If only someone would find DED a decent editor and proofreader to reduce these rambling, haystack articles to their needle-worth of content.
How about this? You submit an editorial piece to AppleInsider. Assuming they accept it and publish it let’s see what kind of critiques it gets from the AI ecosystem. I dare you! I double dog dare you! Or are you one of those who claim to know how to get somewhere but can’t drive the car?
Many people can write effectively, including me. But I don’t ask you to read a few thousand of my words, much less when a fraction would have done the job.
Hotel rooms, friends cars, friends stereo systems, my bose QC's, all use a headphone jack. These things will all have headphone jacks for the next 5-10 years. Removing the headphone jack was a travesty and i'll never forgive Apple for it until everything is wireless. Carrying around an adapter like I have to for my Macbook is ridiculous. This is just a fact and reading all of you sucking the mega corporations proverbial junk is absolutely baffling.
A travesty! christ listen to yourself someday...
ive never plugged into anyone’s stereo system and i doubt many do. you’re not th primary use case, you’re an outlier. so use the adapter or tell your friend to get some wireless tech.
I wonder if we’ll be having an almost identical conversation in September when Apple finds the courage to remove Bluetooth from the iPhone and replaces it with a free lightning Bluetooth dongle in the box.
The problem with all the arguments for removing the headphone jack is that they either don't hold up, or are contradicted by other things Apple has said or done.
Argument: They needed to remove it for waterproofing. Except there are many other waterproof phones on the market that have a headphone jack. On top of this, they made a waterproof lightning jack, so the jack itself shouldn’t have been an issue.
Argument: 'We needed the space.' Except they took up as much space (or more) than they saved with the haptic engine that really wasn’t necessary, either.
Argument: It’s old technology. True, but old is not synonymous with obsolete. The 3.5mm headphone jack is still THE standard. If it truly was old technology that they needed to get rid of, why didn’t they get rid of it in the iPad and the MacBooks and tell people they could use an adapter if they needed to? They answered that question themselves with the MacBook - people use it.
Argument: the headphone jack was a reliability issue. This is a conceivable argument, and honestly the only reasonable one I’ve heard, except Apple has never made this argument themselves, nor have I seen excessive reports of the headphone jack failing. Anecdotally, I’ve had 4 iPhones going back to a 3G and never had a headphone jack fail. Further, if they are expecting people to use the lightning jack, why won’t that fail from use just like the headphone jack? If anything this is a worse scenario, since a failed lightning jack potentially means no charging or data transfer capabilities.
Argument: there are alternatives available. This is clearly true, I would argue that none of the alternatives match the convenience and economy of standard headphones. Yes, I can use the provided lighting headphones, but I can’t use these with my MacBook, or any non-apple device (is there even a female lightning to 3.5mm dongle available?) Yes there are dongles available, but requiring the dongle means one more thing to keep track of, pay to replace, etc. And if you forget the dongle, you’re SOL. When I flew recently the stewardess handed out headphones. With a 3.5mm plug. She did not have any dongles, either USB C or lightning.
Bluetooth is an alternative - I have bluetooth devices that I use on a regular basis. They work, but none of them has the consistent reliability and ease of use of wired headphones.
The other issues is de-standardization fo the connectors. There are a handfull andorid phones on the market. To my knowledge, these all use USB C connectors. Now, instead of a single 3.5mm connector, manufacturers need to make 3 versions. (Does anyone think Beats is going to ditch the 3.5mm connector?)
In the end, you can make things work without a 3.5mm connector, but Apple isn’t about making things work, it’s about things just working. What they did by removing the 3.5mm jack was make life more complicated and less convenient for a large segment of their users. If there were a reasonable justification for it, I could be more understanding, but when none of their reasons hold up, it’s hard to swallow.
I was using an iPhone 5s (then SE) through the release of the iPhone 6 and 6plus. This article was helpful in that it told me that I was smart not to upgrade. Besides giving Battery problems DED basically said that it was a bad phone because of the headphone port. Maybe thats why Apple's planning a big new AppleCare center. I have a 7plus and 8plus. While the 8Plus is better than the 7plus, it is only incrementally so. I will be surprised it there is a reason to upgrade in the next 4 years. I carry HomePods now (when I remember to grab them) but still wish that Apple kept the headphone jack for when I bring my Bose noise canceling headphones.
False. The article actually explained why iPhone 6 appeared to have a higher failure rate than previous models: it was showing up more in large part because the volume of sales went up dramatically. But since 2017, the failure rate has improved despite volumes still being high, and the reason for that has been improvements made to its hardware.
Lightning is 100% digital. There's no pass-through that lets analog audio go through the Lightning port to your headphones. The Lightning headphones have a miniature D/A converter and amplifier built right into the connector. That's why it's physically larger (though not by much). The Lightning to 3.5mm adaptor also has a built-in D/A converter and amplifier. That's why selling it for $9 at the beginning made it such a bargain - it's not a traditional adapter and actually has a lot of tech packed into its connector.
You are correct. but the Verge imagined a world where there would no longer be a way to get analog audio out, where Lightning would effectively turn into an HDMI port and there could be DRM preventing you from listening to commercial content. That's silly for a couple reasons: first of all, your own audio content would still play out via audio because Apple doesn't limit this in any way. And secondly, commercial content video that requires DRM playback over HDMI will only play out from devices that support it. If Apple were the only company supporting Lighting and that occurred, it would be an advantage to get a device with a headphone jack. Apple is quite obviously not going in that direction.
Thanks to both of you for clarifying that the analog audio output is a function of the adapter.
I wonder if we’ll be having an almost identical conversation in September when Apple finds the courage to remove Bluetooth from the iPhone and replaces it with a free lightning Bluetooth dongle in the box.
Straw Man Argument. Apple is focussed on moving toward BT
The problem with all the arguments for removing the headphone jack is that they either don't hold up, or are contradicted by other things Apple has said or done.
Argument: ...
Argument: ...
Argument: ...
Argument...
Argument: ... etc. etc.
OK I may or may not agree with everything you listed. But DAMN that was one of the clearest, most logical arguments I've read. Nicely done.
The problem with all the arguments for removing the headphone jack is that they either don't hold up, or are contradicted by other things Apple has said or done.
Argument: They needed to remove it for waterproofing. Except there are many other waterproof phones on the market that have a headphone jack. On top of this, they made a waterproof lightning jack, so the jack itself shouldn’t have been an issue.
Argument: 'We needed the space.' Except they took up as much space (or more) than they saved with the haptic engine that really wasn’t necessary, either.
Argument: It’s old technology. True, but old is not synonymous with obsolete. The 3.5mm headphone jack is still THE standard. If it truly was old technology that they needed to get rid of, why didn’t they get rid of it in the iPad and the MacBooks and tell people they could use an adapter if they needed to? They answered that question themselves with the MacBook - people use it.
Argument: the headphone jack was a reliability issue. This is a conceivable argument, and honestly the only reasonable one I’ve heard, except Apple has never made this argument themselves, nor have I seen excessive reports of the headphone jack failing. Anecdotally, I’ve had 4 iPhones going back to a 3G and never had a headphone jack fail. Further, if they are expecting people to use the lightning jack, why won’t that fail from use just like the headphone jack? If anything this is a worse scenario, since a failed lightning jack potentially means no charging or data transfer capabilities.
Argument: there are alternatives available. This is clearly true, I would argue that none of the alternatives match the convenience and economy of standard headphones. Yes, I can use the provided lighting headphones, but I can’t use these with my MacBook, or any non-apple device (is there even a female lightning to 3.5mm dongle available?) Yes there are dongles available, but requiring the dongle means one more thing to keep track of, pay to replace, etc. And if you forget the dongle, you’re SOL. When I flew recently the stewardess handed out headphones. With a 3.5mm plug. She did not have any dongles, either USB C or lightning.
Bluetooth is an alternative - I have bluetooth devices that I use on a regular basis. They work, but none of them has the consistent reliability and ease of use of wired headphones.
The other issues is de-standardization fo the connectors. There are a handfull andorid phones on the market. To my knowledge, these all use USB C connectors. Now, instead of a single 3.5mm connector, manufacturers need to make 3 versions. (Does anyone think Beats is going to ditch the 3.5mm connector?)
In the end, you can make things work without a 3.5mm connector, but Apple isn’t about making things work, it’s about things just working. What they did by removing the 3.5mm jack was make life more complicated and less convenient for a large segment of their users. If there were a reasonable justification for it, I could be more understanding, but when none of their reasons hold up, it’s hard to swallow.
The problems with your arguments are:
- it doesn't matter if other phones are waterproof and have the jack, because they aren't the iPhone, which has its own design and its wn constraints and compromises inside. And in its case the people who design it (VP dude of hardware) said very clearly they needed the space for the a) the waterproof seals, b) the improved imaging, c) a larger battery.
- W1-equipped BT (ala AirPods) is supremely consistent and easy. I use them a 6-12 times a day for various tasks such as working out and taking work calls or watching video on the iPad. Switching between multiple devices is easy, unlike my standard-BT devices which won't even do it half the time.
- my life is fine, no more complicated. I've used the adapter one time and that was out of curiosity.
- It's done. It's not coming back in the iPhone. Time to move on with your life.
I've had an iPhone 6 since launch and never had any hardware errors. Ios 11 did manage to destroy the phone though with the "system grows to big"-bugg. I really hope apple fixes this quickly, I wanna have this phone for one more year!
I wonder if we’ll be having an almost identical conversation in September when Apple finds the courage to remove Bluetooth from the iPhone and replaces it with a free lightning Bluetooth dongle in the box.
Straw Man Argument. Apple is focussed on moving toward BT
I was joking, but as someone who rarely uses Bluetooth, I would be the first to say, “What’s the problem? They give you a free dongle, and it works perfectly fine!”
I've said this here before, but I'll say it again: Nilay Patel is absolutely ridiculous (dear God... spike bracelets!!!). I had absolutely no idea how Walt Mossberg put up with the guy in his last years, before retiring. Though Mossberg had his fair share in promoting technological turds (even to the point of comparing them to Apple products, as in the same ballpark), he never was critical to Apple just for the sake of it.
Patel is a loser. I vividly recall seeing him on videos where he looked and acted like he was aggressively drunk. Slurred speech, combative, the whole thing. No wonder The Verge has been losing their top journalists for some time since he was put in charge.
I wonder if we’ll be having an almost identical conversation in September when Apple finds the courage to remove Bluetooth from the iPhone and replaces it with a free lightning Bluetooth dongle in the box.
Straw Man Argument. Apple is focussed on moving toward BT
I was joking, but as someone who rarely uses Bluetooth, I would be the first to say, “What’s the problem? They give you a free dongle, and it works perfectly fine!”
The problem with all the arguments for removing the headphone jack is that they either don't hold up, or are contradicted by other things Apple has said or done.
Argument: They needed to remove it for waterproofing. Except there are many other waterproof phones on the market that have a headphone jack. On top of this, they made a waterproof lightning jack, so the jack itself shouldn’t have been an issue.
Argument: 'We needed the space.' Except they took up as much space (or more) than they saved with the haptic engine that really wasn’t necessary, either.
Argument: It’s old technology. True, but old is not synonymous with obsolete. The 3.5mm headphone jack is still THE standard. If it truly was old technology that they needed to get rid of, why didn’t they get rid of it in the iPad and the MacBooks and tell people they could use an adapter if they needed to? They answered that question themselves with the MacBook - people use it.
Argument: the headphone jack was a reliability issue. This is a conceivable argument, and honestly the only reasonable one I’ve heard, except Apple has never made this argument themselves, nor have I seen excessive reports of the headphone jack failing. Anecdotally, I’ve had 4 iPhones going back to a 3G and never had a headphone jack fail. Further, if they are expecting people to use the lightning jack, why won’t that fail from use just like the headphone jack? If anything this is a worse scenario, since a failed lightning jack potentially means no charging or data transfer capabilities.
Argument: there are alternatives available. This is clearly true, I would argue that none of the alternatives match the convenience and economy of standard headphones. Yes, I can use the provided lighting headphones, but I can’t use these with my MacBook, or any non-apple device (is there even a female lightning to 3.5mm dongle available?) Yes there are dongles available, but requiring the dongle means one more thing to keep track of, pay to replace, etc. And if you forget the dongle, you’re SOL. When I flew recently the stewardess handed out headphones. With a 3.5mm plug. She did not have any dongles, either USB C or lightning.
Bluetooth is an alternative - I have bluetooth devices that I use on a regular basis. They work, but none of them has the consistent reliability and ease of use of wired headphones.
The other issues is de-standardization fo the connectors. There are a handfull andorid phones on the market. To my knowledge, these all use USB C connectors. Now, instead of a single 3.5mm connector, manufacturers need to make 3 versions. (Does anyone think Beats is going to ditch the 3.5mm connector?)
In the end, you can make things work without a 3.5mm connector, but Apple isn’t about making things work, it’s about things just working. What they did by removing the 3.5mm jack was make life more complicated and less convenient for a large segment of their users. If there were a reasonable justification for it, I could be more understanding, but when none of their reasons hold up, it’s hard to swallow.
1) No one said it was impossible, but every port inference adds extra complexity to the engineers. I also look forward to when the physical SIM card goes caput.
2) They did the space. Finite space is the biggest issue with modern smartphones, and usually a major issue with all portable devices. They made the battery smaller when they added the haptic engine. They made the battery larger, added an altimeter, and was able to introduce better camera components (and possibly Face ID) by moving the battery and haptic engine down a little, which no longer was stopped by the headphone socket component.
3) In this case, and on an iPhone, yes, but personally I would say the technology is obsolescing. Lots of things were the standard… and they weren't. The iPad and Macs aren't space limited the way the iPhone is and to suggest that it's the exact same scenario is ridiculous.
4) A company removing a technology doesn't mean the technology is inherently bad. Apple removed the USB-C port from the Apple TV, Apple has used a dozen different video port standards in the last decade or so. Technology moves forward with or without you.
5) Why are you flying without headphones in 2018? Why do you believe Apple gives you headphones for your iPhone so that you can plug it into PCs and planes? Personally, I wish they'd stop giving away crappy headphones and PSUs that only cause more waste, but I don't see that happening.
6) Then you have poor BT headphones because the technology works great with Apple devices, especially their headphones with the W-series chip. Do you not see that they're moving toward BT headphones?
7) No, they don't have to make "3 versions." They can include adapters, or not address that market at all. While you claim this is some dongle you need to disconnect every time you take off your headphones the reality is that people (like me) with wired headphones that they like just put the adapter and left it. It's the tightest fit for a 3.5mm jack I've ever seen and even helps prevent them from getting tangled from that slight extra weight at the end. Android-based vendors are moving toward USB-C for audio. This will continue to move in that direction so I would suggest coming to terms with the 3.5mm jack going away in future smartphones or buy up all the old kit you can.
8) Your arguments remind me of what Apple started to remove the ODD, but you don't hear much about it because people who don't like change have moved on. The same thing will happen with the 3.5mm headphone jack, too. But really it shouldn't be an issue for you because there's nothing you can do about it outside of not getting Apple's latest iPhones. Vote with your wallet.
Hotel rooms, friends cars, friends stereo systems, my bose QC's, all use a headphone jack. These things will all have headphone jacks for the next 5-10 years. Removing the headphone jack was a travesty and i'll never forgive Apple for it until everything is wireless. Carrying around an adapter like I have to for my Macbook is ridiculous. This is just a fact and reading all of you sucking the mega corporations proverbial junk is absolutely baffling.
While this is a fairly common occurrence for many people, especially younger generations -- to be fair, you have to carry a special cable to jack into most of those things, especially those you find in a hotel room, which are unlikely to supply that cable. So carrying an adapter for your iPhone to use the Lightning port is not really that big a deal. I do have a real problem with the fact that Apple hasn't really offered a solution for sharing a wireless connection, such that people can watch a movie together, or even listen to music together by sharing the same audio feed. Even Apple's own AirPod commercial demonstrates their own recognition that people want to share their music like that -- but I guess mono is the new paradigm in sharing? That said, you always needed a y-splitter adapter to do it, so again, that big a concern to carry a Lightning adapter with it.
I do agree that Apple was a little quick to drop the headphone jack without offering complete solutions to replace it, like the ability to share a wireless BT connection with someone, or inexplicably the ability to use a pair of Lightning headphones on a MacBook (I wish I could carry around an adapter!), or any non-iOS device. But the reality is, if Apple, or any corporation for that matter waited until everything was in place to drop old technology in favor of new, nothing would ever move forward.
Well that was great and makes sense from an engineering perspective, I won't deny that. However, I'm not an engineer. I'm a customer. Not only that, I'm a customer that takes care of the delicate tech that I carry around with me daily. If people had problems with the headphone jack it was their fault most likely. I've never had problems with it on any devices, ever. I still have my old iPhone 6 which has performed flawlessly this whole time, and stopped using my iPhone 7 plus as a daily because of the frustration of not having a 3.5mm.
I don't like apple's pods, I don't want to buy their airpods, and even with a good pair of Bluetooth buds I get frustrated with my iPhone 7 plus. I don't like the adapter, forget it most of the time, and I'm surprised I haven't lost it yet like most people have. I just want to plug in my favorite wired ear buds at times and I can't. I forgot my adapter. I don't want to re pair my bluetooth buds because I used them with my other device earlier, and I have a call coming in. I just want to plug in my Apple forsaken normal headphones or buds and I can't. Fock this, I'll just use my iPhone 6.
A combination of the lack of 3.5mm, touchid and yet still no pencil support has kept me from moving to the iPhone 8/X and I'll probably skip 2018 as well.
Comments
ive never plugged into anyone’s stereo system and i doubt many do. you’re not th primary use case, you’re an outlier. so use the adapter or tell your friend to get some wireless tech.
Argument: They needed to remove it for waterproofing. Except there are many other waterproof phones on the market that have a headphone jack. On top of this, they made a waterproof lightning jack, so the jack itself shouldn’t have been an issue.
Thanks to both of you for clarifying that the analog audio output is a function of the adapter.
Nicely done.
- it doesn't matter if other phones are waterproof and have the jack, because they aren't the iPhone, which has its own design and its wn constraints and compromises inside. And in its case the people who design it (VP dude of hardware) said very clearly they needed the space for the a) the waterproof seals, b) the improved imaging, c) a larger battery.
- W1-equipped BT (ala AirPods) is supremely consistent and easy. I use them a 6-12 times a day for various tasks such as working out and taking work calls or watching video on the iPad. Switching between multiple devices is easy, unlike my standard-BT devices which won't even do it half the time.
- my life is fine, no more complicated. I've used the adapter one time and that was out of curiosity.
- It's done. It's not coming back in the iPhone. Time to move on with your life.
2) They did the space. Finite space is the biggest issue with modern smartphones, and usually a major issue with all portable devices. They made the battery smaller when they added the haptic engine. They made the battery larger, added an altimeter, and was able to introduce better camera components (and possibly Face ID) by moving the battery and haptic engine down a little, which no longer was stopped by the headphone socket component.
3) In this case, and on an iPhone, yes, but personally I would say the technology is obsolescing. Lots of things were the standard… and they weren't. The iPad and Macs aren't space limited the way the iPhone is and to suggest that it's the exact same scenario is ridiculous.
4) A company removing a technology doesn't mean the technology is inherently bad. Apple removed the USB-C port from the Apple TV, Apple has used a dozen different video port standards in the last decade or so. Technology moves forward with or without you.
5) Why are you flying without headphones in 2018? Why do you believe Apple gives you headphones for your iPhone so that you can plug it into PCs and planes? Personally, I wish they'd stop giving away crappy headphones and PSUs that only cause more waste, but I don't see that happening.
6) Then you have poor BT headphones because the technology works great with Apple devices, especially their headphones with the W-series chip. Do you not see that they're moving toward BT headphones?
7) No, they don't have to make "3 versions." They can include adapters, or not address that market at all. While you claim this is some dongle you need to disconnect every time you take off your headphones the reality is that people (like me) with wired headphones that they like just put the adapter and left it. It's the tightest fit for a 3.5mm jack I've ever seen and even helps prevent them from getting tangled from that slight extra weight at the end. Android-based vendors are moving toward USB-C for audio. This will continue to move in that direction so I would suggest coming to terms with the 3.5mm jack going away in future smartphones or buy up all the old kit you can.
8) Your arguments remind me of what Apple started to remove the ODD, but you don't hear much about it because people who don't like change have moved on. The same thing will happen with the 3.5mm headphone jack, too. But really it shouldn't be an issue for you because there's nothing you can do about it outside of not getting Apple's latest iPhones. Vote with your wallet.
I do agree that Apple was a little quick to drop the headphone jack without offering complete solutions to replace it, like the ability to share a wireless BT connection with someone, or inexplicably the ability to use a pair of Lightning headphones on a MacBook (I wish I could carry around an adapter!), or any non-iOS device. But the reality is, if Apple, or any corporation for that matter waited until everything was in place to drop old technology in favor of new, nothing would ever move forward.