[quote]Art Levinson (Not even an emplyee at Apple)<hr></blockquote>
Nice try flame bait. Levinson is on the Board of Directors at Apple, which technically makes him one of the people that Steven Jobs reports to.
[quote]come on, even Time magazine had the story for months in advance.<hr></blockquote>
Nope. Time Magazines lead time is anywhere from one month to a couple of days. Its a weekly news magazine not a glossy monthly--despite what people may think about the quality of the writing.
<strong>Its not about what he or whoever knows...it is about what they said to make us think they know, even though I know that what they said was really not an opinion but "in the know" deterrance speak.......or maybe circumstances have permitted a change to the word on hardware 2 months ago?</strong><hr></blockquote>
1: yes, what he knows or doesn't is irrelevant.
2: nothing was said to make us think he knows (do you realise that you're basically accusing him of lying to impress you?).
3a: of course it was not an opinion; he was speaking in the role of Apple spokesperson - his opinions on anchovies or Katie Couric are irrelevant.
3b: "deterrance speak"? Yeah, he's just lying to throw you off the scent...(*sheesh*).
4: circumstances may have changed in the one month since he spoke, but that won't cause them to throw away their timeline just to surprise you.
But when the a top executive who works for Apple. Comes out and says specificaly "No new CPU's [comps] at Macworld Tokyo" I tend to believe him.
I've been watching the various threads attempting to pick apart Jozwiak's words from a month ago, observed everyone calling the other guy idiotic, sat quietly while illogical assumptions after illogical assumptions are taken as Given, and I haven't written anything. This one has gotten me a bit annoyed.
We all "heard" Jozwiak use the acronym "CPU." CPU does not _stand for_ the word "computer," nor does it replace the word "hardware," nor does it even mean "chip."
I am not an indisputable computer virtuoso or an expert in any field therein related, but someone correct me if I am wrong w/re: the following statement:
The acronym CPU stands for Central Processing Unit.
LOL... I'm still trying to figure out if the post that has with Onlookers everywhere in it
is supposed to be a slam on me or not. Like I care.
[Edit] Ahh yea.. If someone seriously thinks that Apple is going to speed bump the PowerMac at Tokyo you should seek help. Wasn't the PowerMac the most recent Apple item to be updated?
iPod maybe, some new device, or Displays. I have heard from a wholesaler who was loking at my old powermac that I should expect some new displays down the line, but I can't imagine much else.
Software is always a possibility.
Don't wory Tokyo will be a cool show, but no way on the PowerMac this time.
The acronym CPU stands for Central Processing Unit.[/QB]<hr></blockquote>Yes but often people use it to just mean computer. Marketing people often talk about selling a certain number of CPUs. I'm pretty sure they're not talking just about the central processing units - they're talking about the whole machine.
Give it up, no one bl00dy cares which one of you has a bigger d*ck. Drop the pissing contest already, neither of you knows A N Y T H I N G. Period. It's quite obvious, really. If you would each pull your head out for just one second you'd realize it. The fact that this battle isn't the first makes me think either you guys are 12yrs old, or you're the same person with a touch of multiple personality disorder ( I am leaning toward the former).
Speed bump, new configs, 10g iPod.. maybe maybe maybe..
Will be a good laugh the morning we're all watching MWTY.. we'll all be laughing at YOU, while SJ goes on about how much more 'zippy' OSX is now.
Just to add something relevant instead of wasting your time..
I am really hoping for the 10g iPod.. have a co-worker who tries very very hard to slag everything Apple does.. his latest is that Riot piece of junk.. all he can say is - "but it's 20gigs!"
No new CPUs. How hard is that to understand. Sure, Apple could release the G5 if it were ready and they wanted to, but that is wishful thinking. It would be horrible PR for an Apple exec to promise no new hardware and then be exposed as a liar. Nobody at Apple is that stupid.
This dramatically highlights the desperation of the MHz gap. Apple is so far behind that Mac users really cannot comprehend reality. I know I can't. It's so bad now that one wonders how long Apple will remain in business if the current trend continues.
And yes, my dick is the biggest, that's why I have a 400 MHz G4....the less MHz you have, the bigger your dick is.
There will BE no new hardware at MWTokyo.... The G5 will only be announced...It will not BE there...it will not be sold there... You'll have to wait for a month
By the way...there is currently a price reduction on some tower configs.....
[quote]I haven't implied the senior marketers don't know what is going on, but their job is to spin information in a way to drive sales this moment. <hr></blockquote>
True dat. The point here, folks, is that the executive said no new CPU's and no quandrant updates. The caveat here is the word marketing in his job title. He's got to sell what Apple is shipping NOW! A job made more difficult by the fact that many professional regard the DP 1GHz as not quite adequate enough to warrant a new computer purchase.
Could Apple release new/updated computers at MWT? Of course, they can. Will they? C'mon, lets be honest here....probably not. No reason to get all butt hurt about it...Apple WILL release some killer hardware soon..just be a bit more patient about it.
Apple has proven a willingness to update things between MW's, so the potential for a press release launch (like the iPod) or a splipstream update (DP 1 GHz) is possible. Besides, we've also got WWDC coming up, which would be a fitting time to release some heavy iron.
At any rate, you people should let the eternal optimists have their thread. Its certainly not hurting anyone and the moderators haven't seemed to object to the topic.
EDIT: "there is currently a price reduction on some tower configs" -really? I haven't seen any reductions. Linkage?
<strong>This dramatically highlights the desperation of the MHz gap. Apple is so far behind that Mac users really cannot comprehend reality. I know I can't. It's so bad now that one wonders how long Apple will remain in business if the current trend continues.
And yes, my dick is the biggest, that's why I have a 400 MHz G4....the less MHz you have, the bigger your dick is.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, that's certainly a new twist to the MHZ Myth. Somehow, I doubt John Rubenstein will invite you on stage to demonstrate your version of the MHZ Myth.
On another note, I think it's probably more pathetic how people think Apple's going to lose any significant amount of business based on MHZ. If you're theory on this had any validity, why is anyone buying Macs today? The fact of the matter is that Mac OS X is pretty awesome and is only getting better as the kinks are worked out and more native software is becoming available. Further, the overall user experience is still much better than on Windows. Just look what you can do right out of the box with even just an iMac. Is the P4 faster at some things? Sure. If all you're doing is 3D Raytracing, you'll be better off on an Athlon or P4. However, a good portion of Apple's key market areas make heavy use of Altivec (Photoshop, Cleaner5, Final Cut Pro, DVD Studio Pro, all of the "iApps", etc. Further, the majority of business productivity apps are not exactly starved for CPU horsepower on todays machines. In short, for Apple's core market, the G4 performs much better than you give it credit for. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
<strong>On another note, I think it's probably more pathetic how people think Apple's going to lose any significant amount of business based on MHZ. If you're theory on this had any validity, why is anyone buying Macs today? The fact of the matter is that Mac OS X is pretty awesome and is only getting better as the kinks are worked out and more native software is becoming available. Further, the overall user experience is still much better than on Windows. Just look what you can do right out of the box with even just an iMac. Is the P4 faster at some things? Sure. If all you're doing is 3D Raytracing, you'll be better off on an Athlon or P4. However, a good portion of Apple's key market areas make heavy use of Altivec (Photoshop, Cleaner5, Final Cut Pro, DVD Studio Pro, all of the "iApps", etc. Further, the majority of business productivity apps are not exactly starved for CPU horsepower on todays machines. In short, for Apple's core market, the G4 performs much better than you give it credit for. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
Steve</strong><hr></blockquote>
Right on. Finally, someone whose actually thinking and making sense.
We all "heard" Jozwiak use the acronym "CPU." CPU does not _stand for_ the word "computer," nor does it replace the word "hardware," nor does it even mean "chip."
I am not an indisputable computer virtuoso or an expert in any field therein related, but someone correct me if I am wrong w/re: the following statement:
The acronym CPU stands for Central Processing Unit.
Respectfully,
PEte
PS - Please don't stone me.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You need to read the next paragraph of that article, where he clearly states that "the quadrants" will not be updated at MWTY. This indicates that none of the current computer models will be revised or replaced at MWTY. Whether or not he is using "CPU" to mean "Central processing unit" or computer, is cleared up by this statement.
So, if there is new hardware, it will be either a digital device or new displays, not a revised Powerbook or a G5.
My guess is that he hears about the hardware a few weeks before it is released, but there is no way the guy is on the inside on everything. He's basically in charge of advertising for the entire hardware lineup (bar the iPod, maybe, who knows). It is my thought that he knows about a product when its gurranteed to be final, or a few final candidates so he can have his team come up with advertising schemes.</strong><hr></blockquote>
that's not exactly how advertising works. i know people who work at chiat/day and they know about the products sooner than you'd think. you can't just whip up ads in a couple weeks. you have to shoot the product at least a month in advance of when the ad will be released. if you're advertising in magazines, it's a lot earlier than that. you have to submit materials to most books at least a month in advance of their run.
so i would suspect he has pretty good advanced warning of when things are coming out. not to mention the fact that's he's probably not just some order taker. he has to strategically plan the communications for the company, so he should be aware of new products well before they ship so he can adjust his priorities appropriately. trust me, i work on a tech account and the client's ad team thinks about this stuff FAR in advance.
[quote] On another note, I think it's probably more pathetic how people think Apple's going to lose any significant amount of business based on MHZ. If you're theory on this had any validity, why is anyone buying Macs today? <hr></blockquote>
You have got to be kidding. Look at Apple's four hardware quadrants, consider which quadrants have high sales, and which ones have price/performance ratios that are at least in the ball park with AMD/Intel machines. The portable machines and the iMac have price/performance which is close to what's offered on PCs, and Apple can't make them fast enough. The Powermacs, on the other hand, sell poorly by comparison.
If the PMs had, say, dual 1.3-1.4GHz processors and a better bus, they'd stomp the crap out of anything the Intel world had to offer, but the plain fact is, they don't. And there are still a lot of people who "buy for the future", even though that's not as relevant now as it was just a few years ago.
This is going to be an uphill battle for Apple. They're going to have to demonstrate machines that can whip the competition (or at least compete) in benchmarks and applications that are used by more than a small portion of computer buyers (like RC5 & BLAST).
In short, its a rumor of a new G4 with RapidIO coming soon. I don't know how accurate this person is but I have read several times here and there that he (or she) has a pretty good track record with rumors coming true.
Comments
Nice try flame bait. Levinson is on the Board of Directors at Apple, which technically makes him one of the people that Steven Jobs reports to.
[quote]come on, even Time magazine had the story for months in advance.<hr></blockquote>
Nope. Time Magazines lead time is anywhere from one month to a couple of days. Its a weekly news magazine not a glossy monthly--despite what people may think about the quality of the writing.
<strong>Its not about what he or whoever knows...it is about what they said to make us think they know, even though I know that what they said was really not an opinion but "in the know" deterrance speak.......or maybe circumstances have permitted a change to the word on hardware 2 months ago?</strong><hr></blockquote>
1: yes, what he knows or doesn't is irrelevant.
2: nothing was said to make us think he knows (do you realise that you're basically accusing him of lying to impress you?).
3a: of course it was not an opinion; he was speaking in the role of Apple spokesperson - his opinions on anchovies or Katie Couric are irrelevant.
3b: "deterrance speak"? Yeah, he's just lying to throw you off the scent...(*sheesh*).
4: circumstances may have changed in the one month since he spoke, but that won't cause them to throw away their timeline just to surprise you.
But when the a top executive who works for Apple. Comes out and says specificaly "No new CPU's [comps] at Macworld Tokyo" I tend to believe him.
I've been watching the various threads attempting to pick apart Jozwiak's words from a month ago, observed everyone calling the other guy idiotic, sat quietly while illogical assumptions after illogical assumptions are taken as Given, and I haven't written anything. This one has gotten me a bit annoyed.
We all "heard" Jozwiak use the acronym "CPU." CPU does not _stand for_ the word "computer," nor does it replace the word "hardware," nor does it even mean "chip."
I am not an indisputable computer virtuoso or an expert in any field therein related, but someone correct me if I am wrong w/re: the following statement:
The acronym CPU stands for Central Processing Unit.
Respectfully,
PEte
PS - Please don't stone me.
is supposed to be a slam on me or not. Like I care.
[Edit] Ahh yea.. If someone seriously thinks that Apple is going to speed bump the PowerMac at Tokyo you should seek help. Wasn't the PowerMac the most recent Apple item to be updated?
iPod maybe, some new device, or Displays. I have heard from a wholesaler who was loking at my old powermac that I should expect some new displays down the line, but I can't imagine much else.
Software is always a possibility.
Don't wory Tokyo will be a cool show, but no way on the PowerMac this time.
[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: onlooker ]</p>
The acronym CPU stands for Central Processing Unit.[/QB]<hr></blockquote>Yes but often people use it to just mean computer. Marketing people often talk about selling a certain number of CPUs. I'm pretty sure they're not talking just about the central processing units - they're talking about the whole machine.
(you know who you are)
Give it up, no one bl00dy cares which one of you has a bigger d*ck. Drop the pissing contest already, neither of you knows A N Y T H I N G. Period. It's quite obvious, really. If you would each pull your head out for just one second you'd realize it. The fact that this battle isn't the first makes me think either you guys are 12yrs old, or you're the same person with a touch of multiple personality disorder ( I am leaning toward the former).
Speed bump, new configs, 10g iPod.. maybe maybe maybe..
Will be a good laugh the morning we're all watching MWTY.. we'll all be laughing at YOU, while SJ goes on about how much more 'zippy' OSX is now.
NEXT
<img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" /> <img src="graemlins/lol.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughing]" />
I am really hoping for the 10g iPod.. have a co-worker who tries very very hard to slag everything Apple does.. his latest is that Riot piece of junk.. all he can say is - "but it's 20gigs!"
<img src="graemlins/oyvey.gif" border="0" alt="[No]" />
This whole thread has become rediculous, and cluttered with clowns.
This dramatically highlights the desperation of the MHz gap. Apple is so far behind that Mac users really cannot comprehend reality. I know I can't. It's so bad now that one wonders how long Apple will remain in business if the current trend continues.
And yes, my dick is the biggest, that's why I have a 400 MHz G4....the less MHz you have, the bigger your dick is.
By the way...there is currently a price reduction on some tower configs.....
[ 03-13-2002: Message edited by: cytri ]</p>
True dat. The point here, folks, is that the executive said no new CPU's and no quandrant updates. The caveat here is the word marketing in his job title. He's got to sell what Apple is shipping NOW! A job made more difficult by the fact that many professional regard the DP 1GHz as not quite adequate enough to warrant a new computer purchase.
Could Apple release new/updated computers at MWT? Of course, they can. Will they? C'mon, lets be honest here....probably not. No reason to get all butt hurt about it...Apple WILL release some killer hardware soon..just be a bit more patient about it.
Apple has proven a willingness to update things between MW's, so the potential for a press release launch (like the iPod) or a splipstream update (DP 1 GHz) is possible. Besides, we've also got WWDC coming up, which would be a fitting time to release some heavy iron.
At any rate, you people should let the eternal optimists have their thread. Its certainly not hurting anyone and the moderators haven't seemed to object to the topic.
EDIT: "there is currently a price reduction on some tower configs" -really? I haven't seen any reductions. Linkage?
[ 03-13-2002: Message edited by: mslee ]</p>
<strong>This dramatically highlights the desperation of the MHz gap. Apple is so far behind that Mac users really cannot comprehend reality. I know I can't. It's so bad now that one wonders how long Apple will remain in business if the current trend continues.
And yes, my dick is the biggest, that's why I have a 400 MHz G4....the less MHz you have, the bigger your dick is.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Well, that's certainly a new twist to the MHZ Myth. Somehow, I doubt John Rubenstein will invite you on stage to demonstrate your version of the MHZ Myth.
On another note, I think it's probably more pathetic how people think Apple's going to lose any significant amount of business based on MHZ. If you're theory on this had any validity, why is anyone buying Macs today? The fact of the matter is that Mac OS X is pretty awesome and is only getting better as the kinks are worked out and more native software is becoming available. Further, the overall user experience is still much better than on Windows. Just look what you can do right out of the box with even just an iMac. Is the P4 faster at some things? Sure. If all you're doing is 3D Raytracing, you'll be better off on an Athlon or P4. However, a good portion of Apple's key market areas make heavy use of Altivec (Photoshop, Cleaner5, Final Cut Pro, DVD Studio Pro, all of the "iApps", etc. Further, the majority of business productivity apps are not exactly starved for CPU horsepower on todays machines. In short, for Apple's core market, the G4 performs much better than you give it credit for. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
Steve
[code]
Speed(GHz) - .edu/MSRP($) - delta($)
733 - 1202/NA - N/A
800 - 1453/1599 - 146
933 - 2071/2299 - 228
DP 1 (Faster) - 2719/2999 - 280
DP 1 (Ultimate) - 3753/4099 - 346
</pre><hr></blockquote>
These are the latest prices from the Apple Higher Education AppleStore for the PowerMac series.
Have fun!
[ 03-13-2002: Message edited by: mslee ]
[ 03-13-2002: Message edited by: mslee ]</p>
<strong>On another note, I think it's probably more pathetic how people think Apple's going to lose any significant amount of business based on MHZ. If you're theory on this had any validity, why is anyone buying Macs today? The fact of the matter is that Mac OS X is pretty awesome and is only getting better as the kinks are worked out and more native software is becoming available. Further, the overall user experience is still much better than on Windows. Just look what you can do right out of the box with even just an iMac. Is the P4 faster at some things? Sure. If all you're doing is 3D Raytracing, you'll be better off on an Athlon or P4. However, a good portion of Apple's key market areas make heavy use of Altivec (Photoshop, Cleaner5, Final Cut Pro, DVD Studio Pro, all of the "iApps", etc. Further, the majority of business productivity apps are not exactly starved for CPU horsepower on todays machines. In short, for Apple's core market, the G4 performs much better than you give it credit for. <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
Steve</strong><hr></blockquote>
Right on. Finally, someone whose actually thinking and making sense.
<strong>
We all "heard" Jozwiak use the acronym "CPU." CPU does not _stand for_ the word "computer," nor does it replace the word "hardware," nor does it even mean "chip."
I am not an indisputable computer virtuoso or an expert in any field therein related, but someone correct me if I am wrong w/re: the following statement:
The acronym CPU stands for Central Processing Unit.
Respectfully,
PEte
PS - Please don't stone me.</strong><hr></blockquote>
You need to read the next paragraph of that article, where he clearly states that "the quadrants" will not be updated at MWTY. This indicates that none of the current computer models will be revised or replaced at MWTY. Whether or not he is using "CPU" to mean "Central processing unit" or computer, is cleared up by this statement.
So, if there is new hardware, it will be either a digital device or new displays, not a revised Powerbook or a G5.
<strong>
My guess is that he hears about the hardware a few weeks before it is released, but there is no way the guy is on the inside on everything. He's basically in charge of advertising for the entire hardware lineup (bar the iPod, maybe, who knows). It is my thought that he knows about a product when its gurranteed to be final, or a few final candidates so he can have his team come up with advertising schemes.</strong><hr></blockquote>
that's not exactly how advertising works. i know people who work at chiat/day and they know about the products sooner than you'd think. you can't just whip up ads in a couple weeks. you have to shoot the product at least a month in advance of when the ad will be released. if you're advertising in magazines, it's a lot earlier than that. you have to submit materials to most books at least a month in advance of their run.
so i would suspect he has pretty good advanced warning of when things are coming out. not to mention the fact that's he's probably not just some order taker. he has to strategically plan the communications for the company, so he should be aware of new products well before they ship so he can adjust his priorities appropriately. trust me, i work on a tech account and the client's ad team thinks about this stuff FAR in advance.
[ 03-13-2002: Message edited by: admactanium ]</p>
You have got to be kidding. Look at Apple's four hardware quadrants, consider which quadrants have high sales, and which ones have price/performance ratios that are at least in the ball park with AMD/Intel machines. The portable machines and the iMac have price/performance which is close to what's offered on PCs, and Apple can't make them fast enough. The Powermacs, on the other hand, sell poorly by comparison.
If the PMs had, say, dual 1.3-1.4GHz processors and a better bus, they'd stomp the crap out of anything the Intel world had to offer, but the plain fact is, they don't. And there are still a lot of people who "buy for the future", even though that's not as relevant now as it was just a few years ago.
This is going to be an uphill battle for Apple. They're going to have to demonstrate machines that can whip the competition (or at least compete) in benchmarks and applications that are used by more than a small portion of computer buyers (like RC5 & BLAST).
I...I just bought a dual 1Ghz.
<a href="http://www.macedition.com/nmr/nmr_20020313.php"; target="_blank">http://www.macedition.com/nmr/nmr_20020313.php</a>;
In short, its a rumor of a new G4 with RapidIO coming soon. I don't know how accurate this person is but I have read several times here and there that he (or she) has a pretty good track record with rumors coming true.