New MacBook Air threatens both MacBook and MacBook Pro with Function Keys

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  • Reply 41 of 56
    dewmedewme Posts: 2,100member

    dewme said:
    Also the name "Air" itself makes sense when it was first came out. Now it doesn't since all Mac laptops are as light as "Air". This new MacBook Air is an odd ball.
    The Ford Mustang has wheels and not hooves. Odd.
    Haha. Reminds me of this:

    https://youtu.be/SmTh9fR3vVs

    I have a feeling they initially intended tended to kill the Air branding, but in their Mac soul search in the last couple years realized people *really* love the Air and the name recognition was worth it.  If they released it as a larger MB, people would be crying about how Apple killed their favorite Mac. The branding alone keeps that from happening and they sell millions more maybe, despite the fractured branding in the lineup. Another one of Tim’s “nice problem to have”.

    Agreed. The actual name is fairly meaningless. It's all about brand value, but it still requires proper care and feeding. As you allude to, brands can be destroyed through neglect or loss of authenticity between the product and the brand. Ford Mustang is actually a good case study in a brand that was abused by its owner, e.g., the Mustang II, where the product no longer lived up to the authenticity of the brand. A good brand can carry a bad product only for a short period of time and Ford was eventually able to recover with the follow-on generation Mustang 5.0 product. I think Apple stayed as true to the brand as they could with the MacBook Air. Rebranding the current MacBook as "Air" would not have worked regardless of how much the product weighed. The Air has a signature and Apple stayed with enough of the defining elements to stay true to the brand. My only mild concern about the new Air is how much I will like the feel of the 3rd gen BF keyboard and force touch trackpad. My gut feel is that there will be a adaptation or familiarization period and then I will not even think about it. When I moved from the 1st gen Magic TrackPad to the 2nd gen one it was "different" but after a few hours of use I never thought about it ever again. Having muscle memory about an interaction doesn't imply either good or bad. Once new memories are created we move on unimpeded.  
    fastasleep
  • Reply 42 of 56
    SoliSoli Posts: 8,985member
    tipoo said:
    It's the 12" that definitely looks to be on death row.
    What if the 12" MacBook was the first Mac to come with Apple's custom designed silicon. Not necessarily an A-series chip (in fact, I'd bet against that), but an ARM chip with a built-in Apple GPU and, say, 16 GiB RAM running macOS for less money and at much faster speed?

    Out of the gate there will be OS and app limitations, but that probably won't be an issue for those that are fine with an entry-level device.
  • Reply 43 of 56
    tipoo said:
    The 12" particularly seems on death row. Who would pay 100 dollars more, to lose Thunderbolt 3 and a port and have less power? All to save 0.75 pounds. 

    The 13" nTB Pro is a bit better positioned with more powerful processing, and I'm not sure if the Air screen has 500 nits and P3 like it? 
    Me. :)


    williamlondon
  • Reply 44 of 56
    chasm said:
    tipoo said:
    The 12" particularly seems on death row. Who would pay 100 dollars more, to lose Thunderbolt 3 and a port and have less power? All to save 0.75 pounds.
    While I'm not about to defend the MacBook because I agree with you that it needs either an overhaul or death, I do want to raise a point about the curious inclusion of TB3 on the MBA. Only power-nerds like us in this forum are going to care about this in the slightest, and we will make up an extremely tiny single-digit percentage of the buyers of the new MBA. Due to USB-C peripherals being considerably cheaper and their needs more than met by USB-C, I predict it would be extremely rare to see a genuine Thunderbolt 3 accessory attached to an MBA in the wild, ever.

    So the USB-C/TB3 argument is, I think, almost entirely moot to typical buyers, and so is the power argument IMO. MB and MBA buyers are not doing "heavy lifting" computer work by and large -- both models are popular with students, light-duty users, writers, social media/websurfing mavens, and people who carry their machine with them everywhere. So the difference in speed is as moot as the difference in TB3/USB-C, or indeed the difference in the number of ports (thanks to the battery life of both machines).

    Especially for the writer, the student, and the traveller, the weight is a very key issue, and on that front -- finally -- the MB still makes a compelling argument that either model of MBA cannot match. Thus, the MB will still appeal to some people. That said, the MB badly needs a rethink to increase its value proposition if it's going to do well enough to stick around.
    The new MBA is an excellent tool for business executives with its T2 security chip, and I think Apple will sell tens of thousands to the corporate world with support from IBM. So, that is the rationale of Thunderbolt, along with the T2 chip.

    The user profile you describe rather matches iPad’s.
    edited October 2018
  • Reply 45 of 56
    ne1ne1 Posts: 37member
    I thought so on the new MacBook Air. It competes with current MacBook and base MacBook Pro. It makes no sense. Also the name "Air" itself makes sense when it was first came out. Now it doesn't since all Mac laptops are as light as "Air". This new MacBook Air is an odd ball.
    They should really switch the names at some point— this new 13” machine should be called the MacBook and the lighter, 12” MacBook should be called the “Air.”

    That must drive their marketing department up a wall, as it does me. 
  • Reply 46 of 56
    ne1 said:
    I thought so on the new MacBook Air. It competes with current MacBook and base MacBook Pro. It makes no sense. Also the name "Air" itself makes sense when it was first came out. Now it doesn't since all Mac laptops are as light as "Air". This new MacBook Air is an odd ball.
    They should really switch the names at some point— this new 13” machine should be called the MacBook and the lighter, 12” MacBook should be called the “Air.”

    That must drive their marketing department up a wall, as it does me. 
    Nah, it's clear that:
    plain old MacBook is the entry-level bare-bones Mac.
    MacBook Air is the upgraded MacBook for business folks.
    MacBook Pro is the power user/developer MacBook.

    It's not really accurate to paint the MacBook as "more expensive" than the MacBook Air.  Like for like storage, the MacBook Air is $100 more.  The MacBook only looks more expensive because (for some odd reason) they don't offer a 128GB model.
    tht
  • Reply 47 of 56
    droodroo Posts: 23member
    This article misses a key selling point of the Air and I am concerned Apple has to. The MBA was perfect for ordinary academic workflow: small, light, cheap, versatile, nice keyboard, and because it didn’t have to power a retina screen, fast and long battery life. Now it has all the disadvantages of the MacBook, slow, no ports, bad keyboard, expensive, without the MacBook advantage of being tiny. 
    baconstangwilliamlondon
  • Reply 48 of 56
    chasm said:
    tipoo said:
    The 12" particularly seems on death row. Who would pay 100 dollars more, to lose Thunderbolt 3 and a port and have less power? All to save 0.75 pounds.
    While I'm not about to defend the MacBook because I agree with you that it needs either an overhaul or death, I do want to raise a point about the curious inclusion of TB3 on the MBA. Only power-nerds like us in this forum are going to care about this in the slightest, and we will make up an extremely tiny single-digit percentage of the buyers of the new MBA. Due to USB-C peripherals being considerably cheaper and their needs more than met by USB-C, I predict it would be extremely rare to see a genuine Thunderbolt 3 accessory attached to an MBA in the wild, ever.

    So the USB-C/TB3 argument is, I think, almost entirely moot to typical buyers, and so is the power argument IMO. MB and MBA buyers are not doing "heavy lifting" computer work by and large -- both models are popular with students, light-duty users, writers, social media/websurfing mavens, and people who carry their machine with them everywhere. So the difference in speed is as moot as the difference in TB3/USB-C, or indeed the difference in the number of ports (thanks to the battery life of both machines).

    Especially for the writer, the student, and the traveller, the weight is a very key issue, and on that front -- finally -- the MB still makes a compelling argument that either model of MBA cannot match. Thus, the MB will still appeal to some people. That said, the MB badly needs a rethink to increase its value proposition if it's going to do well enough to stick around.
    The new MBA is an excellent tool for business executives with its T2 security chip, and I think Apple will sell tens of thousands to the corporate world with support from IBM. So, that is the rationale of Thunderbolt, along with the T2 chip.

    The user profile you describe rather matches iPad’s.
    As a writer I want to use a real keyboard, not an iPads Smart Keyboard. I realise I could get an apple keyboard but when you then have those two devices to carry around together frankly I’d rather just a lightweight laptop like the MacBook. 
    williamlondon
  • Reply 49 of 56
    "..just through its being the cheapest model. There was nothing else that made the MacBook Air superior or more appealing than any other Apple portable"

    Apart from reliability, the best keyboard, SD card reader, a replaceable battery, magsafe and also being the best apple laptop for combat (wedge shape with decent weight).
    williamlondon
  • Reply 50 of 56
    chasm said:
    tipoo said:
    The 12" particularly seems on death row. Who would pay 100 dollars more, to lose Thunderbolt 3 and a port and have less power? All to save 0.75 pounds.
    While I'm not about to defend the MacBook because I agree with you that it needs either an overhaul or death, I do want to raise a point about the curious inclusion of TB3 on the MBA. Only power-nerds like us in this forum are going to care about this in the slightest, and we will make up an extremely tiny single-digit percentage of the buyers of the new MBA. Due to USB-C peripherals being considerably cheaper and their needs more than met by USB-C, I predict it would be extremely rare to see a genuine Thunderbolt 3 accessory attached to an MBA in the wild, ever.

    So the USB-C/TB3 argument is, I think, almost entirely moot to typical buyers, and so is the power argument IMO. MB and MBA buyers are not doing "heavy lifting" computer work by and large -- both models are popular with students, light-duty users, writers, social media/websurfing mavens, and people who carry their machine with them everywhere. So the difference in speed is as moot as the difference in TB3/USB-C, or indeed the difference in the number of ports (thanks to the battery life of both machines).

    Especially for the writer, the student, and the traveller, the weight is a very key issue, and on that front -- finally -- the MB still makes a compelling argument that either model of MBA cannot match. Thus, the MB will still appeal to some people. That said, the MB badly needs a rethink to increase its value proposition if it's going to do well enough to stick around.
    The new MBA is an excellent tool for business executives with its T2 security chip, and I think Apple will sell tens of thousands to the corporate world with support from IBM. So, that is the rationale of Thunderbolt, along with the T2 chip.

    The user profile you describe rather matches iPad’s.
    As a writer I want to use a real keyboard, not an iPads Smart Keyboard. I realise I could get an apple keyboard but when you then have those two devices to carry around together frankly I’d rather just a lightweight laptop like the MacBook. 
    You’re a pro ;-)

  • Reply 51 of 56
    Mike WuertheleMike Wuerthele Posts: 4,650administrator
    "..just through its being the cheapest model. There was nothing else that made the MacBook Air superior or more appealing than any other Apple portable"

    Apart from reliability, the best keyboard, SD card reader, a replaceable battery, magsafe and also being the best apple laptop for combat (wedge shape with decent weight).
    The MacBook Air has identical failure rates to the 2016 and 2017 MacBook Pro, including the latter's keyboard issues. I think the combat remark is legit, though :D
    edited November 2018
  • Reply 52 of 56
    If they were going to adjust an/or replace their current lineup, wouldn’t they have done that during the presentation?
  • Reply 53 of 56
    mac_128mac_128 Posts: 3,448member
    tipoo said:
    The 12" particularly seems on death row. Who would pay 100 dollars more, to lose Thunderbolt 3 and a port and have less power? All to save 0.75 pounds. 

    The 13" nTB Pro is a bit better positioned with more powerful processing, and I'm not sure if the Air screen has 500 nits and P3 like it? 
    Me. :)


    Where did you get that wireless iPhone dock? ;-)
    christopher126
  • Reply 54 of 56
    mac_128 said:
    tipoo said:
    The 12" particularly seems on death row. Who would pay 100 dollars more, to lose Thunderbolt 3 and a port and have less power? All to save 0.75 pounds. 

    The 13" nTB Pro is a bit better positioned with more powerful processing, and I'm not sure if the Air screen has 500 nits and P3 like it? 
    Me. :)


    Where did you get that wireless iPhone dock? ;-)
    Haha...I knew someone would pickup on that! :) However, I was thinking the comment would be something more related to 'mental illness.' :)

    I do plug it in to recharge every evening. It was more for effect than anything else! :)

    I'm hoping for the AirPower, (placed on my nightstand), so my iPhone, AppleWatch and AirPods will be charging from one 'wired' device! Life would be so grand!

    Then my desk will only have my MacBook! Yeah, I win! :)

    Best.
    edited November 2018
  • Reply 55 of 56
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 2,992member
    droo said:
    This article misses a key selling point of the Air and I am concerned Apple has to. The MBA was perfect for ordinary academic workflow: small, light, cheap, versatile, nice keyboard, and because it didn’t have to power a retina screen, fast and long battery life. Now it has all the disadvantages of the MacBook, slow, no ports, bad keyboard, expensive, without the MacBook advantage of being tiny. 
    Which color did you order?
  • Reply 56 of 56
    asciiascii Posts: 5,941member
    Microsoft is able to hide their fingerprint sensor in an ordinary looking key. I think this laptop would have looked better with that approach. The current appearance did suit the Touch Bar Macs though.


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