now it is IBM and graphics card maker...another piece of the puzzel??

thegelding · March 26, 2003 7:44AM

go here

if nothing else...big blue seems to be on a roll...wonder what's being discussed at those intel board meetings these days?

g

hmurchison · March 26, 2003 8:52AM

Ca'ching! IBM is going to get Fishkill running and generating profits. I expect to see IBM get some more wins for Fishkill in the near future. They didn't spend 2.5billion for nothing. Very suprising.

onlooker · March 26, 2003 9:02AM

Freakin kewl! Now, what does this mean for Apple if anything? I guess nothing. But it would be nice to have an awesome QuatroFX Highend 3D card with some serious hardware rendering capability to go along with some new PowerMac's.

programmer · March 26, 2003 9:10AM

All this means is that IBM doesn't want Fishkill sitting idle. Ever.

bigc · March 26, 2003 9:17AM

manufacturing Xilinx chips too. Now, where did I recently see some Xilinx chips...

zapchud · March 26, 2003 9:18AM

Quote:

Originally posted by onlooker

Freakin kewl! Now, what does this mean for Apple if anything? I guess nothing. But it would be nice to have an awesome GeforceFX Highend 3D card with some serious hardware rendering capability to go along with some new PowerMac's.

<offtopic>AAAAArrrrghhh, not a GeForce FX!! Noisy, expensive, power hungry, ugly, and not too impressing overall. Gimme something different, like the Radeon 9700/9800, or newer generation. </offtopic>

I agree with Programmer, IBM just wishes to milk the opportunity. Not good having an idle production site, or unused capacity!

onlooker · March 26, 2003 9:30AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by r-0X#Zapchud

[B]<offtopic>AAAAArrrrghhh, not a GeForce FX!! Noisy, expensive, power hungry, ugly, and not too impressing overall. Gimme something different, like the Radeon 9700/9800, or newer generation. </offtopic>

You missed my edit by about a second. I was refering to a Nvidia QuadroFX, (1000, 2000 too bad I can't afford it after buying the software I would use it with) but an ATI 9800 Pro would be nice but how long until ATI brings it to us? We'll be two card lineups behind by then, and we'll want something new.

zapchud · March 26, 2003 10:03AM

AFAIK, the difference between the nVidia Quadro-series and the GeForce series, is some simple hardware or software "lock", that prevents the GeForce to perform like it's capable of in the applications pro's use. This is/was PC-side only, and therefore there is/was a performance advantage in apps like Maya when using a GeForce on the mac compared to on the PC. I don't know if this is the case with the newer GeForces/Quadros.

Either this is true, or more than one person fooled me bigtime. Can someone confirm?

tom west · March 26, 2003 10:12AM

Of course, the glass half empty way of looking at it is if the Fishkill plant reaches 100% capacity and there are more contracts waiting to go, it makes sense to eliminate the least profitable lines.

This means either boosting the 970 price so that IBM makes more money on the chip than most of the other chips in the plant, or ending 970 production as "not profitable enough".

This is why (if at all possible) Apple must not utterly depend on IBM. IBM doesn't *need* the 970. The "Die, Motorola, Die!" sentiment is completely destructive to Apple.

I don't think it's likely to happen (although there are indications that Fishkill is reaching total capacity usage rather faster than anyone anticipated), but it's certainly something to be aware of.

yevgeny · March 26, 2003 10:23AM

Really folks, IBM has more clients than Apple. Just because they are doing something does NOT mean that they are doing it for Apple. The problem is that you need to sift all the tech news for info that actually applies to Apple. Most of the people at this forum just take all the tech news noise out there and assume that it is all good signal. This produces some odd results. You need to understand that there is alot of noise- tech news that has very little to do with Apple- and to weed out this news when making bold predictions about the next thing that Apple is going to bring out. Learn to differentiate the signal from the noise (last time I heard, this is what human beings are supposed to be good at).

henriok · March 26, 2003 10:26AM

I think it's goning to take a while to saturate Fishkill. It's a new plant designed for the future. They might have just a few production lines right now, but it's designed to grow. These news are good news in my book.

leonis · March 26, 2003 10:30AM

Also IBM does make LCDs.....if I am not mistaken

So if the CPU, graphic chip, even display panel are all from IBM....

....should we call the next PowerMac the IBM workstation?

kidred · March 26, 2003 10:39AM

Quote:

Originally posted by r-0X#Zapchud

<offtopic>AAAAArrrrghhh, not a GeForce FX!! Noisy, expensive, power hungry, ugly, and not too impressing overall. Gimme something different, like the Radeon 9700/9800, or newer generation. </offtopic>

I agree with Programmer, IBM just wishes to milk the opportunity. Not good having an idle production site, or unused capacity!

Say what you want but the GF4MX was beating the GFTi and the 8500 is a few tests.

hmurchison · March 26, 2003 10:45AM

Having Fishkill remain busy will only benefit Apple.

IBM is betting ALOT on the PPC 970. Not just for Apple but for Linux PPC. They're competing with low cost Intel based boxes. IBM will have to crank out the chips as fast as they can make them.

Any news that IBM is one step closer to maximizing profitability for Fishkill is great news in my book.

This is so different from Motorola who shunned taking on any new work.

zapchud · March 26, 2003 10:45AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KidRed

Say what you want but the GF4MX was beating the GFTi and the 8500 is a few tests.

I'm sorry, but I am not getting your point here... (Sarcasm/irony maybe?)

tom west · March 26, 2003 12:04PM

Quote:

IBM is betting ALOT on the PPC 970. Not just for Apple but for Linux PPC. They're competing with low cost Intel based boxes. IBM will have to crank out the chips as fast as they can make them.

Now this is something I've heard a lot lately and I don't understand the reasoning.

First, who the heck is going to buy a Linux PPC? Second, competing on price kills you. Seen AMD's bottom line lately? Small wonder that AMD keeps muttering about getting out of the processor market into something where they can make money...

Nobody (Transmeta, etc.) makes money in the desktop processor market except Intel.

If IBM is really depending on the 970 being successful in the mainstream, we're doomed. There's just no way that the 970 will displace Intel and if that's the way success will be measured for the 970, expect it to be cancelled within 3 years. (Or does no-one remember all the .com's. "We'll own the market within three years or bust." Guess what happened.)

I am desperately hoping that the 970 is a boutique processor. One designed and made on the cheap (but with decent performance) that can be marketed profitably with a million or so sales a year. If that's what IBM is expecting, then the 970 should have a long and fruitful life.

placebo · March 26, 2003 2:29PM

I think that the 970 is good for many applications, including scientific and others, because of its low cost, scalability, speed, and power consumption. What most people don't appreciate is that when you have 400 or so chips crunching data 24/7, the electricity bill is not something to scoff at.

With Xeons/Itaniums/Power5s, the procesing power to power consumption ratio is not as good as one might expect.

eugene · March 26, 2003 3:36PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Leonis

Also IBM does make LCDs.....if I am not mistaken

So if the CPU, graphic chip, even display panel are all from IBM....

....should we call the next PowerMac the IBM workstation?

IBM makes practically everything. That's why their stock is so much more stable than other tech stocks...

bluerabbit · March 26, 2003 3:51PM

Could this be why Apple put the GeForce4 in the new powerbooks?

mooseman · March 26, 2003 5:09PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tom West

I am desperately hoping that the 970 is a boutique processor. One designed and made on the cheap (but with decent performance) that can be marketed profitably with a million or so sales a year. If that's what IBM is expecting, then the 970 should have a long and fruitful life.

...I hope they aren't planning on selling just a million a year. Apple sells over 3million PCs a year. Apple sold a hundred and something thousand PMs last quarter, which is waaaayyy off the 250,000 or so they were selling per quarter, and with the Dual 867/1.0/1.25s that means 250,000 G4s alone just in PMs, or well over 1m a year, just in PMs, not counting PowerBooks, iMac, eMacs, etc.

I would think Apple will be selling upwards of 5-6 million 970s a year by themselve once their entire line is revamped over he next year or year and a half.

So, if IBM is selling Linux workstations, putting them in blades, all the way up to the big iron when the Power5 arrives, IBM could be selling upwards of 10million 980s/Power5s a year.

So, I hope that IBM is considering and investing in the 970 as more than just a boutique processor.

dobby · March 26, 2003 5:44PM

Article related topic deviation -

The article said the IBM plant was in East Fishkill NY.

Who on earth selects the place names!

Sorry for the interruption.

Dobby.

now it is IBM and graphics card maker...another piece of the puzzel??

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