Unbelievable -- is everyone in here an Apple shareholder?
There's no other possible explanation for people begging on their knees to be restricted of their freedom to install any apps they please on their own device, paid for by them.
I can only speak for myself, but when I got my first iPhone, a 4s, I had a pretty good idea of what I was getting into, which is a package deal of sorts. I knew the App Store was an integral part of the iPhone, love it or leave it. If there was app that I absolutely needed that I could not obtain through the App Store but was available on the Android platform, I would consider switching to that platform or carrying multiple phones, which I'd been doing for years anyway because I never used my work phone for personal business.
Freedom? Yes, I exercised my freedom of choice and selected the product that best fit my needs and budget. There's nothing theoretical or philosophical behind my product choices, it's all about finding the best fit and doing a little upfront research to get a handle on what each choice offers. If I discovered after the fact that I had made the wrong choice, that having the "Any" app on my phone was a make or break requirement, I would switch. Why keep using a tool that doesn't fit your needs? Staying on the Apple platform and being miserable about it is a choice and the remedy for it is completely in your own hands.
What makes you think this person is even on the Apple platform?
You simply cannot create your own platform to sell iOS software outside AppStore without jailbreaking.
And is true that all developers are not (and cannot) be treated equal.
Something will probably change in the next two years, some outside developers have fair points on this topic.
The alternative is web-apps. Developers have the choice, but they know that if they go the web-app route they won't get all the benefits of the app-store including the marketing. These whingers want all the benefits and none of the drawbacks.
Maybe Apple should pull the free category and make the minimum charge for an app-store app 4.99 or whatever figure it takes to make the app-store break-even. You know, go back to how it was with Symbian/Java phones, etc. before Apple created the app-store.
People keep forgetting how good web apps are these days there are many free or cheap apps that could be web apps into. There are many that are bad web apps wrapped in a bundle to be on the store.
I think people forget how good web apps were in the year before the store.
Not happy then they could create a web platform to get store like benefits without paying Apple. If it’s good concentrates on the right things I’m sure it could get the same traction.
It's only a handfull of "wealthy" fat cat companies and developers that are bitching. If I were to bitch then I would put the blame on Xbox and PlayStation Develoment Kits $10,000+
Xcode for FREE? bah Xcode Developer Account for $99!!!
Please, they are STRICTLY for developers where the other platforms aren't.
I mean they aren't the Android platform but still, at least you get paid better!
This is a joke, only of handful who don't want Apple to succeed and want Apple to hurt in the longrun, TOO BAD, 🖕
The real issue here is very simple: It's not Apple's iPhone. It's MY iPhone.
If I only want to install programs from Apple's app store, that should be my right.
If I want to install program's from Joe's Fly By Night app store too, that should also be my right.
If I want to install programs that didn't come from any app store at all, that too should be my right.
Apple is unlawfully interfering with my right to install programs on MY iPhone from whatever source I choose. It's monopolistic behavior, and it's restraint of trade. They must be stopped.
And Apple knows this. It's why they don't do it on the Mac, because if they suddenly started doing the same thing on the Mac the law would come down upon them like a ton of bricks. But they pretend that the iPhone and iPad should somehow get to be different, while they at the same time try to promote the idea that the iPad is a substitute for a real computer.
Unbelievable -- is everyone in here an Apple shareholder?
There's no other possible explanation for people begging on their knees to be restricted of their freedom to install any apps they please on their own device, paid for by them.
Actually, I am a shareholder - bought Apple in (I think) 2014 when I realized how much I was spending on Apple gear and wanted to defray the cost .
Doesn't mean I'm not entitled to an opinion though - here's mine:
Developers who subverted the MDM program are using a feature designed for enterprises who own the phone - it gives them rights to the device which no third party should have. They knew they shouldn't be doing what they did, but did it anyway, and then whined when Apple shut them down.
Tough.
As for Sweeny - he's in it for the money, and that's all. He runs a very different type of store for a very different type of device.
If a software developer did something nefarious, he'd just throw up his hands and say, "Oh well".
Epic doesn't distribute software that runs on a mission critical device, and if software he peddles crash your computer: so what - complain to the developer. Apple on the other hand runs software on the device you may be counting on to save your life in an emergency.
He doesn't produce the atomic level tools for development, and doesn't vet the apps he sells, so the cost of his infrastructure is waaayy less.
Apple creates, manages, develops, and evolves the development tools, provides infrastructure, provides bandwidth for the product download and all updates, provides a searchable information outlet and storefront, vets applications, and provides every facet of payment and interface infrastructure. They produce the foundation classes and evolve them to create value for developers and customers, and provide whole frameworks which allow developers to create software for a whole range of devices with constantly expanding capabilities and the software which allows developers to develop a single code base to run on multiple devices with minimal effort. All of that costs real money, and is part and parcel of the percentage charged by the app store.
Most of those complaining about the app store are those who want in but don't want to pay any of the freight - and ALL of them knew the rules of engagement before they started developing their software.
Apple has the right to continue to develop and add features to the operating system - otherwise the platform would stagnate and die. As far as I can tell all those features are free to consumers with an OS upgrade.
Competitors who sell software which duplicate free OS functionality and add no additional value should not be allowed to rip off those customers based on their ignorance.
Apple should, however, include a toggle in the app store which allows developers to see some information about their customers (at the customer's discretion).
The real issue here is very simple: It's not Apple's iPhone. It's MY iPhone.
If I only want to install programs from Apple's app store, that should be my right.
If I want to install program's from Joe's Fly By Night app store too, that should also be my right.
If I want to install programs that didn't come from any app store at all, that too should be my right.
Apple is unlawfully interfering with my right to install programs on MY iPhone from whatever source I choose. It's monopolistic behavior, and it's restraint of trade. They must be stopped.
And Apple knows this. It's why they don't do it on the Mac, because if they suddenly started doing the same thing on the Mac the law would come down upon them like a ton of bricks. But they pretend that the iPhone and iPad should somehow get to be different, while they at the same time try to promote the idea that the iPad is a substitute for a real computer.
The iPhone may be owned by you but you don’t own iOS.
It is your right to do whatever you want with your phone but not to the OS. Feel free to flash the memory and install some other OS that lets you do the things you want to do.
If you don’t like running macOS, install Windows. Sure, it will be harder in an iPhone but that’s your choice. I seem to remember years ago someone had Android running on an iPhone. Go for it!!
If you think you’re being treated unfairly then leave the platform, band together, build your own platform. Simples.
That is just too challenging and too difficult. We will just cry louder.
Too challenging? Too difficult? Bollocks. All you need is a few years and a few billion dollars. What’s the big deal?
And then when you’ve done that you should let everyone use it however they want and do whatever they want with it all for a fraction of what you invested into it.
The world will be a much better place. You’ll feel great about yourself for contributing. Everyone wins!
What’s stopping you? Come on. Get to it!
——
I shouldn’t have to say this but some will miss it: Yes. I’m being sarcastic to make a point. The point is: Exactly. It’s challenging to do. But Apple did it. And one of the ways Apple did it is with all their rules and their business model. Without those rules or that business model they would not have succeeded at it where others have dismally failed. If you don’t agree with that statement then look at the alternatives. Android’s or Microsoft’s systems are better? The old ways before Apple’s App Store and eco systems were better? Or what?
Everyone who is “crying” about how Apple is doing it wrong: tell us how Apple should do it instead. You’re complaining about Apple’s decisions, but no one has any sensible description of how to do it better.
The “if you don’t like it leave the platform and go to Android, etc instead” line is the only answer. Oh, but you don’t want to go anywhere else? Why? Because Apple’s products and ecosystem are better? Hmm... Gee... I wonder why that is.
The real issue here is very simple: It's not Apple's iPhone. It's MY iPhone.
If I only want to install programs from Apple's app store, that should be my right.
If I want to install program's from Joe's Fly By Night app store too, that should also be my right.
If I want to install programs that didn't come from any app store at all, that too should be my right.
Apple is unlawfully interfering with my right to install programs on MY iPhone from whatever source I choose. It's monopolistic behavior, and it's restraint of trade. They must be stopped.
And Apple knows this. It's why they don't do it on the Mac, because if they suddenly started doing the same thing on the Mac the law would come down upon them like a ton of bricks. But they pretend that the iPhone and iPad should somehow get to be different, while they at the same time try to promote the idea that the iPad is a substitute for a real computer.
Unbelievable -- is everyone in here an Apple shareholder?
There's no other possible explanation for people begging on their knees to be restricted of their freedom to install any apps they please on their own device, paid for by them.
I know, right? And I should also be able to do anything I want on my own land, or in my own car - my own devices, paid for by me. To hell with the neighbors, or anyone else on the road.
You’ll argue that your own device doesn’t affect others like your car or back yard does, but that’s not true. It’s on the internet and very few apps today are an island. In many cases what you do on your device can affect others. An iPhone isn’t just a disconnected brick. It’s a window into the entire ecosystem just like your house is part of a neighborhood and your car is part of traffic.
But hey if you don’t like that analogy then how about how unfair it is that you can’t buy whatever medications you want without some regulation via prescriptions, or why certain drugs are illegal. It’s your body, you should be able to put whatever the heck you want into it, surely? Who do these lawmakers think they are telling you what you can and can’t do with your own body?**
**(In case it’s not clear: I’m being sarcastic and I do not condone purchase or use of any illegal substances).
The real issue here is very simple: It's not Apple's iPhone. It's MY iPhone.
If I only want to install programs from Apple's app store, that should be my right.
If I want to install program's from Joe's Fly By Night app store too, that should also be my right.
If I want to install programs that didn't come from any app store at all, that too should be my right.
Apple is unlawfully interfering with my right to install programs on MY iPhone from whatever source I choose. It's monopolistic behavior, and it's restraint of trade. They must be stopped.
And Apple knows this. It's why they don't do it on the Mac, because if they suddenly started doing the same thing on the Mac the law would come down upon them like a ton of bricks. But they pretend that the iPhone and iPad should somehow get to be different, while they at the same time try to promote the idea that the iPad is a substitute for a real computer.
The iPhone may be owned by you but you don’t own iOS.
It is your right to do whatever you want with your phone but not to the OS. Feel free to flash the memory and install some other OS that lets you do the things you want to do.
If you don’t like running macOS, install Windows. Sure, it will be harder in an iPhone but that’s your choice. I seem to remember years ago someone had Android running on an iPhone. Go for it!!
This here. This says - in a different way- what I was also trying to say above with my car analogies etc.
Sure, buy the phone and do whatever you want with it - with the hardware that is, or at least whatever the technology and hardware in it allow. If you can install any app you want on it without going through iOS then there you go.
And if you can’t figure out how to do that then realize this: there is a lot of stuff in the chips etc. in the iPhone - firmware, heck even the ARM instruction set that Apple’s chips use, etc. - that isn’t yours. The design isn’t yours. The technology and capabilities produced by the specific arrangement of all the parts isn’t yours.
So frankly, you buy an iPhone and think it’s entirely yours? Sorry, you’re gravely mistaken.
Unbelievable -- is everyone in here an Apple shareholder?
There's no other possible explanation for people begging on their knees to be restricted of their freedom to install any apps they please on their own device, paid for by them.
you cannot just install another bathroom in your house, or add an addition without seeking permission--and it is your house and your property and pay tax on it. you cannot just expand your basement, you cannot just plop in an in-ground pool, you cannot just build a roller-coaster, you cannot plant a plant from a foreign country, you cannot start raising cows if you are too close to the city, you cannot raise an elephant. Many housing developments do not allow people to change their own oil. There are several things that you cannot do to items you already own.
so this restriction of freedom comes off as a bit silly.
For me the hearing shined a light on just how sleazy other companies are with their abuse of power like Facebook, Amazon and Google. It was like those three were accused of capital murder and Apple was busted Jaywalking.
The other irony not lost on me was the accusers whose hands aren’t any cleaner than the three other companies I mentioned. It’s not like congress is impartial and fair either.
Unbelievable -- is everyone in here an Apple shareholder?
There's no other possible explanation for people begging on their knees to be restricted of their freedom to install any apps they please on their own device, paid for by them.
Nope. Many of us are developers — who have been around long enough and seen the alternatives.
As a user, there’s no way in hell I would go back to a device OS where anyone can install anything. I’ve already tried that for years, and its nothing but an ill-conceived developer’s dream. It might be nice as a tool for developers, but definitely not for actual usage.
Perhaps what you are looking for is a better dev environment. But don’t confuse that with the platform and echo system the final product has to live in. Matters like usability, reliability, security, uniformity, coherence, and trust are what makes iOS stand out. And do you know where it gets that from, and why not every software environment has it?
Developers rail against Apple App Store policy bite the hand that feeds them in wake of House antitrust hearing
Fixed that for ya.
Apple should unleash hell and start getting rid of developers who violate their NDA or publicly complain about App Store policies. They have the legal right to do it.
Developers rail against Apple App Store policy bite the hand that feeds them in wake of House antitrust hearing
Fixed that for ya.
Apple should unleash hell and start getting rid of developers who violate their NDA or publicly complain about App Store policies. They have the legal right to do it.
Actually what might happen is when those developers call for support and ask Apple to fix a problem they my not get returned calls or the response will be really slow.
When your business does not depend on other companies doing things for you, go ahead and complain all you want, but when your own business is highly tied to another companies success. You would hope they would think twice about attacking their primary source of income, especially when the alternative will be far more costly. I suspect the biggest complainer do not realize how much better they have than the way it was 20 yrs ago, all they see is they pay 30% and that could be in their pockets.
Unbelievable -- is everyone in here an Apple shareholder?
There's no other possible explanation for people begging on their knees to be restricted of their freedom to install any apps they please on their own device, paid for by them.
Doesn't mean I'm not entitled to an opinion though - here's mine:
Absolutely, and I couldn't agree more with what you wrote, I mean Too Long Would Have Myself, TLWHM, gees
The only thing I wanted to add, would be you see these "Stores" come in like Steam, on Windows at least, and they are adding apps that aren't even Games, they are like system products. So if Apple was to let, which in some respects they do, but let Store A Store B, what's the difference in the long run of them taking over the user experince and just controlling your device, with there apps, I mean it's practically Jailbroken write, if Store just became abundant?
Put things like this, there could be an Android app for iPhone that basically emulates an Android phone on iPhone, then the guy is like I have Android and iPhone, but he might stay in Android, and buy apps whatever, but IF the Android Apps he purchase thru a "Android Store" crashed his phone or locked things up, Apple would be to blame.
Long story short, The Apps store above all is for Security, and I want that payed for as a developer and as a consumer, I don't and can't do the work of 10,000 people/coders at Apple. I mean Apple probably hates that fact they have to allow web (apps) or code, to even run on device, but that's the sandbox they have setup.
I mean I hate to say but is what it is... It's more than just oh Apple wants money. And you could tell people would for Apple to fold and then we goto all Android, YUCK, I want security not "ransomware phones". Click to pay ransom to use your phone, you have 48 hours....
Comments
Xcode for FREE? bah
Xcode Developer Account for $99!!!
Please, they are STRICTLY for developers where the other platforms aren't.
I mean they aren't the Android platform but still, at least you get paid better!
This is a joke, only of handful who don't want Apple to succeed and want Apple to hurt in the longrun, TOO BAD, 🖕
Doesn't mean I'm not entitled to an opinion though - here's mine:
Developers who subverted the MDM program are using a feature designed for enterprises who own the phone - it gives them rights to the device which no third party should have. They knew they shouldn't be doing what they did, but did it anyway, and then whined when Apple shut them down.
Tough.
As for Sweeny - he's in it for the money, and that's all. He runs a very different type of store for a very different type of device.
If a software developer did something nefarious, he'd just throw up his hands and say, "Oh well".
Epic doesn't distribute software that runs on a mission critical device, and if software he peddles crash your computer: so what - complain to the developer. Apple on the other hand runs software on the device you may be counting on to save your life in an emergency.
He doesn't produce the atomic level tools for development, and doesn't vet the apps he sells, so the cost of his infrastructure is waaayy less.
Apple creates, manages, develops, and evolves the development tools, provides infrastructure, provides bandwidth for the product download and all updates, provides a searchable information outlet and storefront, vets applications, and provides every facet of payment and interface infrastructure. They produce the foundation classes and evolve them to create value for developers and customers, and provide whole frameworks which allow developers to create software for a whole range of devices with constantly expanding capabilities and the software which allows developers to develop a single code base to run on multiple devices with minimal effort. All of that costs real money, and is part and parcel of the percentage charged by the app store.
Most of those complaining about the app store are those who want in but don't want to pay any of the freight - and ALL of them knew the rules of engagement before they started developing their software.
Apple has the right to continue to develop and add features to the operating system - otherwise the platform would stagnate and die. As far as I can tell all those features are free to consumers with an OS upgrade.
Competitors who sell software which duplicate free OS functionality and add no additional value should not be allowed to rip off those customers based on their ignorance.
Apple should, however, include a toggle in the app store which allows developers to see some information about their customers (at the customer's discretion).
——
I shouldn’t have to say this but some will miss it: Yes. I’m being sarcastic to make a point. The point is: Exactly. It’s challenging to do. But Apple did it. And one of the ways Apple did it is with all their rules and their business model. Without those rules or that business model they would not have succeeded at it where others have dismally failed. If you don’t agree with that statement then look at the alternatives. Android’s or Microsoft’s systems are better? The old ways before Apple’s App Store and eco systems were better? Or what?
Everyone who is “crying” about how Apple is doing it wrong: tell us how Apple should do it instead. You’re complaining about Apple’s decisions, but no one has any sensible description of how to do it better.
In no way is it restraint of trade.
You’ll argue that your own device doesn’t affect others like your car or back yard does, but that’s not true. It’s on the internet and very few apps today are an island. In many cases what you do on your device can affect others. An iPhone isn’t just a disconnected brick. It’s a window into the entire ecosystem just like your house is part of a neighborhood and your car is part of traffic.
**(In case it’s not clear: I’m being sarcastic and I do not condone purchase or use of any illegal substances).
To darkvader, and others towing the “it’s MY device” line:
Sure, buy the phone and do whatever you want with it - with the hardware that is, or at least whatever the technology and hardware in it allow. If you can install any app you want on it without going through iOS then there you go.
As a user, there’s no way in hell I would go back to a device OS where anyone can install anything. I’ve already tried that for years, and its nothing but an ill-conceived developer’s dream. It might be nice as a tool for developers, but definitely not for actual usage.
Perhaps what you are looking for is a better dev environment. But don’t confuse that with the platform and echo system the final product has to live in. Matters like usability, reliability, security, uniformity, coherence, and trust are what makes iOS stand out. And do you know where it gets that from, and why not every software environment has it?
Developers rail against Apple App Store policy bite the hand that feeds them in wake of House antitrust hearing
Fixed that for ya.
When your business does not depend on other companies doing things for you, go ahead and complain all you want, but when your own business is highly tied to another companies success. You would hope they would think twice about attacking their primary source of income, especially when the alternative will be far more costly. I suspect the biggest complainer do not realize how much better they have than the way it was 20 yrs ago, all they see is they pay 30% and that could be in their pockets.
The only thing I wanted to add, would be you see these "Stores" come in like Steam, on Windows at least, and they are adding apps that aren't even Games, they are like system products. So if Apple was to let, which in some respects they do, but let Store A Store B, what's the difference in the long run of them taking over the user experince and just controlling your device, with there apps, I mean it's practically Jailbroken write, if Store just became abundant?
Put things like this, there could be an Android app for iPhone that basically emulates an Android phone on iPhone, then the guy is like I have Android and iPhone, but he might stay in Android, and buy apps whatever, but IF the Android Apps he purchase thru a "Android Store" crashed his phone or locked things up, Apple would be to blame.
Long story short, The Apps store above all is for Security, and I want that payed for as a developer and as a consumer, I don't and can't do the work of 10,000 people/coders at Apple. I mean Apple probably hates that fact they have to allow web (apps) or code, to even run on device, but that's the sandbox they have setup.
I mean I hate to say but is what it is... It's more than just oh Apple wants money. And you could tell people would for Apple to fold and then we goto all Android, YUCK, I want security not "ransomware phones". Click to pay ransom to use your phone, you have 48 hours....