First look: Apple's new 9.7-inch iPad with Apple Pencil support

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 102
    The keynote video is well worth watching:

    https://www.apple.com/apple-events/march-2018/
    edited March 2018 watto_cobra
  • Reply 42 of 102
    A10... I guess Apple need to keep a difference to justify the price of the Pro. I am not sure, but it seems logical that it would cost them less to only produce A11 instead of 2 different CPU.


    Or...

    Using a processor only one generation old helps keep the cost of the entire device down, making it that much more attractive to the educational types.  How many K-12 students need the latest and greatest processor, or camera?  The inclusion of the better screen and pencil support are reasonable, as both of those things make usage perceptibly more pleasant.  With the types of apps used by the schools, most people won't notice the difference in processor; the speed will be governed by the slowest gear in the machine, i.e. the human.

    As for one CPU versus two, once the production line is set up, it's a matter of ROI, rather than a simple "what costs more" calculation.  As long as the profit margin from the A10 is as good as the A11, it's reasonable to use both, especially if it lets them offer a less expensive iPad model that isn't really any less capable, at least not in any way that most students will notice.

    fallenjtwatto_cobra
  • Reply 43 of 102
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 2,073member
    The keynote video is well worth watching:

    https://www.apple.com/apple-events/march-2018/
    I thought that this was Tim Cook's best presentation performance.   Seemed sincerely passionate (in a Tim Cook way).

    They really should hire the "Nailing it" kid.
  • Reply 44 of 102
    AI_liasAI_lias Posts: 429member
    mike54 said:
    Not impressed. A more recent CPU, but not the latest. Still has bluetooth 4.2. How much RAM? Apple Pencil and keyboard from Apple still very expensive. And no pointer support. So the only main difference is Apple Pencil support (CPU upgrade is a given). And how about a redesign to make it more rugged for schools? I expect more from this highly profitable company.
    I must say, when you put it in the education perspective, it's still not enough to dislodge the Chromebooks. Those have a real keyboard, and the iPads need even more money for a faux keyboard. As far as the pen, that's too expensive, too. As a normal consumer device, I'm glad the cheapest iPad supports the pen, but I'm not sure this was sufficient for Apple's education efforts.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 45 of 102
    Nameo_ said:
    There are two things that came to my mind when I heard the news about this budget iPad:

    1. I know Sammy’s Galaxy tablets are already dead, but I just want to recognize them: RIP Galxy tabs. 
    2. At this point, when the budget iPad packs all these features and performance while maintaining the price tag of $329, iPP pricing seems unreasonable and even a little ridiculous.

    At $649, it’s roughly 2x the price of the iPad 6th gen, and I just can’t justify that price gap. I hope this year’s iPP would bring enough enhancements to make me feel I was actually wrong.
    To be fair on the iPad Pro pricing, those devices are now a bit older. Chances are they will be updated fairly soon, putting them quite a step above this budget iPad. 
    The more egregious issue, in my opinion, is the ridiculous price of the iPad Mini. The mini 4 is only $29 less than the same storage 9.7"iPad. So for that $29 you get a bigger/better screen, faster processor, upgraded motion coprocessor, more ram, etc. The iPad Mini isn't even capable of shooting Live Photos. 
    Yes, it makes no sense to not kill the iPad mini or drop its price, or update it.  
  • Reply 46 of 102
    k2kwk2kw Posts: 2,073member
    So is the Apple Pencil no longer considered a “Pro” feature? Or will the next iPad Pro support a new version of the pencil that this iPad won’t?
    By adding the Pencil support to the regular iPad they have probably undercut iPadPro sales.

    The only reason I would buy an iPadPro now would be if it had Mouse or TrackPad support.
    Maybe they will announce that for the iPP and iOS 12 at WWDC along with the 
    rumored Marzipan project for macOS.   iOS 12 ideally would allow developers to add Mouse/Cursor support to iOS APPS 
    and that could then run in Mouse/cursor mode on the macOS.   Hopefully then one APP could then run on both OS's.
    Maybe that's how we get the HOME App to macOS.   Maybe that's why the ClassRoom App (beta) for macOS won't debut till WWDC.
    That's what I'm hoping.

    Hopefully they won't just limit the next iPP to adding FaceID and Talking Pooh.
  • Reply 47 of 102
    rogifan_newrogifan_new Posts: 4,297member
    k2kw said:
    So is the Apple Pencil no longer considered a “Pro” feature? Or will the next iPad Pro support a new version of the pencil that this iPad won’t?
    By adding the Pencil support to the regular iPad they have probably undercut iPadPro sales.

    The only reason I would buy an iPadPro now would be if it had Mouse or TrackPad support.
    Maybe they will announce that for the iPP and iOS 12 at WWDC along with the 
    rumored Marzipan project for macOS.   iOS 12 ideally would allow developers to add Mouse/Cursor support to iOS APPS 
    and that could then run in Mouse/cursor mode on the macOS.   Hopefully then one APP could then run on both OS's.
    Maybe that's how we get the HOME App to macOS.   Maybe that's why the ClassRoom App (beta) for macOS won't debut till WWDC.
    That's what I'm hoping.

    Hopefully they won't just limit the next iPP to adding FaceID and Talking Pooh.
    The reason I own a Pro is because I want the larger screen and 4GB RAM. Split screen multitasking sucks on smaller devices.
    fallenjt
  • Reply 48 of 102
    TomETomE Posts: 168member
    Just trying to provoke conversations re the new iPad for education and the possible relationship between product introduction and stock.
    If I really knew, we would not be having this conversation.  We would not care and would be on the Beach or in the Mountains some where.
    What we do know is that stock usually goes up prior to product launch and down afterwards after a less than overwhelming presentation.
    I think what we got yesterday was product and software improvements.  An iPad that will perhaps not break as easily and they had to replace it with a better one.  No way would Apple put current processors in the new lower cost replacement - they have the cost and production down on them.

    No, PickUrPoison, I really don't know why Google dropped.  Google dropped almost twice as much percentage wise as Apple.  I do like the Apple products, but I expect more.  Hopefully , We will see some even better Macs.  The ability to run iOS on an OSX box would be a dream; Either by emulation in a window or a A Series Co-Processor.

    I am most likely not buying the education model, but instead the new 10" iPad and a new Mac, not the larger iPad Pro - too heavy to hold easily with arthritis.  The Keyboard on my MacBook does not come up to the older MacBook Air or other Keyboards.  The small differences are small enough to cause me typing errors in every line.

    Since this launch date is over, will there be a relationship between the Product Introductions and the Stock Price.  Mr Market has already lowered the projected price by $2 per share.  As we near the next launch it will go up - Anticipation (perception) is a wonderful thing. We always expect more than it is.  A nice house in a Gated Subdivision is often an optical illusion.


  • Reply 49 of 102
    lvidallvidal Posts: 158member
    Honestly, this was an ultra boring event. I couldn't watch that video entirely without skipping all the time. That iPad update could have been announced through their website and a press note to the best news sites, papers and magazines. At $300 that iPad is far from budget for education. You still have to buy the pencil that doesn't come with it, also have to buy a keyboard because it is a must have accessory, a really good case and maybe pay for the Apple Care. So, we are talking about $700 or more here. If that's affordable... Doesn't Apple know that kids drop things all the time? That kids lose things all the time? That shiny iPad with its edge-to-edge glass display is too delicate for the kind of abuse they'll get from kids. And that Apple Pencil is TOO EXPENSIVE! for a thing your kid can lose too easy or break its lighting connector. Apple is clearly not in touch with reality here. That affordable and realistic iPad for education should be really good plastic casing with rubber bumper edges and a little gap front and back for the best drop protection out-of-the-box. Kids don't need shiny hardware, they need tough ones. It should come with the pencil, a tough and cheaper version of it ($30) that works exactly the same, and with a smart keyboard, because give me a break! This iPad doesn't even support the smart keyboard. This is a bad joke. An affordable iPad for education should be that bundle for $300 if they want to be competitive. But what I get from this announcement is that Apple doesn't want everybody to get their hands on their devices, but just the privileged ones. Clearly that's their vision. Also it isn't a worldwide plan. Normal schools around the world can't even think about the iPad as an education device, only the more expensive schools can ask their parents for it and can't get the iPad education discount. This is a shame. Apple is really an gigantic company that can do way better for almost everybody to get it touch with this technology. But it seems they can't accept making less money for the cause.
    edited March 2018 london11
  • Reply 50 of 102
    lvidal said:
    Honestly, this was an ultra boring event. I couldn't watch that video entirely without skipping all the time. That iPad update could have been announced through their website and a press note to the best news sites, papers and magazines. At $300 that iPad is far from budget for education. You still have to buy the pencil that doesn't come with it, also have to buy a keyboard because it is a must have accessory, a really good case and maybe pay for the Apple Care. So, we are talking about $700 or more here. If that's affordable... Doesn't Apple know that kids drop things all the time? That kids lose things all the time? That shiny iPad with its edge-to-edge glass display is too delicate for the kind of abuse they'll get from kids. And that Apple Pencil is TOO EXPENSIVE! for a thing your kid can lose too easy or break its lighting connector. Apple is clearly not in touch with reality here. That affordable and realistic iPad for education should be really good plastic casing with rubber bumper edges and a little gap front and back for the best drop protection out-of-the-box. Kids don't need shiny hardware, they need tough ones. It should come with the pencil, a tough and cheaper version of it ($30) that works exactly the same, and with a smart keyboard, because give me a break! This iPad doesn't even support the smart keyboard. This is a bad joke. An affordable iPad for education should be that bundle for $300 if they want to be competitive. But what I get from this announcement is that Apple doesn't want everybody to get their hands on their devices, but just the privileged ones. Clearly that's their vision. Also it isn't a worldwide plan. Normal schools around the world can't even think about the iPad as an education device, only the more expensive schools can ask their parents for it and can't get the iPad education discount. This is a shame. Apple is really an gigantic company that can do way better for almost everybody to get it touch with this technology. But it seems they can't accept making less money for the cause.
    You're absolutely right, this didn't need an event... perhaps some communications to schools directly or additionally to a launch on the website and a couple of ads. And yes at $300 why is everyone acting as if it's cheap?? But then again, the iPod Touch sells for $200 ! 
    lvidal
  • Reply 51 of 102
    gatorguygatorguy Posts: 23,473member
    tmay said:
    RonnnieO said:
    TomE said:
    What I see at this point is my stock dropped to day.  Mr Market did not like what Apple did; so, people sold the stock.  There has to be something else.  But wait there is more. I would expect no less than what Apple did today.  It is 1+ year old parts with a long over due software update.  
    There had better be more pretty soon for the higher end.  Apple can do better.  They are over confident - I wonder if the original talent and drive has some been lost.  They have to move fast because everyone wants a piece of their cheese.  They cannot tell us what they are doing - they must show it.   I don't care for the competing products, but they have not left the scene yet.
    For your information the whole market sold off today and Aapl fared better than all the big names on the Nasdaq.
    How about this for a bit of entertainment:
     
    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/apple-education-event-shows-company-hasnt-learned-its-lesson-2018-03-27

    So, The Market wants Apple, who almost certainly makes more revenue, and income, in K-12 than Google, (sans all that data harvesting of course) to compete for greater marketshare by lowering prices.

    That's an unsurprisingly familiar, and repetitious, refrain coming from The Market. Why are we supposed to listen to them; in the long run, they are almost always wrong about Apple.
    Counter to what the MarketWatch author has to say I think Apple absolutely understands they can't win in education with a closed ecosystem so they're going to do something out of character: They're going to invite Google in along with all their educational tools.
    canukstorm
  • Reply 52 of 102
    "stylus? Who wants a stylus? Yuck! No one wants a stylus"
  • Reply 53 of 102
    AJ MAC25 said:
    Maybe I am just old, but for me, the magic of Apple died with Steve. 
    Yep must be. Nostalgia is a helluva drug. 
    No it did, as much as hate to admit it. Today more than ever his combative style with the media and others in Silicon valley is severely missed.
    patchythepirate
  • Reply 54 of 102
    mike1mike1 Posts: 3,081member
    Wow. Lots of trolls in this thread.

    Is the camera in an iPad really a big deal for a lot of people?
    edited March 2018 london11StrangeDayswatto_cobra
  • Reply 55 of 102
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    mike54 said:
    Not impressed. A more recent CPU, but not the latest. Still has bluetooth 4.2. How much RAM? Apple Pencil and keyboard from Apple still very expensive. And no pointer support. So the only main difference is Apple Pencil support (CPU upgrade is a given). And how about a redesign to make it more rugged for schools? I expect more from this highly profitable company.
    The previous generation CPU is appropriate to keep down bill of materials costs.  So, makes sense.

    I’ll bet the RAM is matched to the CPU.  3GB for the A10 Fusion.  Apple likely knows best.  So, makes sense.

    On the subject of no pointer support, well, it’s a touch screen interface.  Tablets are designed for a different user interaction paradigm.  So, makes sense.

    No need to ruggedize the device as there are perfectly suitable cases to protect it.  Why have that capability built into the device, necessitating a whole new engineering effort and separate SKUs.  So, as is makes sense.

    Making sense in their design, engineering, and marketing is what I expect from any company.  Apple is one of few that deliver.


    The arguments against "pointer support" on the iPad are primarily ideological rather than technical.   The fact is:  iOS was created by stripping that support from MacOS.  And, that was done because it was simply not needed on a tiny 3.5" iPhone screen that valued CPU/battery efficiency above all else. 

    Today, (iPad) screens are now the size of laptop screens and the processors that drive them are as powerful (or more!) than many laptop processors  So, the technical reasons for keeping iPads cursorless are fast fading away.   And, more importantly, it is painting Apple into an "also ran" corner -- which is becoming acutely obvious in the education market where they are being overrun with Chromebooks.   An article in CNBC said it well:

    "Venture capitalist Gene Munster said iPad is strongest in grades kindergarten through fifth grade while Chromebooks are more popular among older students in middle and high school, when activities like essays and spreadsheets come into play."

    Very simply, a cursorless iPad with only a touchscreen interface is mostly restricted to play and creative / artistic pursuits.  While it can do some limited serious work like word processing and spreadsheets, it is not well suited to those tasks. To perform those tasks well you need a high quality external keyboard with a mouse or a touchpad.  The iPad has the keyboard -- now it needs to the touchpad/mouse as well.

    If Apple is to remain competitive in markets such as education they have three choices:
    1)  Give the iPad a cursor
    2)  Produce a sub $500 MacBook
    3)  Produce a "SafariBook"

    Of the three, the first is the easiest and will produce the best overall product.  (And frankly is probably the only viable solution)
    Despite the screams of anguish from the ideological elite that it's a dreaded "H Y B R I D", adding a cursor to the iPad takes NOTHING away from the iPad.  Like split screen, an external keyboard and a file system, it just adds to its power and functionality...

    Frankly, I think if Steve were still with us the iPad would have had a cursor long ago -- because Steve was not constrained by ideology, biases and convention.   And frankly, he wouldn't accept "also ran".  Instead he made every product the best he could make it without unnecessary compromise.
    edited March 2018 muthuk_vanalingamlvidal
  • Reply 56 of 102
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    TomE said:
    What I see at this point is my stock dropped to day.  Mr Market did not like what Apple did; so, people sold the stock.  There has to be something else.  But wait there is more. I would expect no less than what Apple did today.  It is 1+ year old parts with a long over due software update.  
    There had better be more pretty soon for the higher end.  Apple can do better.  They are over confident - I wonder if the original talent and drive has some been lost.  They have to move fast because everyone wants a piece of their cheese.  They cannot tell us what they are doing - they must show it.   I don't care for the competing products, but they have not left the scene yet.
    Mr. Market never likes an Apple event, because they have mythical visions in their head about every one of them updating every Apple product ever.
    True....
    But this decline in Apple Stock may have had more to do with Goldman Sacks issuing a caution that iPhone sales in the next two quarters were projected to be lower than expected (while iPhone ownership increased).

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/28/goldman-sachs-slashes-apple-iphone-sales-estimates.html

    edited March 2018
  • Reply 57 of 102
    I thought I heard during the presentation something about multiple students being able to sign onto a single iPad.   Was that for school only (where they're accessing a school app) -- or does it mean a multi-user iPad where each member of the family could use it?
    The education Shared iPad feature introduced in iOS 9.3 doesn't work like multiple users on a Mac. It loads server side profiles from a school's local network infrastructure. If you're wondering why an iPad doesn't support swapping between various family members' accounts on the device itself, look how much content each user would have (GB of email, photos, apps, games) and divide the internal storage by the number of users you think it should support.
    GeorgeBMacmacxpresswatto_cobra
  • Reply 58 of 102
    AJ MAC25 said:
    Maybe I am just old, but for me, the magic of Apple died with Steve. 
    Sure I miss his showmanship and attitude but I am just as satisfied if not more with Apple products right now. The X, Airpods and iMac are a fantastic part of my day, every day. The ease and fun of sending money with Apple Pay / Messages integration is a perfect example of Apple elegance. As far as advertising: The Spike Jones / FKA Twigs promo for HomePod is thrilling and innovative. The watch promos I'm seeing in my instagram feed are simple and gorgeous. I laughed out loud at the woman doing aerobics that turned into an animated pattern which then turned into animated wrapping paper for the box. Apple might be more magical than ever right now.
    edited March 2018 netmagemacxpresswatto_cobra
  • Reply 59 of 102
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,259member
    bookemd said:
    AJ MAC25 said:
    Maybe I am just old, but for me, the magic of Apple died with Steve. 
    Yep must be. Nostalgia is a helluva drug. 
    No it did, as much as hate to admit it. Today more than ever his combative style with the media and others in Silicon valley is severely missed.
    Nope. Being combative wasn’t Apple’s magic. Great new product is the magic, and Apple is delivering. The X, iPad Pro, Watch Series 3, AirPods, rMBP, all the finest computing devices I’ve ever owned. iMP looks amazing too. My friend’s HomePod sounds great and I can’t wait to get one when budget permits. 
    GeorgeBMacnetmagePickUrPoisonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 60 of 102
    netmagenetmage Posts: 314member
    netrox said:
    I am not understanding that at all. I can write on PDF files on iPad Pro (IBook and GoodNotes) and the annotations will also be updated as well.
    The difference being you don’t commonly edit PDFs and change their contents. If you create a Pages document, annotate with Pencil, then update the document by adding a page of text, the Smart Annotation will stay associated with the original text that was annotated. 
    watto_cobra
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