Apple's Campus 2 repeatedly delayed by emphasis on perfecting small details, profile says

2

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 51
    wlymwlym Posts: 102member
    They should just buy Apple Care on the building and send it in for repairs when they discover some features not working as advertised. Or they could move in, expecting some problems, but call it the "Beta Campus" until they get it right in a few years. ;-)
    glynhdacharavon b7
  • Reply 22 of 51
    That proves it. Steve didn't die, but is skulking around the jobsite at night in a hoodie making notes. Viva Steve!
    StrangeDays
  • Reply 23 of 51
    Think of all the time they wasted meeting and discussing this building when it would have been better spent on fixing all of the bugs in MacOS, iOS, or tvOS. Or spent bringing Pages, Numbers, and Keynote back to feature parity with the previous iWork versions. Or spent fixing bugs in or just giving up and starting over with iTunes. Or spent redesigning the terrible AppleTV 4 remote. Or spent fixing... I could go on and on. What a colossal misdirection of scarce resources.
    edited February 2017 dachar
  • Reply 24 of 51
    radarthekatradarthekat Posts: 3,842moderator
    dr. x said:
    I too would like to visit as well. 

    Me too, but I'm living in SE Asia these days, so I'll probably just wait for Samsung to make a copy on this side of the planet.
    cornchip
  • Reply 25 of 51
    glynhglynh Posts: 133member
    Sir Jony Ive: "This door handle is not thin enough. It doesn't feel perfect."

    Contractor: "You're holding it wrong..."
    dacharlorin schultzRayz2016
  • Reply 26 of 51
    dewmedewme Posts: 5,371member
    No problemo. Spending billions in total and then compromising on the fine details of fit & finish for the sake of expediency simply does not make sense. This is what world class "build quality" is all about boys and girls. This is no different than how Rolls Royce scrutinizes all the fine details of the fit & finish of their automobiles to the fingertip and trained eye level. I'd expect no less for Apple's cathedral dedicated to the legend and genius of Steve Jobs. 
    StrangeDaysSolirandominternetpersonpatchythepirate
  • Reply 27 of 51
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,384member
    sog35 said:
    Tim Cook again showing why he's the best CEO in the world

    The guy is the MAN.

    I'm glad I stuck with Cook and Apple.

    Just checked my Apple shares.....its up another $2000 the last 2 days.

    Apple will see $150 this year, nothing is going to stop it this time

    You're severely mentally ill. You haven't "stuck" with Cook, and you're a serial liar. You've been shitting on him non-stop for the past few thousand posts, and demanding that he resign. I mean, everyone has been witnessing your post history, so why come out with such a blatant lie that you "stuck with Cook"? You're a fucking child, and will be back to your vociferous hatred of the man as soon as the stock drops a couple bucks. The short term price of your Apple shares are all that matter to you, and you're clueless about absolutely everything else. I suggest you sell them all off now and get out, so we don't need to be subjugated to another 10,000 posts of you destroying every thread and shitting on Cook as soon as the stock (inevitably) drops again. Your posts have never been based on anything approaching fact or rationality, only Apple's current stock price, and you draw all conclusions from there. I've never seen such a shitty and short-sighted investor in my life. 

    How the mods continue to let you to post, after you've destroyed so many threads with your off-topic Cook hate, and the same rants over and over, is absolutely remarkable. 
    edited February 2017 StrangeDaysai46patchythepiratecornchipxiamenbill
  • Reply 28 of 51
    big8ce said:
    neilm said:
    Emphasis on perfecting small details — ya think? This is Apple, after all.

    BTW, I don't see anything unreasonable in insisting on zero height thresholds. This would also be an accessibility issue.
    I have to agree with the Architects on this one. Construction is not like electronics. Wood, concrete and drywall expand and contract over the years due to the temperature and moisture in the air. It would be foolish to have a zero height threshold knowing that sometime down the line either the floor or the door will expand or contract creating an issue.
    No big deal. Once the building settles, they'll just replace all the doors to the new tolerance.   :p
    edited February 2017 cornchip
  • Reply 29 of 51
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,879member
    Wow that's nuts.  I can appreciate attention to detail in their devices, but applying that mentality to construction is a bit overboard imo.  Congrats to Apple for delaying the project by months and jacking up the cost I guess.  
    Congrats to the rumor mill readers for taking every anonymous third-hand (or more) tale as fact. 
    edited February 2017 ai46
  • Reply 30 of 51
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,879member
    sog35 said:
    Tim Cook again showing why he's the best CEO in the world

    The guy is the MAN.

    I'm glad I stuck with Cook and Apple.

    Just checked my Apple shares.....its up another $2000 the last 2 days.

    Apple will see $150 this year, nothing is going to stop it this time
    Will you return to your hysteric criticism of Cook when the stock next loses value?
    cornchipSpamSandwich
  • Reply 31 of 51
    I guess when you have $250+ billion laying around, who really gives a damn about time & money concerns ??   As someone who's been around in arch + construction field for 40+ years I have seen enough anal obsessive behavior by "so-called professionals" over many truly inconsequential things but it appears Apple's culture of "perfection" has taken this notion well past the limits of our solar system and into some endless "black hole".    Obsessing over the thickness of a laptop computer isn't in the same league as losing sleep over the threshold of a doorway opening.... seriously Apple, go focus on "industrial design" which is the core of your business and spend time and money improving the OS X operating system and integration with their hardware instead of wasting effort on trying to perfect building construction.
  • Reply 32 of 51
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,879member

    enlarsen said:
    Think of all the time they wasted meeting and discussing this building when it would have been better spent on fixing all of the bugs in MacOS, iOS, or tvOS. Or spent bringing Pages, Numbers, and Keynote back to feature parity with the previous iWork versions. Or spent fixing bugs in or just giving up and starting over with iTunes. Or spent redesigning the terrible AppleTV 4 remote. Or spent fixing... I could go on and on. What a colossal misdirection of scarce resources.
    Your post, I presume? Since none of the software team is diverted to build their new HQ, your post is quite insane. Also, since Apple likely could use more good people, you should be in support of a bigger HQ to put them in.
    edited February 2017 patchythepirate
  • Reply 33 of 51
    dachardachar Posts: 330member
    The contracts will no doubt follow normal practice and change extra for anything outside the specification and build contract. I wonder how much extra this will cost Apple?
  • Reply 34 of 51
    nhtnht Posts: 4,522member
    ppartekim said:
    neilm said:
    Emphasis on perfecting small details — ya think? This is Apple, after all.

    BTW, I don't see anything unreasonable in insisting on zero height thresholds. This would also be an accessibility issue.
    While not zero I was trying to find at least a flat threshold (even for ease of cleaning) for a new Patio Door and no once carries such a thing.. Everything is raised, mutual-grooved and designed to either trip one or make a cleaning nightmare when used hourly by kids/dogs/etc...
    Because for an exterior door you have to deal with weather intrusion and a 1" sill or a step down is done to do a weather seal unless you go a expensive route with a lift mechanism that allows the door to settle inside the flat threshold.  The lift mechanism will need appropriate drainage and typically grill drainage (aco style) will also be done on the exterior floor.

    That said, if you have a deep lanai/veranda you can get away without the lift thingy and just a drain assuming you have some other storm/hurricane protection for the lanai itself.

    A French/hinged patio door (i.e. swings, not slides) should give you a flat threshold.

    https://www.andersenwindows.com/product/french-doors-hinged-patio-doors/

    Of course it swings and not slides so it takes more clearance...
    edited February 2017
  • Reply 35 of 51

    "The project has also been subject to cost overruns, and is now estimated to carry a $5 billion pricetag —more than many large corporations make in an entire year."

    The last part of the sentence is silly.  Construction is a capital expense to be paid for over years, if not decades.  It is common for companies to pay more for a new building than they make in a single year--not unlike a family in that regard.  The fact that Apple could pay for this out of petty cash is the remarkable part.

    There are two mistakes you can make on a project like this: being too inattentive or being too picky.  It doesn't surprise me that Apple is erring on the too picky side, and is probably the wiser choice.  But let's see when the move-in date is.  If it slips too 2018, that would be a bad sign.

    cornchip
  • Reply 36 of 51
    mac_128mac_128 Posts: 3,454member
    nht said:
    big8ce said:
    neilm said:
    Emphasis on perfecting small details — ya think? This is Apple, after all.

    BTW, I don't see anything unreasonable in insisting on zero height thresholds. This would also be an accessibility issue.
    I have to agree with the Architects on this one. Construction is not like electronics. Wood, concrete and drywall expand and contract over the years due to the temperature and moisture in the air. It would be foolish to have a zero height threshold knowing that sometime down the line either the floor or the door will expand or contract creating an issue.
    None of our interior doors have thresholds in our building with the exception of the bathrooms and ESD rooms.   The floors are largely 10" concrete slab and no thresholds required or desired. Requiring zero thresholds is a complete non-issue.  Even fire doors have no thresholds in the stairwell and the corridor.  

    Evidently the construction manager never built a hospital either.  Huge buildings where you can roll patients everywhere.

    Heck, there are no thresholds in my house except for the exterior doors and the bathrooms.
    It depends on what your needs are. All of the doors in my office suite have thresholds that are recessed into the floor for the purposes of soundproofing. They create an airtight seal around the entire perimeter. Perhaps most of Apple's offices won't need this level of security, but a fair amount of them might knowing Apple. 
  • Reply 37 of 51
    Wow that's nuts.  I can appreciate attention to detail in their devices, but applying that mentality to construction is a bit overboard imo.  Congrats to Apple for delaying the project by months and jacking up the cost I guess.  
    Yes, shame on Apple for expecting the construction industry to have pride in their workmanship, instead of optimizing for graft.
  • Reply 38 of 51
    sog35 said:
    Tim Cook again showing why he's the best CEO in the world

    The guy is the MAN.

    I'm glad I stuck with Cook and Apple.

    Just checked my Apple shares.....its up another $2000 the last 2 days.

    Apple will see $150 this year, nothing is going to stop it this time
    Talk about jumping on the bandwagon. After crapping on Tim Cook for months now he's the best CEO around. Hopefully in his next round of buybacks he'll buy your 10 shares and you'll go away.
    cornchip
  • Reply 39 of 51
    ksecksec Posts: 1,569member
    I am not an architect, but i have never seen ONE single building that i was were perfectly happy with, even those so call 6 stars hotel. I guess Architect has grown with margin of error for everything. And it is good Apple may have push the limit, and even in the course of these have many innovation of fixing and reinventing architect.

    And if somebody is paying 5 billion USD dont you think they should demand perfection? And apart from those most interior's job are rubbish. Too labor intensive and not scale to perfection.
  • Reply 40 of 51
    So, at least one contractor was complaining that the Apple team was refining small, normally "inconsequential" details. Apparently the details were not inconsequential to the Apple team. Without detailed specific examples (photographic backup would be helpful), it is impossible to determine if the Apple managers and/or architects were indeed demanding things beyond the drawings and specifications or the contractors were not following the contract. The former would result in change orders that cost Apple and the latter typically is usually on the contractors dime, except it could become a bit more complicated when there is multiple prime contracts, as this massive project certainly has.

    The very first example -- "the main ring's polished concrete ceiling panels" -- is likely a poor description of the actual construction, as is "inside and out". In essence, every single part of the construction is approved by the contractor (though it seams they typically overlook things to do the minimal amount of work and still get paid) and the architect and the owner's agents.

    Apple is correct that any change in flooring is a potential trip hazard. Apple's obsession with doorways very well could have been a specifications issue where they did not know what they were getting from the design team. Interior thresholds are unnecessary, since automatic door bottoms perform many of the same functions. It is unclear what "stuff that's never been done before" is referring. But I have heard a few times similar statements, such as, "I have been doing it like this for 20 years..." Where the person making the statement either does not know or accept the fact that standards are constantly changing. ADA allows a 1/4-inch high abrupt change in flooring height and a maximum 1/2-inch height in a threshold, but I have known numerous contractors who did not know this.

    I find it very believable that Apple clashed with the fire department about code required exit sign locations and signage at stairs and elevators. I also would not be surprised if the discussions also included audio/visual notification devices, sprinkler head and smoke detector locations. These are all ugly things if you are a minimalist. I am always amused when in a haunted Disney ride and see the illuminated exit signs.

    Maybe the sample door handle was just too heavy because it took construction crews to present it to Apple.×Page There are several construction tolerances less than 1/8-inch. The industry tolerance for door machining to receive door hardware is 1/32-inch.

    I have been a CCS for too many years.
    edited February 2017 patchythepirate
Sign In or Register to comment.