The truth holds. There may be more money involved when participating in the Apple ecosystem, but the true value is also MUCH greater than the alternatives. So while it may hurt the pocketbook a bit, we all come out better in the end anyway — consumers and developers alike.
Apple should charge $1000 per developer per year for XCode and $10000 per title per year to license the SDK. That is fairly reasonable considering what you get for the money and much cheaper than similar ecosystems before Apple built the App store. Codewarrior cost me $1500 back in the day and it was no where near as good as XCode. Adjust for inflation and you've got yourself a bargain.
And charge fees of $0.10 per download (including all updates) to help run the store, don't allow free apps and charge take 30% of the initial purchase price.
Developers aren't getting charged 30% for simply having their app on the app store. They're getting that for the entire ecosystem Apple built for them, tools, support systems, online store as a service and so on.
The reason Apple doesn't want to do that is because it kills innovation. It kills the small guys by putting a high bar in place to cover Apple's costs. Look at the before and after landscape. How many stories were there of high schoolers making a million dollars from their bedroom back when they had to pay vast sums for development tools, negotiate with publishers (who were taking more than 30%) and fight for shelf space at retailers (who were taking more than 30%)? In round numbers, 0.
Epic can die in a fire for all I care. All the developers who work there have profited immensely from what Apple has done for the software industry and now they want to either force Apple to give everything away or recoup their costs in the only other way and kill opportunity for those who come behind them? Disgraceful.
Do you notice that only the big developer houses are the ones that are screaming about an apple tax. They are big enough to have the payment system that people might trust.
While I do not like your $0.10 per download as the only option it might be an interesting experiment for Apple to do. You can a) Follow all of the rules and pay the 30%/15% or b) pay per byte that your app interacts with Apple servers (including Push Notifications, iCloud, Downloads (including updates)) but be able to have your own payment system.
When are people going to realize this isn’t about reducing the cost to consumers, this is about getting as much money out of consumers as they possibly can. Epic and the other companies that are protesting the “Apple Tax” aren’t trying to eliminate or even reduce the cost of being in the App Store for themselves. What they are trying to do is force Apple, either through their own decision, through the courts, or through legislation, to change the way they charge developers for being in the App Store. They want to do away with the competition from free apps. They want Apple to change to an approach where any developer that wants to put an app in the App Store has to pay for it, which in turn will eliminate almost all free apps and almost all developers they may have to compete with. Or better yet, they want to force Apple to allow, or be force to allow, alternate App Stores on every single IOS device so they can stop having to live with the privacy restrictions Apple forces on them. Then they can get to what they really want, harvesting user data so they can make the user what they think all users should be – the product rather than the customer.
Sorry but you are wrong. Epic did lower the price by 20% if purchased through the online payment system. For instance, 1,000 V-bucks, which is roughly equivalent to $10 in-game Fortnite currency, now costs just $7.99.
You are very naive if you think that's the case. This is a stunt to get consumers on their side and nothing more. If Apple was out of the picture, there is no way they would discount the price. Why would any company lose out on extra money. If the market was willing to pay $10 before, why would they lower it for you. You really think they are nice guys and don't care about making as much money as they can. Maybe if they make another stand and get rid of other costs such as employee coffee breaks, they will pass that on to us customers too. Looking forward to it being $6.99
John Gruber pointed out that from the App Store $9.99 price Epic gets ~$7. From the direct to Epic price of $7.99 they get something like $7.75 after payment processing fees.
So as @Altivec88 says, when they make it $6.99 (to eliminate the "Apple Tax") and eat the cost of payment processing then they'll be sacrificing some of what they're already getting and can be judged accordingly.
Let's also think about Fortnite being a knock-off of "Player Unknown's Battlegrounds" while we're examining Epic's motives and character. While we're at it, think about the business reasons for having "in-game currency" that does not mimic any fiat currency users might be familiar with - research has shown that (much like with credit cards) customers will pay more when they are distracted from calculations involving cash.
Why are they not also going after Sony and other platforms that charge 30%?
Sony allows transactions to bypass their store, mostly because Sony sells and makes more money from the platform & installed player-base rather than singular companies and services. i.e, Sony gets their $60 through the player buying PSN+.
When are people going to realize this isn’t about reducing the cost to consumers, this is about getting as much money out of consumers as they possibly can. Epic and the other companies that are protesting the “Apple Tax” aren’t trying to eliminate or even reduce the cost of being in the App Store for themselves. What they are trying to do is force Apple, either through their own decision, through the courts, or through legislation, to change the way they charge developers for being in the App Store. They want to do away with the competition from free apps. They want Apple to change to an approach where any developer that wants to put an app in the App Store has to pay for it, which in turn will eliminate almost all free apps and almost all developers they may have to compete with. Or better yet, they want to force Apple to allow, or be force to allow, alternate App Stores on every single IOS device so they can stop having to live with the privacy restrictions Apple forces on them. Then they can get to what they really want, harvesting user data so they can make the user what they think all users should be – the product rather than the customer.
Sorry but you are wrong. Epic did lower the price by 20% if purchased through the online payment system. For instance, 1,000 V-bucks, which is roughly equivalent to $10 in-game Fortnite currency, now costs just $7.99.
You are very naive if you think that's the case. This is a stunt to get consumers on their side and nothing more. If Apple was out of the picture, there is no way they would discount the price. Why would any company lose out on extra money. If the market was willing to pay $10 before, why would they lower it for you. You really think they are nice guys and don't care about making as much money as they can. Maybe if they make another stand and get rid of other costs such as employee coffee breaks, they will pass that on to us customers too. Looking forward to it being $6.99
John Gruber pointed out that from the App Store $9.99 price Epic gets ~$7. From the direct to Epic price of $7.99 they get something like $7.75 after payment processing fees.
So as @Altivec88 says, when they make it $6.99 (to eliminate the "Apple Tax") and eat the cost of payment processing then they'll be sacrificing some of what they're already getting and can be judged accordingly.
Let's also think about Fortnite being a knock-off of "Player Unknown's Battlegrounds" while we're examining Epic's motives and character. While we're at it, think about the business reasons for having "in-game currency" that does not mimic any fiat currency users might be familiar with - research has shown that (much like with credit cards) customers will pay more when they are distracted from calculations involving cash.
Further to this, I can't believe how many general users are being fooled by this thinking that prices will drop. Companies such as Epic have people hired specifically to figure out what the market is willing to pay for their products. Since they chose the disgusting loot box method with in game currency, they even get to control and manipulate the value of the currency. An exaggerated example would be, they offer a 50% discount to look good but magically newer items that are for sale cost twice as much. So although people are tricked into thinking they are getting a deal, in reality they are paying the same. As mentioned, that was an exaggerated example, they do this staggered, slowly and over time so it doesn't look so obvious. The point being, they control the value of the virtual currency so what they charge in real currency is irrelevant.
The bottom line is every company wants to maximize their profits. So if they know little Timmy is willing to pay 10 real dollars for that costume, it will eventually creep up to be the virtual equivalent of $10 regardless if Apple is takes a cut or not. Apple's expense is no different than any other expense they have. It would be no different if they pulled the same stunt to get rid of employee coffee breaks. Get the customers on their side by saying we will cut the price by a dollar. Little Timmy will be happy that day, but big CEO knows Timmy will pay $10, so over time and a little manipulation, it will end up back at $10. This is a publicity stunt to make Timmy think he is going to save big if he helps them go against Apple. For the short term he will, but once Apple is gone, prices will go back in line with the Moto every company has "maximize profit based on what the market is willing to pay"
I can understand developers wanting this to happen but I don't understand the general public siding with these companies because they think prices will go down. Prices will end up being the same in the long term regardless. So you are gaining nothing but you are losing a lot. Security of the OS, Security of your information and CC being stored only at one company, Convenience of not having to shop at 300 different stores to find what you're looking for, etc...
When are people going to realize this isn’t about reducing the cost to consumers, this is about getting as much money out of consumers as they possibly can. Epic and the other companies that are protesting the “Apple Tax” aren’t trying to eliminate or even reduce the cost of being in the App Store for themselves. What they are trying to do is force Apple, either through their own decision, through the courts, or through legislation, to change the way they charge developers for being in the App Store. They want to do away with the competition from free apps. They want Apple to change to an approach where any developer that wants to put an app in the App Store has to pay for it, which in turn will eliminate almost all free apps and almost all developers they may have to compete with. Or better yet, they want to force Apple to allow, or be force to allow, alternate App Stores on every single IOS device so they can stop having to live with the privacy restrictions Apple forces on them. Then they can get to what they really want, harvesting user data so they can make the user what they think all users should be – the product rather than the customer.
Sorry but you are wrong. Epic did lower the price by 20% if purchased through the online payment system. For instance, 1,000 V-bucks, which is roughly equivalent to $10 in-game Fortnite currency, now costs just $7.99.
Do the math for a second. So, for the Apple version of that package is $9.99. Their "Epic Store" pricing is $2.00 cheaper (or 20%). They make MORE by having you go through their system than the Apple ecosystem. This is 100% so Epic can make more money, and not pay anything (or close to anything) for being on someone else's hard work and infrastructure. JMaille is absolutely correct.
Imagine a company wanting to make more money yet it being cheaper for their customers at the same time.
When are people going to realize this isn’t about reducing the cost to consumers, this is about getting as much money out of consumers as they possibly can. Epic and the other companies that are protesting the “Apple Tax” aren’t trying to eliminate or even reduce the cost of being in the App Store for themselves. What they are trying to do is force Apple, either through their own decision, through the courts, or through legislation, to change the way they charge developers for being in the App Store. They want to do away with the competition from free apps. They want Apple to change to an approach where any developer that wants to put an app in the App Store has to pay for it, which in turn will eliminate almost all free apps and almost all developers they may have to compete with. Or better yet, they want to force Apple to allow, or be force to allow, alternate App Stores on every single IOS device so they can stop having to live with the privacy restrictions Apple forces on them. Then they can get to what they really want, harvesting user data so they can make the user what they think all users should be – the product rather than the customer.
Sorry but you are wrong. Epic did lower the price by 20% if purchased through the online payment system. For instance, 1,000 V-bucks, which is roughly equivalent to $10 in-game Fortnite currency, now costs just $7.99.
You are very naive if you think that's the case. This is a stunt to get consumers on their side and nothing more. If Apple was out of the picture, there is no way they would discount the price. Why would any company lose out on extra money. If the market was willing to pay $10 before, why would they lower it for you. You really think they are nice guys and don't care about making as much money as they can. Maybe if they make another stand and get rid of other costs such as employee coffee breaks, they will pass that on to us customers too. Looking forward to it being $6.99
When are people going to realize this isn’t about reducing the cost to consumers, this is about getting as much money out of consumers as they possibly can. Epic and the other companies that are protesting the “Apple Tax” aren’t trying to eliminate or even reduce the cost of being in the App Store for themselves. What they are trying to do is force Apple, either through their own decision, through the courts, or through legislation, to change the way they charge developers for being in the App Store. They want to do away with the competition from free apps. They want Apple to change to an approach where any developer that wants to put an app in the App Store has to pay for it, which in turn will eliminate almost all free apps and almost all developers they may have to compete with. Or better yet, they want to force Apple to allow, or be force to allow, alternate App Stores on every single IOS device so they can stop having to live with the privacy restrictions Apple forces on them. Then they can get to what they really want, harvesting user data so they can make the user what they think all users should be – the product rather than the customer.
Sorry but you are wrong. Epic did lower the price by 20% if purchased through the online payment system. For instance, 1,000 V-bucks, which is roughly equivalent to $10 in-game Fortnite currency, now costs just $7.99.
You are very naive if you think that's the case. This is a stunt to get consumers on their side and nothing more. If Apple was out of the picture, there is no way they would discount the price. Why would any company lose out on extra money. If the market was willing to pay $10 before, why would they lower it for you. You really think they are nice guys and don't care about making as much money as they can. Maybe if they make another stand and get rid of other costs such as employee coffee breaks, they will pass that on to us customers too. Looking forward to it being $6.99
John Gruber pointed out that from the App Store $9.99 price Epic gets ~$7. From the direct to Epic price of $7.99 they get something like $7.75 after payment processing fees.
So as @Altivec88 says, when they make it $6.99 (to eliminate the "Apple Tax") and eat the cost of payment processing then they'll be sacrificing some of what they're already getting and can be judged accordingly.
Let's also think about Fortnite being a knock-off of "Player Unknown's Battlegrounds" while we're examining Epic's motives and character. While we're at it, think about the business reasons for having "in-game currency" that does not mimic any fiat currency users might be familiar with - research has shown that (much like with credit cards) customers will pay more when they are distracted from calculations involving cash.
Further to this, I can't believe how many general users are being fooled by this thinking that prices will drop. Companies such as Epic have people hired specifically to figure out what the market is willing to pay for their products. Since they chose the disgusting loot box method with in game currency, they even get to control and manipulate the value of the currency. An exaggerated example would be, they offer a 50% discount to look good but magically newer items that are for sale cost twice as much. So although people are tricked into thinking they are getting a deal, in reality they are paying the same. As mentioned, that was an exaggerated example, they do this staggered, slowly and over time so it doesn't look so obvious. The point being, they control the value of the virtual currency so what they charge in real currency is irrelevant.
The bottom line is every company wants to maximize their profits. So if they know little Timmy is willing to pay 10 real dollars for that costume, it will eventually creep up to be the virtual equivalent of $10 regardless if Apple is takes a cut or not. Apple's expense is no different than any other expense they have. It would be no different if they pulled the same stunt to get rid of employee coffee breaks. Get the customers on their side by saying we will cut the price by a dollar. Little Timmy will be happy that day, but big CEO knows Timmy will pay $10, so over time and a little manipulation, it will end up back at $10. This is a publicity stunt to make Timmy think he is going to save big if he helps them go against Apple. For the short term he will, but once Apple is gone, prices will go back in line with the Moto every company has "maximize profit based on what the market is willing to pay"
I can understand developers wanting this to happen but I don't understand the general public siding with these companies because they think prices will go down. Prices will end up being the same in the long term regardless. So you are gaining nothing but you are losing a lot. Security of the OS, Security of your information and CC being stored only at one company, Convenience of not having to shop at 300 different stores to find what you're looking for, etc...
They don't have to think. The options to pay $9.99 through Apple or $7.99 through Epic's direct payment was already instituted
Comments
Do you notice that only the big developer houses are the ones that are screaming about an apple tax. They are big enough to have the payment system that people might trust.
While I do not like your $0.10 per download as the only option it might be an interesting experiment for Apple to do. You can a) Follow all of the rules and pay the 30%/15% or b) pay per byte that your app interacts with Apple servers (including Push Notifications, iCloud, Downloads (including updates)) but be able to have your own payment system.
So as @Altivec88 says, when they make it $6.99 (to eliminate the "Apple Tax") and eat the cost of payment processing then they'll be sacrificing some of what they're already getting and can be judged accordingly.
Let's also think about Fortnite being a knock-off of "Player Unknown's Battlegrounds" while we're examining Epic's motives and character. While we're at it, think about the business reasons for having "in-game currency" that does not mimic any fiat currency users might be familiar with - research has shown that (much like with credit cards) customers will pay more when they are distracted from calculations involving cash.
Sony allows transactions to bypass their store, mostly because Sony sells and makes more money from the platform & installed player-base rather than singular companies and services. i.e, Sony gets their $60 through the player buying PSN+.
The bottom line is every company wants to maximize their profits. So if they know little Timmy is willing to pay 10 real dollars for that costume, it will eventually creep up to be the virtual equivalent of $10 regardless if Apple is takes a cut or not. Apple's expense is no different than any other expense they have. It would be no different if they pulled the same stunt to get rid of employee coffee breaks. Get the customers on their side by saying we will cut the price by a dollar. Little Timmy will be happy that day, but big CEO knows Timmy will pay $10, so over time and a little manipulation, it will end up back at $10. This is a publicity stunt to make Timmy think he is going to save big if he helps them go against Apple. For the short term he will, but once Apple is gone, prices will go back in line with the Moto every company has "maximize profit based on what the market is willing to pay"
I can understand developers wanting this to happen but I don't understand the general public siding with these companies because they think prices will go down. Prices will end up being the same in the long term regardless. So you are gaining nothing but you are losing a lot. Security of the OS, Security of your information and CC being stored only at one company, Convenience of not having to shop at 300 different stores to find what you're looking for, etc...