Ralph Nader once again assails Apple's stock buybacks

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Comments

  • Reply 61 of 90
    dysamoriadysamoria Posts: 2,333member
    Someone please explain to me: What is it about Apple that attracts so many libertarians, Cold War propaganda repeaters, and anti-government conspiracy theorist commentators?

    Is it the money? Do they idolize Apple for their stockpiles of money, hoping some of it will fall out of Apple pockets into their own? Are these the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" of the audience?

    What attracts the rabid attention and puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents (on a forum that says "don't do that" and even shuts down comments to avoid it on certain stories), who then also go on to mock any and all criticism aimed at a company that's virtually one of their ideological opponents to begin with?

    It goes from "how dare Tim Cook do socially-positive things! Stop wasting Apple's time on politics" ... and then it jumps to defending Apple's financial activities from any and all critics, while using cartoonishly politically extreme language to mock said critics. So, it's not okay for Apple to be political, but these commentators can use extreme political rhetoric to defend Apple's financial behaviors?

    Is it all the money that lets them ignore the socially-left behavior of Apple? Do they think Apple's left-leaning pro-society ideological public image is just a cynical act; that Apple is really just a pure profit machine that cares nothing about society?

    I mean, they may have a point there, if that's the thinking. Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands. The company is somewhat schizophrenic in its ideologies because laissez faire capitalism is incompatible with pro-society behavior.

    Either way, please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else.
    dewmeGeorgeBMac
  • Reply 62 of 90
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,497member
    j238 said:
    The economy is increasingly favoring owners over workers. That's not about to change. No one wants to invest in a company that isn't focused on investment return. Stock ownership should be more available to people with small amounts of assets and people with low-wage jobs should have an option to save some of their wages in equities. Capitalism marches onwards, but we need ways to make it work for everyone.
    What the hell are you taking about? It doesn’t take a lot of money to get started investing in stocks and people chasing fast bucks these days are all playing in the crypto space, not stocks.

    i started out with very little money in the stock market in the pre-dotcom crash days. I ended up investing a lot and losing a lot. That was a valuable lesson. People can jump in and start trading or create a “fantasy stock portfolio” and track it on their own before they choose to use real money.
    edited August 2018
  • Reply 63 of 90
    dysamoria said:
    ...libertarians, ...propaganda repeaters, ...conspiracy theorist commentators... idolize Apple for their stockpiles of money... "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" ... puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, ... using cartoonishly politically extreme language ....Is it all the money....
    Yikes.
    JWSCdocno42
  • Reply 64 of 90
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,497member
    horvatic said:
    Apple spends a lot on recycling and all forms of clean energy. More than any other company in the world for that matter. They could do more for employees though.
    No.
  • Reply 65 of 90
    So I am supposed to take the advice of a guy who still uses a typewriter in 2018!! End of subject!
    JWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 66 of 90
    dewmedewme Posts: 2,193member
    There just HAS to be a self driving Corvair Uber somewhere in Ralph's future...
    mdwychoffGG1watto_cobra
  • Reply 67 of 90
    frankiefrankie Posts: 373member
    1983 said:
    Another hard left lanky spewing their ill-informed biased vitriol against a successful ‘Capitalist’ company. I bet like Sanders he thinks the Iranian regime is the bees knees and Socialists should rule the world. I wonder if he’ll agree to appear on Iranian state TV like Britain’s Corbyn was happy to do going on an anti-establishment tirade. Don’t get me wrong I’m no Trump fanboy. The guy’s a douche and a bully. But G.. help the world if as a reaction to Trumps antics, Socialists like Sanders and Corbyn ultimately come to power. It’ll be the 1970s in the UK all over again. Why don’t people vote in experienced normal ‘middle of the road’ politicians anymore? (rhetorical) I know they can be slippery too (politics always has been, it’s the nature of the beast) but at least they’re not fanatics. The larger the middle-class (socio-economically that is) the more stable and tolerant a society is. That’s historically just how it is, and that hasn’t changed no matter what the hard-left and hard-right are trying (with scary success it increasingly seems) to convince everybody into believing. 
    America had the largest middle class and was most successful from the 50's to the70',s when union membership was it's highest and companies actually paid taxes.  People like Nadar and Sanders are democratic socialists and want exactly that.  Maybe you aren't actually listening to that they're saying?

    I don't think anyone wants actually soclialsm, which is just a BS scare tactic word thrown around by the right wingers, they just want us to get back to a world where we have exactly those things listed above, which you apparently agree with.  This country has gone was too far to the right.  Right now 6 people own as much wealth as half of the entire USA. 
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 68 of 90
    steven n.steven n. Posts: 1,127member
    dysamoria said:
    Someone please explain to me: What is it about Apple that attracts so many libertarians, Cold War propaganda repeaters, and anti-government conspiracy theorist commentators?

    Is it the money? Do they idolize Apple for their stockpiles of money, hoping some of it will fall out of Apple pockets into their own? Are these the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" of the audience?

    What attracts the rabid attention and puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents (on a forum that says "don't do that" and even shuts down comments to avoid it on certain stories), who then also go on to mock any and all criticism aimed at a company that's virtually one of their ideological opponents to begin with?

    It goes from "how dare Tim Cook do socially-positive things! Stop wasting Apple's time on politics" ... and then it jumps to defending Apple's financial activities from any and all critics, while using cartoonishly politically extreme language to mock said critics. So, it's not okay for Apple to be political, but these commentators can use extreme political rhetoric to defend Apple's financial behaviors?

    Is it all the money that lets them ignore the socially-left behavior of Apple? Do they think Apple's left-leaning pro-society ideological public image is just a cynical act; that Apple is really just a pure profit machine that cares nothing about society?

    I mean, they may have a point there, if that's the thinking. Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands. The company is somewhat schizophrenic in its ideologies because laissez faire capitalism is incompatible with pro-society behavior.

    Either way, please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else.
    So, let me get this right. If people don't have your opinion of the world, then they must be wrong? Sounds like a solid left view point of the world.
    SpamSandwichJWSC
  • Reply 69 of 90
    To all those (and Ralph Nader) saying Apple should do more for their employees, I ask this:

    Did you know retail employees now get vested shares in Apple? I didn't know that until yesterday. Way better than what I got ten years ago working at Apple (while Steve was around I might add).

    So is it possible some people should research the facts more before jumping to conclusions? And maybe Apple is doing something for the company besides buying back shares for themselves?
    JWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 70 of 90
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 5,269member
    steven n. said:
    dysamoria said:
    Someone please explain to me: What is it about Apple that attracts so many libertarians, Cold War propaganda repeaters, and anti-government conspiracy theorist commentators?

    Is it the money? Do they idolize Apple for their stockpiles of money, hoping some of it will fall out of Apple pockets into their own? Are these the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" of the audience?

    What attracts the rabid attention and puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents (on a forum that says "don't do that" and even shuts down comments to avoid it on certain stories), who then also go on to mock any and all criticism aimed at a company that's virtually one of their ideological opponents to begin with?

    It goes from "how dare Tim Cook do socially-positive things! Stop wasting Apple's time on politics" ... and then it jumps to defending Apple's financial activities from any and all critics, while using cartoonishly politically extreme language to mock said critics. So, it's not okay for Apple to be political, but these commentators can use extreme political rhetoric to defend Apple's financial behaviors?

    Is it all the money that lets them ignore the socially-left behavior of Apple? Do they think Apple's left-leaning pro-society ideological public image is just a cynical act; that Apple is really just a pure profit machine that cares nothing about society?

    I mean, they may have a point there, if that's the thinking. Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands. The company is somewhat schizophrenic in its ideologies because laissez faire capitalism is incompatible with pro-society behavior.

    Either way, please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else.
    So, let me get this right. If people don't have your opinion of the world, then they must be wrong? Sounds like a solid left view point of the world.
    No, that's not what he said at all...  But nice troll!
  • Reply 71 of 90
    crabbycrabby Posts: 38member
    Ralph. You were wrong about the Corvair, though you did kill it. I heard you speak on campus 1971 and of the three topics with which I was very familiar- you were just wrong on the facts.    It’s frustrating to share an outlook on the world of safety, cleanness, and justice with someone so well known and so often wrong. Oh- and you cost Al the presidency. Go away
    DAalsethJWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 72 of 90
    bbhbbh Posts: 79member
    I wish ole' Ralph would just go away. He still refuses to admit his siphoning off of votes helped, in a big way, to get Bush elected. 
    JWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 73 of 90
    steven n.steven n. Posts: 1,127member
    steven n. said:
    dysamoria said:
    Someone please explain to me: What is it about Apple that attracts so many libertarians, Cold War propaganda repeaters, and anti-government conspiracy theorist commentators?

    Is it the money? Do they idolize Apple for their stockpiles of money, hoping some of it will fall out of Apple pockets into their own? Are these the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" of the audience?

    What attracts the rabid attention and puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents (on a forum that says "don't do that" and even shuts down comments to avoid it on certain stories), who then also go on to mock any and all criticism aimed at a company that's virtually one of their ideological opponents to begin with?

    It goes from "how dare Tim Cook do socially-positive things! Stop wasting Apple's time on politics" ... and then it jumps to defending Apple's financial activities from any and all critics, while using cartoonishly politically extreme language to mock said critics. So, it's not okay for Apple to be political, but these commentators can use extreme political rhetoric to defend Apple's financial behaviors?

    Is it all the money that lets them ignore the socially-left behavior of Apple? Do they think Apple's left-leaning pro-society ideological public image is just a cynical act; that Apple is really just a pure profit machine that cares nothing about society?

    I mean, they may have a point there, if that's the thinking. Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands. The company is somewhat schizophrenic in its ideologies because laissez faire capitalism is incompatible with pro-society behavior.

    Either way, please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else.
    So, let me get this right. If people don't have your opinion of the world, then they must be wrong? Sounds like a solid left view point of the world.
    No, that's not what he said at all...  But nice troll!
    It’s exactly what he said. "puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents"

    "
    Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands."

    "
    please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else."

    But nice ice attempt at showing you comprehended dysamoria’s rhetoric.

    docno42
  • Reply 74 of 90
    Sorry, but Apple doesn't have a pension fund for employees.  I know corporate staff had just 401(k) plans, I don't know about retail staff.

  • Reply 75 of 90
    SpamSandwichSpamSandwich Posts: 31,497member
    gidney101 said:
    Sorry, but Apple doesn't have a pension fund for employees.  I know corporate staff had just 401(k) plans, I don't know about retail staff.

    Apple doesn't owe employees anything other than a paycheck. No business should be forced into offering perks beyond the paycheck unless market conditions (competition for good employees or rapid business growth) warrant such a thing.
    JWSCdocno42
  • Reply 76 of 90
    Hahahaha. Nader sure is generous with other people’s money. 

    And regarding his comment that that they didn’t ask the shareholders about the buyback, well who the hell
    does he think is selling their stock back to Apple? 

    Meanwhile, good ol’ Ralph is furiously typing away on his typewriter, pining for the good ol’ days before all this tech mumbo jumbo came along. Back when the environment really was a disaster, and the bulk of the third world was living in abject poverty. 
    ‘Hahahaha. Nader sure is generous with other people’s money"

    the whole of  left/liberal freeloaders are !
    JWSCwatto_cobra
  • Reply 77 of 90
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 5,269member
    steven n. said:
    steven n. said:
    dysamoria said:
    Someone please explain to me: What is it about Apple that attracts so many libertarians, Cold War propaganda repeaters, and anti-government conspiracy theorist commentators?

    Is it the money? Do they idolize Apple for their stockpiles of money, hoping some of it will fall out of Apple pockets into their own? Are these the "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" of the audience?

    What attracts the rabid attention and puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents (on a forum that says "don't do that" and even shuts down comments to avoid it on certain stories), who then also go on to mock any and all criticism aimed at a company that's virtually one of their ideological opponents to begin with?

    It goes from "how dare Tim Cook do socially-positive things! Stop wasting Apple's time on politics" ... and then it jumps to defending Apple's financial activities from any and all critics, while using cartoonishly politically extreme language to mock said critics. So, it's not okay for Apple to be political, but these commentators can use extreme political rhetoric to defend Apple's financial behaviors?

    Is it all the money that lets them ignore the socially-left behavior of Apple? Do they think Apple's left-leaning pro-society ideological public image is just a cynical act; that Apple is really just a pure profit machine that cares nothing about society?

    I mean, they may have a point there, if that's the thinking. Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands. The company is somewhat schizophrenic in its ideologies because laissez faire capitalism is incompatible with pro-society behavior.

    Either way, please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else.
    So, let me get this right. If people don't have your opinion of the world, then they must be wrong? Sounds like a solid left view point of the world.
    No, that's not what he said at all...  But nice troll!
    It’s exactly what he said. "puritanical capitalist apologetics of anti-left commentators, spouting constant mockery of their political opponents"

    "
    Despite Apple's socially-positive image and [certain] behaviors, a lot of what Apple do actually runs counter to that very image, purely to serve shareholder demands."

    "
    please take the 50s era Cold War rhetoric and mockery somewhere else."

    But nice ice attempt at showing you comprehended dysamoria’s rhetoric.

    Good job!  You changed what you said and then objected to being called out on it!   I guess that's why you guys are always right...


  • Reply 78 of 90
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 5,269member
    Hahahaha. Nader sure is generous with other people’s money. 

    And regarding his comment that that they didn’t ask the shareholders about the buyback, well who the hell
    does he think is selling their stock back to Apple? 

    Meanwhile, good ol’ Ralph is furiously typing away on his typewriter, pining for the good ol’ days before all this tech mumbo jumbo came along. Back when the environment really was a disaster, and the bulk of the third world was living in abject poverty. 
    ‘Hahahaha. Nader sure is generous with other people’s money"

    the whole of  left/liberal freeloaders are !
    It wasn't a left/liberal freeloader who borrowed $1.5Trillion to provide welfare to the rich. Just another right wing traitor.
  • Reply 79 of 90
    spice-boyspice-boy Posts: 1,025member
    It's good that Ralph Nader is using, LOL, a typewriter! This idiot should be as unproductive as possible. It has another advantage - Luddites have approximately zero credibility when talking about technology or technology companies.
    tell us what you have done for society as a whole? RL is a hero, read a book
  • Reply 80 of 90
    JWSCJWSC Posts: 551member
    ... Such buybacks and high dividends were not initiated by Tim but forced by activist shareholders trying to extract cash from the company.
    You can’t seriously believe that outside activists “forced” Apple management to initiate stock buybacks against their will.  That delusional.  They did push Apple management to take a serious look at it.  In the end Apple, and Apple alone, decides what is best for the company, its shareholders, and other significant stakeholders.
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