Availability of 15" MacBook Pro with Touch Bar slips ahead of rumored refresh

2

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 60
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    entropys said:
    You know, I just realised I have never, ever seen a MacBook outside of a shop.
    Could be a few reasons for this:

    1. Apple is lying and has not sold a single MacBook ever.
    2. You're not very observant. 
    3. You don't actually know what a MacBook looks like. 

    I suspect it's a combination of 2 and 3, weighing heavily towards 2. 

    edited May 2017 Metriacanthosauruspscooter63fastasleep
  • Reply 22 of 60
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    Just don't use the "Hello Again!" moniker for something so mundane. I hope Apple re-realizes the value of their history and not use it idiotically again
    Or don't attach the second coming of Christ to a marketing slogan. I don't think it's Apple's fault that a few  people try desperately to pull their product plans for the next decade out of two words printed on a poster. 

    They said "Hello Again" because the last time they said "Hello". 
    edited May 2017 pscooter63macxpressfastasleep
  • Reply 23 of 60
    night9hawknight9hawk Posts: 103member
    entropys said:
    You know, I just realised I have never, ever seen a MacBook outside of a shop.
    maybe they will put a better processor in it, an extra port and drop the price to mere stratospheric levels. I know most school kids are still buying MBAs.
    Dream on! drop the price? Really? And Pigs can fly, I have a bridge over the thames I want to sell...

    Hopefully it's the Blackfriars Bridge. I've wanted it since I first laid eyes on it 16 years ago!

    I've seen the MacBooks in the wild at the university I work at but they keyboard on them is an unmitigated disaster. Terrible, terrible design and the keyboard on the recent MacBook Pro computers is only marginally better. This is born out in experience as well as working with the warranty repair people in our campus computer store.
  • Reply 24 of 60
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 6,858administrator
    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.


    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    Not quite. One in 2007 would be faster. Also, the last Mac hardware refesh that was announced at WWDC was in 2014, and was the MacBook Air.

    1: Needs a new motherboard, and possibly a new case, so probably no.
    2: See 1.
    3: See "new case" in response 1.
    4: Not likely, and see "new case" in response 1.

    IF the MacBook Pro is refreshed at all, and that's still a big if, it'll be a shift Kaby Lake, as that's basically a drop-in for the Skylake in the MBP now, and no other major changes. KL doesn't support LPDDR4, and LPDDR3 is limited to 16GB of RAM regardless of what processor it's bolted to.
    fastasleep
  • Reply 25 of 60
    aenghusaenghus Posts: 14member
    I wonder if Apple will provide a way for those who bought last fall's machine to easily upgrade to the newer model?
  • Reply 26 of 60
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,801member
    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.


    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    Not quite. One in 2007 would be faster. Also, the last Mac hardware refesh that was announced at WWDC was in 2014, and was the MacBook Air.

    1: Needs a new motherboard, and possibly a new case, so probably no.
    2: See 1.
    3: See "new case" in response 1.
    4: Not likely, and see "new case" in response 1.

    IF the MacBook Pro is refreshed at all, and that's still a big if, it'll be a shift Kaby Lake, as that's basically a drop-in for the Skylake in the MBP now, and no other major changes. KL doesn't support LPDDR4, and LPDDR3 is limited to 16GB of RAM regardless of what processor it's bolted to.
    Oh boy and then we'll have to go through this bitching about the 16GB limitation for another 2 months and how they're going to get something else because Apple doesn't care even though they've said this at least 20 times within the past couple of years and yet they still use Apple products. 

    I've asked this I don't know how many times and NOBODY and I mean NOBODY has ever responded with why they need more than 16GB of RAM and what they're doing that requires more RAM in a laptop. Certain people want to complain, yet nobody has an explanation. I'm truly beginning to think its just a nicety rather than a requirement at this point. 
    edited May 2017
  • Reply 27 of 60
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,801member

    Rayz2016 said:
    entropys said:
    You know, I just realised I have never, ever seen a MacBook outside of a shop.
    maybe they will put a better processor in it, an extra port and drop the price to mere stratospheric levels. I know most school kids are still buying MBAs.
    Could be a couple reasons for this:

    1. Apple is lying and has not sold a single MacBook ever.
    2. You're not very observant. 
    3. You don't actually know what a MacBook looks like. 

    I suspect it's a combination of 2 and 3, weighing heavily towards 2. 

    We also have to take into account that the outgoing model has been out for quite some time, and the previous models to that have been out for even longer. So of course all you're seeing are older models. Its like when a totally brand new car comes out. You don't see very many if any for a while, but as time passes you start to see them more and more and eventually its just nothing special to see them. 
  • Reply 28 of 60
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member

    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.

    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    Well two of those items will never happen -- the consumer card slot is gone, and removable storage will never return either since it's too big and slow.  
    It may be unlikely, but I don't think it's impossible that the SD card slot may come back.  The iMac still has it (as does the Mac mini, though that doesn't count for much), and Apple sell an SD to Lightning adaptor, and it's not obsolete technology at all.  The original MacBook Air launched without an SD slot, and then was upgraded later to include one.  Long shot, but not impossible.

    The MacBook Pro without Touch Bar has replaceable storage.  https://www.macrumors.com/2016/10/28/new-macbook-pro-removable-ssd/
    I don't think it's at all inconceivable for Apple to ship the Touch Bar MacBook pros without soldering the storage in.  In fact I'd put this at 50/50.


    edited May 2017
  • Reply 29 of 60
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,801member
    aenghus said:
    I wonder if Apple will provide a way for those who bought last fall's machine to easily upgrade to the newer model?
    There's a very easy way...sell your current model and buy the newest one. You can't have the newest technology forever. Eventually, it will be out of date. Apple doesn't have to do anything for previous owners. 
    edited May 2017
  • Reply 30 of 60
    boboliciousbobolicious Posts: 1,139member
    appex said:
    Hopefully they fix previous errors:

    The Touchbar MacBook Pro is a Disposable Embarrassment
    I'd rather have the 2.5GB/sec SSD than a 2.5-inch SATA III one. Even the M.2 form factor NVMe SSDs don't hit the speed that the 15-inch does.

    Guy's welcome to his opinion, but he's basing it off of a lot of false assumptions about intent, and what will happen to Apple's marketshare if they don't kowtow to a very loud, very small portion of Apple's market.
    While I understand optimizing speed is the raison d'être for close tolerance memory 'onboard', per the article in my work I'd rather have capacity than speed for the same price, yet the ability to change components with industry standard form factors (as I have with every Mac I've owned) as needs, options and pricing adjust, eventually downgrading and repurposing when newer tech replaces older, and save the 'appliance' approach for consumer products.....

    3500 vs 545 MBps ?
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAAZU57T5317&cm_re=1tb_ssd-_-20-147-597-_-Product
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820250083&cm_re=1tb_ssd-_-20-250-083-_-Product

    Could a backlit wireless external keyboard with touch bar (wishlist) or via duet via iOS also be options for those that desire touch bar upgrades when software eventually supports it ?
  • Reply 31 of 60
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 6,858administrator
    appex said:
    Hopefully they fix previous errors:

    The Touchbar MacBook Pro is a Disposable Embarrassment
    I'd rather have the 2.5GB/sec SSD than a 2.5-inch SATA III one. Even the M.2 form factor NVMe SSDs don't hit the speed that the 15-inch does.

    Guy's welcome to his opinion, but he's basing it off of a lot of false assumptions about intent, and what will happen to Apple's marketshare if they don't kowtow to a very loud, very small portion of Apple's market.
    While I understand optimizing speed is the raison d'être for close tolerance memory 'onboard', per the article in my work I'd rather have capacity than speed for the same price, yet the ability to change components with industry standard form factors (as I have with every Mac I've owned) as needs, options and pricing adjust, eventually downgrading and repurposing when newer tech replaces older, and save the 'appliance' approach for consumer products.....

    3500 vs 545 MBps ?
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIAAZU57T5317&cm_re=1tb_ssd-_-20-147-597-_-Product
    https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820250083&cm_re=1tb_ssd-_-20-250-083-_-Product

    Could a backlit wireless external keyboard with touch bar (wishlist) or via duet via iOS also be options for those that desire touch bar upgrades when software eventually supports it ?
    Sure, and I'm not saying that you don't need these things from your storage.

    However, as I keep saying, you and I are in the firm minority of Apple users. As a result, you're likely not going to get them from Apple's MacBook Pro line. The speed on the Apple drives is delivered. The claimed speed on the Samsung drive is promised, but actual benchmarks on it are slower than the drive on the MBP.

    Re: External with Touch bar would be nice and is a logical step, but we haven't heard anything about it.
  • Reply 32 of 60
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,382member
    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.


    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    1. Will happen. 
    2. Nope.
    3. Nope. 
    4. Nope. 

    I'll never understand how some of you set up unrealistic expectations which will only lead to disappointment. Apple is not going to reverse course on replaceable storage or an SD card (come on, really?), and the keyboard is not objectively "worse" than their previous ones. I happen to love it. 

    Just don't use the "Hello Again!" moniker for something so mundane. I hope Apple re-realizes the value of their history and not use it idiotically again
    Yeah, because redesigning the Macbook Pro from the ground-up is so "mundane". You clearly have no clue as to the amount of engineering and thought that goes in to something like this. Completely new internals, screen, body, keyboard, touchbar, trackpad, ports etc. "Idiotically"? Wow. For some of you, your Apple hatred really rots your brains and prevents you from thinking in any kind of rational fashion. Your personal feelings towards the product have nothing to do with whether it deserves that moniker. The fact is that it's a significant change. 
    edited May 2017 pscooter63fastasleep
  • Reply 33 of 60
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 6,858administrator

    crowley said:

    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.

    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    Well two of those items will never happen -- the consumer card slot is gone, and removable storage will never return either since it's too big and slow.  
    It may be unlikely, but I don't think it's impossible that the SD card slot may come back.  The iMac still has it (as does the Mac mini, though that doesn't count for much), and Apple sell an SD to Lightning adaptor, and it's not obsolete technology at all.  The original MacBook Air launched without an SD slot, and then was upgraded later to include one.  Long shot, but not impossible.

    The MacBook Pro without Touch Bar has replaceable storage.  https://www.macrumors.com/2016/10/28/new-macbook-pro-removable-ssd/
    I don't think it's at all inconceivable for Apple to ship the Touch Bar MacBook pros without soldering the storage in.  In fact I'd put this at 50/50.


    Still would need mass renovations to the motherboard to accommodate either thing you're talking about here -- there are other architectural differences between the 13 and 15-inch motherboards beyond just removable storage. 

    I don't see it happening in 220 days between the last release and WWDC. The last short-cycle on MBPs that I keep mentioning was a drop-in processor, necessitating no other motherboard change than a new BGA processor on the same board.
    edited May 2017
  • Reply 34 of 60
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    slurpy said:
    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.


    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    1. Will happen. 
    2. Nope.
    3. Nope. 
    4. Nope. 

    I'll never understand how some of you set up unrealistic expectations which will only lead to disappointment. Apple is not going to reverse course on replaceable storage or an SD card (come on, really?), and the keyboard is not objectively "worse" than their previous ones. I happen to love it. 
    I happen to not.  Who said it was "objectively" worse? 

    And what's wrong with a wishlist?  I didn't say I'd definitely not buy if none of them came true.

    I'll never understand how some of you pooh-pooh other peoples wants just because they don't conform with yours, as if that has any relevance to the OP's POV.


    edited May 2017 avon b7
  • Reply 35 of 60
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member

    crowley said:

    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.

    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    Well two of those items will never happen -- the consumer card slot is gone, and removable storage will never return either since it's too big and slow.  
    It may be unlikely, but I don't think it's impossible that the SD card slot may come back.  The iMac still has it (as does the Mac mini, though that doesn't count for much), and Apple sell an SD to Lightning adaptor, and it's not obsolete technology at all.  The original MacBook Air launched without an SD slot, and then was upgraded later to include one.  Long shot, but not impossible.

    The MacBook Pro without Touch Bar has replaceable storage.  https://www.macrumors.com/2016/10/28/new-macbook-pro-removable-ssd/
    I don't think it's at all inconceivable for Apple to ship the Touch Bar MacBook pros without soldering the storage in.  In fact I'd put this at 50/50.


    Still would need mass renovations to the motherboard to accommodate either thing you're talking about here -- there are other architectural differences between the 13 and 15-inch motherboards beyond just removable storage. 

    I don't see it happening in 220 days between the last release and WWDC. The last short-cycle on MBPs that I keep mentioning was a drop-in processor, necessitating no other motherboard change than a new BGA processor on the same board.
    Maybe, but the very fact that this has been such a fast turnaround, following what was widely acknowledged as a less than warm welcome for the new form factor of the MBP (yes big sales etc etc, but press and pro reaction matters too) suggests that maybe there's been some rethinking going on.  Maybe not, of course, all will be revealed on the 8th, but as one of those who found the MBPwTB underwhelming because of the compromises I'll live in hope.
    avon b7
  • Reply 36 of 60
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,801member
    crowley said:

    crowley said:

    crowley said:
    https://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#Mac

    215 days (ok, 224 by WWDC), would that be a record update cycle for the MacBook Pro?  Certainly in recent memory.

    Hoping for:
    1. 32GB or more RAM option
    2. Replaceable storage.
    3. SD card slot.
    4. Better keyboard.

    2 or more of those and I'll definitely be buying.

    Bringing back MagSafe in some form would be nice as well, but I'm not holding my breath for that.
    Well two of those items will never happen -- the consumer card slot is gone, and removable storage will never return either since it's too big and slow.  
    It may be unlikely, but I don't think it's impossible that the SD card slot may come back.  The iMac still has it (as does the Mac mini, though that doesn't count for much), and Apple sell an SD to Lightning adaptor, and it's not obsolete technology at all.  The original MacBook Air launched without an SD slot, and then was upgraded later to include one.  Long shot, but not impossible.

    The MacBook Pro without Touch Bar has replaceable storage.  https://www.macrumors.com/2016/10/28/new-macbook-pro-removable-ssd/
    I don't think it's at all inconceivable for Apple to ship the Touch Bar MacBook pros without soldering the storage in.  In fact I'd put this at 50/50.


    Still would need mass renovations to the motherboard to accommodate either thing you're talking about here -- there are other architectural differences between the 13 and 15-inch motherboards beyond just removable storage. 

    I don't see it happening in 220 days between the last release and WWDC. The last short-cycle on MBPs that I keep mentioning was a drop-in processor, necessitating no other motherboard change than a new BGA processor on the same board.
    Maybe, but the very fact that this has been such a fast turnaround, following what was widely acknowledged as a less than warm welcome for the new form factor of the MBP (yes big sales etc etc, but press and pro reaction matters too) suggests that maybe there's been some rethinking going on.  Maybe not, of course, all will be revealed on the 8th, but as one of those who found the MBPwTB underwhelming because of the compromises I'll live in hope.
    I wouldn't get your hopes up. Judging by sales numbers, I don't think Apple needs to change a thing. Just because a few people are loud and obnoxious about their dislike of a product doesn't mean everyone hates the laptop. If that were true, they wouldn't have the sales they have with it. I'd bet if we see anything, it will just be a CPU, maybe a GPU bump. Its too early to do anything drastic like adding legacy ports and slots. 
    edited May 2017
  • Reply 37 of 60
    jbishop1039jbishop1039 Posts: 257member

    A spec bump to the Mac line is most likely all that is going to happen. The Mac lineup will probably have 5-10 minutes of stage time highlighting the new processors. Perhaps a peek at the new Mac Pro, but doubtful. If new iPads and a Siri speaker are also to be introduced, the keynote is suddenly going to be more focused on hardware than on the software. Maybe there'll be new iOS features tailored to iPad could warrant their introduction at a software conference.

    But who knows. It's fun to guess, but since it is WWDC, I'm mostly looking forward to the new operating systems and what they can do. Maybe Apple will have a few surprises for us this year!

  • Reply 38 of 60
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 7,623member
    slurpy said:
    appex said:
    Hopefully they fix previous errors:

    The Touchbar MacBook Pro is a Disposable Embarrassment
    That shitty column (and millions of others aimed at every single Apple product, ever) is not proof of any "errors". You're delusional if you think Apple is going to reverse course on many of the fundamental choices made for the MBP, including keyboard, ports, and touchbar. It's an excellent machine that moves things forward, and that always brings the gnashing of teeth and extreme whining. There were no "errors", every decision was meticulously considered and Apple made the product that they wanted. We're not gonna see USB-A ports or spinning disks in these newer models.
    It is not whining. 

    And if rumours are to be believed, even within Apple there were doubts about which direction to take. Perhaps every option was meticulously studied (including the one that would have given us machines that you claim people are whining about). Now we have one of the fastest potential laptop upgrades in recent memory (again, rumours permitting) Let's see what they finally do. If things were going so amazingly well, I doubt we would be seeing any kind of MBP upgrade at this stage. Just perhaps things haven't gone quite as well as hoped. We can't know for sure though.
  • Reply 39 of 60
    nhtnht Posts: 4,522member
    appex said:
    Hopefully they fix previous errors:

    The Touchbar MacBook Pro is a Disposable Embarrassment
    I'd rather have the 2.5GB/sec SSD than a 2.5-inch SATA III one. Even the M.2 form factor NVMe SSDs don't hit the speed that the 15-inch does.

    Guy's welcome to his opinion, but he's basing it off of a lot of false assumptions about intent, and what will happen to Apple's marketshare if they don't kowtow to a very loud, very small portion of Apple's market.
    While I understand optimizing speed is the raison d'être for close tolerance memory 'onboard', per the article in my work I'd rather have capacity than speed for the same price, yet the ability to change components with industry standard form factors (as I have with every Mac I've owned) as needs, options and pricing adjust, eventually downgrading and repurposing when newer tech replaces older, and save the 'appliance' approach for consumer products.....
    At some point storage becomes good enough for internal storage.  Granted I'm short on space right now with a 500GB internal on my 2013 MBP but I keep some large datasets for work (115GB worth of data) on top of a couple large VMs and 3 years worth of clutter.  

    1TB would keep me in pretty good shape when I get my 2016 or 2017 MBP replacement until 2019 or 2020.

    Lets put this in perspective.  500GB will give you 53 minutes worth of 8K full format 24 fps REDCODE 8:1 Red Weapon Helium video.  Given a bit of overhead on a 1TB drive for other stuff I'll have about 800GB for data...and if I was editing 8K video that would be enough for 84 minutes worth.

    More likely I'd have that on an external drive and edit using proxies on the internal drive then render at full resolution at the end.

    For 4K/24 full format it's 267 minutes worth of video in 800GB.  

    I personally don't edit R3D but ProRes which is about a GB a minute.  So for a 2 hour show multicam I end up with about 200-300GB worth of video to edit together (yes, I do this for fun) that I leave on an external project USB3 SSD and edit using proxy after making an archival copy on the RAID.

    /shrug

    That the SSD is soldered on isn't that big a deal to me anymore.  Any revolutionary jump in size or performance will likely require a new machine anyway.
  • Reply 40 of 60
    chasmchasm Posts: 3,274member
    Still no reason given for an update to Kaby Lake: there's no significant speed improvement, it doesn't allow for more than 16GB of RAM, so ... what's the point? I would *love* to see an MB upgrade with real USB-C 3.1 and a faster chip (and this is entirely possible), but I can't imagine why Apple would upgrade the current MBP when this is literally ZERO improvement in doing so. Next year, there will be a chip that can do more than 16GB. Till then, there's no point.
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