California tables Right to Repair bill following pressure from Apple, others

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 29
    rogifan_newrogifan_new Posts: 4,297member
    Nobody cares about this except DIY geeks and sites like iFixit that make money off of selling repair kits/parts.
  • Reply 22 of 29
    doggonedoggone Posts: 386member
    avon b7 said:

    My credit card (with EMV chips) is sent to me by regular post. It use useless until I activate it.

    Not true, I had credit card (with EMV) delivery stolen from my mailbox.  Very quickly I started seeing charges on my account.  Whilst the bank reversed the charges, the perp was obviously able to get some use out of the card for a few days. I had to change my bank accounts since this card was associated with these.  Major pain in the ass and wasted a lot of my time.
    The EMV system makes it harder to steal CC information.  However the lack of a PIN requirement makes it just as easy as the older CC types once the card is stolen or compromised.  The chip and pin system has been in place in Europe for over 10 years and its only in the 2 in the States that the system has become available. This lack of security costs the customers BILLIONS of dollars a year in higher interest rates and vendor fees.  I personally think that is more important to fix than whether customers have more choices for repairing phones.

    On the point of screen repairs.  There are multiple places to get your screen fixed outside of Apple so that option exists.  Battery replacements is a moot point now that Apple offers a $29 replacement program.  As for other components, I would prefer Apple to do it.  They would repair it well and also recycle the used parts.
  • Reply 23 of 29
    doggonedoggone Posts: 386member
    Avon B7 said
    Lithium batteries are totally safe under normal conditions. They are designed to be safe. The problem is perforation and perforation (during repair) occurs because they are difficult to remove - by design. Not battery design but phone design.

    Tell that to the guy I know who had his house half burnt down when a lithium battery exploded.  It was for a radio controlled car and it caught fire whilst charging.  They spent 6 months in hotels whilst the house was repaired. 
    Point being is that if cheap knock off batteries are used in a repair the risk to the customer is higher.  You know that will happen and then Apple will be sued for something beyond their control.  They won't win but it will be bad press and spread the notion that Apple's product are unsafe.
  • Reply 24 of 29
    If repairability is a feature in great demand then I’m sure some enterprising innovator will create a mobile phone that the world will buy. 
    So you repairablity guys get on it make your billions by creating something. 
  • Reply 25 of 29
    davgregdavgreg Posts: 1,039member
    Nice gig Apple has, selling themselves as green while designing in planned obsolescence and unrepairable devices. That and the flying of devices from China. Love to see the carbon footprint of anything Apple sells.


    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 26 of 29
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 7,881member
    doggone said:
    avon b7 said:

    My credit card (with EMV chips) is sent to me by regular post. It use useless until I activate it.

    Not true, I had credit card (with EMV) delivery stolen from my mailbox.  Very quickly I started seeing charges on my account.  Whilst the bank reversed the charges, the perp was obviously able to get some use out of the card for a few days. I had to change my bank accounts since this card was associated with these.  Major pain in the ass and wasted a lot of my time.
    The EMV system makes it harder to steal CC information.  However the lack of a PIN requirement makes it just as easy as the older CC types once the card is stolen or compromised.  The chip and pin system has been in place in Europe for over 10 years and its only in the 2 in the States that the system has become available. This lack of security costs the customers BILLIONS of dollars a year in higher interest rates and vendor fees.  I personally think that is more important to fix than whether customers have more choices for repairing phones.

    On the point of screen repairs.  There are multiple places to get your screen fixed outside of Apple so that option exists.  Battery replacements is a moot point now that Apple offers a $29 replacement program.  As for other components, I would prefer Apple to do it.  They would repair it well and also recycle the used parts.
    Sorry. It is true. My card is useless until I activate it. In fact I can also suspend it at will and at any time and later reactivate it at will - and with no charge for the service.

    Until it is activated I am not even liable for the under 20€ pinless charges.

    On top of that I get real time notifications for every single charge to the card.

    If you had problems, your card probably shipped pre-activated.
  • Reply 27 of 29
    avon b7avon b7 Posts: 7,881member
    doggone said:
    Avon B7 said
    Lithium batteries are totally safe under normal conditions. They are designed to be safe. The problem is perforation and perforation (during repair) occurs because they are difficult to remove - by design. Not battery design but phone design.

    Tell that to the guy I know who had his house half burnt down when a lithium battery exploded.  It was for a radio controlled car and it caught fire whilst charging.  They spent 6 months in hotels whilst the house was repaired. 
    Point being is that if cheap knock off batteries are used in a repair the risk to the customer is higher.  You know that will happen and then Apple will be sued for something beyond their control.  They won't win but it will be bad press and spread the notion that Apple's product are unsafe.
    Let me qualify it with some 'stating the obvious'. Lithium batteries built to certified status (those imposed by law at the very least) are perfectly safe. Safe as a technology!

    Even the best designed battery could run into problems at some point if a defective component causes a failure.

    But, and here is the most important point, it still wouldn't change the claim: lithium batteries are perfectly safe - as a technology.

    You have usage situations that must also be complied with - like not sticking a screwdriver in it. Not exposing it to extreme heat. Using a certified charger etc.

    Your example is like claiming microwave ovens are unsafe because one short circuited and burnt down the house.

    Your example also points to the charger being a possible cause of the fire. Not that that would have any impact on what I wrote anyway.

    .
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 28 of 29
    lorin schultzlorin schultz Posts: 2,771member
    xixo said:
    I'm thinking of all those dead auto mechanics killed in gas tank and lead-acid battery explosions, especially since those two items are factors of magnitude more dangerous than a cellphone.
    A former co-worker died last year when his vehicle fell on him while he was working on it. The manufacturer of the vehicle is not liable for this. Why would Apple be liable for someone puncturing a battery?

    It's a bullshit argument.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 29 of 29
    charlitunacharlituna Posts: 7,217member
    DAalseth said:
    Eventually this will get passed. Then a few weeks later someone will try to fix his phone himself, will perforate the battery, and then it will burst into flame in his face. The next thing will be he sues. 
    because of things like that I think that the law should have some guidelines. i haven't seen any so far. it's just 'you will let folks fix their stuff and you will sell them what's required to do so.' And i can totally see Apple flipping out over something like that. 

    some of the things that I could see being added that might not be viewed as heinous by Apple etc might be:

    Apple doesn't have to provide tools and parts in their retail stores. You want it, you contact Apple Care
    Apple might not have to sell to individuals if they relax their certification program for shops. as I hear it's pretty costly to get and stay certified which is why so many places don't do it. 
    Apple doesn't have to service devices after an individual has done their own, particularly in regards to fixing an individual screw up. 
    Apple is not held liable for any injury etc that might result from an individual doing his/her own repair unless it can be proven that the tool, part or instructions were at fault. so like they sell a faulty battery that catches fire, that's on them. the individual, after being given multiple warnings in the instructions, leaves a loose screw in the body of the device and it punctures the battery etc, that's on the individual. 
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