I am a complete and total Apple fanboy and I am proud of it. That being said, I have a problem with this "feature." I do not question their intentions or reasoning. What I do question is the transparency. We are strongly encouraged to update our devices every time there is an update available.
We should be told if we do update the device that we will experience a "slowing down," if the battery is degraded. It should be clearly outlined what is considered a degraded battery. How many charging cycles? Then we can make our decision about updating with the knowledge of what we should expect.
This has nothing to do with the slowing down of the phones to protect us from crashes. Whether that is true or not, really isn't important to this. Because in truth, we all place different values on how our devices perform and what is important to us.
danv2 said: They [Apple] should have made it a feature,
Apple did make this a feature; it warns you when your battery needs to be replaced. See https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453. If the user had the ability to turn it off the throttling then the phone would would shutdown unexpectedly and the user would be ticked off.
This lawsuit is totally stupid. Should someone sue Apple because their batteries wear out?
Look at the date this support page was posted. "Published Date: Nov 29, 2017". Uh, today is the 21st.
I can see a future update having an option in Settings » Battery for a a Throttle toggle switch that works kinda like Low Power Mode, except that it won't disable "mail fetch, Hey Siri, background app refresh, automatic downloads, and some visual effects."
I was reading all the headline on this subject, in typical media fashion these days, they make it sound like Apple only did it to force people to update their phones. Verses the real reality, they were trying to extend the useful life of the phone under low battery conditions. It was clear the phone was not slow down all the time only when the battery level hit a certain point.
it made total sense what they did, reduce the current spikes on low battery condition which kept the battery voltage from dipping below the low voltage cut off. Customer could get a new phone or new battery, I have replaced batteries on a number of iPhone after 3 yrs to get rid of the problem of it shutting down too quickly on low battery. I am not sure if we really notice the slow performance.
The issue now it the media has spun this so bad that people are piss even if they never saw an issue or upgrade just because they wanted a new phone. As person who used an Android for long time and saw real performance hits after 6 to 9 months of using the phone, Apple slow down does not compare.
When I bought an iPhone SE (never wanted a larger screen) about a year ago, I gave my iPhone 5 to a deserving friend. I never had a unexpected shutdown, nor has the recipient of my iPhone 5. Battery has never been replaced.
This guy suing sounds to me like the tech version of an ambulance chaser.
Actually describing this person as an ambulance chaser is pretty accurate.
The first person to make a claim, that leads to a class action suit, gets preference in the settlement terms. By that I mean instead of receiving a the customary coupon as settlement, they are paid as much as $20,000 [by the plaintiff attorney] for bringing the suit to them. The payment only comes if there is a judgement or settlement. This has led to a class of professional class action plaintiffs who are always on the lookout for a class action issue.
That this plaintiff stepped forward within 24 hours of media coverage should not be a surprise.
Just another person making this world muddy and messy.
Apple doesn't owe anybody any money.
It owes a shit load in taxes and is gonna pay up as per the EU lol. Regarding this situation: if they were transparent then they would not be getting fucked on this deal. They should have made it a feature, and left it to the consumer to decide. When you make calls like this on behalf of the customer, then they will come at you with fangs. More importantly, a prompt should pop up "its time to replace your battery for $80" instead of "lemme slow you down bro w/out telling you bro" etc.
There is a clear cut difference here, and they made a mistake on assuming what each person would want.
Please watch your language. This is s tech board. Not some gutter forum. There are kids checking this out as well. Have some decency, thanks.
danv2 said: They [Apple] should have made it a feature,
Apple did make this a feature; it warns you when your battery needs to be replaced. See https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453. If the user had the ability to turn it off the throttling then the phone would would shutdown unexpectedly and the user would be ticked off.
This lawsuit is totally stupid. Should someone sue Apple because their batteries wear out?
Look at the date this support page was posted. "Published Date: Nov 29, 2017". Uh, today is the 21st.
Does anyone think this is a big deal? Apple choose to preserve battery life over power in older models, they continually update iOS and bring new phones out every year, the way technology advances I don't see this as a big deal but thats maybe cause I'm more than happy to pay whatever for the latest phones, I certainly wouldn't expect my old iPhone 6 to work at the same speed as my new iPhone 10, regardless of how old the device is.
This is a big deal for me. Apple crippled my device, without my consent. It is MY choice to decide when to buy a new one, not this forced obsolescence. I also wouldn't expect my iPhone 6 to perform as fast as an X, but I damn sure don't expect for the manufacturer to cripple a device I paid for either.
Just another person making this world muddy and messy.
Apple doesn't owe anybody any money.
It owes a shit load in taxes and is gonna pay up as per the EU lol. Regarding this situation: if they were transparent then they would not be getting fucked on this deal. They should have made it a feature, and left it to the consumer to decide. When you make calls like this on behalf of the customer, then they will come at you with fangs. More importantly, a prompt should pop up "its time to replace your battery for $80" instead of "lemme slow you down bro w/out telling you bro" etc.
There is a clear cut difference here, and they made a mistake on assuming what each person would want.
Please watch your language. This is s tech board. Not some gutter forum. There are kids checking this out as well. Have some decency, thanks.
And what exactly is your problem with the English language? Do you think that words are literally cursed? Do you think that reading descriptive language will send you to hell? Are you the type of person that believes it's OK to use passive-aggressive pussified terms so you can have an out, like saying darn instead of damn, fudge instead of fuck, and goshdarnit instead of goddammit? It's literally just words. Instead of being offended by an arrangement of letters or a series of phonemes why not concentrate on context. I see your false logic all the time with all sorts of ridiculous bigotry where people feel indemnified because they didn't say the word they were thinking despite the context being exactly the same. Don't diminish the value of a language with arbitrary rules to make certain words taboo for stupid fucking reasons.
And taxpayers should sue NASA because they've been turning off features we paid for on the Voyager space probes as the power level drops because of the plutonium decay.
Do you still have your receipt for the voyager. File in the First District Court of Mars.
Does anyone think this is a big deal? Apple choose to preserve battery life over power in older models, they continually update iOS and bring new phones out every year, the way technology advances I don't see this as a big deal but thats maybe cause I'm more than happy to pay whatever for the latest phones, I certainly wouldn't expect my old iPhone 6 to work at the same speed as my new iPhone 10, regardless of how old the device is.
I definitely do think this is big deal. The battery on my iPhone 6 Plus was still strong -- I didn't even have to charge it every day -- but it started running insanely slow doing the same functions that were previously lightning fast. The only reason that I bought a new phone is because of this slowdown. This was a dirty ploy on Apple's part disguised as "help".
Just another person making this world muddy and messy.
Apple doesn't owe anybody any money.
Sign me up. When does Apple ever win lawsuits? Never. The don’t even have to file in the eastern federal district of Texas to win this, but if they do file there Apple will lose big league.
Just another person making this world muddy and messy.
Apple doesn't owe anybody any money.
It owes a shit load in taxes and is gonna pay up as per the EU lol. Regarding this situation: if they were transparent then they would not be getting fucked on this deal. They should have made it a feature, and left it to the consumer to decide. When you make calls like this on behalf of the customer, then they will come at you with fangs. More importantly, a prompt should pop up "its time to replace your battery for $80" instead of "lemme slow you down bro w/out telling you bro" etc.
There is a clear cut difference here, and they made a mistake on assuming what each person would want.
Please watch your language. This is s tech board. Not some gutter forum. There are kids checking this out as well. Have some decency, thanks.
And what exactly is your problem with the English language? Do you think that words are literally cursed? Do you think that reading descriptive language will send you to hell? Are you the type of person that believes it's OK to use passive-aggressive pussified terms so you can have an out, like saying darn instead of damn, fudge instead of fuck, and goshdarnit instead of goddammit? It's literally just words. Instead of being offended by an arrangement of letters or a series of phonemes why not concentrate on context. I see your false logic all the time with all sorts of ridiculous bigotry where people feel indemnified because they didn't say the word they were thinking despite the context being exactly the same. Don't diminish the value of a language with arbitrary rules to make certain words taboo for stupid fucking reasons.
Anyone in doubt of their battery being worn out and suffers from throttling, can download coconut app to their Mac from coconut-favour.com. It's free and it tells you the battery condition of your iPhone. Excuse me AppleInsider, it's not the battery problem. I tested on a dozen of iPhones, only 6 Plus and 6 have been suffering. All iPhones suffering from throttling and reduced speed to at least half, that I tested, have 85% to 94% of their design capacities. It's a strategic throttling!
Mostly I use top downloaded apps from big vendors like google, fb, apple, ... i doubt these are poorly designed.
Actually, I think Facebook might be poorly designed. Using Facebook causes both my Mac and iPhone to behave strangely.
I realize this doesn't address your main point about the larger issue, but thought it might be worth noting that restarts after Facebook have become a fairly common part of maintaining optimum performance from my devices.
Soli said: [...] You can say you want the "original" clock rate in which you first bought it, but then you really shouldn't do updates as even new features can affect how fast it feels
What you say is true, but we both know that avoiding updates runs completely counter to the messaging from both Apple and outside experts. Have you called Apple support recently? The first question they ask is whether the software is up-to-date.
Software updates do more than just add features. They fix bugs and close security holes. Freezing software at a point that's ideal for the hardware may or may not result in a better user experience overall, as bugs in that version may be worse than increased processor load. Unfortunately bug repairs and security fixes are usually not delivered a la carte, but included with new features and functions that may make the device slower. One possible remedy is to make iOS development more similar to macOS, with important updates being made available for older operating systems without new features or hardware load.
I honestly don't understand how the situation with phones is perceived to be any different than what we've experienced with computers for decades. Everyone knows that development marches on, and new devices gradually become old devices. As devices age their performance degrades, and as software develops its hardware demands increase. Why do we accept this with computers but not phones? This lawsuit is an example of that inconsistent thinking.
Just another person making this world muddy and messy.
Apple doesn't owe anybody any money.
It owes a shit load in taxes and is gonna pay up as per the EU lol. Regarding this situation: if they were transparent then they would not be getting fucked on this deal. They should have made it a feature, and left it to the consumer to decide. When you make calls like this on behalf of the customer, then they will come at you with fangs. More importantly, a prompt should pop up "its time to replace your battery for $80" instead of "lemme slow you down bro w/out telling you bro" etc.
There is a clear cut difference here, and they made a mistake on assuming what each person would want.
My suggestion is a message that says "Your battery is getting to near to its end, so ... do you want to keep going as you are and risk the phone dying on you or allow iOS to slow down some processes to make it last a little longer, totally up to you bro."
Yes that would make sense, but what happened to the 1,000 cycles claim on their batteries? I do remember Apple boasting it a few years back.
1,000 cycles is a little over 3 years if you drain your battery every single day.
That’s part of the problem, people don’t know how to treat their batteries. You should NEVER run a lithium battery flat as it degrades faster. It should never be run below 20%.
Also Apple said 500 charges not 1000.
iPhones and almost all other phones have low charge protection. If Apple starts asking users not to drop below 20% then they’d have to reduce their claim to usage hours.
Apparently the iPhone is the only Apple device with 500 cycles, even the Apple Watch has a 1000 cycles. This smells fishy.
What's not clear is, does Apple detect that a battery is having issues and slows it down, or does Apple slow all phones that have older batteries even if they aren't having any issues.
I don't know, but I haven't noticed any particular change to my iPhone 6 Plus with iOS 11. It has the same amount of lag and sluggishness it had with iOS 10. My wife is still on iOS 10 and, based on just casual observation and not any quantifiable testing, the performance of hers compared to mine seems pretty similar. My phone is definitely slower, laggier, and choppier than it was when it was new, but the degradation began before iOS 11. I don't remember which OS was installed when I bought it, nor when I first started noticing performance issues, but I think it may have been with iOS 10.
For me iOS 11 has been a wash -- neither better nor worse. While we obviously can't draw any definitive conclusions from casual observation of a single sample, that at least implies that there MAY be some battery detection at work.
I’m not one inclined to support conspiracy theories. And I generally give Apple the benefit of the doubt. But this trend graph is definitely saying something. If the raw data is real it’s hard to ignore.
That tracking is corrupted by the graph including searches for "slow motion." In the case of the iPhone, it was the most common search. Second most for Android.
For the results to tell us anything useful those results would have to be filtered out. Scientific method, controls, etc.
Comments
We should be told if we do update the device that we will experience a "slowing down," if the battery is degraded. It should be clearly outlined what is considered a degraded battery. How many charging cycles? Then we can make our decision about updating with the knowledge of what we should expect.
This has nothing to do with the slowing down of the phones to protect us from crashes. Whether that is true or not, really isn't important to this. Because in truth, we all place different values on how our devices perform and what is important to us.
It's there now. https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT207453
When I bought an iPhone SE (never wanted a larger screen) about a year ago, I gave my iPhone 5 to a deserving friend. I never had a unexpected shutdown, nor has the recipient of my iPhone 5. Battery has never been replaced.
The first person to make a claim, that leads to a class action suit, gets preference in the settlement terms. By that I mean instead of receiving a the customary coupon as settlement, they are paid as much as $20,000 [by the plaintiff attorney] for bringing the suit to them. The payment only comes if there is a judgement or settlement. This has led to a class of professional class action plaintiffs who are always on the lookout for a class action issue.
That this plaintiff stepped forward within 24 hours of media coverage should not be a surprise.
There are kids checking this out as well. Have some decency, thanks.
I realize this doesn't address your main point about the larger issue, but thought it might be worth noting that restarts after Facebook have become a fairly common part of maintaining optimum performance from my devices.
What you say is true, but we both know that avoiding updates runs completely counter to the messaging from both Apple and outside experts. Have you called Apple support recently? The first question they ask is whether the software is up-to-date.
Software updates do more than just add features. They fix bugs and close security holes. Freezing software at a point that's ideal for the hardware may or may not result in a better user experience overall, as bugs in that version may be worse than increased processor load. Unfortunately bug repairs and security fixes are usually not delivered a la carte, but included with new features and functions that may make the device slower. One possible remedy is to make iOS development more similar to macOS, with important updates being made available for older operating systems without new features or hardware load.
I honestly don't understand how the situation with phones is perceived to be any different than what we've experienced with computers for decades. Everyone knows that development marches on, and new devices gradually become old devices. As devices age their performance degrades, and as software develops its hardware demands increase. Why do we accept this with computers but not phones? This lawsuit is an example of that inconsistent thinking.
Apparently the iPhone is the only Apple device with 500 cycles, even the Apple Watch has a 1000 cycles. This smells fishy.
For me iOS 11 has been a wash -- neither better nor worse. While we obviously can't draw any definitive conclusions from casual observation of a single sample, that at least implies that there MAY be some battery detection at work.
For the results to tell us anything useful those results would have to be filtered out. Scientific method, controls, etc.