Of course existing iPhone users will buy it at first place.
iPhone 8 and 8 Plus are single-hand devices. iPhone X requires both hands and it lacks Reachability. The use of both hands is default in Android world. So Android switchers will buy the X (if they can afford the price) and existing iPhone users will buy the 8 series.
1) iPhone plus is not a one handed iPhone. Apple created reachability because of it. 2) iPhone x is closer to being a one handed use iPhone, seeing as its similar size to the standard iPhone. 3) reachability will be on the iPhone x line of phones, yes I said line, I fully expect Apple to make an iPhone x plus version next year assuming iPhone x meets there's sales goals. 4) the iPhone x is for people who want a iPhone plus but think the iPhone plus is huge. I'm one of those, ever since I saw the lg G4 I've wanted a "bezelless" phone. I have the 6s I want a bigger screen but don't like how huge the bezels look on the plus.
The iphone x is not for android users. The iPhone se through iPhone 8 are for android buyers, after all most android buyers are accustomed to cheap phones.
For me it is simple. Is the iPhone 8 compelling enough to make me rush to the shop? the answer is no, but anyhow I will consider it when my iPhone 6s breaks down.
Having a faster processor does not say a lot to me when my iPhone 6s does not feel sluggish for all the things I currently do with my smartphone. It is nice when one has to wait only 0.3 sec iso 1 sec, but I don't care if the waiting time drops from 0.1 sec to 0.03 sec. The improvements with the iPhone 8 (as with the iPhone 7) don't have enough impact on my user experience to be very excited. The improvements are welcome but are no longer a driver (like the iPhone 4 5 and 6 were) to buy the phone immediately.
You're all wrong. The feature for most of us that's most important is storage space. 64GB is barely enough now-a-days so you're forced to buy the 256GB version as there is nothing in between. $849 for that. OR do what I'll do. I'm trading in my 5s for a iPhone 7. It is still fast, still has a great camera, still has most of the same features but missing wireless charging which is of dubious value, and I'll get the 128GB version for $648 and save $200.
In another quarter, I think we'll see the iPhone 8 be a under performer and the 7 remain strong as people do that math and say no to a $849 iPhone.
I’m still on my 6 plus and used to upgrade almost every cycle but loss of the headphone jack and similar designs coupled with the fact that my phone was still functioning well meant I didn’t upgrade for the last few years. Now I’m finding my phone is slowing down a bit and not handling newer apps so well and having found another solution for listening to music will be going for an upgrade. I will be going for the X mainly because you have a similarly specced phone but with a different form factor. Despite what many are saying, design is important especially if you are given a choice. Honestly, if the X hadn’t come out at the same time I would be perfectly happy buying an 8 plus but psychologically and technically it isnt the flagship anymore regardless of price.
at this early stage, the (unscientific) timing in the Apple store appears to be showing that less people are buying the 8. The longest delay in shipping I noticed was 1-2 weeks on the first day whereas previous phones would have quickly jumped to at least a month. Checking today and that delivery time has gone back to 1-2 days shipping. Maybe it’s people waiting to see what the X does but it looks like a lot of people are willing to shell out over 1k for it
When it comes to the newest I gadget . Mainly iPhones. Apple uses a scarcity marketing tactic. Now, with even more pipeline constraint. I almost gaurantee you, when the iPhone x comes out next month it's going to have at least an 8 week ship time or longer, and everyone is going to scream how popular it must be.
I try to deem if an Apple item is popular buy how many people I see using one. Most Apple products are popular, ie Air pods are popular. I see a lot of people using them. My point is, I don't go just off #s on Apples website and such.
[....] Apple sellers and buyers are unaccustomed to having the choices that they are now facing with the iPhone 8/8X and iPhone X and it's not certain how this will play out because it's new and different for Apple and its customers. If Apple had called the iPhone X the iPhone Pro instead, then it would be very clear what Apple's intentions were and customers would have some historical leanings to apply. Apple's MacBook, Mac, and soon, iMac product lines follow the same pattern with a "pro" moniker attached to the higher spec'd version in the product line. [....]
Customers pick up on the message about the mix and their perspectives define the reality for how the product mix is dealt with in the sales channels and by customers. Apple's launch of the iPhone X only dealt with the product and was clear as mud about the mix. Apple could have done a better job here to avoid the confusion that's playing out now.
I think the 'Pro' moniker is actually vanity title to get professionals to bite the bullet and buy preconfigured 'Professional-configured' devices, instead of homebrew types trying to 'cobble' ('cable') up after market upgrades in disks and componentry.
I do think the iPhoneX is the 'next' iPhone. not a pro model. They want all people to move to the X, but they need to get user adoption and functional telemetry to get it right. Pushing this out at the high end is getting the early adopters to beat the usability out of this (remember the original iPhone... basically the same situation).
I posit they need to beta test FaceID/emojicons with millions, given their place in the [stock] market (you can't bet a 200Million unit sales per year shareholder requirement on a 'hope' that FaceID will work with every skin tone, use case, etc etc.).
Deploying on the same A11Bionic with 8 and 8+ gives them 3 base ASP 'top market' selling points, and they don't have to significantly 'downgrade' (trade-in) anyone who says FaceID doesn't work for them (I know that first iterations iPhoto and iPhone camera flat out didn't detect faces for most African American's I knew or took pictures of... but that was a 'free'/'cool' feature, not a bet the business personal security feature). You don't want people buying iPhone 7's... you minimally want your newest supply chain to pay for itself. If the only risk is the screen, which is already rate limited, deploy at a lower rate, and see if demand outstrips supply, which is a good thing (my guess the any increase in profit margin is consumed by a risk hedge line item, hence selling any 2017 unit will be the same net profit in their plan).
Philosophically, and this is maybe something we placed on Apple: Apple tended to 'tell' people what the right technology/UI solution was and be all or nothing with that UX. I don't think they can do that now as blatantly now. They are economically able to do it (live on their cash if they make a major mistake), but I think strategically, they do have to maintain their base and offer 'transitional' branches, such as the 'X', and we move to AR and a millienial userbase where their avatar will need to become more 'real time' (hence the emojicon tactic) [I'm fearing the day when emojicon's read facebook/twitter posts to me]. Apple needs to experiment,educate, and market 'in real time.'
X+1 will have a better FaceID, 'rightsized' bezels, and iOS 12 will have better interactions for same. Ipads will come with FaceID, and the same bezel rightsizing, and deliver something you can hold and use effectively in that larger form factor. the UX will become normalized.
I think their messaging is clear. Buy what you want/need.
For weeks now, we've been reading stories with a common, unimaginative theme – The iPhone X is too expensive – although the herd of tech reviewers, analysts and unnamed "critics" singing this song seldom went out on the limb of predicting poor sales. Now, many of the same reviewers and critics have switched to a new theme – the iPhone 8 and 8+ aren't going to sell well because too many potential buyers are going to hold out for the iPhone X. An amazing and contradictory about-face in a remarkably short time. At the same time, the iPhone 8 and 8+ are being panned by many in the same herd as "minor" upgrades of a familiar design. Shouldn't adjectives like "minor" and "major" get some kind of definition? To me, the specs of the A11 chip are incredible, the still and video camera improvements are substantial, especially in the 8+, and the addition of True Tone display technology and induction charging are significant upgrades to the 7+ I'm now using. Everybody's iPhone use case is a little bit different – and there are hundreds of millions of us – but the camera is the big issue to me when weighing upgrades. I have a big investment in camera equipment, but the iPhone is the camera that is always in my pocket. So, I'll be taking a careful look at the 8+ and wondering if I really want the OLED display and facial recognition technology of the iPhone X. Either way, I think I'll be pretty happy. My only concern is whether Apple can make enough of the iPhone X so that it doesn't turn into a six month wait to get one.
When it comes to the newest I gadget . Mainly iPhones. Apple uses a scarcity marketing tactic. Now, with even more pipeline constraint. I almost gaurantee you, when the iPhone x comes out next month it's going to have at least an 8 week ship time or longer, and everyone is going to scream how popular it must be.
I try to deem if an Apple item is popular buy how many people I see using one. Most Apple products are popular, ie Air pods are popular. I see a lot of people using them. My point is, I don't go just off #s on Apples website and such.
Apple has sold almost 700,000,000 iPhones the last 3 years.
This isn't a marketing tactic.
iPhone demand is MASSIVE. They will sell close to 80,000,000 iPhones in the holiday quarter. Do you realize how many phones that is?
Marketing tactic? MY ASS.
Every year the rumor sites all Chime in about how many iPhones Apple supposedly sold in its opening pre-order weekend, even last year when Apple stated they no longer gave #s this year there's nothing not even an article. I almost gaurantee you there will be articles and#s when iphone x comes out. Yes I realize how big a # 170000000 is. When I say scarcity marketing. I'm really just talking the opening weekend or month alone. After that Apple "catches up" on demand. Apple has sold 170,000,000 iphonea each year for the last several years.
its like other people said, do you really think by now that Apple doesn't know it's #s and won't make enough iPhones ahead of time to satiate demand? I am sure they do make enough iPhones to satisfy demand based off the previous sales. If there was no iPhone x I gaurantee you the ship time would make the iPhones look sold out and scarce so everyone would think they are popular.
I am a committed Apple fanboy with two iphones, four ipads, two laptops and a desktop and I am currently in the market for a new iPhone to replace my 6. Looking at the options the only iPhone that makes sense to me is the iPhone 7.... the 8 and the X are either too expensive or don't offer anything I need or want. I would buy the X if it was selling at the regular new iPhone price point. I am astounded at Tim's comment that the X is "Value Priced...."
Apple is so far ahead in silicon performance, the iPhone 8 will still crush the top end Android phones next year.
ROFL. Really? What about the droves of Fandroid's who won't touch anything made by Apple with a 40ft Barge Pole? What about the retailers who only display Samsung devices but still carry iPhones (unmarked boxes in a locked room with a sign saying 'Rabid dogs inside' on the door) What about the retailers who promote the S7 Edge as the latest phone (not kidding here) etc etc etc
There are dozens of reasons why the iPhone 8/X won't crush the top end Android phones and not should they. Competition is what keeps the market moving forward.
Oh, and most buyers don't care one little bit about CPU specs. Shiny, shiny is what sells to around 50% of the market.
Quote: iPhone 8 and 8 Plus shouldn't have any trouble finding buyers. Yep, all those who won't go near the 'X' for a variety of reasons including cost, TouchID and the 'notch'.
You are either dim or not well read. It clearly referenced "silicon" w.r.t. crushing Android next year. Check out the performance benchmarks of iPhone 8 vs. even the top-of-the-line Note 8. A Note 9 next year is not going to beat it - period.
There is no doubt in my mind Apple could have shrunk the top/bottom bezel of the iPhone 8 by 20-30%. That would make a huge difference in making the 8 look fresh and attractive. If they could not fit everything they could have made the phone a bit thicker.
Apple came up with a standard for Touch ID/Home button size for it's lifetime. It doesn't make sense to spend the R&D and manufacturing time on shrinking the size of it for a single version of the iPhone just so they can say "the slightly smaller bezels = fresh design". Touch ID is going to be retired, and Face ID/iPhone X are the new standard to build upon going forward.
Of course existing iPhone users will buy it at first place.
iPhone 8 and 8 Plus are single-hand devices. iPhone X requires both hands and it lacks Reachability. The use of both hands is default in Android world. So Android switchers will buy the X (if they can afford the price) and existing iPhone users will buy the 8 series.
2) iPhone x is closer to being a one handed use iPhone, seeing as its similar size to the standard iPhone.
2) This is not a matter of size, this is a matter of functionality. The removal of the single click Home button compromises functionality. Swipe gesture is not the same as tap or click. No one has dared to do that Home gesture single handedly in hands-on videos.
3) reachability will be on the iPhone x line of phones, yes I said line, I fully expect Apple to make an iPhone x plus version next year assuming iPhone x meets there's sales goals.
3) I agree. Apple most probably will/must implement Reachability on the X as soon as mass drops and mass returns of the X begin. People won't tolerate to pay $1000 for a device they can't use single handedly whilst there are cheaper and as powerful iPhones they can use single handed.
4) the iPhone x is for people who want a iPhone plus but think the iPhone plus is huge. I'm one of those, ever since I saw the lg G4 I've wanted a "bezelless" phone. I have the 6s I want a bigger screen but don't like how huge the bezels look on the plus.
4) The hugeness of iPhone Plus is only on the height, to which iPhone X doesn't contribute much. iPhone X screen is not "bigger", just "taller". Its width is the same as your 6s, so you will have the same limitations as your 6s in landscape use. iPhone Plus gives you more screen height in landscape use.
The iphone x is not for android users. The iPhone se through iPhone 8 are for android buyers, after all most android buyers are accustomed to cheap phones.
What I was trying to emphasize with that is the introduction of a compromise (2-handed use) specific to Android platform to the iOS platform. Yet iPhone 8 is not a cheap phone, it is the most powerful and most expensive among similar form factor phones.
For me it is simple. Is the iPhone 8 compelling enough to make me rush to the shop? the answer is no, but anyhow I will consider it when my iPhone 6s breaks down.
Having a faster processor does not say a lot to me when my iPhone 6s does not feel sluggish for all the things I currently do with my smartphone. It is nice when one has to wait only 0.3 sec iso 1 sec, but I don't care if the waiting time drops from 0.1 sec to 0.03 sec. The improvements with the iPhone 8 (as with the iPhone 7) don't have enough impact on my user experience to be very excited. The improvements are welcome but are no longer a driver (like the iPhone 4 5 and 6 were) to buy the phone immediately.
When a new generation of Apps come out (including AR apps) your 6s will be very slow.
The 8 has a CPU that is faster than many Macbook Pro's.
There will be some amazing Apps coming out in the next couple years on iOS
Exactly, when these apps will be launched, i might be interested. But currently none of the apps I am using (YMMV) require a faster CPU. So I am not in rush to buy an iPhone 8
There is no doubt in my mind Apple could have shrunk the top/bottom bezel of the iPhone 8 by 20-30%. That would make a huge difference in making the 8 look fresh and attractive. If they could not fit everything they could have made the phone a bit thicker.
Apple came up with a standard for Touch ID/Home button size for it's lifetime. It doesn't make sense to spend the R&D and manufacturing time on shrinking the size of it for a single version of the iPhone just so they can say "the slightly smaller bezels = fresh design". Touch ID is going to be retired, and Face ID/iPhone X are the new standard to build upon going forward.
I guess we differ with Apple's road map.
I don't think Apple will retire the Home button for another 3-4 years.
I think from this year forward we will have two tiers of phones. The lower tier with the touch ID.
2018
iPhone X1 - $999
iPhone 9 - with smaller bezel and touch ID
Redesigned SE with fingerprint.
2019
iPhone X2 $999
iPhone 9s - same small bezel design
2020-2022
They will still sell the 9s and 9 as the older models.
If that was Apple’s plan then the 8 would have been redesigned with smaller bezels. But that would mean putting Touch ID on the back which they’re never going to do. There’s no way to shrink the bezels without making the home button much smaller which would look stupid and who even knows is possible engineering wise.
The fact is that the preorder delivery times for the 8/8+ are not moving beyond the "1 to 2 weeks" stage, and in many cases the variants are available "on Sep 22" or "within 3 days". The huge demand is simply not there.
--> There is a substantial risk that Apple will be stuck with millions of unsold units of 8/8+ in inventory while production issues prevent them from selling enough X that the market wants.
For me, the appeal of the iPhone 8 is the future. It's not that it's not improved enough over the 7. Rather that the iPhone 7 was already more than enough to handle current needs and functions. I think the analogy would be: Comparing a $5,000 stereo to a $7,500 version: The $7,500 version is clearly better -- but you can't tell the difference without looking at the label.
But, that said: I think the iPhone 7 will soon begin to look dated when AR and wireless charging become normalized.
You're all wrong. The feature for most of us that's most important is storage space. 64GB is barely enough now-a-days so you're forced to buy the 256GB version as there is nothing in between. $849 for that. OR do what I'll do. I'm trading in my 5s for a iPhone 7. It is still fast, still has a great camera, still has most of the same features but missing wireless charging which is of dubious value, and I'll get the 128GB version for $648 and save $200.
In another quarter, I think we'll see the iPhone 8 be a under performer and the 7 remain strong as people do that math and say no to a $849 iPhone.
Your comment helped me to consider the 7 Plus among alternatives. My decision stands centered on the 8 Plus, I cannot pass on the 8 series easily. 8 represents a platform jump thanks to A11, and it will not be an under performer as soon as next year. And afterwards, it will continue to occupy the position where you see the 7 now. Consider fairly four years for a 8, thanks to the platform jump brought by the A11, just like your 5s which is also a platform jump to 64-bit. You may not keep the 7 so long, so for $200 I wouldn't pass on such a durability.
Comments
2) iPhone x is closer to being a one handed use iPhone, seeing as its similar size to the standard iPhone.
3) reachability will be on the iPhone x line of phones, yes I said line, I fully expect Apple to make an iPhone x plus version next year assuming iPhone x meets there's sales goals.
4) the iPhone x is for people who want a iPhone plus but think the iPhone plus is huge. I'm one of those, ever since I saw the lg G4 I've wanted a "bezelless" phone. I have the 6s I want a bigger screen but don't like how huge the bezels look on the plus.
The iphone x is not for android users. The iPhone se through iPhone 8 are for android buyers, after all most android buyers are accustomed to cheap phones.
Having a faster processor does not say a lot to me when my iPhone 6s does not feel sluggish for all the things I currently do with my smartphone. It is nice when one has to wait only 0.3 sec iso 1 sec, but I don't care if the waiting time drops from 0.1 sec to 0.03 sec. The improvements with the iPhone 8 (as with the iPhone 7) don't have enough impact on my user experience to be very excited. The improvements are welcome but are no longer a driver (like the iPhone 4 5 and 6 were) to buy the phone immediately.
In another quarter, I think we'll see the iPhone 8 be a under performer and the 7 remain strong as people do that math and say no to a $849 iPhone.
at this early stage, the (unscientific) timing in the Apple store appears to be showing that less people are buying the 8. The longest delay in shipping I noticed was 1-2 weeks on the first day whereas previous phones would have quickly jumped to at least a month. Checking today and that delivery time has gone back to 1-2 days shipping. Maybe it’s people waiting to see what the X does but it looks like a lot of people are willing to shell out over 1k for it
I try to deem if an Apple item is popular buy how many people I see using one. Most Apple products are popular, ie Air pods are popular. I see a lot of people using them. My point is, I don't go just off #s on Apples website and such.
I do think the iPhoneX is the 'next' iPhone. not a pro model. They want all people to move to the X, but they need to get user adoption and functional telemetry to get it right. Pushing this out at the high end is getting the early adopters to beat the usability out of this (remember the original iPhone... basically the same situation).
I posit they need to beta test FaceID/emojicons with millions, given their place in the [stock] market (you can't bet a 200Million unit sales per year shareholder requirement on a 'hope' that FaceID will work with every skin tone, use case, etc etc.).
Deploying on the same A11Bionic with 8 and 8+ gives them 3 base ASP 'top market' selling points, and they don't have to significantly 'downgrade' (trade-in) anyone who says FaceID doesn't work for them (I know that first iterations iPhoto and iPhone camera flat out didn't detect faces for most African American's I knew or took pictures of... but that was a 'free'/'cool' feature, not a bet the business personal security feature). You don't want people buying iPhone 7's... you minimally want your newest supply chain to pay for itself. If the only risk is the screen, which is already rate limited, deploy at a lower rate, and see if demand outstrips supply, which is a good thing (my guess the any increase in profit margin is consumed by a risk hedge line item, hence selling any 2017 unit will be the same net profit in their plan).
Philosophically, and this is maybe something we placed on Apple: Apple tended to 'tell' people what the right technology/UI solution was and be all or nothing with that UX. I don't think they can do that now as blatantly now. They are economically able to do it (live on their cash if they make a major mistake), but I think strategically, they do have to maintain their base and offer 'transitional' branches, such as the 'X', and we move to AR and a millienial userbase where their avatar will need to become more 'real time' (hence the emojicon tactic) [I'm fearing the day when emojicon's read facebook/twitter posts to me]. Apple needs to experiment,educate, and market 'in real time.'
X+1 will have a better FaceID, 'rightsized' bezels, and iOS 12 will have better interactions for same. Ipads will come with FaceID, and the same bezel rightsizing, and deliver something you can hold and use effectively in that larger form factor. the UX will become normalized.
I think their messaging is clear. Buy what you want/need.
iphonea each year for the last several years.
its like other people said, do you really think by now that Apple doesn't know it's #s and won't make enough iPhones ahead of time to satiate demand? I am sure they do make enough iPhones to satisfy demand based off the previous sales. If there was no iPhone x I gaurantee you the ship time would make the iPhones look sold out and scarce so everyone would think they are popular.
2) This is not a matter of size, this is a matter of functionality. The removal of the single click Home button compromises functionality. Swipe gesture is not the same as tap or click. No one has dared to do that Home gesture single handedly in hands-on videos.
3) I agree. Apple most probably will/must implement Reachability on the X as soon as mass drops and mass returns of the X begin. People won't tolerate to pay $1000 for a device they can't use single handedly whilst there are cheaper and as powerful iPhones they can use single handed.
4) The hugeness of iPhone Plus is only on the height, to which iPhone X doesn't contribute much. iPhone X screen is not "bigger", just "taller". Its width is the same as your 6s, so you will have the same limitations as your 6s in landscape use. iPhone Plus gives you more screen height in landscape use.
What I was trying to emphasize with that is the introduction of a compromise (2-handed use) specific to Android platform to the iOS platform. Yet iPhone 8 is not a cheap phone, it is the most powerful and most expensive among similar form factor phones.
--> There is a substantial risk that Apple will be stuck with millions of unsold units of 8/8+ in inventory while production issues prevent them from selling enough X that the market wants.
It's not that it's not improved enough over the 7. Rather that the iPhone 7 was already more than enough to handle current needs and functions. I think the analogy would be: Comparing a $5,000 stereo to a $7,500 version: The $7,500 version is clearly better -- but you can't tell the difference without looking at the label.
But, that said: I think the iPhone 7 will soon begin to look dated when AR and wireless charging become normalized.
For me, the appeal of the iPhone 8 is the future.