The US has been doing the same thing for decades. There is a Foriegn Technology Division in WPAFB in Ohio whose purpose is to reverse engineer Foriegn Technology! China has invested untold Billions of dollars in technology while the US has SPENT untold Billions on the military. If America had created the 5G technology first they would be pushing it to countries around the world (for spying as well ) and no one would have heard of Huawei.
OK, you China trolls that are showing up in spades. Here's a simple question that I invite any one of you to answer: Name one -- not two, not three, not four, just one -- product or service created/innovated by China in the past, let's say, three decades that has become a global product or service. I dare you to name one.
I'll wait.
That reminded me of the 'what have the Romans ever done for us?' in the Life of Brian. LOL.
But if we are ignoring what the Chinese gave to the world centuries ago and limiting scope to the last few decades, I'd say China is leading the way in technologies related to facial recognition and exporting them with success but what is perhaps more noteworthy is the progess it has made in innovation and technology during the last 30 years:
Joking apart, let's not forget that Huawei is going to be a major player in 5G and everything associated with the technologies that branch out from it.
Ah, I knew that ridiculous stuff like centuries old "chow mein" -- heck, I'll even grant you paper, porcelain, and gunpowder -- would be trotted out.
The only example you can come up with is a yet-to-be proven "..leading the way in in technologies related to facial recognition and exporting them with success...." How exactly are they leading the way except in building the surveillance state? Who are the companies doing this? What are their revenues? To whom are they exporting? What is the value of their exports? How does it compare with their $500B in Chinese exports to the US of other stuff that the rest of the world created or innovated?
Btw, do you know who came up with facial recognition technology, and where? (Hint: It's not China).
That's all you can come up with?! Did China come up with.... let me throw out a few random things from just the last 30 or so years... Laptops? Email? E-commerce? Search? Social networking? GUI? MRI? Flash memory? Lasers? Robotic surgery? DNA testing? RFID? Barcodes? Stents? Smartphones? Tablets? Biofuels? ATMs? LEDs? LCDs? GPS? Large scale wind turbines? PV cells? Digital photography?
If you go back a bit more, did China come up with world-changing things like Airplanes? Fiber optics? Internet? Software/programming languages? Automobiles? The internal combustion engine? Rockets? Satellites? Penicillin? The germ theory of disease? Open heart surgery? Semiconductors? Want me to go on? Want 20 more such examples? 50 more? 100 more?
Name ONE innovation from China -- OK, I'll expand it to the last 100 years -- that's in the same league as any of these. ONE. (I don't wish to single out China -- I'll take any Asian country as an example in the same league of innovative ability, if you can provide it).
Pathetic... please just slink away...
As I said, what is far more important is how they have progressed and where they might be heading over the coming decades. The document I linked to is quite informative. Especially the section on patents
Facial recognition technology is not something people want to speak openly about but Chinese tech is currently in testing or being used around the world in both the public and private sector. HiSilicon is also developing (well it has already deployed) custom AI silicon to advance the technology even further.
Facial recognition wasn't the only thing I mentioned. I also mentioned 5G and the possible developments arising from that.
You don’t even know that the correct term is Face Recognition. Google a bit to discover how the huge body of technical research papers (hundreds of them) use the terms.
FACIAL recognition is not FACE recognition. It can be used as a step in a face recognition process, but facial recognition is simply the process of identifying each feature of a face; eyes, nose, mouth, smiling, frowning, etc, but not used to determine whose face it is.
Facial recognition returns the result, here is the mouth and it is smiling, which is useful to map that feature onto the face of an avatar or game character, or useful in mapping an overlay onto the person's actual face, ala Memoji. But facial recognition does NOT return the result, 'this is Phil Schiller's face.' That biometric identification step is done by a method called face recognition. I know, I know, they sound the same. But facial recognition and face recognition, and face detection, are all three different things:
Face recognition is the term used to describe the process of identifying a specific person, such as from a database of known persons (no fly list, for example). This is face recognition.
There's also face detection, which is the process of detecting a human face, or faces, within a scene. This is typically a precursor to application of face recognition algorithms.
Then there's facial recognition, which is the process of detecting specific facial expressions (smiling, frowning, sadness, etc). This term is often used in the medical world to characterize specific inabilities of patients to recognize meaning in human faces. Or, I suppose, one could use the term facial recognition to mean the detection of someone who has recently come from a spa treatment appointment. (Kidding.)
And now you know the reason Apple calls the feature Face ID, and not Facial ID.
And by the way, if you want to know the origins, they date back to the 70s and 80s. My own brother filed a patent advancing face recognition as part of his Master thesis, applying blurring techniques and Fourier transforms that today are still used in the implementation of the function.
You are wrong again. I deliberately used facial recognition.
As new terminology comes into use it is important to understand how it is used.
In fact I never use the term 'face detection' or such like as, out of a purely field based context, it comes over as pompous.
Take a look around you and observe how language is used and try to avoid being pedantic. How many times do you see both terms being used? Rarely? Never?
This is why no challenges terms like 'LCD display'.
People have standardised on facial recognition and that is why I use it virtually exclusively.
In fact, 'facial recognition' from a purely English perspective is fine as a dual use term.
It is only necessary to differentiate between the two in a formal technical context which is almost never the case.
Lol. Let me know when an iphone shoots better pics than even the cheapest Huawei. For your info the best smartphone in the world is the Huawei Mate 20 pro.
As well it should be -- they steal their technologies from the best global companies, just like the other Chinese companies. The only thing China innovates at is spyware, viruses, malware, and oppressing their own people.
Perhaps you don't know much about this area of Huawei phones. They have a complete imaging research centre in Finland where most of Nokia's imaging division was absorbed into. Lens hardware is co-engineered with Leica and often Sony sensors are used. I've never read anything related to IP theft for imaging. Have you?
The US has been doing the same thing for decades. There is a Foriegn Technology Division in WPAFB in Ohio whose purpose is to reverse engineer Foriegn Technology! China has invested untold Billions of dollars in technology while the US has SPENT untold Billions on the military. If America had created the 5G technology first they would be pushing it to countries around the world (for spying as well ) and no one would have heard of Huawei.
OK, you China trolls that are showing up in spades. Here's a simple question that I invite any one of you to answer: Name one -- not two, not three, not four, just one -- product or service created/innovated by China in the past, let's say, three decades that has become a global product or service. I dare you to name one.
I'll wait.
I'll give you two... Fireworks, and the clock. Of course you have to go back three millennia to get those. Recently... they put a rover on the far side of the moon. I'll give them style points for that one.
I think the guy is talking about technology. You know stuff that's electric.
Also past 3 decades. Seems this challenge is hard for everyone.
Yeah I was making a joke dude. Note I said you had to go back three millienia, as in 3000 years. Lighten up.
On the bright side, seeing Avon B7 and GeorgeBMac trolling for Huawei and all the other rotten companies in the world at least tells us that the universe is on track so keep up your work you ███ ████ of ███.
At this point in time it should be clear to all that a very widespread and intense slur campaign is underway by the US government against Huawei.
Something is not a "slur campaign" if it's true.
That's true. But so far all we've seen is slur with no facts to back it up -- which makes it a slur campaign. Amazing that an administration that demands absolute, irrefutable proof of it's own crimes relies on hear-say, speculation and prophesying when condemning others.
So then it's only a "slur campaign" that Russian worked to help Trump win, since despite all the US intelligence agencies saying this was so, they did not provide the evidence to the world.
On the bright side, seeing Avon B7 and GeorgeBMac trolling for Huawei and all the other rotten companies in the world at least tells us that the universe is on track so keep up your work you xxxxx pieces of xxxx
I think morality, immorality or amorality can only come into the debate when something is proven.
Until then how can you even begin to judge things? Or do you already know?
Or are you simply judging others and throwing insults around?
While Huawei has clearly been drawn into a political net - against its will - and I don't want to go too far away from Huawei related issues (even if they do inevitably touch politics because of the situation), there is one thing which is first and foremost: all anyone has is allegations.
Don't lose sight of that fact.
What is amoral about expecting to see some real information before reaching conclusions?
"In the following days, Chinese student groups published a “bulletin report” about Turdush’s talk. The bulletin, which was co-signed by five McMaster student groups, including the Chinese Students and Scholars Association (CSSA), noted contact with the Chinese Consulate in Toronto."
Chinese students; yet another front of the CCP.
Hard to imagine why people would question that a "private" company, Huawei, run by Chinese Communist Party members would be considered a national security risk, yet here we are with yet more Huawei support from posters.
Students ratting out their brethren to the Chinese Consulate in Canada is a line crossed.
The fact that China/CCP is so militant against any real or perceived criticism of their totalitarian state is such a strong tell. They're jack-boot thugs.
At this point in time it should be clear to all that a very widespread and intense slur campaign is underway by the US government against Huawei.
Something is not a "slur campaign" if it's true.
That's true. But so far all we've seen is slur with no facts to back it up -- which makes it a slur campaign. Amazing that an administration that demands absolute, irrefutable proof of it's own crimes relies on hear-say, speculation and prophesying when condemning others.
Don’t know where you live or what legal systems you’re used to, but “Slur with no facts” would hardly be consistent with a Canadian court arresting and holding this lady for extradition to the US.
Get real, instead of siding with the fake news brigade. You just come off sounding very stupid, which I am sure you’re not.
canadien's only arrested her at the request of the U.S. -- not because there was any evidence of her or Huawei's wrong doing. Essentialy, the U.S. wants to hold her as a hostage in their trade war.
That's your opinion, not a fact. The authorities say she sold tech to Iran. Until it works thru due process we simply won't know. Your opinion is not fact.
The US has been doing the same thing for decades. There is a Foriegn Technology Division in WPAFB in Ohio whose purpose is to reverse engineer Foriegn Technology! China has invested untold Billions of dollars in technology while the US has SPENT untold Billions on the military. If America had created the 5G technology first they would be pushing it to countries around the world (for spying as well ) and no one would have heard of Huawei.
OK, you China trolls that are showing up in spades. Here's a simple question that I invite any one of you to answer: Name one -- not two, not three, not four, just one -- product or service created/innovated by China in the past, let's say, three decades that has become a global product or service. I dare you to name one.
I'll wait.
That reminded me of the 'what have the Romans ever done for us?' in the Life of Brian. LOL.
But if we are ignoring what the Chinese gave to the world centuries ago and limiting scope to the last few decades, I'd say China is leading the way in technologies related to facial recognition and exporting them with success but what is perhaps more noteworthy is the progess it has made in innovation and technology during the last 30 years:
Joking apart, let's not forget that Huawei is going to be a major player in 5G and everything associated with the technologies that branch out from it.
Ah, I knew that ridiculous stuff like centuries old "chow mein" -- heck, I'll even grant you paper, porcelain, and gunpowder -- would be trotted out.
The only example you can come up with is a yet-to-be proven "..leading the way in in technologies related to facial recognition and exporting them with success...." How exactly are they leading the way except in building the surveillance state? Who are the companies doing this? What are their revenues? To whom are they exporting? What is the value of their exports? How does it compare with their $500B in Chinese exports to the US of other stuff that the rest of the world created or innovated?
Btw, do you know who came up with facial recognition technology, and where? (Hint: It's not China).
That's all you can come up with?! Did China come up with.... let me throw out a few random things from just the last 30 or so years... Laptops? Email? E-commerce? Search? Social networking? GUI? MRI? Flash memory? Lasers? Robotic surgery? DNA testing? RFID? Barcodes? Stents? Smartphones? Tablets? Biofuels? ATMs? LEDs? LCDs? GPS? Large scale wind turbines? PV cells? Digital photography?
If you go back a bit more, did China come up with world-changing things like Airplanes? Fiber optics? Internet? Software/programming languages? Automobiles? The internal combustion engine? Rockets? Satellites? Penicillin? The germ theory of disease? Open heart surgery? Semiconductors? Want me to go on? Want 20 more such examples? 50 more? 100 more?
Name ONE innovation from China -- OK, I'll expand it to the last 100 years -- that's in the same league as any of these. ONE. (I don't wish to single out China -- I'll take any Asian country as an example in the same league of innovative ability, if you can provide it).
Pathetic... please just slink away...
As I said, what is far more important is how they have progressed and where they might be heading over the coming decades. The document I linked to is quite informative. Especially the section on patents
Facial recognition technology is not something people want to speak openly about but Chinese tech is currently in testing or being used around the world in both the public and private sector. HiSilicon is also developing (well it has already deployed) custom AI silicon to advance the technology even further.
Facial recognition wasn't the only thing I mentioned. I also mentioned 5G and the possible developments arising from that.
You don’t even know that the correct term is Face Recognition. Google a bit to discover how the huge body of technical research papers (hundreds of them) use the terms.
FACIAL recognition is not FACE recognition. It can be used as a step in a face recognition process, but facial recognition is simply the process of identifying each feature of a face; eyes, nose, mouth, smiling, frowning, etc, but not used to determine whose face it is.
Facial recognition returns the result, here is the mouth and it is smiling, which is useful to map that feature onto the face of an avatar or game character, or useful in mapping an overlay onto the person's actual face, ala Memoji. But facial recognition does NOT return the result, 'this is Phil Schiller's face.' That biometric identification step is done by a method called face recognition. I know, I know, they sound the same. But facial recognition and face recognition, and face detection, are all three different things:
Face recognition is the term used to describe the process of identifying a specific person, such as from a database of known persons (no fly list, for example). This is face recognition.
There's also face detection, which is the process of detecting a human face, or faces, within a scene. This is typically a precursor to application of face recognition algorithms.
Then there's facial recognition, which is the process of detecting specific facial expressions (smiling, frowning, sadness, etc). This term is often used in the medical world to characterize specific inabilities of patients to recognize meaning in human faces. Or, I suppose, one could use the term facial recognition to mean the detection of someone who has recently come from a spa treatment appointment. (Kidding.)
And now you know the reason Apple calls the feature Face ID, and not Facial ID.
And by the way, if you want to know the origins, they date back to the 70s and 80s. My own brother filed a patent advancing face recognition as part of his Master thesis, applying blurring techniques and Fourier transforms that today are still used in the implementation of the function.
In fact, 'facial recognition' from a purely English perspective is fine as a dual use term.
Not really. 'Biometric authentication' is correct, 'biometrical authentication' is not. People say facial recognition because they're heard it a million times. Doesn't mean it's correct, just as like you say 'ATM machine' is incorrect, or 'heads-up display' instead of 'head-up display', etc..
On the bright side, seeing Avon B7 and GeorgeBMac trolling for Huawei and all the other rotten companies in the world at least tells us that the universe is on track so keep up your work you xxxxx pieces of xxxx
I think morality, immorality or amorality can only come into the debate when something is proven.
Until then how can you even begin to judge things? Or do you already know?
Or are you simply judging others and throwing insults around?
We've all been here long enough to recognize a brand shill when we see one. One who constantly moves goalposts and other mental gymnastics to keep his argument going. It's been commented on for the past year or two since your persona arrived on this Apple-centric site to introduce into topic after topic how wonderful the "Ripoff Mate X" is, etc etc. Don't knock us for conclusions based on observed behavior.
On the bright side, seeing Avon B7 and GeorgeBMac trolling for Huawei and all the other rotten companies in the world at least tells us that the universe is on track so keep up your work you ███ ████ of ███.
At this point in time it should be clear to all that a very widespread and intense slur campaign is underway by the US government against Huawei.
Something is not a "slur campaign" if it's true.
That's true. But so far all we've seen is slur with no facts to back it up -- which makes it a slur campaign. Amazing that an administration that demands absolute, irrefutable proof of it's own crimes relies on hear-say, speculation and prophesying when condemning others.
So then it's only a "slur campaign" that Russian worked to help Trump win, since despite all the US intelligence agencies saying this was so, they did not provide the evidence to the world.
On the bright side, seeing Avon B7 and GeorgeBMac trolling for Huawei and all the other rotten companies in the world at least tells us that the universe is on track so keep up your work you xxxxx pieces of xxxx
I think morality, immorality or amorality can only come into the debate when something is proven.
Until then how can you even begin to judge things? Or do you already know?
Or are you simply judging others and throwing insults around?
We've all been here long enough to recognize a brand shill when we see one. One who constantly moves goalposts and other mental gymnastics to keep his argument going. It's been commented on for the past year or two since your persona arrived on this Apple-centric site to introduce into topic after topic how wonderful the "Ripoff Mate X" is, etc etc. Don't knock us for conclusions based on observed behavior.
Well you need to improve your observational skills then because you are wrong. Not only about me but pretty much everything you have said about Huawei in the past. If not absolutely everything!-+
It would help if you actually knew something about the company before passing your brush strokes all over it and drawing conclusions, especially as there is no 'observed behaviour' to go on. In reality you are looking at minute aspects of a massive company and literally ignoring the rest - because that simply doesn't interest you. You are picking up on allegations and passing judgement. So much for the facts! Why wait for those pesky details!
Haven't you exhausted your rip off, knock-off etc catalogue yet? LOL.
There are rumours circulating (and picked up by AI) on a future iPhone that seems to be a lost twin of the Mate 20 Pro (wireless reverse charging included). Food for thought, eh?
Don't worry, I won't be charging around screaming 'rip-off!' if that phone becomes reality. Just like I haven't charged around reminding people how completely wrong they were on Huawei in regards to Apple. I let the facts speak for themselves.
I have no need to move goalposts or mental gymnastics because I don't make outlandish claims or use hyperbole.
I don't profess to be 'right' when I speculate but mostly I have been right. That's how it goes sometimes but I try not to dig holes for myself all the same.
The Globe and Mail is an anti-US rag. Moreover, it's not a serious court case, just a journalist spouting stuff. Journalists can -- and do -- say anything (in countries where such things as free speech are allowed).
Sure, let's wait to hear both sides. Wait first for the extradition to be completed (Step 1). The facts will start to roll out. It's going to become very quickly uncomfortable for Huawei (Step 2). My popcorn is ordered.
You can't commit a crime against an illegal enterprise -- and the world has recognized that the U.S. is on the wrong side of this whole affair. Several European countries are in the process of establishing their own financial systems independent of the U.S.'s to get around this nonsense.
Get in touch when that happens.
It's happening. Try to keep up.
Just making up stuff, aren't you? Show us who is "...establishing their own financial systems independent of the U.S.'s to get around this nonsense..", where, and what the progress is. Just one credible example will do.
The Globe and Mail is an anti-US rag. Moreover, it's not a serious court case, just a journalist spouting stuff. Journalists can -- and do -- say anything (in countries where such things as free speech are allowed).
Sure, let's wait to hear both sides. Wait first for the extradition to be completed (Step 1). The facts will start to roll out. It's going to become very quickly uncomfortable for Huawei (Step 2). My popcorn is ordered.
You can't commit a crime against an illegal enterprise -- and the world has recognized that the U.S. is on the wrong side of this whole affair. Several European countries are in the process of establishing their own financial systems independent of the U.S.'s to get around this nonsense.
Get in touch when that happens.
It's happening. Try to keep up.
Just making up stuff, aren't you? Show us who is "...establishing their own financial systems independent of the U.S.'s to get around this nonsense..", where, and what the progress is. Just one credible example will do.
The Globe and Mail is an anti-US rag. Moreover, it's not a serious court case, just a journalist spouting stuff. Journalists can -- and do -- say anything (in countries where such things as free speech are allowed).
Sure, let's wait to hear both sides. Wait first for the extradition to be completed (Step 1). The facts will start to roll out. It's going to become very quickly uncomfortable for Huawei (Step 2). My popcorn is ordered.
You can't commit a crime against an illegal enterprise -- and the world has recognized that the U.S. is on the wrong side of this whole affair. Several European countries are in the process of establishing their own financial systems independent of the U.S.'s to get around this nonsense.
Get in touch when that happens.
It's happening. Try to keep up.
Just making up stuff, aren't you? Show us who is "...establishing their own financial systems independent of the U.S.'s to get around this nonsense..", where, and what the progress is. Just one credible example will do.
Otherwise, you really should put a lid on it.
Europe. I guess Faux didn't report that huh?
Umm... "Europe" what? Whom? Where? When? What financial systems?
What is the role of the USD as a reserve currency and how has that changed?
Comments
As new terminology comes into use it is important to understand how it is used.
In fact I never use the term 'face detection' or such like as, out of a purely field based context, it comes over as pompous.
Take a look around you and observe how language is used and try to avoid being pedantic. How many times do you see both terms being used? Rarely? Never?
This is why no challenges terms like 'LCD display'.
People have standardised on facial recognition and that is why I use it virtually exclusively.
In fact, 'facial recognition' from a purely English perspective is fine as a dual use term.
It is only necessary to differentiate between the two in a formal technical context which is almost never the case.
Until then how can you even begin to judge things? Or do you already know?
Or are you simply judging others and throwing insults around?
While Huawei has clearly been drawn into a political net - against its will - and I don't want to go too far away from Huawei related issues (even if they do inevitably touch politics because of the situation), there is one thing which is first and foremost: all anyone has is allegations.
Don't lose sight of that fact.
What is amoral about expecting to see some real information before reaching conclusions?
The fact that China/CCP is so militant against any real or perceived criticism of their totalitarian state is such a strong tell. They're jack-boot thugs.
Not really. 'Biometric authentication' is correct, 'biometrical authentication' is not. People say facial recognition because they're heard it a million times. Doesn't mean it's correct, just as like you say 'ATM machine' is incorrect, or 'heads-up display' instead of 'head-up display', etc..
We've all been here long enough to recognize a brand shill when we see one. One who constantly moves goalposts and other mental gymnastics to keep his argument going. It's been commented on for the past year or two since your persona arrived on this Apple-centric site to introduce into topic after topic how wonderful the "Ripoff Mate X" is, etc etc. Don't knock us for conclusions based on observed behavior.
It would help if you actually knew something about the company before passing your brush strokes all over it and drawing conclusions, especially as there is no 'observed behaviour' to go on. In reality you are looking at minute aspects of a massive company and literally ignoring the rest - because that simply doesn't interest you. You are picking up on allegations and passing judgement. So much for the facts! Why wait for those pesky details!
Haven't you exhausted your rip off, knock-off etc catalogue yet? LOL.
There are rumours circulating (and picked up by AI) on a future iPhone that seems to be a lost twin of the Mate 20 Pro (wireless reverse charging included). Food for thought, eh?
Don't worry, I won't be charging around screaming 'rip-off!' if that phone becomes reality. Just like I haven't charged around reminding people how completely wrong they were on Huawei in regards to Apple. I let the facts speak for themselves.
I have no need to move goalposts or mental gymnastics because I don't make outlandish claims or use hyperbole.
I don't profess to be 'right' when I speculate but mostly I have been right. That's how it goes sometimes but I try not to dig holes for myself all the same.
What are your qualifications?