Third report reaffirms iPhone X TrueDepth Face ID camera is bottleneck for Apple

Posted:
in iPhone edited September 2017
The advanced new facial recognition system in Apple's iPhone X is the main holdup in production of the device -- a rumor now corroborated by three different publications ahead of the handset's November launch.




Citing people familiar with the iPhone X supply chain, The Wall Street Journal reported on Wednesday that the TrueDepth camera on the iPhone X, which is responsible for Face ID logins, is comprised of two key components dubbed "Romeo" and "Juliet."

According to the report, "Romeo" parts are more difficult to manufacture than "Juliet," and Apple has been hit with an imbalance in supply. As a result, mass production of the iPhone X remains hampered by the TrueDepth camera.





It's the third time in as many days that the Face ID sensor has taken the fall for the delayed -- and expected to be limited -- debut of the iPhone X. Analyst Ming-Chi Kuo of KGI Securities was the first to report on Monday that the TrueDepth camera is making it difficult for Apple to achieve mass production.

Then on Tuesday, Nikkei chimed in and said suppliers are "still struggling" to improve output of the TrueDepth camera before preorders for the device begin. Apple will begin accepting orders for the iPhone X on Oct. 27 in more than 55 countries and territories, before launching a week later on Nov. 3.




Apple's Face ID technology introduced in the iPhone X is made up of four components including an infrared camera, a flood illuminator, a dot projector, and the front camera. The combination of sensors generates a 3D map of the face that it compares to the mathematical models of the stored face, utilizing the new A11 Bionic neural engine.

Apple says Face ID will be more secure and reliable than Touch ID, the fingerprint-based technology it is superseding.
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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 25
    The third report doesn't confirm anything except an unfounded rumor.
    caliStrangeDaysgregg thurmanflyingdp
  • Reply 3 of 25
    hriw-annon@xs4all.nl[email protected] Posts: 61unconfirmed, member
    sog35 said:
    BULL. SHIT.

    Nice try stock manipulators.
    I'm not sure it's necessarily stock manipulation.
    Who pays for stories like this? I'm guessing the stock brokers, the companies that offer stock trading services.
    Whether the stock price goes up or down does not matter to them.
    They fund stories that encourages pessimists to sell, and stories that encourages optimists to buy.
    They need both to make money.
    A well crafted story will do both at once.
    Stories don't have to make sense, they need to provide buyers and sellers an excuse to act on their gut feelings.

    edited September 2017
  • Reply 4 of 25
    lkrupplkrupp Posts: 9,985member
    sog35 said:
    According to the media/rumor mill Tim Cook has been a disaster the last month:

    1. Audio problems on iPhone 8

    2. LTE problems on Apple Watch

    3. iPhone X supply problems

    4. iOS 11 bugs

    5. Mac vunerability

    6. iPhone X bad design NOTCH

    7. AppleTV no Atmos or Youtube 4k compatability

    8. Weak iPhone 8 sales - very small lines

    Not saying any of this is true, but its certainly a bad look.
    Well you yourself condemn Cook on a daily basis so I would think you agree with all of these disasters. Care to comment?
    StrangeDaysnetmage
  • Reply 5 of 25
    jd_in_sbjd_in_sb Posts: 1,600member
    I wish people wouldn’t quote sog35. That allows his garbage through to all the people who block him. 
    jfc1138fastasleeptyler82netmage
  • Reply 6 of 25
    sog35 said:
    According to the media/rumor mill Tim Cook has been a disaster the last month:

    1. Audio problems on iPhone 8

    2. LTE problems on Apple Watch

    3. iPhone X supply problems

    4. iOS 11 bugs

    5. Mac vunerability

    6. iPhone X bad design NOTCH

    7. AppleTV no Atmos or Youtube 4k compatability

    8. Weak iPhone 8 sales - very small lines

    Not saying any of this is true, but its certainly a bad look.
    You absolutely have said all of that was true. What's wrong with you, why don't you remember the things you type? Are you a single person or a staff of people pushing an agenda? Or do you drink while posting perhaps? Very inconsistent...If I were your handler I'd be disappointed in the work.
    edited September 2017 patchythepiratenetmage
  • Reply 7 of 25
    People keep saying these are the same old garbage rumors about limited supply we get every year. HOWEVER there is one major difference this year. Apple has never before (with one exception) delayed one model of an iPhone later than the rest. This one is over a month delayed. This does provide at least a decent index of suspicion that there is a manufacturing issue or else it would have been released the same day as the 8 or maybe a week later if they wanted a staggered release. 

    The only other time an iPhone wasn't released at the same time was the white iPhone 4 and there the issue was an inability to manufacture it to spec. 

    I believe it's garbage every time they say that. This year given the delayed release I give it more credence. Not enough to be sure about it but I think there's a good chance very small numbers (by iPhone standards) will be seen at launch and the months after
    edited September 2017
  • Reply 8 of 25
    I'll be so annoyed if I can't get an iPhone X because of face ID delays. 

    I don't even want face ID. I would have been more than happy with an OLED wrap around screen with touch ID on the 8
    netmage
  • Reply 9 of 25
    netroxnetrox Posts: 1,158member
    I don't understand why there is a yield issue with TrueDepth cameras... what is so special about them that sets them apart from other sensors? I would think it's easy to manufacture.
  • Reply 10 of 25
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 23,361member
    For those that are especially interested in FaceID and security beyond "it just works" Apple has released a white paper:
    https://images.apple.com/business/docs/FaceID_Security_Guide.pdf

    One thing of note if you have children you're buying an X for (or siblings that have a strong resemblance to you). Apple suggests that you rely on passcode instead and it's not for child privacy protection.
    "The probability of a false match is different for twins and siblings that look like you as well as among children under the age of 13, because their distinct facial features may not have fully developed."

    edited September 2017 patchythepirate
  • Reply 11 of 25
    sog35 said:
    BULL. SHIT.

    Nice try stock manipulators.
    Circular confirmation.  Nikkei reprints Kuo's report, the WSJ reprints the Nikkei report, Voila, confirmation of Kuo's report.
  • Reply 12 of 25
    People keep saying these are the same old garbage rumors about limited supply we get every year. HOWEVER there is one major difference this year. Apple has never before (with one exception) delayed one model of an iPhone later than the rest. This one is over a month delayed. This does provide at least a decent index of suspicion that there is a manufacturing issue or else it would have been released the same day as the 8 or maybe a week later if they wanted a staggered release. 

    The only other time an iPhone wasn't released at the same time was the white iPhone 4 and there the issue was an inability to manufacture it to spec. 

    I believe it's garbage every time they say that. This year given the delayed release I give it more credence. Not enough to be sure about it but I think there's a good chance very small numbers (by iPhone standards) will be seen at launch and the months after
    What if, just what if, Apple knows what the demand for the iPhone X is going to be, and that demand could not be met by Foxconn while also producing the iPhone 8/8 Plus.  Staggering the release would allow Foxconn to get past the early adopter bulge of the iPhone 8/8 Plus before getting serious about iPhone X.  Remember, Apple continues to produce the iPhone 7/7 Plus, iPhone 6/6 Plus and iPhone SE in addition to the iPhone 8/8 Plus and iPhone X.  That's 8 production lines, not to mention the production needs of competing labels.  Also remember that Foxconn is paying employees bonuses for referring workers to Foxconn.  Sounds to me the staggered introduction has more to do with production capacity, than it does a component issue.

    After all, component production capability would have been signed off BEFORE production agreements were made 9+ months ago.  I say 9+ months because if a component supplier could not show production capability by that time Apple would have to shift to Plan B.  Nine months would be cutting it very close when shifting to a Plan B on this magnitude.
    fastasleep
  • Reply 13 of 25

    Mmmm...

    I wonder who will be the first to use the TrueDepth FaceID camera to take a Moon Shot?

  • Reply 14 of 25
    People keep saying these are the same old garbage rumors about limited supply we get every year. HOWEVER there is one major difference this year. Apple has never before (with one exception) delayed one model of an iPhone later than the rest. This one is over a month delayed. This does provide at least a decent index of suspicion that there is a manufacturing issue or else it would have been released the same day as the 8 or maybe a week later if they wanted a staggered release. 

    The only other time an iPhone wasn't released at the same time was the white iPhone 4 and there the issue was an inability to manufacture it to spec. 

    I believe it's garbage every time they say that. This year given the delayed release I give it more credence. Not enough to be sure about it but I think there's a good chance very small numbers (by iPhone standards) will be seen at launch and the months after
    What if, just what if, Apple knows what the demand for the iPhone X is going to be, and that demand could not be met by Foxconn while also producing the iPhone 8/8 Plus.  Staggering the release would allow Foxconn to get past the early adopter bulge of the iPhone 8/8 Plus before getting serious about iPhone X.  Remember, Apple continues to produce the iPhone 7/7 Plus, iPhone 6/6 Plus and iPhone SE in addition to the iPhone 8/8 Plus and iPhone X.  That's 8 production lines, not to mention the production needs of competing labels.  Also remember that Foxconn is paying employees bonuses for referring workers to Foxconn.  Sounds to me the staggered introduction has more to do with production capacity, than it does a component issue.

    After all, component production capability would have been signed off BEFORE production agreements were made 9+ months ago.  I say 9+ months because if a component supplier could not show production capability by that time Apple would have to shift to Plan B.  Nine months would be cutting it very close when shifting to a Plan B on this magnitude.
    Interesting idea, I suppose that's possible however they have produced far more for past releases I wonder why the issue this time but never before.  However, if what you say is true o if everything was up to par for all the models and it was just capacity wouldn't they release the iPhone X first and then the 8 later?
    edited September 2017
  • Reply 15 of 25
    sog35 said:
    According to the media/rumor mill Tim Cook has been a disaster the last month:

    1. Audio problems on iPhone 8

    2. LTE problems on Apple Watch

    3. iPhone X supply problems

    4. iOS 11 bugs

    5. Mac vunerability

    6. iPhone X bad design NOTCH

    7. AppleTV no Atmos or Youtube 4k compatability

    8. Weak iPhone 8 sales - very small lines

    Not saying any of this is true, but its certainly a bad look.

    Stop attacking Tim Cook at every occasion (for what it is worth). Tim Cook is the best man you can find and hire to run that company. He was the chief operating officer of Steve Jobs. Thanks to his engineering talent and immense knowledge on industrial processes the visions of Steve Jobs have become a reality. If Steve Jobs’ visions have become tangible products and made Apple what it is today this is also thanks to Tim Cook’s success as his chief operating officer. He is so loyal to Steve Jobs that he even suggested to donate his liver to his friend. He’s so loyal to Steve Jobs’ visions that he didn’t give up on iPad and committed to the improvement of that product to make it finally shine and rise again. Steve Jobs has passed away, you cannot bring him back. But you can support the members of his team in their endeavor to make Apple a company of their dreams common with Steve Jobs. This is Tim Cook’s commitment to that team mentality that keeps Apple today as a unified and a powerful entity. Without Tim Cook Apple might already be shredded to three or more companies by shareholders like you. As I understand you’re from a culture in which spiritual and moral values are highly appreciated, so I invite you to see the deeper realities behind the stock charts.

    edited September 2017 Solifastasleep
  • Reply 16 of 25
  • Reply 17 of 25
    SoliSoli Posts: 10,033member
    Why would anyone inherently doubt that a brand new, highly innovative, and cutting edge piece of technology could be a bottleneck for this new iPhone?
    gatorguy
  • Reply 18 of 25
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 23,361member
    Soli said:
    Why would anyone inherently doubt that a brand new, highly innovative, and cutting edge piece of technology could be a bottleneck for this new iPhone?
    :)
  • Reply 19 of 25
    slurpyslurpy Posts: 5,345member
    sog35 said:
    According to the media/rumor mill Tim Cook has been a disaster the last month:

    1. Audio problems on iPhone 8

    2. LTE problems on Apple Watch

    3. iPhone X supply problems

    4. iOS 11 bugs

    5. Mac vunerability

    6. iPhone X bad design NOTCH

    7. AppleTV no Atmos or Youtube 4k compatability

    8. Weak iPhone 8 sales - very small lines

    Not saying any of this is true, but its certainly a bad look.


    This "list" of bullshit is only relevant to those intellectually dishonest people gleefully and obsessively scouring tech blogs and forums for negative news stories - like you, of course. 

    1. Audio issues affecting a very tiny number of iPhone 8s in very specific apps, which Apple has already acknowledged and will be patched. Every single iPhone release EVER has had these sorts of minor SW/HW issues at launch affecting a percentage of people. This doesn't even make the list compared to previous iPhone launches. 

    2. Most reviews say LTE works great, and if there are issues these will be addressed ASAP. Not a shred of evidence that this is a universal problem for most. Some issues are to be expected considering how relatively new eSIM is and the watch form factor, etc. Only someone like you would spin this into a "disaster". 

    3. "Supply problems" for a phone that doesn't launch for more than a month. Why don't we talk when the phone is actually launched and we have numbers? 

    4. Every version of iOS ever released has bugs on release, and iOS11 would have had bugs had they spent another 20 years working on it. What a bullshit "point". 

    5. Assume you meant "vulnerability". Moronic point, since what you're referring affects older versions of OSX, and there isn't a single case of it being exploited in the wild. High Sierra is more secure than any version before it, and this will no doubt be addressed. More stupidity and sensationalism from you.

    6. Completely subjective. The tens and tens of millions of who buy phone might disagree and have zero issues with it. But I can see how desperate you are to pad your "list".

    7. Atmos- Will be added in a software update, and realistically only a TINY percentage of ATV owners actually care about this. Youtube 4K- Not a shred of evidence that this isn't in Google's court. More FUD for your shitty list. 

    8. More garbage from you. Anyone and their dog could have predicted "shorter lines" for the 8, a phone similar in design to the ones of the last 4 years, considering a much more "exciting" iPhone launch is right around the corner. As for sales, you must have data that Apple doesn't even have, considering the phone literally just launched. You're literally oozing bullshit.

    "Not saying this is true..." Right, but you went through the trouble of assembling this weak-ass list anyway, right? You've already used some of these to bash Cook in serious fashion, so don't pretend you don't believe your own bullshit. You claim not to be sure if "any" of that list is true, but still condemn Cook for the "bad look", regardless of truth or fact. You're such a clown, and this entire forum knows it. You make these "lists" on a daily basis and spam every thread with them. 

    edited September 2017 Solikevin keesuddenly newton
  • Reply 20 of 25
    sog35 said:
    According to the media/rumor mill Tim Cook has been a disaster the last month:

    6. iPhone X bad design NOTCH

    Not saying any of this is true, but its certainly a bad look.

    NOTCH will be a status symbol!

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