Apple AirPort Extreme claims top marks in consumer-grade wireless router survey

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Comments

  • Reply 81 of 107
    blastdoor said:

    If you depend on any product from Apple other than the iPhone, iPad, or MacBook I suggest you start looking for alternatives because no matter how good the product is, no matter how popular within its market, and no matter how much you are willing to pay -- Apple can and in many cases will kill the product with no clear reason and no warning. 

    As I cling to Aperture with both hands...
    cornchip
  • Reply 82 of 107
    mattinozmattinoz Posts: 2,299member
    rob53 said:
    "During the survey period, 16% of users experienced a problem with their router, with the most commonly reported problem being the frequency of the need to reset the device, followed closely by slow internet speeds."

    Slow internet speeds are usually the fault of the modem (cable/DSL) in front of the router. The only time I power cycle my Airport is after I power cycle my cable modem to make sure the Airport router syncs properly with the modem. Of course, it's always Apple's fault and never the ISP's over lack or inconsistent internet speeds. 

    If Apple stays in the router business, I'd love to see them expand into providing cable modems since (at least) Comcast allows third-party modems. Why pay for the extra device or rent a combined WiFi router/modem from the ISP when you don't have to. I thought I read something about cable providers having to allow third-party cable boxes. If this is true, Apple could provide an AIO cable box (multiple tuners like Comcast's X1 box) with cable modem, WiFi router and DVR. Add additional WiFi stations, maybe even with data going over the existing cable coax instead of WiFi for faster speeds. I would buy this kind of a box in a heartbeat. If I still had internet speed issues I'd still complain to Comcast first before touching my Apple devices because most of the speed issues are outside my house.
    I know know I'll take so flack for this but ....
    Wouldn't this be a good case to reduce the modem side of things down to a USB-c dongle?

    Keep the router as the main central hub of the operation plug in a different dongle to suit which ever WAN the customer has. Then doesn't matter if cable, fibre, DSL or Even old school dial-up.

  • Reply 83 of 107
    SoliSoli Posts: 10,035member
    mattinoz said:
    rob53 said:
    "During the survey period, 16% of users experienced a problem with their router, with the most commonly reported problem being the frequency of the need to reset the device, followed closely by slow internet speeds."

    Slow internet speeds are usually the fault of the modem (cable/DSL) in front of the router. The only time I power cycle my Airport is after I power cycle my cable modem to make sure the Airport router syncs properly with the modem. Of course, it's always Apple's fault and never the ISP's over lack or inconsistent internet speeds. 

    If Apple stays in the router business, I'd love to see them expand into providing cable modems since (at least) Comcast allows third-party modems. Why pay for the extra device or rent a combined WiFi router/modem from the ISP when you don't have to. I thought I read something about cable providers having to allow third-party cable boxes. If this is true, Apple could provide an AIO cable box (multiple tuners like Comcast's X1 box) with cable modem, WiFi router and DVR. Add additional WiFi stations, maybe even with data going over the existing cable coax instead of WiFi for faster speeds. I would buy this kind of a box in a heartbeat. If I still had internet speed issues I'd still complain to Comcast first before touching my Apple devices because most of the speed issues are outside my house.
    I know know I'll take so flack for this but ....
    Wouldn't this be a good case to reduce the modem side of things down to a USB-c dongle?

    Keep the router as the main central hub of the operation plug in a different dongle to suit which ever WAN the customer has. Then doesn't matter if cable, fibre, DSL or Even old school dial-up.
    Interesting idea, but I'm not sure that would be feasible for several reasons:

    1) This would mean the router would need to contain the broadband modem. This not only means full spectrum support for cable modems, but also fiber and DSL modems. I can't image dial-up being supported, regardless of how little additional effort and cost this would take. That in itself already seem implausible to me.

    2) I don't USB can be used that way. I think Apple would have to do a lot with driver and OS support to make it accept cable, fiber, and DSL switching. Thunderbolt would be mode ideal as it's protocol agnostic, but that require certain Intel CPUs and is costly to implement. Even the 12" MacBook doesn't offer TB. This would probably be most easy with a unique, proprietary port interface that would then allow for all these connection types to filter into a single port, but that still leaves the other hurdles, which I think are NOT impossible yet not worth Apple's time and effort.

    Since we've never seen Apple combined the router+modem or AppleTV+cable box in the past because of issues with different HW and services vendors, I don't think we'll see that going forward.
  • Reply 84 of 107
    williamh said:
    I've used Apple Airports for many years now and I am generally happy.  I expect the high marks are because most people are intimidated by the idea of the setup of other brands (although they're mostly easy enough.)  Airports have fewer distinguishing features now as a many other routers can also do printer and drive sharing. The main advantage is Time Machine backup for multiple machines on the network.  If you only have one machine to back up, you may as well plug in a drive.
    Netgear's current lineup of routers seem to support Time Machine backups to an attached USB drive, so that might be a suitable replacement.
    edited November 2016 Soli
  • Reply 85 of 107
    yojimbo007yojimbo007 Posts: 1,165member
    Seems the only vision that is running Apple lately is gluttony for money..

    It seens they have forgotten the key  philosophy Steve layed down... the Philosophy that elevated Apple to unprecedented heights:

    Product  and customer experience FIRST .  
    Money will follow. .....

    That moto took them to the top...

    But i guess like the Router... and and borowing what  BMWtwisty said at another forum  thread... .."if it dont need to be Fixed , Break it. ...."

    and F- the loyal concened customer ! right?

    Apple  dont put a gun on my head  to force me to buy icloud subscription...
    Make it good enough so ill do it voluntarily ..  in the meanwhile listen to your customers needs  and frustrations.  Stop leaving gaping holes in your product line  just to force customers in a convoluted dogmatic environment  you are creating. 
    you present style is leaving a massive distaste in  your loyal customers/ unpaid PR army's  mouth... 

    Choice over Dogma Apple !







    Sent from my iPad
  • Reply 86 of 107
    SoliSoli Posts: 10,035member
    Seems the only vision that is running Apple lately is gluttony for money..
    It seens they have forgotten the key  philosophy Steve layed down... the Philosophy that elevated Apple to unprecedented heights:
    And you figure Apple's "philosophy" has changed because of this rumor?

    Apple  dont put a gun on my head  to force me to buy icloud subscription...

    You know that iCloud started under Jobs, right? You know that it was also under Jobs that the much worse and less functional MobieMe and .Mac, existed, right? If anyone should be blamed for Apple not focusing on web-based services sooner, it's Jobs.

    cornchipStrangeDays
  • Reply 87 of 107
    cornchipcornchip Posts: 1,945member
    blastdoor said:

    They should have released AirPods a year before they removed the audio jack. If people loved the AirPods, then there would have been a strong case to remove the jack. 

    Something is wrong in Cupertino. 

    Apple tries not to telegraph their plans that blatantly.
    StrangeDays
  • Reply 88 of 107
    cornchipcornchip Posts: 1,945member
    mtbnut said:
    Reassign them to the AirPods division.  It needs help, apparently.

    $200 billion in the bank. 115,000 employees. 

    And are late delivering wireless f-ing earphones. 

    In any other industry, that's a fail. But with Apple, it's "We're taking the time to make sure we're doing it right," and everyone nods in agreement. 

    Nice job. 
    Almost two-thirds of those employees work in retail


    Then there's HR, Marketing, Accounting, Graphic Design, Design & Engineering Management, and who knows how many additional personnel who have little or nothing to do with actual Design & Engineering. I know for a fact they have a large squad of strictly CAD jockeys who have nothing to do with ID or engineering; only building appearance models off sketches. It's as if the people who complain about this sort of stuff don't have jobs. Maybe I myself being in the design and engineering for consumer products field makes me more attuned to how this stuff works? Seems like all you'd have to do is think about it critically for a few seconds though. 
    edited November 2016
  • Reply 89 of 107
    melgross said:

    [...] Perhaps they're right, and Mac Pro sales have dropped to the point where they care less about it.

    It's frustrating though, when a product may be a huge seller with some adjustments. Sometimes the reason it's not selling is not that there isn't demand in that segment, but rather that the particular offering isn't what that segment is waiting for. I think the Mac Pro is an excellent example of that.

    If the sales of the Mac Pro are poor, is it because the market for professional desktop workstations is shrinking, or is it because the current version is not perceived as a good value proposition? Maybe a version with card slots would sell in the millions, or one with current components, or one with existing components but at a lower price, or whatever is preventing people from buying them.

    I don't know how Apple assesses and evaluates things like that, but when I read rumours like this one about the AirPorts it makes me worry that if I don't buy the current version of a particular product Apple will just discontinue it.
    palomine
  • Reply 90 of 107
    cornchipcornchip Posts: 1,945member
    Based on this article and the discussion, I thought that I might consider purchasing one before it disappeared.

    However, I was disappointed to discover that 31% of 428 reviews give it 3 stars or less. That gives me pause. One would think that there are few more robust CE products today than a garden-variety router. Is it normal for such a product, especially one from Apple, to get so many mediocre-to-poor ratings?!
    That definitely sounds suspect. Ever since I plugged up my (used) Express in place of a super buggy Brlkin I haven't had one ounce of trouble with wifi. The power went out last night for a few minutes. I would have had to reset the Belkin, but the Express picked up like nothing happened. It also doesn't make the high-pitched whistle like the Belkin. 
    pscooter63
  • Reply 91 of 107
    I bet ASUS is very happy about Apple exiting this market.

    This is a RUMOR, Not a fact.
    Stop spreading FAKE NEWS!!

    …which happens to be a major problem all over the internet
    I recently read a NEWS story detailing the alarming number of Americans who cannot distinguish news from comment (or even advertising). You, my friend, are apparently one of 'em. Coolfactor expressed an opinion. Your first clue might have been the qualifier "I bet."
  • Reply 92 of 107
    zoetmbzoetmb Posts: 2,654member
    I bet ASUS is very happy about Apple exiting this market.

    This is a RUMOR, Not a fact.
    Stop spreading FAKE NEWS!!

    …which happens to be a major problem all over the internet
    Maybe it's a rumor, maybe it's not.   The other day I checked the Apple website and only Airport Express was listed and that, combined with the news that the team had been reassigned lead me to believe that the rumor was completely accurate.  But I just checked again now and all the networking products are there:  Airport Express, Airport Extreme and Airport Time Capsule 2TB and 3TB.   But if they're keeping the line, they need to update Airport Express to AC.  

    Either way, Apple needs to say something.   Soon.

    People have paid the Apple tax at least in part because of the complete Apple eco-system.   On the one hand, Apple has tried to lock us in whether we want to be or not.  On the other, they're dropping products that are part of that system (first monitors and presumably these networking products).   I'm not going to pretend that I know how to run Apple, but these do seem like bad decisions to me because it gives consumers insight that they don't need Apple.   That combined with ludicrous pricing (IMO) on the new MBP is going to cause (again, IMO) many consumers to look elsewhere.   After using Apple products since 1981 or so, I know I'm looking at alternatives.     I think the highly paid executives at Apple have forgotten how real people live.  
  • Reply 93 of 107
    My Time Capsule is sitting behind the cable modem using RJ45, which is also equipped with a WiFi router. It is a double NAT configuration.
    Oddly enough, I get more consistent download speeds with no hickups from the Airport than from the cable modem router.
    Apple must be doing something right.
  • Reply 94 of 107
    liangmikeliangmike Posts: 1unconfirmed, member
    I have been a big fan of Apple's routers over the last ten years. I love the stability, reliability, and ease of use. I hope that Apple will stay in the market...
    edited December 2016 StrangeDays
  • Reply 95 of 107
    williamh said:
    I've used Apple Airports for many years now and I am generally happy.  I expect the high marks are because most people are intimidated by the idea of the setup of other brands (although they're mostly easy enough.)  Airports have fewer distinguishing features now as a many other routers can also do printer and drive sharing.
    Actually, you just hit on my main need for Airport Extreme over other networking devices - printer sharing. While other brands offer printer sharing, I haven't found a single one that can do it with Macs - they all only have drivers for Windows! :( If anyone wants to start a company out there, please produce Mac drivers for print sharing. Thanks!
  • Reply 96 of 107
    grangerfx said:
    Letting the news get out that the entire development staff for the Airport routers have been reassigned without putting out an official statement on the matter is the first sign of serious problems in Apple's management. 
    It's a rumour. It may bear out and it may not, but Apple has never (or very, very rarely) commented on rumours. 

    To do a good job of routing packets to VOIP or NetFlix streaming requires deep network packet sniffing on the local network 
    This is not true. Nothing about VoIP or streaming video requires any soft of deep inspection. Also, from a network equipment point of view, neither of those applications is especially taxing, even for consumer level gear. 

     and that requires very strong encryption on the router. 

    The encryption used for all modern WiFi networks is the same. I'll grant you that shoddy implementations may (probably do) exist but barring that, it's the same protocol using the same encryption algorithm. If it weren't, devices would not interoperate. 

    Also, the encryption on a WiFi device is there solely to secure the data that's transmitted via the radio interface. It has nothing to do with "deep network packet sniffing", which in turn has nothing to do with routing packets (or forwarding frames). 

    Only a router can sense that there are insecure devices on the network such as Chinese IP cameras and firewall them. 
    Also nope. There are no IPS/IDS functions built into Apple's network devices, nor into any consumer level devices that I'm aware of. They provide some *very* basic firewall functionality, but nothing beyond that of any other consumer level home router. 

    This is a disaster for local network security. 
    Maybe. One thing that I have found where Apple exceeds others as far as network device security goes is that they publish software updates (though very infrequently) for their Airport devices, let you know via Airport Utility, and make it really easy to install them. That's a huge plus for home network security.

    Also, Apple has a demonstrated track record of (at least ostensibly) taking privacy seriously. 

    *If* this rumour turns out to be true, those two things will be most missed by me. I say this as someone who's job it has been (of late) to deal with the fallout out of date software running on a plethora of Internet of (sh*tty) Things devices. (Thanks Mirai creators)

    Network gear (especially consumer level stuff, but enterprise as well) has become extremely commoditized. Pushing frame and packets around is something that just about everyone does equally well (or poorly). I wouldn't be surprised to see Apple get out of this market, but I would be saddened. It may be a problem for home network security, but not for the reasons that you are expressing here. 
    Soli
  • Reply 97 of 107
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,844member
    melgross said:

    [...] Perhaps they're right, and Mac Pro sales have dropped to the point where they care less about it.

    It's frustrating though, when a product may be a huge seller with some adjustments. Sometimes the reason it's not selling is not that there isn't demand in that segment, but rather that the particular offering isn't what that segment is waiting for. I think the Mac Pro is an excellent example of that.

    If the sales of the Mac Pro are poor, is it because the market for professional desktop workstations is shrinking, or is it because the current version is not perceived as a good value proposition? Maybe a version with card slots would sell in the millions, or one with current components, or one with existing components but at a lower price, or whatever is preventing people from buying them.

    You mean like the old MP? Are you suggesting Apple never thought to compare sales of the old MP to the new?

    Apple has the data. All the data. The data nobody on any of these rumor sites or forums will ever have. They analyze it, they study it, and they make decisions with it. They've been doing this longer and better than any of us here. I am continually amazed when commenters don't stop and think about that. 
  • Reply 98 of 107
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,844member

    MicDorsey said:
    I bet ASUS is very happy about Apple exiting this market.

    This is a RUMOR, Not a fact.
    Stop spreading FAKE NEWS!!

    …which happens to be a major problem all over the internet
    I recently read a NEWS story detailing the alarming number of Americans who cannot distinguish news from comment (or even advertising). You, my friend, are apparently one of 'em. Coolfactor expressed an opinion. Your first clue might have been the qualifier "I bet."
    Wrong. His "I bet" wasnt a qualifier about Apple leaving the market, it was a qualifier about ASUS being happy. 
  • Reply 99 of 107
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,844member

    zoetmb said:
    I bet ASUS is very happy about Apple exiting this market.

    This is a RUMOR, Not a fact.
    Stop spreading FAKE NEWS!!

    …which happens to be a major problem all over the internet
    Maybe it's a rumor, maybe it's not.   The other day I checked the Apple website and only Airport Express was listed and that, combined with the news that the team had been reassigned lead me to believe that the rumor was completely accurate.  But I just checked again now and all the networking products are there:  Airport Express, Airport Extreme and Airport Time Capsule 2TB and 3TB.   But if they're keeping the line, they need to update Airport Express to AC.  

    Either way, Apple needs to say something.   Soon.

    People have paid the Apple tax at least in part because of the complete Apple eco-system.   On the one hand, Apple has tried to lock us in whether we want to be or not.  On the other, they're dropping products that are part of that system (first monitors and presumably these networking products).   I'm not going to pretend that I know how to run Apple, but these do seem like bad decisions to me because it gives consumers insight that they don't need Apple.   That combined with ludicrous pricing (IMO) on the new MBP is going to cause (again, IMO) many consumers to look elsewhere.   After using Apple products since 1981 or so, I know I'm looking at alternatives.     I think the highly paid executives at Apple have forgotten how real people live.  
    Troll tropes:

    - Apple needs to...
    - Apple tax
    - forced lock-in
    - old fan looking to switch

    ...nice work!
  • Reply 100 of 107
    Mikeymike said:

    Nobody 'needs' an Apple display (which is just a rebadged LG or something anyway), or an Apple router.
    They may not need it, but these were details that provided a more delightful and unified user experience that many want. As Jobs put it: "...our job is to take responsibility for the complete user experience. And if it's not up to par, it's our fault, plain and simply." I love my thunderbolt monitor. It matches my imac and just looks nice. My colleague has a dell monitor and honestly, its just looks out of place. That plastic frame is just cheap (yes I'm a bit of a snob;). At home, I have an Airport Extreme which 'just works.' I've had Asus and linksys routers and always felt I had to spend time tweaking, tuning, or upgrading. These, to me, are part of the complete user experience and I fear dropping these products are signs that Apple is staring to move away from that promise.

    Here's the reference for Steve Jobs quote: http://archive.fortune.com/galleries/2008/fortune/0803/gallery.jobsqna.fortune/4.html
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