New rumor claims 2018 iPad Pros will be smaller, drop headphone jacks

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Comments

  • Reply 41 of 83
    StrangeDaysStrangeDays Posts: 12,257member

    wizard69 said:

    jdw said:
    That notch is quite unsightly on an iPhone X, but on an iPad it's just unthinkably unnecessary.  The quest to shrink bezels to nothingness is driving this insanity, and it is NOT "insanely great" either.  Bezels should be as thick as that notch so there is no notch at all on an iPad.  A notch is just not necessary, especially since you grab the device with your entire hands in a very different way than you do with an iPhone.

    There once was a time when Apple knew better than I did about design.  There was time when they knew better what I wanted than I did, and when I saw an Apple product announcement I was filled with joy and excitement.  That joy has not entirely vanished but in recent years I am more annoyed than happy with what Apple kicks out.  It's either Johnny Ive minimalism taken to an extreme (notches, butterfly keyboards, missing SD card slots, etc.), or perhaps it's Johnny Ive apathy.  Maybe it is the lack of fanny-kicking by Steve Jobs.  Or maybe it is all of the above.  But as long as we keep buying their stuff and worshiping all of Apple's design decisions with criticism or question, there is no incentive for them to change course and design something better.  If Apple continues down this path, I shutter to think what kind of designs we'll have 10 years hence.
    The stupid moves like the headphone jack likely have little to do with Ive.   When Apple puts a custom port in a machine it is there for lock in.   Vendors dont have to sign up to use the analog jack, lighting though is controlled by Apple and thus you have to be in Apples good graces too use it.    Lighting gives Apple the opportunity to screwcover both the consummer and the third party supplier.  
    Paranoid nonsense born of ignorance. The Lightning port was implemented before USB-C was a word. It doesn’t “lock in” because there’s nothing to lock in. You can buy non-Apple cables anywhere. Removal of the legacy analog headphone jack came much later, and again you are free to use anyone’s headphones, wired or wireless, not just Apple’s.

    You seem to think you’re being screwed a lot. It’s quite odd. If you’re unhappy, you should try to make changes in life to make yourself happier. I guess PCs and Androids are a first step....?
    elijahgJWSCRayz2016netmagewilliamlondon
  • Reply 42 of 83
    elijahgelijahg Posts: 2,650member
    dewme said:
    Dropping the conventional headphone jack makes sense to bring the iPad into alignment with the iPhone. The question of whether to pack your dongle or not to pack your dongle to accommodate conventional hookups should apply to all of your iDevices. Consistency is king. Macs should logically be next.
    ...and plug it in to the Lightning port on which particular Mac, exactly?
    edited July 2018
  • Reply 43 of 83
    thttht Posts: 4,631member
    FYI, if you do some basic math on the reported dimensions of: The 10.5-inch model will go from 250.6 x 174.1 x 6.1 millimeters to 247.5 x 178.7 x 6according to Japanese site Macotakara. The 12.9-inch device will allegedly switch from 305.7 x 220.6 x 6.9 millimeters to 280 x 215 x 6.4.

    The dimensions of the 12.9” model checks out with a nearly uniform bezel or margin of 9 mm, give or take half a mm. The height of the Face ID notch is about 8 mm on the iPhone X. Enough thickness for the Face ID module, but the rumored thickness of the 12.9” model is 6.4 mm. The iPhone X is 7.7 mm. That’s a lot that has to be thinned down, but if it’s only the front camera that drove the thickness on the iPhone X, a lower MP front cam will be thinner. So, they don’t have to have a notch for the 12.9” if it uses a 12.9” 4:3 display, from a technical perspective.

    The dimensions of the 11” model is just FUBAR though. It doesn’t make any sense. A form factor with a uniform thickness bezel or margin would need to have a display aspect ratio 247.5/178.7 = 1.39, or 4.2:3, not 4:3. If it is a 11” 4:3 display with the reported case dimensions, it’ll look like this:


    The normal 10.5” on the left. The rumored 11” on the right assuming a 4:3 aspect ratio. I had to reduce the corner radius otherwise it would look ugly. Obviously does not have uniform thickness bezels, and would have bezels of 12 mm and 6 mm. No need for a notch if is portrait oriented, and 2 or 3 mm of more bezel in landscape doesn’t merit much argument imo. Bigger issue is the 6 mm thickness. It would mean much smaller front cameras. 

  • Reply 44 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    MisterKit said:
    I don’t like the idea on not having a headphone jack. I think of it as a line output. Not a headphone out. There are too many audio/MIDI applications where the Lightning port is needed for MIDI input and it would not be able to simultaneously serve as a line out.
    This is what i dont understan about Apple.   They actually pursue industries such as the music industry and then a couple of years later screw the industry over by ""updating"" its hardware into unusable configurations.  

    From my perspective taking away the analog connecto should only happen if a more versatile solution replaces it.   In my mind that means unencumbered USD-C ports.    Unencummbired because many audio hardware companies are hardly large enough to stay in business much less support Apple via MiFi. 

    So an ideal change for IPad would be two USB-C ports.   One to effectively replace the lighting port ond one the analog port.    Such a change would be huge for iPad opening it up for uses in a variety of industries.   The fewer ports it has the more of a toy it becomes.  

    By the way i really believe Apples MiFi program is a massive mistake!!!
    williamlondon
  • Reply 45 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member
    No headphone jack, cool. That's one more Apple product off my bi-annual shopping list, saving money just keeps getting easier. :)
    Sadly that is the way i feel.  If we dont get something better in return what is the point.  
    williamlondon
  • Reply 46 of 83
    wizard69wizard69 Posts: 13,377member

    wizard69 said:

    jdw said:
    That notch is quite unsightly on an iPhone X, but on an iPad it's just unthinkably unnecessary.  The quest to shrink bezels to nothingness is driving this insanity, and it is NOT "insanely great" either.  Bezels should be as thick as that notch so there is no notch at all on an iPad.  A notch is just not necessary, especially since you grab the device with your entire hands in a very different way than you do with an iPhone.

    There once was a time when Apple knew better than I did about design.  There was time when they knew better what I wanted than I did, and when I saw an Apple product announcement I was filled with joy and excitement.  That joy has not entirely vanished but in recent years I am more annoyed than happy with what Apple kicks out.  It's either Johnny Ive minimalism taken to an extreme (notches, butterfly keyboards, missing SD card slots, etc.), or perhaps it's Johnny Ive apathy.  Maybe it is the lack of fanny-kicking by Steve Jobs.  Or maybe it is all of the above.  But as long as we keep buying their stuff and worshiping all of Apple's design decisions with criticism or question, there is no incentive for them to change course and design something better.  If Apple continues down this path, I shutter to think what kind of designs we'll have 10 years hence.
    The stupid moves like the headphone jack likely have little to do with Ive.   When Apple puts a custom port in a machine it is there for lock in.   Vendors dont have to sign up to use the analog jack, lighting though is controlled by Apple and thus you have to be in Apples good graces too use it.    Lighting gives Apple the opportunity to screwcover both the consummer and the third party supplier.  
    Paranoid nonsense born of ignorance. The Lightning port was implemented before USB-C was a word. It doesn’t “lock in” because there’s nothing to lock in. You can buy non-Apple cables anywhere. Removal of the legacy analog headphone jack came much later, and again you are free to use anyone’s headphones, wired or wireless, not just Apple’s.

    You seem to think you’re being screwed a lot. It’s quite odd. If you’re unhappy, you should try to make changes in life to make yourself happier. I guess PCs and Androids are a first step....?
    Apparently you have never heard of Apples MiFi program and the authentication required to use lighting.  It helps to understand the issues.  
    williamlondon
  • Reply 47 of 83
    CheeseFreezeCheeseFreeze Posts: 1,100member
    These will be the least kids friendly iPads since the inception of the iPad. As a dad of two I know from practical use

    With thick rubber protectors parents use to keep the iPad from damaging;

    1. ...The rubber frame you put the iPhone ‘in’ will obstruct the actual iPad screen (now: covering the bezel)

    2. ...Kids will have to swipe instead of click a home button to return to the home screen, which is much harder for kids to pull off.

    also;

    - No headphone jacket? There are no good kid friendly wireless headphone products on the market now. The ones I see are Bluetooth (too hard for kids to connect), and the few options out there are adult targeted and/or way, way more expensive.

    - The iPad will have to rely more on unintentional gesture detection. Kids lack fine hand coordination and will be more likely to rest their hands on an iPad. With iOS12 and iPhoneX, the OS much more relies on a numerous amount of swipe gestures to invoke certain OS functionality or panes, which previously was partially covered by the home button. Removing bezels won’t help unintentional gestures either.
    edited July 2018
  • Reply 48 of 83
    thttht Posts: 4,631member
    These will be the least kids friendly iPads since the inception of the iPad. As a dad of two I know from practical use

    With thick rubber protectors parents use to keep the iPad from damaging;

    1. ...The rubber frame you put the iPhone ‘in’ will obstruct the actual iPad screen (now: covering the bezel)

    2. ...Kids will have to swipe instead of click a home button to return to the home screen, which is much harder for kids to pull off.

    also;

    - No headphone jacket? There are no good kid friendly wireless headphone products on the market now. The ones I see are Bluetooth (too hard for kids to connect), and the few options out there are adult targeted and/or way, way more expensive.

    - The iPad will have to rely more on unintentional gesture detection. Kids lack fine hand coordination and will be more likely to rest their hands on an iPad. With iOS12 and iPhoneX, the OS much more relies on a numerous amount of swipe gestures to invoke certain OS functionality or panes, which previously was partially covered by the home button. Removing bezels won’t help unintentional gestures either.

    These are iPad Pro devices. 

    Apple sells a very nice 6th gen iPad that is Pencil compatible for $330. That’s definitely the device for younger kids, plus whatever protective case is deemed necessary.

    I wouldn’t get an iPad Pro for a “kid” until they are in 6th or 7th grade when they begin to take class notes and have more involved homework. The 6th gen iPad will still serve this purpose admirably, but at some point in time, a longish paper or largish project will need to be done, and therefore a larger screen will really be beneficial. Maybe 10th grade?
    netmage
  • Reply 49 of 83
    I just realized from this story there's a headphone port on my iPad pro after all this time. I assumed there wasn't from using the iPhone with an adapter
  • Reply 50 of 83
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 33,407member
    netrox said:
    jdw said:
    That notch is quite unsightly on an iPhone X, but on an iPad it's just unthinkably unnecessary.  The quest to shrink bezels to nothingness is driving this insanity, and it is NOT "insanely great" either.  Bezels should be as thick as that notch so there is no notch at all on an iPad.  A notch is just not necessary, especially since you grab the device with your entire hands in a very different way than you do with an iPhone.

    There once was a time when Apple knew better than I did about design.  There was time when they knew better what I wanted than I did, and when I saw an Apple product announcement I was filled with joy and excitement.  That joy has not entirely vanished but in recent years I am more annoyed than happy with what Apple kicks out.  It's either Johnny Ive minimalism taken to an extreme (notches, butterfly keyboards, missing SD card slots, etc.), or perhaps it's Johnny Ive apathy.  Maybe it is the lack of fanny-kicking by Steve Jobs.  Or maybe it is all of the above.  But as long as we keep buying their stuff and worshiping all of Apple's design decisions with criticism or question, there is no incentive for them to change course and design something better.  If Apple continues down this path, I shutter to think what kind of designs we'll have 10 years hence.
    I am betting there will be a notch on iPad. And a notch will become the norm for many devices, not just Apple. Rumors of new Android phones are showing notches as well. 
     
    This design is “notch” the iPad for me.
  • Reply 51 of 83
    thttht Posts: 4,631member
    dewme said:
    Dropping the conventional headphone jack makes sense to bring the iPad into alignment with the iPhone. The question of whether to pack your dongle or not to pack your dongle to accommodate conventional hookups should apply to all of your iDevices. Consistency is king. Macs should logically be next.
    I thought they dropped it from the iPhone for space reasons and to make the device more waterproof. iPad has plenty of space and isn’t likely being used around water so removing it makes no sense. I have some decent JBL wireless earbuds but when I use them while watching video on YouTube for example the audio and video are never synced up. Not a great experience.
    If the new 11”, or the 10.5” replacement, is 6 mm thick and the display extends to all sides iPhone X style, there won’t be enough thickness to accommodate the housing of a 3.5 mm audio port. The display is going to be 2 to 3 mm thick, the case itself will be up to 1 mm thick. At 6 mm, it may not be thick enough to accommodate a 3.5 mm audio port.

    Apple actually has patent on a 3/4th housing for 3.5 mm jacks, ie, about 1/4 of the audio jack is exposed to the open. There’s definitely a holding it wrong scenario there when a finger can bridge the contacts on the jack.
  • Reply 52 of 83
    CheeseFreezeCheeseFreeze Posts: 1,100member
    tht said:
    These will be the least kids friendly iPads since the inception of the iPad. As a dad of two I know from practical use

    With thick rubber protectors parents use to keep the iPad from damaging;

    1. ...The rubber frame you put the iPhone ‘in’ will obstruct the actual iPad screen (now: covering the bezel)

    2. ...Kids will have to swipe instead of click a home button to return to the home screen, which is much harder for kids to pull off.

    also;

    - No headphone jacket? There are no good kid friendly wireless headphone products on the market now. The ones I see are Bluetooth (too hard for kids to connect), and the few options out there are adult targeted and/or way, way more expensive.

    - The iPad will have to rely more on unintentional gesture detection. Kids lack fine hand coordination and will be more likely to rest their hands on an iPad. With iOS12 and iPhoneX, the OS much more relies on a numerous amount of swipe gestures to invoke certain OS functionality or panes, which previously was partially covered by the home button. Removing bezels won’t help unintentional gestures either.

    These are iPad Pro devices. 

    Apple sells a very nice 6th gen iPad that is Pencil compatible for $330. That’s definitely the device for younger kids, plus whatever protective case is deemed necessary.

    I wouldn’t get an iPad Pro for a “kid” until they are in 6th or 7th grade when they begin to take class notes and have more involved homework. The 6th gen iPad will still serve this purpose admirably, but at some point in time, a longish paper or largish project will need to be done, and therefore a larger screen will really be beneficial. Maybe 10th grade?
    Good point. I should have clarified that I referred to “the future direction of Apple” because it is not unrealistic Apple will go for a similar route with their non-Pro devices later after introducing these changes for their Pro devices (albeit with a lower cost feature set). This is also reinforced by iOS developer builds referring to “modern iPad” devices).
  • Reply 53 of 83
    dewmedewme Posts: 4,545member
    elijahg said:
    dewme said:
    Dropping the conventional headphone jack makes sense to bring the iPad into alignment with the iPhone. The question of whether to pack your dongle or not to pack your dongle to accommodate conventional hookups should apply to all of your iDevices. Consistency is king. Macs should logically be next.
    ...and plug it in to the Lightning port on which particular Mac, exactly?
    Wireless audio across the board ... addition by subtraction.

    Lightning port is for charging iDevices. Never want to see it on a Mac.


  • Reply 54 of 83
    entropysentropys Posts: 3,708member
    I find it hard to believe Apple would require the iPad to be vertical to unlock. That would be very user unfriendly.  For his reason alone I am calling BS on this rumour. Would not the landscape implementation be a software issue? 
    On the smart connector issue, Apple really needs to either ditch it altogether (because it isn’t really utilised by much) or shake things up a bit to encourage peripheral uptake. I think adding a smart connector on the base in vertical mode makes sense once you have removed the home button. But it should be an addition, not replacing the one in landscape. I am not sure it should be alongside the lightning port though.  If you are removing the headphone port, peripherals management could get a bit tricky if the smart connector and the lightning port are side by side.

    Edit: I don’t use the headphone port on the iPad. This is because I use the earphones that come with my iPhone.  With a lightning connector.
    edited July 2018
  • Reply 55 of 83
    bohlerbohler Posts: 37member
    I would like to see a larger ipadPro...14inch would be great...I‘m using the ipad instead of a laptop and a larger screen would cleary help with  lot of tasks...
    tht
  • Reply 56 of 83
    tallest skiltallest skil Posts: 43,399member
    Folio said:
    Do people expect Apple to notch laptops and the iMac too, as part of its signature move? Come on.
    Of course they will. The notch means a smaller laptop bezel, which means a smaller laptop, which means less power and less battery, but who the fuck cares as long as it’s smaller, right? This is Apple, after all.
  • Reply 57 of 83
    netroxnetrox Posts: 1,266member
    I predict that future MacBooks will embrace the notch as well. It's all about minimalism. And considering that Mojave has dark mode, the notch will be virtually invisible. Just accept that notch is part of the menu bar. And even the notch is "part" of the top menu in iOS. 

    Embrace the notch. It took me a while. 
  • Reply 58 of 83
    kiowavtkiowavt Posts: 88member
    I am a little confused.  The larger Pro is losing 5.6mm in length, but the smaller of the two is gaining length??  This seems unlikely to me. 250.6 x 174.1 x 6.1 becomes 247.5 x 178.7 x 6 or gains 3.6mm in length?  More than it loses in the two other dimensions (2.5mm and .1mm)?  I suspect something is garbled here.  
  • Reply 59 of 83
    thttht Posts: 4,631member
    kiowavt said:
    I am a little confused.  The larger Pro is losing 5.6mm in length, but the smaller of the two is gaining length??  This seems unlikely to me. 250.6 x 174.1 x 6.1 becomes 247.5 x 178.7 x 6 or gains 3.6mm in length?  More than it loses in the two other dimensions (2.5mm and .1mm)?  I suspect something is garbled here.  
    Prior rumors have the 10.5” model becoming an 11” model. So, if in portrait, the width has to grow, but the height can decrease.
  • Reply 60 of 83
    I hope the Apple pencil 2 comes has a smart connector and magnet so it can charge while clipped to the side of the ipad and doesnt have to stick awkwardly out the side of the lightning port anymore. That’d be a cool change.
    netmage
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