'Profits will follow' if Apple can nail AR & VR experiences, Cook says

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  • Reply 21 of 32
    cgWerkscgWerks Posts: 2,952member
    flaneur said:
    If you don't think a real-time index of the world around you that's connected to a tracking of your binocular gaze into a scene in three dimensions, whereby you can fix on an object at a given distance in the scene, and the system will be aware of that fixation and respond accordingly, if you don't think this is at least a "game-changing" pointing device for a computer interface, then there's no hope — until maybe you do like Jobs did and open up your right brain by taking some proper doses. 
    Yes, I suppose when we get there... if it actually turns out well-done... it would be **a** revolution in user-interface that would be nice to have at times/places. I can imagine a HUD display in a car, for example. Or, yes, overlying some info in glasses is kind of neat compared to holding up your phone. But, I don't really want to go there in any kind of overall way. Just like as revolutionary Siri is, I seldom use it and am still sitting here with my keyboard/mouse/trackpad. Yes, part of that is because Siri (or like technologies) are in their infancy and far from perfection, let along decent usability. But it's also partly that I just don't really want to - most of the time - give voice commands to my computing device.
  • Reply 22 of 32
    flaneur said:
    staigard said:
    The iPhone X has potentially all the functionality of AR glasses ... well apart from the ability to balance on your nose.

    I find the Face Tracking very interesting ... also the bezel-less design.

    Face ID has the ability to track your eyes. By fast processing of the camera signal a seamless copy of reality could be displayed on the screen of the phone. A copy of reality that fits in exactly with the actual reality around it (a very small seam being caused by the bezel). Over this copy of reality, anything could be written or drawn.

    Face Tracking is great, but it is not doing much useful at the moment ... animating lumps of poo ? OK it also unlocks your iPhone but that was done well enough with the old Touch ID.

    I have a feeling that Face Tracking will suddenly become a lot more useful in the not so distant future.

    Also AR on iPhone X would avoid the social problems that Google Glass engendered.
    I do not understand how people ignore the fact that they have two eyes that provide two visual fields that are merged in the brain to provide the perception of depth, substantiality, texture and space itself — natively, out of the binocular architecture of the visual system, and then they pretend that a flat, two-dimensional rectangular electronic display will substitute for the sublimnity of that stereo perception.

    What Tim is talking about when he says Apple is focusing on "customer experience" is clearly something more than what you are talking about, which they already have running on iPads in the new Apple Park visitor center. I'm almost positive that he's talking about a way to make wearable screens that would only make sense if they were binocular, stereo 3D, as well as being transparent to the Reality part of AR, the world you see around you when you wear your normal glasses or sunglasses, in other words.
    OK ... you think Tim had glasses in mind when he responded as he did. Maybe he did.

    I hope to have useful/pleasant AR experiences on a iPhone X though, not too far in the future. I think I can forgo stereoscopic vision ... as I do everytime I look at a movie. Of course refocusing as you take your eyes off the screen and on to the back-ground might be a problem ... especially if you are like me and have to wear specs for reading/computers.

    Possibly refocusing would not be a problem if you could keep focused on the screen and just let your peripheral vision register the off-screen-reality.

    You say Apple have already iPads in the new Apple Park visitor center working as I suggested. Very interesting. It's a pity I am nearly half way around the world, or I would drop in for a look.

    Well obviously to perfect the AR experience you must build test rigs and experiment ... then repeat that ... then repeat again. However if Tim Cook is getting excited about AR, I guess these experiments are yielding good results. We shall see soon enough what form it takes. 
  • Reply 23 of 32
    cgWerks said:
    I think he's somewhat wrong... but then again, I wouldn't have bet all the chips on poop emojis either. On the bright side, at least some of the technology involved with pulling off VR is probably useful for other things. Does this mean Apple will finally have a reasonable GPU in their products?

    re: "We're all about making sure the customer experience is great. We think if we get the experience right, revenue and profits will follow. We're very much focused on the experience right now."

    I'm pretty sure (judging by other things they've been doing) that he just knows this is the language he needs to use. I'm not sure he actually understands the concept. I bet he just knows it's good marketing speak he learned from Jobs. Sheesh!
    What? He is an engineer and if he talks about user experience then there are very tangible issues on the table. I can guess what these may be, based on my gaming experience and today’s VR implementations. Whatever the case, it is almost certain that we won’t see a dork turning in circles around his water plumbed computer wired to it by his helmet, when Apple releases a VR solution.
    edited November 2017
  • Reply 24 of 32
    cgWerkscgWerks Posts: 2,952member
    staigard said:
    However if Tim Cook is getting excited about AR, I guess these experiments are yielding good results. We shall see soon enough what form it takes. 
    Sure, I suppose I was a bit over-enthusiastic in my initial response. Yes, I can see some uses for it, and I suppose if it gets good enough, it will eventually be *another* important form of user-interface.

    What tweaks me off, though, is when Apple is playing with AR, VR, AI, Cars, etc. when 'the city is burning' in other regards. I know they have to keep R&D going on in all kinds of experiments, but it seems they are moving on pretty aggressively into less important areas until they once again, solidify the base. And, my fear (aside from a bit of correction with admission on the Mac) is that they don't even know the the city is on fire.

    Once Apple gets back to making the best products (that they are capable of... yes, the bar is low), re-implements good UI practices into their OSs, gets QC back under control, establishes feature parity across their important software on both platforms, re-implemnts features they took away in their rush, re-establishes their tools for content creators and creatives, etc. THEN I'll welcome them branching out into any interesting areas that seem even semi-interesting.

    macplusplus said:
    What? He is an engineer and if he talks about user experience then there are very tangible issues on the table. I can guess what these may be, based on my gaming experience and today’s VR implementations. Whatever the case, it is almost certain that we won’t see a dork turning in circles around his water plumbed computer wired to it by his helmet, when Apple releases a VR solution.
    Yea, today's VR is horrible. No argument with him there. I'm not even sure I see a viable solution to that. The tech just isn't there yet (will it ever be?). I think the current state of things (maybe with a bit of improvement) could be good for certain verticals, though. But, as a mass thing? No, unless society becomes a lot richer, while yet more daffy, than present. (More daffy, I expect, but not richer.)

    And, that brings up another point. When economic collapse comes (and it will... just a matter of when). Is an Apple with the most awsomeist poop emojis and AR flourish better to weather that, or the Apple with good solid useful productivity technology? Maybe that sums up my fears best... Apple has been moving from must-have tools for the most productive people, to fluff for the masses with too much cash in their pockets. When the cash disappears or the fancy turns, where does that leave Apple?
  • Reply 25 of 32
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,363member
    cgWerks said:
    macplusplus said:
    What? He is an engineer and if he talks about user experience then there are very tangible issues on the table. I can guess what these may be, based on my gaming experience and today’s VR implementations. Whatever the case, it is almost certain that we won’t see a dork turning in circles around his water plumbed computer wired to it by his helmet, when Apple releases a VR solution.
    Yea, today's VR is horrible. No argument with him there. I'm not even sure I see a viable solution to that. The tech just isn't there yet (will it ever be?). I think the current state of things (maybe with a bit of improvement) could be good for certain verticals, though. But, as a mass thing? No, unless society becomes a lot richer, while yet more daffy, than present. (More daffy, I expect, but not richer.)

    And, that brings up another point. When economic collapse comes (and it will... just a matter of when). Is an Apple with the most awsomeist poop emojis and AR flourish better to weather that, or the Apple with good solid useful productivity technology? Maybe that sums up my fears best... Apple has been moving from must-have tools for the most productive people, to fluff for the masses with too much cash in their pockets. When the cash disappears or the fancy turns, where does that leave Apple?
    You should have just stated that "Apple is Doomed!" instead of wasting your time writing out the last paragraph.

    Seriously.

    An economic collapse occurred in 2008 and only now is the entire world back up to speed; Apple survived quite nicely through that. If the collapse is worse than that was, what the hell difference will it make?
  • Reply 26 of 32
    cgWerkscgWerks Posts: 2,952member
    tmay said:
    You should have just stated that "Apple is Doomed!" instead of wasting your time writing out the last paragraph.

    Seriously.

    An economic collapse occurred in 2008 and only now is the entire world back up to speed; Apple survived quite nicely through that. If the collapse is worse than that was, what the hell difference will it make?
    I guess if you want to be overly simplistic, then yes. You can't run a premium brand of Apple's scale being mediocre and with typical business practices. That's not how Apple got there, it it won't keep them there.

    But, I'm talking something bigger in regards to the last paragraph. 2008 was just another scale-up and correction type blip (like 2000/01, but smaller). Those are designed, in a sense, to move capital to the corrupt/wealthy, and enabled by stupid practices and tricking the financially naive. I mean a much bigger collapse/depression. That won't be so easy to survive for companies that simply have fashion/luxury products with no distinct advantage or usefulness.

    What difference would it make? It's not like you're going to get an opt-out. You and I will have to survive, as well as every company that wants to still be around after.
  • Reply 27 of 32
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,363member
    cgWerks said:
    tmay said:
    You should have just stated that "Apple is Doomed!" instead of wasting your time writing out the last paragraph.

    Seriously.

    An economic collapse occurred in 2008 and only now is the entire world back up to speed; Apple survived quite nicely through that. If the collapse is worse than that was, what the hell difference will it make?
    I guess if you want to be overly simplistic, then yes. You can't run a premium brand of Apple's scale being mediocre and with typical business practices. That's not how Apple got there, it it won't keep them there.

    But, I'm talking something bigger in regards to the last paragraph. 2008 was just another scale-up and correction type blip (like 2000/01, but smaller). Those are designed, in a sense, to move capital to the corrupt/wealthy, and enabled by stupid practices and tricking the financially naive. I mean a much bigger collapse/depression. That won't be so easy to survive for companies that simply have fashion/luxury products with no distinct advantage or usefulness.

    What difference would it make? It's not like you're going to get an opt-out. You and I will have to survive, as well as every company that wants to still be around after.
    You are being a concern troll, and your comments prove that. 

    Oh, and the 2000/2001 downturn was nothing compared to that of 2008.

    https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth
  • Reply 28 of 32
    cgWerkscgWerks Posts: 2,952member
    tmay said:
    You are being a concern troll, and your comments prove that. 

    Oh, and the 2000/2001 downturn was nothing compared to that of 2008.

    https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth
    You're welcome to believe what you like. I still think product design excellence, good UI, great UX, etc. are crucial.

    You might be right in terms of GDP growth, but in my experience of how it impacted average people, I think 2000/01 was worse. I'm just saying that in terms of economic problems, neither of them were really that big of a deal. It's hard to say how many more 'downturns' will be orchestrated... but at some point, a real reconciliation is coming. It isn't possible to just keep taking on more debt and tweaking interest rates and such. That's just prolonging the inevitable (and depth of the crash).
  • Reply 29 of 32
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,363member
    cgWerks said:
    tmay said:
    You are being a concern troll, and your comments prove that. 

    Oh, and the 2000/2001 downturn was nothing compared to that of 2008.

    https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth
    You're welcome to believe what you like. I still think product design excellence, good UI, great UX, etc. are crucial.

    You might be right in terms of GDP growth, but in my experience of how it impacted average people, I think 2000/01 was worse. I'm just saying that in terms of economic problems, neither of them were really that big of a deal. It's hard to say how many more 'downturns' will be orchestrated... but at some point, a real reconciliation is coming. It isn't possible to just keep taking on more debt and tweaking interest rates and such. That's just prolonging the inevitable (and depth of the crash).
    This is the part where you might want to stop digging that hole that you are in.
  • Reply 30 of 32
    nhtnht Posts: 4,522member
    tmay said:
    cgWerks said:
    tmay said:
    You are being a concern troll, and your comments prove that. 

    Oh, and the 2000/2001 downturn was nothing compared to that of 2008.

    https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth
    You're welcome to believe what you like. I still think product design excellence, good UI, great UX, etc. are crucial.

    You might be right in terms of GDP growth, but in my experience of how it impacted average people, I think 2000/01 was worse. I'm just saying that in terms of economic problems, neither of them were really that big of a deal. It's hard to say how many more 'downturns' will be orchestrated... but at some point, a real reconciliation is coming. It isn't possible to just keep taking on more debt and tweaking interest rates and such. That's just prolonging the inevitable (and depth of the crash).
    This is the part where you might want to stop digging that hole that you are in.
    They never do. Especially the old ones.
  • Reply 31 of 32
    cgWerkscgWerks Posts: 2,952member
    OK, I'll get with the program. ;)

    Oh, great and mighty Apple, who can do no wrong, we shall buy your most excellent products in abundance.
    and... Oh young people of the world, don't worry about debt. Debt is good (it raises your Equifax scores, you know). The USA is invincible. Follow every cultural trend, because... progress. The economy is just too big to collapse. The (broke) governments will bail us all out.

    Enjoy your life. All is happy.
  • Reply 32 of 32
    tmaytmay Posts: 6,363member
    cgWerks said:
    OK, I'll get with the program. ;)

    Oh, great and mighty Apple, who can do no wrong, we shall buy your most excellent products in abundance.
    and... Oh young people of the world, don't worry about debt. Debt is good (it raises your Equifax scores, you know). The USA is invincible. Follow every cultural trend, because... progress. The economy is just too big to collapse. The (broke) governments will bail us all out.

    Enjoy your life. All is happy.
    Buh bye.
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