.
HAHA Sure they do!
Anyone who thinks any of these multi-billion $ corps actually pays 35% in taxes is either lying on purpose or ignorant.
It's really not about the tax rate they are paying. That's just a percentage that is applied to the profit. The real question should be how they arrive at the profit number. That's where the [legal] international shell game takes place.
People like to say a company made X profit and paid Y taxes and therefore has a Z=Y/X tax rate. Then they focus on only Y and Z without questioning X.
Look at the USA peers, who cares about a country like Cameron.
Don't make silly incorrect claims like "35% corp tax rate... by far the highest in the world" if you can't be big enough to retract them when you're proven wrong.
The last "tax holiday" was granted by the US in 2004 for multinational companies. The rate was heavily reduced to a mere 5.25%. I as a small business owner pay about 35% on my profits. Corporations like Apple expect another Reparation tax holiday sooner or later so there is little incentive to bring this money back to the US until Congress caves in. How did this all happen? Well look at the people we citizen elect to political office, who funds their campaigns, who are they in debt to when the get into office? It is not the US citizen but these huge corporations. Laws are written to make these tax havens possible as a pay back for a cushy seat in Congress. Are corporations like Apple breaking the law? Not as the law is written. Is Apple morally wrong for taking advantage of these laws? Yes. Tax breaks and incentives were originally designed to help small to large businesses grow and have positive impact on a local or regional area. These incentives often have time limits unlike these tax haven laws. I am a big fan of Apple's products and services and have been for decades but don't let you love admiration of this company blind you to the fact they are positioned as many huge international corporations above the tax laws most citizens must follow.
Apple also pays 35% tax on ALL USA profits. You are in the same boat. You are barking up the wrong tree. The problem is the ridiculously high 35% tax rate in the USA. By far the highest tax rate in the world.
But Apple also has operations in other countries like China, Japan, and Europe. In those countries Apple pays all the taxes that are earned on profits in THOSE countries. In China they pay about a 15% corporate tax. So why should Apple pay the USA DOUBLE TAX on income EARNED in China? It makes ZERO sense. There is no logical reason why Apple needs to pay the FULL TAX BURDEN of China profits and then pay tax again in the USA. Profits generated and EARNED in China have no business being taxed in the USA.
When the tax holiday happenned those corporations were not paying a 5% tax on USA profits. They were paying a 5% tax IN ADDITION to the foreign taxes they ALREADY PAID. So Apple would have paid 15% taxes on China generated profits and then an ADDITIONAL 5% tax to the US government for the right to bring the cash back into the USA.
Basically you have a very shallow understanding of US and foreign tax laws.
HAHA Sure they do!
Anyone who thinks any of these multi-billion $ corps actually pays 35% in taxes is either lying on purpose or ignorant.
It's really not about the tax rate they are paying. That's just a percentage that is applied to the profit. The real question should be how they arrive at the profit number. That's where the [legal] international shell game takes place.
People like to say a company made X profit and paid Y taxes and therefore has a Z=Y/X tax rate. Then they focus on only Y and Z without questioning X.
In 2013 Apple paid over $7 billion in taxes to the US govt Total worldwide profit was $37 billion. About 40% of Apple sales is in the USA. So $37 billion x 40% = $14.8 billion in USA profit
So Apple paid $7 billion in USA taxes on $14.8 billion in USA profit. That is very close to a 35% tax rate.
Look at my previous post to see more detail and SEC filing.
Fact is Apple has paid a very high rate on USA income. Between 30-35%
"About 40% of Apple sales is in the USA." Stop guessing shit! "That is very close to a 35% tax rate." No it isn't!
Sorry but Camerron does not matter to me. I don't care what the tax rate in small insignificant nations. Camerron has a GDP lower than Georgia. THE STATE OF GEORGIA in the USA. Compare US rate to its peers.
Then don't write "in the world" if you only mean "in the parts of the world that I care about". You are the one who compared the USA to every other country and spouted a falsehood.
Accuracy. Look it up.
Since we're talking about accuracy, it's Cameroon. Get a clue.
My point stands: the US tax rate is ridiculously high. Especially considering that the same tax is applied to even foreign profits. Other countries like Germany that have 29% rates do not charge foreign profits that are taxed in the foreign countries.
Do you even know the history here? German companies are not reliant on German hegemony and military strength to keep trading routes open and reliable.
The reason companies keep earnings off-shore is to avoid paying taxes - all taxes including to the countries they operate in. It isn't that they pay a foreign tax and then are required to pay a US tax. Basically, these companies shirk their responsibilities as national citizens. Apple is notorious because it is a high earner but it is not the only one. The system has been fixed to favour the rich and powerful. That is the reality. Ultimately, it is the boys and girls running these companies that are making the decisions to stiff the American taxpayer. And, no, there is no honour among thieves.
“Citizens for Tax Justice and the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy” Typical monikers for extreme left wing socialist organizations. Notice how the terms “tax avoider” and “tax haven abuse” are used instead of “illegal” and “fraudulent.” Those terms would get them sued for slander. Subjective labels with wide open interpretations are the norm for outfits like this. Plant the thought seed of illegality without actually saying it. If these outfits want to get their hands on some of that $65 billion then pressure Congress to reform the tax code. Tim Cook said he would be happy to repatriate those off shore assets if conditions were right.
By the way, I personally AVOID paying every tax dollar I can by paying a tax accountant to find every legal deduction and loophole possible. I don’t give a rats ass about “fairness” or “tax justice. I care about paying as little tax as possible and I sure as hell won’t be sending an additional check to the Treasury because I “feel” guilty.
Then GTF off our roads and stop utilizing our public infrastructure or anything that was development from public grants. Cannot stand twits with this pathetic attitude towards paying their fair share to a country. In fact, it would be great if those who share this plutocratic attitude just setup a new country and all move there; where you will be free to screw each other over and some. Oh wait, such places already exist they are called the third world.
Indeed, declare your country so the rest of us can come and attack, which is the way we did it in the old days. Good luck defending yourself with no taxes.
Apple didn't avoid anything...they used the taxes laws that are in place. I don't know what is so hard for people to understand this. If this was illegal, it would have been stopped years ago and someone most likely would have been arrested as a result.
Same sort of rationale was used to justify slavery. Well, if that's "the law" and everyone does it, then it's apparently okay.
Well. it's not okay and should be stamped out in any developed country. Corporate profits are not mentioned in pretty much any OECD nation's charter.
The last "tax holiday" was granted by the US in 2004 for multinational companies. The rate was heavily reduced to a mere 5.25%. I as a small business owner pay about 35% on my profits. Corporations like Apple expect another Reparation tax holiday sooner or later so there is little incentive to bring this money back to the US until Congress caves in. How did this all happen? Well look at the people we citizen elect to political office, who funds their campaigns, who are they in debt to when the get into office? It is not the US citizen but these huge corporations. Laws are written to make these tax havens possible as a pay back for a cushy seat in Congress. Are corporations like Apple breaking the law? Not as the law is written. Is Apple morally wrong for taking advantage of these laws? Yes. Tax breaks and incentives were originally designed to help small to large businesses grow and have positive impact on a local or regional area. These incentives often have time limits unlike these tax haven laws. I am a big fan of Apple's products and services and have been for decades but don't let you love admiration of this company blind you to the fact they are positioned as many huge international corporations above the tax laws most citizens must follow.
Apple also pays 35% tax on ALL USA profits. You are in the same boat. You are barking up the wrong tree. The problem is the ridiculously high 35% tax rate in the USA. By far the highest tax rate in the world.
But Apple also has operations in other countries like China, Japan, and Europe. In those countries Apple pays all the taxes that are earned on profits in THOSE countries. In China they pay about a 15% corporate tax. So why should Apple pay the USA DOUBLE TAX on income EARNED in China? It makes ZERO sense. There is no logical reason why Apple needs to pay the FULL TAX BURDEN of China profits and then pay tax again in the USA. Profits generated and EARNED in China have no business being taxed in the USA.
When the tax holiday happenned those corporations were not paying a 5% tax on USA profits. They were paying a 5% tax IN ADDITION to the foreign taxes they ALREADY PAID. So Apple would have paid 15% taxes on China generated profits and then an ADDITIONAL 5% tax to the US government for the right to bring the cash back into the USA.
Basically you have a very shallow understanding of US and foreign tax laws.
HAHA Sure they do!
Anyone who thinks any of these multi-billion $ corps actually pays 35% in taxes is either lying on purpose or ignorant.
It's really not about the tax rate they are paying. That's just a percentage that is applied to the profit. The real question should be how they arrive at the profit number. That's where the [legal] international shell game takes place.
People like to say a company made X profit and paid Y taxes and therefore has a Z=Y/X tax rate. Then they focus on only Y and Z without questioning X.
In 2013 Apple paid over $7 billion in taxes to the US govt Total worldwide profit was $37 billion. About 40% of Apple sales is in the USA. So $37 billion x 40% = $14.8 billion in USA profit
So Apple paid $7 billion in USA taxes on $14.8 billion in USA profit. That is very close to a 35% tax rate.
Look at my previous post to see more detail and SEC filing.
Fact is Apple has paid a very high rate on USA income. Between 30-35%
"About 40% of Apple sales is in the USA." Stop guessing shit! "That is very close to a 35% tax rate." No it isn't!
It was about 40% in the US in 2013. Worldwide sales was $171 billion Americans sales was $63 billion
So Americas sales was only 37% not counting retail stores. If Americas had 50% retail stores sales than Americans sales would be 43% But then you need to subtract sales in Mexico, Canada, South American, and Central America. So like I said about 40%
No one knows the exact figure because Apple reports American's not US figures.
$7 billion taxes on $14.8 billion in profit is very close to 35% tax rate. Its 32% to be exact. Something none of these clown watchdog groups don't want to bring up.
I deleted my earlier post due to bad math on my part. However, I still believe using sales percentages to figure out how much of the world wide profit is attributable to the US is fuzzy at best. It ignores where non-sales income (ie, investment income) and expenses are incurred. Most importantly, it assumes that a sale outside of the US is equivalent to a sale in the US. Revenue from a sale in the US is partially offset by the disproportionate US-based expenses vs a country which only has sales activities (ie, no R&D, manufacturing, etc). Would not this have the effect of decreasing the taxable revenue from each sale of an iPhone in the US and increase the taxable income on each iPhone sold outside of the US (which, as you've pointed out, almost always means a lower tax rate)?
What evidence do you have that Cameroon is uncivilised?
Common sense and a glance at every single meaningful metric.
HDI: 0.512 / 1 WHR: 4.513 / 10 LPR: 99 of the 110 recorded (lower is worse) GCI: 75 of the 163 recorded (lower is worse) SLI: 138 of the 178 recorded (lower is worse) GTI: 20 of the 180 recorded (higher is worse) SPI: 114 of the 193 recorded (lower is worse)
It's a load of crud to suggest that all foreign profits are delivered to the USA. This is a fever dream unique to the US tax code, and obviously nearly impossible to enforce since locally generated monies are rightfully utilised overseas to further the local business operations, expansion and more recently R&D.
It's a fantasy to believe that the US is entitled to such profits in the first place when the devices, both in design, sourcing and manufacturing are a global effort between not just Apple and its foreign-operated subsidiaries, but non-Apple foreign entities, non-Apple foreign staff and obviously customers of foreign nationalities, paid for in foreign currency.
The idea that companies need to send profits, all profits, up the chain to the US-held company (not even the parent company and not the company responsible for generating profit from work) - pay US taxes - then send them back down the chain for operational reasons is a total farce. It's why companies don't do it and instead hold the funds in the countries which generated them. It also raises the ire of local governments since realistically those profits are built on the back of the local economy and local government's investment.
The 35% (actually 39.1% because there is also a State corporate tax for most corporations) that the US apply to corporate foreign profits is the highest in the World by far. Most other countries do not tax corporate foreign profits. No matter how little foreign tax they already paid on those profits. And if they do, it's far less than the corporate tax they charge for profits made in the corporation's home country. I'm willing to bet that the US in the only country that apply the same tax rate on US corporation foreign profit, as they do to profits made in the US.
Apple didn't avoid anything...they used the taxes laws that are in place. I don't know what is so hard for people to understand this. If this was illegal, it would have been stopped years ago and someone most likely would have been arrested as a result.
Same sort of rationale was used to justify slavery. Well, if that's "the law" and everyone does it, then it's apparently okay.
Well. it's not okay and should be stamped out in any developed country. Corporate profits are not mentioned in pretty much any OECD nation's charter.
But most developed countries do not tax corporate foreign profits. Most countries stamped out taxing corporate foreign profit and only tax the corporate profit made in their own territory.
And equating slavery with tax avoidance is just plain ignorant on your part. That's because everyone thinks is okay to avoid taxes, even you, otherwise everyone wouldn't be doing it. Every hear of ……. Itemize deduction of home mortgage interest and property tax? IRA? Standard deduction? Child exemption? Person exemption? Charitable donation? Flexible Spending Account? 401K? TSP? Solar Power tax break? Renter's credit? Retiring in a State with no State income tax? So by your logic, it's not OK for people avoid taxes with these legal methods because slavery wasn't OK just because it was legal (at the time).
The United States has the third highest general top marginal corporate income tax rate in the world at 39.1 percent, exceeded only by Chad and the United Arab Emirates.
The worldwide average top corporate income tax rate is 22.6 percent (30.6 percent weighted by GDP).
The United States has the third highest general top marginal corporate income tax rate in the world at 39.1 percent, exceeded only by Chad and the United Arab Emirates.
The worldwide average top corporate income tax rate is 22.6 percent (30.6 percent weighted by GDP).
Which facts am I supposed to be checking?
The Global average corporate tax rate is 22.6%. The US corporate tax rate of 39.1 (including 'state corporate tax) is almost twice that. Even when the Global rate is adjusted for GDP, it's still about 25% higher. So the US corporate tax rate is not close the Global average, as you seem to think.
Most of this discussion is focused on the Fed 35% tax that the US apply to foreign profits. That is by far the highest of any country. Even Chad and UAR don't tax corporate foreign profits. The CA corporate tax rate that Apple has to pay, because their US headquarter is in CA, is 8.8%. The highest in the US. So Apple tax rate on their foreign profits would be about 44%. If they were to bring those profit here in tot he US.
“Citizens for Tax Justice and the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy” Typical monikers for extreme left wing socialist organizations. Notice how the terms “tax avoider” and “tax haven abuse” are used instead of “illegal” and “fraudulent.” Those terms would get them sued for slander. Subjective labels with wide open interpretations are the norm for outfits like this. Plant the thought seed of illegality without actually saying it. If these outfits want to get their hands on some of that $65 billion then pressure Congress to reform the tax code. Tim Cook said he would be happy to repatriate those off shore assets if conditions were right.
By the way, I personally AVOID paying every tax dollar I can by paying a tax accountant to find every legal deduction and loophole possible. I don’t give a rats ass about “fairness” or “tax justice. I care about paying as little tax as possible and I sure as hell won’t be sending an additional check to the Treasury because I “feel” guilty.
Then GTF off our roads and stop utilizing our public infrastructure or anything that was development from public grants. Cannot stand twits with this pathetic attitude towards paying their fair share to a country. In fact, it would be great if those who share this plutocratic attitude just setup a new country and all move there; where you will be free to screw each other over and some. Oh wait, such places already exist they are called the third world.
Indeed, declare your country so the rest of us can come and attack, which is the way we did it in the old days. Good luck defending yourself with no taxes.
The thing you need to understand is that the US Fed tax system is very progressive and very fair. It allows for 45% of income earners to legally pay no Federal income taxes while 85% of the taxes collected are paid by the highest 20% income earners. It really doesn't get any fairer than that. Even if it doesn't meet the liberal definition of "fair share". So if one manages to legally reduce his/her income taxes to 0, no matter the income, then he/she paid his/her fair share in taxes. That's is how our tax system works.
Income tax is not the only way to pay money into public infrastructure. Gas tax, sales tax, property tax, parking meters, bridge toll, taxes disguised as fees added to phone, water and electrical bills, etc. also pays into it. Plus spending money contributes to the economy by providing jobs and allowing for companies to make a profit, which is then taxed. Earning money itself contributes in the form of payroll taxes, that the employers must pay. Even if the employees end up paying 0 taxes on the income.
A person making $10/Hr working at McDonald's will have to pay taxes on his income, unless he/she take advantage of all legal deductions. In which case he/she will end up paying $0 in taxes. You have a problem with that?
Bill Gates and Warren Buffet have legally avoided paying tens of billions of dollars in taxes, by donating their fortune to the Bill Gates Foundation. You have a problem with that?
Why are all of you defending the richest company in the world?
Why are you defending the idea that “rich = bad”?
You will never see a penny of it unless you have Apple stock.
We’ll see the products they create.
If I didn't pay my taxes you would call me a tax cheat
Yep. Guess what Apple ISN’T DOING.
unAmerican
lol no.
yet you let Apple slide.
Because they’re not cheating on their taxes.
Corporations have abandoned the USA for manufacturing because they can get people to work for less than our lowest minimum wage state.
So you’re voting for Trump, then, since he’ll end that.
As soon as China's develops a stronger middle class
So… NEVER.
I suggest some of you read… …a book on economics…
Irony.
what these tax laws really mean for our country, who wrote them and the ill affect it is happening on our shrinking middle class.
Who wrote them?
I think this guy writes for Fox News. He loves to edit comments and twist them from what they really mean. Look at the first comment I left, see how he sticks in "rich= bad?" although my comment did not. He also suggest that "seeing the products they create" is worth letting Apple slide on paying tax on earnings of $68B? Apple is not paying taxes on these earnings, they know this, that is why they have left that money overseas where the US government can't get it. If they paid all their taxes then there would be no reason to keep it abroad. They this guy throws in "So you’re voting for Trump, then, since he’ll end that." Really? What part of my comments makes you jump to that absurd suggestion? Dude read my comments again and please stop pulling things out of context when you have no actual good point to make. Unless this is just an audition for that writing job at Fox?
Comments
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_rates
EDIT: Oh, wait.... sog.
People like to say a company made X profit and paid Y taxes and therefore has a Z=Y/X tax rate. Then they focus on only Y and Z without questioning X.
"That is very close to a 35% tax rate." No it isn't!
Then don't write "in the world" if you only mean "in the parts of the world that I care about". You are the one who compared the USA to every other country and spouted a falsehood.
Accuracy. Look it up.
Since we're talking about accuracy, it's Cameroon. Get a clue.
Do you even know the history here? German companies are not reliant on German hegemony and military strength to keep trading routes open and reliable.
Indeed, declare your country so the rest of us can come and attack, which is the way we did it in the old days. Good luck defending yourself with no taxes.
Well. it's not okay and should be stamped out in any developed country. Corporate profits are not mentioned in pretty much any OECD nation's charter.
Because no one actually thinks that.
HDI: 0.512 / 1
WHR: 4.513 / 10
LPR: 99 of the 110 recorded (lower is worse)
GCI: 75 of the 163 recorded (lower is worse)
SLI: 138 of the 178 recorded (lower is worse)
GTI: 20 of the 180 recorded (higher is worse)
SPI: 114 of the 193 recorded (lower is worse)
HERE WE GO AGAIN!
That’s racist against worlds.lol, voluntarism is absolutely terrifying to you, isn’t it? You’re shaking in your boots at the idea of human self-sufficiency.
Maybe it's you that need to check your "facts".
http://taxfoundation.org/article/corporate-income-tax-rates-around-world-2014
But here's one for you to check out.
The 35% (actually 39.1% because there is also a State corporate tax for most corporations) that the US apply to corporate foreign profits is the highest in the World by far. Most other countries do not tax corporate foreign profits. No matter how little foreign tax they already paid on those profits. And if they do, it's far less than the corporate tax they charge for profits made in the corporation's home country. I'm willing to bet that the US in the only country that apply the same tax rate on US corporation foreign profit, as they do to profits made in the US.
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/briefing-book/how-does-current-system-international-taxation-work
http://taxfoundation.org/blog/how-are-multinational-corporations-foreign-profits-treated-around-world
But most developed countries do not tax corporate foreign profits. Most countries stamped out taxing corporate foreign profit and only tax the corporate profit made in their own territory.
http://taxfoundation.org/blog/how-are-multinational-corporations-foreign-profits-treated-around-world ;
And equating slavery with tax avoidance is just plain ignorant on your part. That's because everyone thinks is okay to avoid taxes, even you, otherwise everyone wouldn't be doing it. Every hear of ……. Itemize deduction of home mortgage interest and property tax? IRA? Standard deduction? Child exemption? Person exemption? Charitable donation? Flexible Spending Account? 401K? TSP? Solar Power tax break? Renter's credit? Retiring in a State with no State income tax? So by your logic, it's not OK for people avoid taxes with these legal methods because slavery wasn't OK just because it was legal (at the time).
The two bullet points are:
- The United States has the third highest general top marginal corporate income tax rate in the world at 39.1 percent, exceeded only by Chad and the United Arab Emirates.
- The worldwide average top corporate income tax rate is 22.6 percent (30.6 percent weighted by GDP).
Which facts am I supposed to be checking?Most of this discussion is focused on the Fed 35% tax that the US apply to foreign profits. That is by far the highest of any country. Even Chad and UAR don't tax corporate foreign profits. The CA corporate tax rate that Apple has to pay, because their US headquarter is in CA, is 8.8%. The highest in the US. So Apple tax rate on their foreign profits would be about 44%. If they were to bring those profit here in tot he US.
The thing you need to understand is that the US Fed tax system is very progressive and very fair. It allows for 45% of income earners to legally pay no Federal income taxes while 85% of the taxes collected are paid by the highest 20% income earners. It really doesn't get any fairer than that. Even if it doesn't meet the liberal definition of "fair share". So if one manages to legally reduce his/her income taxes to 0, no matter the income, then he/she paid his/her fair share in taxes. That's is how our tax system works.
Income tax is not the only way to pay money into public infrastructure. Gas tax, sales tax, property tax, parking meters, bridge toll, taxes disguised as fees added to phone, water and electrical bills, etc. also pays into it. Plus spending money contributes to the economy by providing jobs and allowing for companies to make a profit, which is then taxed. Earning money itself contributes in the form of payroll taxes, that the employers must pay. Even if the employees end up paying 0 taxes on the income.
A person making $10/Hr working at McDonald's will have to pay taxes on his income, unless he/she take advantage of all legal deductions. In which case he/she will end up paying $0 in taxes. You have a problem with that?
Bill Gates and Warren Buffet have legally avoided paying tens of billions of dollars in taxes, by donating their fortune to the Bill Gates Foundation. You have a problem with that?
If not? Then what's the problem?
Apple is not paying taxes on these earnings, they know this, that is why they have left that money overseas where the US government can't get it. If they paid all their taxes then there would be no reason to keep it abroad.
They this guy throws in "So you’re voting for Trump, then, since he’ll end that." Really? What part of my comments makes you jump to that absurd suggestion? Dude read my comments again and please stop pulling things out of context when you have no actual good point to make. Unless this is just an audition for that writing job at Fox?