I'm a life long Apple fanboy with an iPhone X and I absolutely HATE the notch! HATE!!! In all seriousness and reasonableness, the notch is a genuinely stupid concept. Why would they choose to put an obstruction INSIDE the screen limiting some of your video viewing content? Let me put it another way.... why would you put a bezel INSIDE the screen??? Bezels are borders. Why put a border as an obstruction inside the viewing area of a screen?? It is literally a stupid design choice, but it passes muster ONLY because Apple did it. Samsung's Note 8/9 is not only aesthetically better but does not rob the user ANY video real estate. If I were not such a maniacal hoarder of iMessage and SMS conversation histories, I would have traded in my iPhone X for a Note 9 this year and kept the Samsung until Apple eliminates the notch - and I am 100% sure Apple will eventually boot the notch once they come up with a way to embed Face ID and/or fingerprint sensor invisibly in the screen. Till that time, I guess I will just hang on to my iPhone X and be pissed off everytime it stares back at me on a solid white screen or when I am watch a full screen movie. ...sigh : (
The notch doesnt obstruct movies, unless your purposefully “zoom in” the playback. But doing this also cuts off the edges of the content (like watching a non-letterboxed movie on the old 4:3 ratio TVs), so you’re already screwing with your content before the notch is even factored in.
Why didn't anyone throw a fit when the Galaxy spy machine hid the forehead and chin in every ad with their wannabe Apple wallpapers??
You do know the notch is where the camera, sensors, FaceID, speaker are located right? Apple didn't "choose" to put the notch in, c'mon use you’re head.
If you turn the brightness up, you can clearly see the bezels in Samsung’s pics. In Apple’s pics, there is *zero* color difference between the notch black and the screen black. The notch might be difficult to see with a black screen, but it’s not invisible. This “invisible notch” is obviously not a representation of reality, and it was a deliberate choice by Apple to misrepresent the phone’s face. I’m not saying that they’re actively trying to *mislead* buyers, but they’re definitely downplaying the notch. As they should. Because it’s embarrassing.
It will also be interesting to see what the margin is between that soap bubble and the notch. How much of a gap did they leave? I am guessing zero, so they could maximize the illusion (apt name for the commercial) that the notch is unobtrusive.
And of course Apple chose to put the notch in in the first place. They could have embedded the sensors in a thin bezel across the top instead of a thicker notch that literally carved out part of the display.
I am with Rrrize — I have bought iPhones since day one, but I’m not buying another unless and until the notch is gone and FaceID with it. They’re both poop.
Nonsense. Apple isn’t trying to fool or trick people, it was visible in every X promo shot.
That you have to crank up your display on the Samsung to see a bezel is absurd, I’m not constantly cranking up my screen to hunt for things.
Apples solutuon is better than putting in a chin and forehead, as it gives me more space. The notch is as benign and non-issue as the rear view mirror is in your windshield — in normal use you just don’t see it. Only OCD folks will ever have an issue with this IRL.
Gizmodo is excoriating Apple for "hiding" the notch in this commercial, claiming it's all but unethical. Ever notice how these douchebag websites latch onto something negative and beat it to death? First the headphone jack and now the notch, both of which have been proven to be accepted by the majority of buyers. When's the next Samsung notch shaming ad coming coming? Anybody?
It's clearly visible when the light hits it right.
Bingo. It’s there and I can see it on the right image. It’s a real photo (Apple often uses real photography rather than CGI, there was an article about the rigs needed to get their product shots).
Well… times have changed… Today the smallest phone is hidden inside a stylish (Apple) watch; and we use our "phones" mostly to consume media, or to interact with something. That's both given us the option to have a tiny phone, and the need/desire for bigger screens.
Why would they choose to put an obstruction INSIDE the screen limiting some of your video viewing content?
They didn't put the notch inside the screen, they extended the screen up on both sides of the notch.
Do these complainers realize that without the notch, the data signal, time, wifi signal, location pointer and other icons would move down into the screen? Obstructing even more screen real estate?
When I first saw the notch, the location of these items seemed genius and it all clicked. Very clean and Apple.
Does anyone complain about the screen real estate that is lost due when viewing due to the ridiculous curved screen on Galaxy phones? Do Samsung measure their screen size including the curved edges or when viewed from above?
My question is why does samsung always come up in Apple conversation?
Oh that's right, because it's the only piece of hope from the hundreds of knockoffs.
When the notch was introduced I, and a few others, attempted the argument that it’s not a notch, it’s ears. But our words fell on deaf ears. There’s just no seeing the silver lining with some folks. Life must suck as they notice all the imperfections they perceive to exist in their worlds.
Gizmodo is excoriating Apple for "hiding" the notch in this commercial, claiming it's all but unethical. Ever notice how these douchebag websites latch onto something negative and beat it to death? First the headphone jack and now the notch, both of which have been proven to be accepted by the majority of buyers. When's the next Samsung notch shaming ad coming coming? Anybody?
It's clearly visible when the light hits it right.
Bingo. It’s there and I can see it on the right image. It’s a real photo (Apple often uses real photography rather than CGI, there was an article about the rigs needed to get their product shots).
The guy claiming it’s a scam is FOS.
Excellent point. There is little difference between the overall composition of the Apple and Samsung ad images shown in this thread. It is a bright image, mostly in the center, on a black screen.
Some Apple critics/haters saying that at maximum brightness something in the black portion of the display can be made out (with the Samsung picture) is besides the point and is true for both the Samsung and Apple images.
Some Apple critics/haters saying that at maximum brightness something in the black portion of the display can be made out (with the Samsung picture) is besides the point and is true for both the Samsung and Apple images.
On the XR, because it's an LCD display, I can see that being the case, but not on an OLED since those black pixels will have no power going to them. You'd need an external light source to reflect so that it can show the different layers/materials below the top glass.
I'm a life long Apple fanboy with an iPhone X and I absolutely HATE the notch! HATE!!! In all seriousness and reasonableness, the notch is a genuinely stupid concept. Why would they choose to put an obstruction INSIDE the screen limiting some of your video viewing content? Let me put it another way.... why would you put a bezel INSIDE the screen??? Bezels are borders. Why put a border as an obstruction inside the viewing area of a screen?? It is literally a stupid design choice, but it passes muster ONLY because Apple did it. Samsung's Note 8/9 is not only aesthetically better but does not rob the user ANY video real estate. If I were not such a maniacal hoarder of iMessage and SMS conversation histories, I would have traded in my iPhone X for a Note 9 this year and kept the Samsung until Apple eliminates the notch - and I am 100% sure Apple will eventually boot the notch once they come up with a way to embed Face ID and/or fingerprint sensor invisibly in the screen. Till that time, I guess I will just hang on to my iPhone X and be pissed off everytime it stares back at me on a solid white screen or when I am watch a full screen movie. ...sigh : (
Some Apple critics/haters saying that at maximum brightness something in the black portion of the display can be made out (with the Samsung picture) is besides the point and is true for both the Samsung and Apple images.
On the XR, because it's an LCD display, I can see that being the case, but not on an OLED since those black pixels will have no power going to them. You'd need an external light source to reflect so that it can show the different layers/materials below the top glass.
Soli; Please look my first sentence where I wrote; “the Apple and Samsung ad images shown in this thread”. That’s what I’m referring to as well as a previous comment that the black part of the Samsung phone in the ad image can be made out when viewing the ad images in this thread at maximum brightness. (As albatross83 stated;)
StrangeDays said: As do their customers, who continually reaffirm and vote with their wallets.
For those already on the platform, their choice is Apple or non-Apple. They aren't voting anything except for how much Apple abuse they'll take before they leave.
... why would you put a bezel INSIDE the screen??? Bezels are borders. Why put a border as an obstruction inside the viewing area of a screen?? It is literally a stupid design choice ...
Yes, but it gets you a bigger screen size spec number. The new Apple isn't about UX or the best thing for the user, it's about the best thing for Apple profits and marketing. Once you get that, the choices start to make sense. We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do.
As my iPhone keeps expanding its role as my de facto primary digital device the larger screen of the XSMax should be an interesting shift from my iPhone X.
I think that's the key difference. For we SE people, as much as we love our iPhone, it isn't more and more a primary device. I can understand why, if the phone were your primary device, you'd want a bigger screen. My phone is an accessory device to iPad/laptop/desktop, etc. Apple seems to just be excluding that market, because... spreadsheets and pie-charts (or, more accurately ASP stats).
claire1 said: You do know the notch is where the camera, sensors, FaceID, speaker are located right?
Apple didn't "choose" to put the notch in ...
They could have just included a small band at the top to put all that stuff in with a slightly smaller screen. It was a design decision they chose.
claire1 said: So you guys complain that the notch takes up screen space and then suggest a forehead that takes up more space?
Yes, because the space isn't usable anyway... it's just a matter of what the screen-space spec number is. They could have put the 'notch' into a status area of ears in that bar and accomplished the same thing, w/o the notch intrusion. It's kind of a silly UI/UX thing to have to deal with (though, I guess this kind of automatically happens in terms of development?).
claire1 said: Ah so you bought every iPhone with bezels, forehead and chin but suddenly that tiny notch bothers you and is "obtrusive"?
What's wrong with bezels? I actually prefer a bezel to an edge-to-edge screen with software touch rejection. But, I'd rather not have part of my display 'covered up'. Once you exclude that aspect, you're down to a smaller screen anyway.
claire1 said: Do these complainers realize that without the notch, the data signal, time, wifi signal, location pointer and other icons would move down into the screen? Obstructing even more screen real estate?
True, but they often disappear in games or certain apps leaving actual usable screen space (which matches the spec). The X essentially has a fake screen size spec, which is - yes - sometimes useful extra space. When like that, it's an advantage I suppose, but otherwise is kind of an aesthetic issue unless you have a perfect black background. When you want to go full-screen, it's in the way.
How times have changed. Remember when this forum’s members were saying that Apple would never build a phablet?
We've crossed that bridge long ago. In some ways, I suppose it is good, in that people now want phablets (and there is a legitimate use-case for them). What concerns me, is that they've abandoned the rest of the market (that they argued was the ideal size) so that they ONLY have phablets.
This is because they aren't building the best products anymore... they are building to optimize profits and satisfy the marketing department.
svanstrom said: Well… times have changed… Today the smallest phone is hidden inside a stylish (Apple) watch; and we use our "phones" mostly to consume media, or to interact with something. That's both given us the option to have a tiny phone, and the need/desire for bigger screens.
Disagree here. The Watch IS NOT a suitable replacement for a smaller iPhone.
foregoneconclusion said: LOL...it's not a misrepresentation of anything.
It's a misrepresentation of the screen size spec, as they measure a screen diagonally (i.e.: including the notch in the screen area).
StrangeDays said: As do their customers, who continually reaffirm and vote with their wallets.
For those already on the platform, their choice is Apple or non-Apple. They aren't voting anything except for how much Apple abuse they'll take before they leave.
... why would you put a bezel INSIDE the screen??? Bezels are borders. Why put a border as an obstruction inside the viewing area of a screen?? It is literally a stupid design choice ...
Yes, but it gets you a bigger screen size spec number. The new Apple isn't about UX or the best thing for the user, it's about the best thing for Apple profits and marketing. Once you get that, the choices start to make sense. We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do.
As my iPhone keeps expanding its role as my de facto primary digital device the larger screen of the XSMax should be an interesting shift from my iPhone X.
I think that's the key difference. For we SE people, as much as we love our iPhone, it isn't more and more a primary device. I can understand why, if the phone were your primary device, you'd want a bigger screen. My phone is an accessory device to iPad/laptop/desktop, etc. Apple seems to just be excluding that market, because... spreadsheets and pie-charts (or, more accurately ASP stats).
claire1 said: You do know the notch is where the camera, sensors, FaceID, speaker are located right?
Apple didn't "choose" to put the notch in ...
They could have just included a small band at the top to put all that stuff in with a slightly smaller screen. It was a design decision they chose.
claire1 said: So you guys complain that the notch takes up screen space and then suggest a forehead that takes up more space?
Yes, because the space isn't usable anyway... it's just a matter of what the screen-space spec number is. They could have put the 'notch' into a status area of ears in that bar and accomplished the same thing, w/o the notch intrusion. It's kind of a silly UI/UX thing to have to deal with (though, I guess this kind of automatically happens in terms of development?).
claire1 said: Ah so you bought every iPhone with bezels, forehead and chin but suddenly that tiny notch bothers you and is "obtrusive"?
What's wrong with bezels? I actually prefer a bezel to an edge-to-edge screen with software touch rejection. But, I'd rather not have part of my display 'covered up'. Once you exclude that aspect, you're down to a smaller screen anyway.
claire1 said: Do these complainers realize that without the notch, the data signal, time, wifi signal, location pointer and other icons would move down into the screen? Obstructing even more screen real estate?
True, but they often disappear in games or certain apps leaving actual usable screen space (which matches the spec). The X essentially has a fake screen size spec, which is - yes - sometimes useful extra space. When like that, it's an advantage I suppose, but otherwise is kind of an aesthetic issue unless you have a perfect black background. When you want to go full-screen, it's in the way.
How times have changed. Remember when this forum’s members were saying that Apple would never build a phablet?
We've crossed that bridge long ago. In some ways, I suppose it is good, in that people now want phablets (and there is a legitimate use-case for them). What concerns me, is that they've abandoned the rest of the market (that they argued was the ideal size) so that they ONLY have phablets.
This is because they aren't building the best products anymore... they are building to optimize profits and satisfy the marketing department.
svanstrom said: Well… times have changed… Today the smallest phone is hidden inside a stylish (Apple) watch; and we use our "phones" mostly to consume media, or to interact with something. That's both given us the option to have a tiny phone, and the need/desire for bigger screens.
Disagree here. The Watch IS NOT a suitable replacement for a smaller iPhone.
foregoneconclusion said: LOL...it's not a misrepresentation of anything.
It's a misrepresentation of the screen size spec, as they measure a screen diagonally (i.e.: including the notch in the screen area).
"For those already on the platform, their choice is Apple or non-Apple. They aren't voting anything except for how much Apple abuse they'll take before they leave."
The torture! We cannot take the abuse from our Apple products so we buy more!!!
"Yes, but it gets you a bigger screen size spec number. The new Apple isn't about UX or the best thing for the user, it's about the best thing for Apple profits and marketing. Once you get that, the choices start to make sense. We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do." Ah the "Steve wouldn't do X" crap.
"I think that's the key difference. For we SE people, as much as we love our iPhone, it isn't more and more a primary device. I can understand why, if the phone were your primary device, you'd want a bigger screen. My phone is an accessory device to iPad/laptop/desktop, etc. Apple seems to just be excluding that market, because... spreadsheets and pie-charts (or, more accurately ASP stats)."
iPhone 7. it even has better specs than SE. /Conspiracy shot down
"What's wrong with bezels?"
Nothing.
"I actually prefer a bezel to an edge-to-edge screen with software touch rejection. But, I'd rather not have part of my display 'covered up'. Once you exclude that aspect, you're down to a smaller screen anyway."
Ah this is where the hypocrisy lays and why I must remind you about bezels. You realize an iPhone X with bezels would be the same size with a smaller screen. Unless they increase screen size leaving us with an iPhone 8 Plus, which is a lot larger thanks to those bezels you admire.
"They could have just included a small band at the top to put all that stuff in with a slightly smaller screen. It was a design decision they chose." The notch wasn't a design decision as much as it was a necessity. Common sense man.
"True, but they often disappear in games or certain apps leaving actual usable screen space (which matches the spec). The X essentially has a fake screen size spec, which is - yes - sometimes useful extra space. When like that, it's an advantage I suppose, but otherwise is kind of an aesthetic issue unless you have a perfect black background. When you want to go full-screen, it's in the way." Right but with your top bezel idea the bezel isn't in the way..... /s
"We've crossed that bridge long ago. In some ways, I suppose it is good, in that people now want phablets (and there is a legitimate use-case for them). What concerns me, is that they've abandoned the rest of the market (that they argued was the ideal size) so that they ONLY have phablets.
This is because they aren't building the best products anymore... they are building to optimize profits and satisfy the marketing department." More than half of Apples products aren't "phablets".
Right Apple isn't #1 in customer satisfaction, sales, ASP, security, speed, eco system, customer privacy etc. etc. Apple is only making technology to please their marketing department so only those guys are buying their crap. /s
"Disagree here. The Watch IS NOT a suitable replacement for a smaller iPhone." No but it replaces a lot of iPhones functions in a more practical way.
"It's a misrepresentation of the screen size spec, as they measure a screen diagonally (i.e.: including the notch in the screen area)."
You just said the "ears" had useful info. Now they aren't part of the screen?
claire1 said: The torture! We cannot take the abuse from our Apple products so we buy more!!!
If it were only that simple...
claire1 said: iPhone 7. it even has better specs than SE.
/Conspiracy shot down
I don't want an iPhone 7. It's a poor replacement for an SE, even if it has some better specs. But, it does bring up Apple's ASP.
claire1 said: Ah this is where the hypocrisy lays and why I must remind you about bezels. You realize an iPhone X with bezels would be the same size with a smaller screen. Unless they increase screen size leaving us with an iPhone 8 Plus, which is a lot larger thanks to those bezels you admire.
Do we need a bigger screen? My point was that they are getting a bigger size screen spec, kind of by cheating a bit. I don't personally mind having some small amount of bezel with a bit smaller screen. What hypocrisy?
claire1 said: The notch wasn't a design decision as much as it was a necessity. Common sense man.
... Right but with your top bezel idea the bezel isn't in the way..... /s
Yep. Then the screen would be unobstructed and a more accurate size spec, and they'd have their place to put the cameras, sensors, etc.. Problem solved.
claire1 said: More than half of Apples products aren't "phablets".
I disagree. Once it's too big to conveniently use in one's hand, fit in pockets well, etc.... it may as well be a phablet. What's the point of, say, buying an iPhone 7 (aside from cost) when you could have a bigger screen? If it's already inconvenient, you may as well get a bit more inconvenient to really experience the increased screen real-estate advantage.
claire1 said: Right Apple isn't #1 in customer satisfaction, sales, ASP, security, speed, eco system, customer privacy etc. etc.
Apple is only making technology to please their marketing department so only those guys are buying their crap. /s
Apple isn't #1 in customer satisfaction. I'm pretty unsatisfied. Also, I didn't say only... it's a matter of priority. The 'old' Apple prioritized making the best stuff and sales, profits, and a loyal fan-based resulted. The 'new' Apple prioritizes making profits and making what the biggest lump of consumers want at the time.... sales and profits follow, until they don't... because eventually people will figure out they aren't the best or right stuff any longer.
claire1 said: You just said the "ears" had useful info. Now they aren't part of the screen?
Part of the screen! With a huge section of it that isn't screen at all.
I'm a life long Apple fanboy with an iPhone X and I absolutely HATE the notch! HATE!!! In all seriousness and reasonableness, the notch is a genuinely stupid concept. Why would they choose to put an obstruction INSIDE the screen limiting some of your video viewing content? Let me put it another way.... why would you put a bezel INSIDE the screen??? Bezels are borders. Why put a border as an obstruction inside the viewing area of a screen?? It is literally a stupid design choice, but it passes muster ONLY because Apple did it. Samsung's Note 8/9 is not only aesthetically better but does not rob the user ANY video real estate. If I were not such a maniacal hoarder of iMessage and SMS conversation histories, I would have traded in my iPhone X for a Note 9 this year and kept the Samsung until Apple eliminates the notch - and I am 100% sure Apple will eventually boot the notch once they come up with a way to embed Face ID and/or fingerprint sensor invisibly in the screen. Till that time, I guess I will just hang on to my iPhone X and be pissed off everytime it stares back at me on a solid white screen or when I am watch a full screen movie. ...sigh : (
You know that you can double tap on the screen and the video will be shown entirely, just do that and pretend the black bars are part of the frame similar to older phones.
The notch is like 99% of using the phone while watching videos is occasionally for the majority of people
We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do.
On behalf of the rest of us "old Apple fans" I'd just like to apologise, and categorically deny that this person has been elected to represent all of us.
StrangeDays said: As do their customers, who continually reaffirm and vote with their wallets.
For those already on the platform, their choice is Apple or non-Apple. They aren't voting anything except for how much Apple abuse they'll take before they leave.
Ah, the old “I’m FORCED to buy Apple!” trope. Nope, that’s nonsense. If customers are unhappy they can and will leave the iPhone for something else, plenty of articles about people doing it, and nothing stopping them. I know it hurts your world view, but people like the products Apple is selling and the design decisions they make.
Seriously listen to yourself — you’re describing Apple as an abuser and yourself as a victim. It’s really sad to see you victimize yourself. You're not a victim. If you’re unhappy, take some easy steps and change that.
I'm a life long Apple fanboy with an iPhone X and I absolutely HATE the notch! HATE!!! In all seriousness and reasonableness, the notch is a genuinely stupid concept. Why would they choose to put an obstruction INSIDE the screen limiting some of your video viewing content? Let me put it another way.... why would you put a bezel INSIDE the screen??? Bezels are borders. Why put a border as an obstruction inside the viewing area of a screen?? It is literally a stupid design choice, but it passes muster ONLY because Apple did it. Samsung's Note 8/9 is not only aesthetically better but does not rob the user ANY video real estate. If I were not such a maniacal hoarder of iMessage and SMS conversation histories, I would have traded in my iPhone X for a Note 9 this year and kept the Samsung until Apple eliminates the notch - and I am 100% sure Apple will eventually boot the notch once they come up with a way to embed Face ID and/or fingerprint sensor invisibly in the screen. Till that time, I guess I will just hang on to my iPhone X and be pissed off everytime it stares back at me on a solid white screen or when I am watch a full screen movie. ...sigh : (
Better to think of it that Apple didn't put a notch into a bezel-free screen to give you less screen estate, they wrapped the screen around the camera and sensors to give you more screen estate. Try to think of that way and you won't be so pissed off.
Rayz2016 said: And the naysayers continually fail to grasp the simple notion that:
Apple knows more about their target market than they do.
They are not in Apple's target market.
Maybe... but then who is Apple's new target market... and does that correspond to Apple's old mission of making the best products possible, and think different, and creatives, and all that kind of stuff. If Apple's new target market is fashionistas with a bit too much cash and an inverse amount of brain cells, then maybe it's better not to be part of the new demographics?
We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do.
On behalf of the rest of us "old Apple fans" I'd just like to apologise, and categorically deny that this person has been elected to represent all of us.
Enjoy the memojis I guess. Not all the old Apple people necessarily got it. Some bought for fashion and status, I suppose.
StrangeDays said: Ah, the old “I’m FORCED to buy Apple!” trope. Nope, that’s nonsense. If customers are unhappy they can and will leave the iPhone for something else, plenty of articles about people doing it, and nothing stopping them. I know it hurts your world view, but people like the products Apple is selling and the design decisions they make.
Seriously listen to yourself — you’re describing Apple as an abuser and yourself as a victim. It’s really sad to see you victimize yourself. You're not a victim. If you’re unhappy, take some easy steps and change that.
Nope, I'm simply saying Apple changed on me, in ways I'm unhappy with. I have a lot invested in workflow, apps, and eco-system, so just leaping to some other platform isn't easy... nor is it even overall necessarily better. But, to fanboys, I should just shut up and not complain? I suppose I could pretend everything they are doing is awesome and impressive... I mean, just look at the stock prices, those never lie.
And, I am taking steps to change that, by complaining about what Apple is doing, not encouraging people to buy Apple stuff anymore w/o big caveats, etc. What would you suggest?
Comments
That you have to crank up your display on the Samsung to see a bezel is absurd, I’m not constantly cranking up my screen to hunt for things.
Apples solutuon is better than putting in a chin and forehead, as it gives me more space. The notch is as benign and non-issue as the rear view mirror is in your windshield — in normal use you just don’t see it. Only OCD folks will ever have an issue with this IRL.
Bingo. It’s there and I can see it on the right image. It’s a real photo (Apple often uses real photography rather than CGI, there was an article about the rigs needed to get their product shots).
The guy claiming it’s a scam is FOS.
It is a bright image, mostly in the center, on a black screen.
Some Apple critics/haters saying that at maximum brightness something in the black portion of the display can be made out (with the Samsung picture) is besides the point and is true for both the Samsung and Apple images.
That’s what I’m referring to as well as a previous comment that the black part of the Samsung phone in the ad image can be made out when viewing the ad images in this thread at maximum brightness. (As albatross83 stated;)
I am not talking about maximum brightness of the OLED Samsung / Apple phones themselves.
Yes, but it gets you a bigger screen size spec number.
The new Apple isn't about UX or the best thing for the user, it's about the best thing for Apple profits and marketing. Once you get that, the choices start to make sense. We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do.
I think that's the key difference. For we SE people, as much as we love our iPhone, it isn't more and more a primary device. I can understand why, if the phone were your primary device, you'd want a bigger screen. My phone is an accessory device to iPad/laptop/desktop, etc. Apple seems to just be excluding that market, because... spreadsheets and pie-charts (or, more accurately ASP stats).
They could have just included a small band at the top to put all that stuff in with a slightly smaller screen. It was a design decision they chose.
Yes, because the space isn't usable anyway... it's just a matter of what the screen-space spec number is. They could have put the 'notch' into a status area of ears in that bar and accomplished the same thing, w/o the notch intrusion. It's kind of a silly UI/UX thing to have to deal with (though, I guess this kind of automatically happens in terms of development?).
What's wrong with bezels? I actually prefer a bezel to an edge-to-edge screen with software touch rejection. But, I'd rather not have part of my display 'covered up'. Once you exclude that aspect, you're down to a smaller screen anyway.
True, but they often disappear in games or certain apps leaving actual usable screen space (which matches the spec). The X essentially has a fake screen size spec, which is - yes - sometimes useful extra space. When like that, it's an advantage I suppose, but otherwise is kind of an aesthetic issue unless you have a perfect black background. When you want to go full-screen, it's in the way.
We've crossed that bridge long ago. In some ways, I suppose it is good, in that people now want phablets (and there is a legitimate use-case for them). What concerns me, is that they've abandoned the rest of the market (that they argued was the ideal size) so that they ONLY have phablets.
This is because they aren't building the best products anymore... they are building to optimize profits and satisfy the marketing department.
Disagree here. The Watch IS NOT a suitable replacement for a smaller iPhone.
It's a misrepresentation of the screen size spec, as they measure a screen diagonally (i.e.: including the notch in the screen area).
The torture! We cannot take the abuse from our Apple products so we buy more!!!
"Yes, but it gets you a bigger screen size spec number.
The new Apple isn't about UX or the best thing for the user, it's about the best thing for Apple profits and marketing. Once you get that, the choices start to make sense. We old Apple fans keep thinking about what the old Apple would do."
Ah the "Steve wouldn't do X" crap.
"I think that's the key difference. For we SE people, as much as we love our iPhone, it isn't more and more a primary device. I can understand why, if the phone were your primary device, you'd want a bigger screen. My phone is an accessory device to iPad/laptop/desktop, etc. Apple seems to just be excluding that market, because... spreadsheets and pie-charts (or, more accurately ASP stats)."
iPhone 7. it even has better specs than SE.
/Conspiracy shot down
"What's wrong with bezels?"
Nothing.
"I actually prefer a bezel to an edge-to-edge screen with software touch rejection. But, I'd rather not have part of my display 'covered up'. Once you exclude that aspect, you're down to a smaller screen anyway."
Ah this is where the hypocrisy lays and why I must remind you about bezels. You realize an iPhone X with bezels would be the same size with a smaller screen. Unless they increase screen size leaving us with an iPhone 8 Plus, which is a lot larger thanks to those bezels you admire.
"They could have just included a small band at the top to put all that stuff in with a slightly smaller screen. It was a design decision they chose."
The notch wasn't a design decision as much as it was a necessity. Common sense man.
"True, but they often disappear in games or certain apps leaving actual usable screen space (which matches the spec). The X essentially has a fake screen size spec, which is - yes - sometimes useful extra space. When like that, it's an advantage I suppose, but otherwise is kind of an aesthetic issue unless you have a perfect black background. When you want to go full-screen, it's in the way."
Right but with your top bezel idea the bezel isn't in the way..... /s
"We've crossed that bridge long ago. In some ways, I suppose it is good, in that people now want phablets (and there is a legitimate use-case for them). What concerns me, is that they've abandoned the rest of the market (that they argued was the ideal size) so that they ONLY have phablets.
This is because they aren't building the best products anymore... they are building to optimize profits and satisfy the marketing department."
More than half of Apples products aren't "phablets".
Right Apple isn't #1 in customer satisfaction, sales, ASP, security, speed, eco system, customer privacy etc. etc.
Apple is only making technology to please their marketing department so only those guys are buying their crap. /s
"Disagree here. The Watch IS NOT a suitable replacement for a smaller iPhone."
No but it replaces a lot of iPhones functions in a more practical way.
"It's a misrepresentation of the screen size spec, as they measure a screen diagonally (i.e.: including the notch in the screen area)."
You just said the "ears" had useful info. Now they aren't part of the screen?
I don't want an iPhone 7. It's a poor replacement for an SE, even if it has some better specs.
But, it does bring up Apple's ASP.
Do we need a bigger screen? My point was that they are getting a bigger size screen spec, kind of by cheating a bit.
I don't personally mind having some small amount of bezel with a bit smaller screen. What hypocrisy?
Yep.
Then the screen would be unobstructed and a more accurate size spec, and they'd have their place to put the cameras, sensors, etc.. Problem solved.
I disagree. Once it's too big to conveniently use in one's hand, fit in pockets well, etc.... it may as well be a phablet. What's the point of, say, buying an iPhone 7 (aside from cost) when you could have a bigger screen? If it's already inconvenient, you may as well get a bit more inconvenient to really experience the increased screen real-estate advantage.
Apple isn't #1 in customer satisfaction. I'm pretty unsatisfied.
Also, I didn't say only... it's a matter of priority.
The 'old' Apple prioritized making the best stuff and sales, profits, and a loyal fan-based resulted.
The 'new' Apple prioritizes making profits and making what the biggest lump of consumers want at the time.... sales and profits follow, until they don't... because eventually people will figure out they aren't the best or right stuff any longer.
Part of the screen! With a huge section of it that isn't screen at all.
That was so desperate I actually felt sorry for you.
And the naysayers continually fail to grasp the simple notion that:
Seriously listen to yourself — you’re describing Apple as an abuser and yourself as a victim. It’s really sad to see you victimize yourself. You're not a victim. If you’re unhappy, take some easy steps and change that.
Enjoy the memojis I guess. Not all the old Apple people necessarily got it. Some bought for fashion and status, I suppose.
Nope, I'm simply saying Apple changed on me, in ways I'm unhappy with. I have a lot invested in workflow, apps, and eco-system, so just leaping to some other platform isn't easy... nor is it even overall necessarily better. But, to fanboys, I should just shut up and not complain? I suppose I could pretend everything they are doing is awesome and impressive... I mean, just look at the stock prices, those never lie.
And, I am taking steps to change that, by complaining about what Apple is doing, not encouraging people to buy Apple stuff anymore w/o big caveats, etc. What would you suggest?