Obviously. Sounds like these deals were planned and executed automatically. I imagine another round of executive sell-offs will show up in the next few days.
As for the timing, well, Apple shares always dip after earnings so I wouldn't wait until after.
Oh oh, jony's told him a retirement date & he's getting out before it's announced & the stock tanks
Apple is doomed?
If they are then it's not Jony's fault. There's no one there to push him like Steve did. They're is no conflict to inspire each other. They got rid of Forestall and all the public thinks is that he f'd up maps. He wasn't a lightweight since he was with Jobs since the NEXT days. Sure he was hated by Ives, Federigi, Faddell, that idiot Schiller, and probably Cook, but Jobs liked him because out of conflict came these beautiful products. They were all trying to out do each other and pushed each other to make the best products they could. Now it's just a big circle jerk. They want to be stylish over functionality.
You can tell that the talent that you never knew that made everything work together so seamlessly has moved on. There is nobody to throw a tantrum when something doesn't work. It took an outside entity to show Apple there is something wrong with their brand new computers, and it was the OS. I doubt anybody lost their job over it too.
This is the nicer Cook era...
Just for clarification sake, Federighi and Forstall were both my colleagues at NeXT and Apple. Of the two, Craig was the bigger dick [egoist] than Scott. Scott was demanding while Craig who aided with EOF was not that vital to NeXT, unlike Forstall who was key on AppKit for Openstep and OS X. Craig's ego ballooned when Serlet retired from Apple and he was given a way too prominent role.
He doesn't show up at the NeXT reunions unlike Scott who does when he's in the area.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
Should be a good sign for the earnings. If earnings are Bad, everyone shouts "insidertrading", but if he sells a week before good earnings , no one has reasons to complain.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
Why do you think he's selling now? He's selling because he knows Apple's share price is going to tank upon earnings. For a CEO, he has little confidence in his company. He's not setting a very good example for 'fellow' shareholders. He could easily wait a bit longer before dumping. It will probably lead to more selling off of Apple stock by example. It's really disappointing how Apple's share price is going to drop while the rest of the major tech companies stocks are going to soar upon earnings. I'm willing to bet Alphabet's stock gets to $1000 in a matter of weeks. I honestly don't know why Tim Cook isn't able to satisfy Wall Street even a little bit when other companies make it look so easy.
Oh oh, jony's told him a retirement date & he's getting out before it's announced & the stock tanks
Apple is doomed?
If they are then it's not Jony's fault. There's no one there to push him like Steve did. They're is no conflict to inspire each other. They got rid of Forestall and all the public thinks is that he f'd up maps. He wasn't a lightweight since he was with Jobs since the NEXT days. Sure he was hated by Ives, Federigi, Faddell, that idiot Schiller, and probably Cook, but Jobs liked him because out of conflict came these beautiful products. They were all trying to out do each other and pushed each other to make the best products they could. Now it's just a big circle jerk. They want to be stylish over functionality.
You can tell that the talent that you never knew that made everything work together so seamlessly has moved on. There is nobody to throw a tantrum when something doesn't work. It took an outside entity to show Apple there is something wrong with their brand new computers, and it was the OS. I doubt anybody lost their job over it too.
This is the nicer Cook era...
Just for clarification sake, Federighi and Forstall were both my colleagues at NeXT and Apple. Of the two, Craig was the bigger dick [egoist] than Scott. Scott was demanding while Craig who aided with EOF was not that vital to NeXT, unlike Forstall who was key on AppKit for Openstep and OS X. Craig's ego ballooned when Serlet retired from Apple and he was given a way too prominent role.
He doesn't show up at the NeXT reunions unlike Scott who does when he's in the area.
It always seemed like to me that software took a lower status with Apple (Cook) after the Forstall firing. It became "the success of the iPhone is all because of Ive's design" And I tend to think that something like SIRI was neglected because its all software&service (there's not a physical device necessarily tied to it). One thing about Federighi though. He probably is just going to go along with whatever IVE and COOK want otherwise he'll get canned. (the squeeky wheel gets canned).
I do think that Apple has lots of challenges now because there are 4 operating systems. without a team dedicated to each OS, it probably takes a while to schedule and implement common services in all systems. Programmers and engineers are expensive. Cook's plan seemed to be import H1B visa's when Hillary became president. Not going to happen now.
Why do you think he's selling now? He's selling because he knows Apple's share price is going to tank upon earnings. For a CEO, he has little confidence in his company. He's not setting a very good example for 'fellow' shareholders. He could easily wait a bit longer before dumping. It will probably lead to more selling off of Apple stock by example. It's really disappointing how Apple's share price is going to drop while the rest of the major tech companies stocks are going to soar upon earnings. I'm willing to bet Alphabet's stock gets to $1000 in a matter of weeks. I honestly don't know why Tim Cook isn't able to satisfy Wall Street even a little bit when other companies make it look so easy.
So many assumptions in this comment... Troll or just that uninformed?
I suppose that's possible, but it doesn't seem likely to me. The only tax consequences of selling those shares now would be capital gains on the increase (or capital loss on the decrease) in their value since the date they vested on. Yes, if he sold those shares at a higher price later on there'd be more capital gains and if he sold them at a lower price there'd be less. But he could sell them anytime this year and the capital gain (or loss) would, in most cases, be accounted for this year.
The larger aspect of the taxes on those shares - the normal income tax that he has to pay on them - isn't affected by when he sells them. That was determined when they vested.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
There are quite a few rules regarding the sale of stock by an executive of a publicly traded company.
Among them is any stock issued has to be held for a year, the corporation has to sign off on it, it has to be sold by a broker etc..
Due to the "process" these sales are scheduled a year or more in advance. They are essentially put into a trust with the broker and they are sold on the scheduled dates no matter what. Whatever the price is that day is what they are sold at, I'm not sure you could stop the sale. Once it's scheduled it's going to happen on that day.
i read in another article. The recent sales were originally scheduled from a 2015 filing. So this was planned 18+ months ago.
There are rules, yes. But these kinds of shares can be (and often are) sold as soon as they vest and they don't have to be scheduled a year in advance. It's advisable for insiders such as Mr. Cook to schedule them a decent amount of time in advance (and in this case he did - at least 17 months or so ago - as the SEC filing indicates the shares were sold pursuant to a 105b-1 plan that was last amended in August 2015) so that they have an affirmative defense to possible insider trading charges. They can just decide to sell shares today and then do so tomorrow, but that would be risky in possibly opening them up to such charges. So they shouldn't, and usually don't, do that. But the plan to sell shares (whether it be based on hitting a certain price or set for a certain date or based on a more complicated set of conditions) doesn't need to be adopted a year in advance - it could just be a few months, during a window when they didn't have non-public material information.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
Sure. Conspiracy theories are always better than the truth.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
There are quite a few rules regarding the sale of stock by an executive of a publicly traded company.
Among them is any stock issued has to be held for a year, the corporation has to sign off on it, it has to be sold by a broker etc..
Due to the "process" these sales are scheduled a year or more in advance. They are essentially put into a trust with the broker and they are sold on the scheduled dates no matter what. Whatever the price is that day is what they are sold at, I'm not sure you could stop the sale. Once it's scheduled it's going to happen on that day.
i read in another article. The recent sales were originally scheduled from a 2015 filing. So this was planned 18+ months ago.
You are confusing Company buyback with individual's holdings.
Tim can sell his shares anytime he wants after a specified period of holding (probably a year) He chose to sell now for whatever reason he chose.
Cook can sells his shares of AAPL once they become vested. However, if he holds it for at least a year, any gain, from the share price at date it became vested to the sale date, will be taxed as capital gains. So the shares he's selling now are shares that he had held for over a year. He's still holding on to the shares that were just vested. And for all we know, he's selling shares of AAPL that had before the last 7 for 1 split.
Company employees can not trade their shares of company stock if they are privy to information that can affect the value of the stock. Information that have not yet been made public. This not only includes earnings, but upcoming acquisitions, mergers, lawsuits, recalls, SEC audits, etc.. Otherwise it's insiders trading. And this restriction applies to any family members or close friends, that the employees may have revealed that information to. Or even if the employees just tell a friend to buy the stock, without actually revealing what privy information he knows.
So Cook can not possibly be, nor would he risk, selling his AAPL if he already have information on Apple upcoming earnings. In order to trade right before or after earnings, he must put in the trade order before he's privy to any information about the earnings. This could be 3 or 6 or even 9 months before the actual earning report. However, he can put in a trade order, right after the release of earnings report, once the public can also trade on the same information.
So Cook can put in a trade order to sell AAPL, right before earnings, based on AAPL usually running up before earnings. But he can not sell AAPL if he already knows anything about the, not yet made public, earnings report. If the SEC finds out that Cook placed an order to sell AAPL, even shares that he purchased with his own money, after he was privy to information about the upcoming earning report, he would lose all his gains and be fined for insiders trading.
I suppose that's possible, but it doesn't seem likely to me. The only tax consequences of selling those shares now would be capital gains on the increase (or capital loss on the decrease) in their value since the date they vested on. Yes, if he sold those shares at a higher price later on there'd be more capital gains and if he sold them at a lower price there'd be less. But he could sell them anytime this year and the capital gain (or loss) would, in most cases, be accounted for this year.
The larger aspect of the taxes on those shares - the normal income tax that he has to pay on them - isn't affected by when he sells them. That was determined when they vested.
These stocks sells are planned MONTHS if not YEARS ahead.
Tim Cook probably checked off a box to sell stock when vested years ago.
If you think Cook is trying to game the market, that ridiculous. Cook sold millions of shares when the stock was at $50 in 2012/2013
I'm well aware that such sells are planned well in advance, I've posted to that effect myself. And I haven't suggested that Mr. Cook is trying to game the market, my thoughts are quite to the contrary.
That said, while Mr. Cook has at times sold shares when they vested, that was not the case here. These shares didn't just vest. The last RSUs that vested for Mr. Cook did so last August and he sold all of them (net of tax withholding) shortly after they did.
Also, Mr. Cook sold about 140,000 shares at around $50 (split-adjusted) in 2011 before he became CEO. The next time he sold shares was in 2012 when sold about 750,000 for around $85 (split-adjusted). I don't think he sold shares again until 2014 (I'd have to double check that to make sure he didn't sell some small blocks). But at any rate, it wasn't millions for $50 (or around $50).
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
Why do you think he's selling now? He's selling because he knows Apple's share price is going to tank upon earnings. For a CEO, he has little confidence in his company. He's not setting a very good example for 'fellow' shareholders. He could easily wait a bit longer before dumping. It will probably lead to more selling off of Apple stock by example. It's really disappointing how Apple's share price is going to drop while the rest of the major tech companies stocks are going to soar upon earnings. I'm willing to bet Alphabet's stock gets to $1000 in a matter of weeks. I honestly don't know why Tim Cook isn't able to satisfy Wall Street even a little bit when other companies make it look so easy.
He could totally wait 3 months instead of selling now¡
But what if he placed a trade order to sell these shares at $120, a year ago? Then it is only coincidence that the sale took place a week or so before earnings. It's the only time AAPL traded at $120 in a year. If AAPL had hit $120 around Xmas, then the shares would have sold then. Or if AAPL never got to $120, Cook would still have the shares. So long as he put in the trade order before he was privy to any information about the upcoming earnings report, he can't control the sale date and he's done nothing wrong.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
Why do you think he's selling now? He's selling because he knows Apple's share price is going to tank upon earnings. For a CEO, he has little confidence in his company. He's not setting a very good example for 'fellow' shareholders. He could easily wait a bit longer before dumping. It will probably lead to more selling off of Apple stock by example. It's really disappointing how Apple's share price is going to drop while the rest of the major tech companies stocks are going to soar upon earnings. I'm willing to bet Alphabet's stock gets to $1000 in a matter of weeks. I honestly don't know why Tim Cook isn't able to satisfy Wall Street even a little bit when other companies make it look so easy.
He could totally wait 3 months instead of selling now¡
But what if he placed a trade order to sell these shares at $120, a year ago? Then it is only coincidence that the sale took place a week or so before earnings. It's the only time AAPL traded at $120 in a year. If AAPL had hit $120 around Xmas, then the shares would have sold then. Or if AAPL never got to $120, Cook would still have the shares. So long as he put in the trade order before he was privy to any information about the upcoming earnings report, he can't control the sale date and he's done nothing wrong.
I think this is more or less right. My suspicion is that Mr. Cook's current 105b-1 plan includes an order to sell a certain number of shares when they hit $120, with the sales coming in blocks of 10,000 per day. My guess would be that the plan only calls for this happening once each year or, at least, that such sales only occur after a certain amount of time (e.g. 6 months) has passed since the last sales. In other words, if the price stays above $120 for 4 months, he doesn't keep selling 10,000 shares per day until he's sold all his shares.
The plan these most recent sales are pursuant to was adopted in August of 2015. In October and November of 2015 he also sold shares as soon as the price hit $120. That time he sold a block of about 70,000 the first day, then sold 10,000 per day for the next 6 days just as he did this time. In 2016, as you suggest, the price never hit $120. And, best I can recall, these are the only share sales he's done since being CEO that didn't correspond to a block of RSUs vesting.
Timing is kind of interesting..
Why sell just a few days before earnings...?
What are the rules of the game....
I dont know about you... but to me its not very comfortable that he is selling now... Rather than after earni gs report...
Any thoughts?
Thanx
Why do you think he's selling now? He's selling because he knows Apple's share price is going to tank upon earnings. For a CEO, he has little confidence in his company. He's not setting a very good example for 'fellow' shareholders. He could easily wait a bit longer before dumping. It will probably lead to more selling off of Apple stock by example. It's really disappointing how Apple's share price is going to drop while the rest of the major tech companies stocks are going to soar upon earnings. I'm willing to bet Alphabet's stock gets to $1000 in a matter of weeks. I honestly don't know why Tim Cook isn't able to satisfy Wall Street even a little bit when other companies make it look so easy.
He could totally wait 3 months instead of selling now¡
But what if he placed a trade order to sell these shares at $120, a year ago? Then it is only coincidence that the sale took place a week or so before earnings. It's the only time AAPL traded at $120 in a year. If AAPL had hit $120 around Xmas, then the shares would have sold then. Or if AAPL never got to $120, Cook would still have the shares. So long as he put in the trade order before he was privy to any information about the upcoming earnings report, he can't control the sale date and he's done nothing wrong.
I think this is more or less right. My suspicion is that Mr. Cook's current 105b-1 plan includes an order to sell a certain number of shares when they hit $120, with the sales coming in blocks of 10,000 per day. My guess would be that the plan only calls for this happening once each year or, at least, that such sales only occur after a certain amount of time (e.g. 6 months) has passed since the last sales. In other words, if the price stays above $120 for 4 months, he doesn't keep selling 10,000 shares per day until he's sold all his shares.
The plan these most recent sales are pursuant to was adopted in August of 2015. In October and November of 2015 he also sold shares as soon as the price hit $120. That time he sold a block of about 70,000 the first day, then sold 10,000 per day for the next 6 days just as he did this time. In 2016, as you suggest, the price never hit $120. And, best I can recall, these are the only share sales he's done since being CEO that didn't correspond to a block of RSUs vesting.
9to5mac is also saying this sale was set up back in 2015.
ah, I see AI has chosen to go with an unflattering photo of Cook that projects some sort of laughing-fat-cat image. I've noticed image patterns like this on AI and MR before, I'm not sure what the perceived value of using such loaded images are.
ah, I see AI has chosen to go with an unflattering photo of Cook that projects some sort of laughing-fat-cat image. I've noticed image patterns like this on AI and MR before, I'm not sure what the perceived value of using such loaded images are.
I like that photo. I don't think it's unflattering.
Comments
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/appleinsider.com/articles/17/01/09/debunking-retail-rumors-apple-says-its-stores-are-equipped-to-repair-new-macbook-pros/amp/
As for the timing, well, Apple shares always dip after earnings so I wouldn't wait until after.
Just for clarification sake, Federighi and Forstall were both my colleagues at NeXT and Apple. Of the two, Craig was the bigger dick [egoist] than Scott. Scott was demanding while Craig who aided with EOF was not that vital to NeXT, unlike Forstall who was key on AppKit for Openstep and OS X. Craig's ego ballooned when Serlet retired from Apple and he was given a way too prominent role.
He doesn't show up at the NeXT reunions unlike Scott who does when he's in the area.
And I tend to think that something like SIRI was neglected because its all software&service (there's not a physical device necessarily tied to it).
One thing about Federighi though. He probably is just going to go along with whatever IVE and COOK want otherwise he'll get canned.
(the squeeky wheel gets canned).
I do think that Apple has lots of challenges now because there are 4 operating systems. without a team dedicated to each OS, it probably takes a while to schedule and implement common services in all systems. Programmers and engineers are expensive. Cook's plan seemed to be import H1B visa's when Hillary became president.
Not going to happen now.
The larger aspect of the taxes on those shares - the normal income tax that he has to pay on them - isn't affected by when he sells them. That was determined when they vested.
There are rules, yes. But these kinds of shares can be (and often are) sold as soon as they vest and they don't have to be scheduled a year in advance. It's advisable for insiders such as Mr. Cook to schedule them a decent amount of time in advance (and in this case he did - at least 17 months or so ago - as the SEC filing indicates the shares were sold pursuant to a 105b-1 plan that was last amended in August 2015) so that they have an affirmative defense to possible insider trading charges. They can just decide to sell shares today and then do so tomorrow, but that would be risky in possibly opening them up to such charges. So they shouldn't, and usually don't, do that. But the plan to sell shares (whether it be based on hitting a certain price or set for a certain date or based on a more complicated set of conditions) doesn't need to be adopted a year in advance - it could just be a few months, during a window when they didn't have non-public material information.
Cook can sells his shares of AAPL once they become vested. However, if he holds it for at least a year, any gain, from the share price at date it became vested to the sale date, will be taxed as capital gains. So the shares he's selling now are shares that he had held for over a year. He's still holding on to the shares that were just vested. And for all we know, he's selling shares of AAPL that had before the last 7 for 1 split.
Company employees can not trade their shares of company stock if they are privy to information that can affect the value of the stock. Information that have not yet been made public. This not only includes earnings, but upcoming acquisitions, mergers, lawsuits, recalls, SEC audits, etc.. Otherwise it's insiders trading. And this restriction applies to any family members or close friends, that the employees may have revealed that information to. Or even if the employees just tell a friend to buy the stock, without actually revealing what privy information he knows.
So Cook can not possibly be, nor would he risk, selling his AAPL if he already have information on Apple upcoming earnings. In order to trade right before or after earnings, he must put in the trade order before he's privy to any information about the earnings. This could be 3 or 6 or even 9 months before the actual earning report. However, he can put in a trade order, right after the release of earnings report, once the public can also trade on the same information.
So Cook can put in a trade order to sell AAPL, right before earnings, based on AAPL usually running up before earnings. But he can not sell AAPL if he already knows anything about the, not yet made public, earnings report. If the SEC finds out that Cook placed an order to sell AAPL, even shares that he purchased with his own money, after he was privy to information about the upcoming earning report, he would lose all his gains and be fined for insiders trading.
That said, while Mr. Cook has at times sold shares when they vested, that was not the case here. These shares didn't just vest. The last RSUs that vested for Mr. Cook did so last August and he sold all of them (net of tax withholding) shortly after they did.
Also, Mr. Cook sold about 140,000 shares at around $50 (split-adjusted) in 2011 before he became CEO. The next time he sold shares was in 2012 when sold about 750,000 for around $85 (split-adjusted). I don't think he sold shares again until 2014 (I'd have to double check that to make sure he didn't sell some small blocks). But at any rate, it wasn't millions for $50 (or around $50).
But what if he placed a trade order to sell these shares at $120, a year ago? Then it is only coincidence that the sale took place a week or so before earnings. It's the only time AAPL traded at $120 in a year. If AAPL had hit $120 around Xmas, then the shares would have sold then. Or if AAPL never got to $120, Cook would still have the shares. So long as he put in the trade order before he was privy to any information about the upcoming earnings report, he can't control the sale date and he's done nothing wrong.
The plan these most recent sales are pursuant to was adopted in August of 2015. In October and November of 2015 he also sold shares as soon as the price hit $120. That time he sold a block of about 70,000 the first day, then sold 10,000 per day for the next 6 days just as he did this time. In 2016, as you suggest, the price never hit $120. And, best I can recall, these are the only share sales he's done since being CEO that didn't correspond to a block of RSUs vesting.