China sees no reason to keep iPhones if WeChat is banned

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 64
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 5,988member
    sflocal said:
    Maybe China also will have no problem with Apple moving all iPhone production out of China.

    Why?  Because Trump told you to hate China?
    Or is it one of his FactFree Allegations?

    Meanwhile, while he has you all obsessed with China, his buddy Vladimir continues to attack our country and its elections.
    This has nothing to do with Trump.  Show's your ignorance in the global community.  I've been complaining abut China being a problem LONG before #45 ever stepped foot into the Oval Room.  That you're making it about Trump just shows you don't have anything to debate, so you play the Trump card.
    Japheygatorguywatto_cobraCarnage
  • Reply 22 of 64
    sdbryansdbryan Posts: 349member
    red oak said:
    It’s a matter of time before Apple pulls out of China.   And all that manufacturing, developer, retail, and R&D investments can find a new home 

    And it will signal to the rest of the world that China is now closed for business

    Once Trump moves from the WhiteHouse to the BigHouse, none of that will be necessary.   The Trump made crisis will be over.
    I wish your assessment were correct, but I suspect the widespread damage will take many years if it is even possible to rectify. The US has shown that it is a comletely unreliable partner: withdrawal from the Paris accords, scrapping multi-nation Iran treaty, defunding the WHO during a global pandemic, erecting damaging tariffs on allies and adversaries alike, denigrating the NATO alliance and our European allies, the list just keeps going on.

    The rest of the world has learned there is a bewildering more than a third of the electorate who will enthusiastically support a historically dishonest and incompetent demagogue as our president. Even if Trump loses (not assured because even before Trump the GOP has done a good job of voter supression) and even if he faces consequences for flaunting the laws, why would we suddenly be considered a nation to be trusted to lead? We have many fences to mend (and Mexico won’t pay for it).
    muthuk_vanalingamGeorgeBMacwatto_cobra
  • Reply 23 of 64
    I know this is a basic question, but I haven't seen it answered anywhere:

    Can the US president force a US based company to ban an App in a foreign country?
    Or can companies do what they feel like outside the US?

    I realize a President could always threaten retaliation on behavior they don't like, but can they actually tell Apple "you cannot offer WeChat in the Chinese App Store?

    Just curious if anyone knows?

    watto_cobra
  • Reply 24 of 64
    sflocal said:
    Maybe China also will have no problem with Apple moving all iPhone production out of China.

    Why?  Because Trump told you to hate China?
    Or is it one of his FactFree Allegations?

    Meanwhile, while he has you all obsessed with China, his buddy Vladimir continues to attack our country and its elections.
    No one needs Trump for that...China does plenty on its own to hate them with the genocide and all...
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 64
    JFC_PA said:
    Since China bans certain apps domestically the U. S. doing the same shouldn’t be an issue. (Though my understanding is there’s no basis in reality for the planned ban as there’s no evidence of a security breach). 
    Exactly, so explain it to me like I am a 5yo, China can ban whatever the hell it wants to in their country but no-one else can do the same in their own country?

    As I understand it when you are in China you have NO choice on the messaging apps you can use, when my son travelled for work he was not able to use the family chat group to keep in touch because of the BAN by China on WhatsApp.

    Can someone explain to me why there is a double standard here that seems to be okay?
    Let alone the rampant IP theft that is just accepted as okay
    muthuk_vanalingamsvanstrommatrix077watto_cobrainTIMidator
  • Reply 26 of 64
    red oak said:
    It’s a matter of time before Apple pulls out of China.   And all that manufacturing, developer, retail, and R&D investments can find a new home 

    And it will signal to the rest of the world that China is now closed for business

    Once Trump moves from the WhiteHouse to the BigHouse, none of that will be necessary.   The Trump made crisis will be over.
    You may need to wait for another 4 years for that to happen, by when lot more damage would have been done. Underestimate right wing extremists ability to retain power at any cost at your own peril. 
    GeorgeBMacmacgui
  • Reply 27 of 64
    digitoldigitol Posts: 269member
    Guess what. Just about no-matter what happens Bunker-Boi will not be as affected/inflicted by these and other possible disasters/consequence of actions. He is 1% and will not suffer like the most of us will. That's just plain fact. Not that posting this matters or will inform any-one or change one's mind not to support. But it was worth a try. Besides I could be part of that 1% for all you all know. 
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 28 of 64
    xiao-zhixiao-zhi Posts: 100member
    I stated this here before. 

    WeChat is essential to daily life in China and for Chinese elsewhere, so without it, there really is not need to use an iPhone when there are other choices.

    He was simply stating a fact.

    Apple can thank Trump for killing it’s second largest market.

    I can tell you the switch is already starting, people buying a new phone simply won’t chose an iPhone any longer.

    This is not about anti-American sentiment but merely practical necessity .

    Americans should understand Mr Trump is ruining the reputation of the USA in the world and if he is re-elected things will turn from bad to worse. 

    Trump’s endless stream of xenophobic and racist rants, and his use of China as a scapegoat to get re-elected has a price, and Apple and other brands are paying the price.
    GeorgeBMacmuthuk_vanalingamwatto_cobra
  • Reply 29 of 64
    xiao-zhixiao-zhi Posts: 100member
    Rayz2016 said:
    I don’t like Trump, but I also don’t like all the grovelling Apple has to do to stay in China. 
    Apple lives the money it makes from it’s second largest market and largest manufacturing base. It has been making billions for years.

    That should not be hard to understand.
    GeorgeBMac
  • Reply 30 of 64
    xiao-zhixiao-zhi Posts: 100member
    quench said:
    Apple,
    Please remove all of your manufacturing and assembly plants to the USA and to USA friendly countries and stop supporting China’s communistic progress. China is an enemy of the free worlds. 
    I think you are missing the point entirely; Apple is at risk of losing it’s second largest and most profitable market. 

    And you won’t se iPhones manufactured in the USA, the cost would be prohibitive and the supply-chain of parts does not exist.

    What we have here is a pug-headed, xenophobic, racist names Trump that destroys everything he touches kneecapping the largest company and American tax paying entity to get re-elected.

    If that is the choice Americans want they can make it. 

    But frankly speaking, Trump is dragging down the USA and Apple with it here.

    I you think that is a good choice you can make it. Do you? Will you?
    GeorgeBMacmuthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 31 of 64
    Shouldn’t the Chinese Foreign Ministry have brushed up on their English before going on record? 
    edited August 2020
  • Reply 32 of 64
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    sflocal said:
    sflocal said:
    Maybe China also will have no problem with Apple moving all iPhone production out of China.

    Why?  Because Trump told you to hate China?
    Or is it one of his FactFree Allegations?

    Meanwhile, while he has you all obsessed with China, his buddy Vladimir continues to attack our country and its elections.
    This has nothing to do with Trump.  Show's your ignorance in the global community.  I've been complaining abut China being a problem LONG before #45 ever stepped foot into the Oval Room.  That you're making it about Trump just shows you don't have anything to debate, so you play the Trump card.

    Sorry, but it has everything to do with Trump.   It is his cold war that he is creating.   So far he has produced zero facts to support it -- just his usual smear campaign that his followers take as gospel.

    Every despot needs to distract his supporters from their own evil and this one needs to distract his followers from the real enemy:  Russia.
  • Reply 33 of 64
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    NinjaMan said:
    sflocal said:
    Maybe China also will have no problem with Apple moving all iPhone production out of China.

    Why?  Because Trump told you to hate China?
    Or is it one of his FactFree Allegations?

    Meanwhile, while he has you all obsessed with China, his buddy Vladimir continues to attack our country and its elections.
    No one needs Trump for that...China does plenty on its own to hate them with the genocide and all...

    Funny how you ignore the problems here in the U.S.  -- kids in cages, systemic racism that supports cops killing innocent black men and boys at random, 180,000 dead Americans, misogyny, homophobia, mass murders, etc....  but your head explodes over unsubstantiated allegations about China?  

    It's exactly what the Despot wanted:   "Look over there!"    And the fools do exactly that!
    muthuk_vanalingamraulcristian
  • Reply 34 of 64
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    JFC_PA said:
    Since China bans certain apps domestically the U. S. doing the same shouldn’t be an issue. (Though my understanding is there’s no basis in reality for the planned ban as there’s no evidence of a security breach). 
    Exactly, so explain it to me like I am a 5yo, China can ban whatever the hell it wants to in their country but no-one else can do the same in their own country?

    As I understand it when you are in China you have NO choice on the messaging apps you can use, when my son travelled for work he was not able to use the family chat group to keep in touch because of the BAN by China on WhatsApp.

    Can someone explain to me why there is a double standard here that seems to be okay?
    Let alone the rampant IP theft that is just accepted as okay

    China is not a democracy.
    The United States is and claims it can take the high moral ground because of freedoms such as freedom of the press.

    When you take away those democratic freedoms you lose the right to claim that high moral ground.   You can't have it both ways.

    So, Trump claims it is for "National Security" -- an excuse that he has grossly overused and pretty much worn out.
    The truth is:
    Trump was pissed at TikTok after its American users humilitated him.   So, he does what he does to any who oppose him:  he crushes them in anyway he can.
    Also, Zuckerberg had apparently struck a deal with him:   he would let Trump publish lies on Facebook to damage his political opponent if Trump would crush its China competitors.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 35 of 64
    It's funny how people think Apple can just pull out of China no questions asked.

    What people forget is most of America's debt is owned by China. If China really wants to mess with America all it needs to do is call in its debts from America and the entire American economy is screwed. America won't be able to pay that debt.

    But go on Trump, poke the bear.
    muthuk_vanalingamGeorgeBMacwatto_cobra
  • Reply 36 of 64
    jdiamond said:
    I know this is a basic question, but I haven't seen it answered anywhere:

    Can the US president force a US based company to ban an App in a foreign country?
    Or can companies do what they feel like outside the US?

    I realize a President could always threaten retaliation on behavior they don't like, but can they actually tell Apple "you cannot offer WeChat in the Chinese App Store?

    Just curious if anyone knows?
    The simple answer is: Yes.

    The less simple answer would be: It kinds depends exactly on how the question is phrased, as well as a number of safeguards within the legal system; and so on.

    The simple way of looking at it is that what's happening isn't really that The Person In Charge reaches into another country and controls what's going on there; but rather TPIC puts their hand on the shoulder of a local person and says "you can't have people doing [that] in another country". So legally speaking it kinda sorta is more like the power is used to exhort a local outcome; which otherwise would reach into another country.

    So, yes, practically speaking it is possible to influence what can and cannot happen in another country simply by controlling the people/companies that otherwise would be controlling these things in that country.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 37 of 64

    xiao-zhi said:
    I stated this here before. 

    WeChat is essential to daily life in China and for Chinese elsewhere, so without it, there really is not need to use an iPhone when there are other choices.

    He was simply stating a fact.

    Apple can thank Trump for killing it’s second largest market.

    I can tell you the switch is already starting, people buying a new phone simply won’t chose an iPhone any longer.

    This is not about anti-American sentiment but merely practical necessity .

    Americans should understand Mr Trump is ruining the reputation of the USA in the world and if he is re-elected things will turn from bad to worse. 

    Trump’s endless stream of xenophobic and racist rants, and his use of China as a scapegoat to get re-elected has a price, and Apple and other brands are paying the price.
    To put that "killing it's second largest market" into perspective…

    China would probably have been Facebook's second, maybe even first, largest market if they'd been allowed in; same with Google if they'd been allowed to simply be accessed from China.

    From that perspective USA has been asleep at the wheel, and has completely missed the mark as far as what to focus on as far as China's position in the world as both a trading and (soft) political force/partner.

    Banning apps and killing markets is simply the phrasing you end up with as the world is waking up and making important course corrections; to end up with a more level playing field.
    matrix077watto_cobra
  • Reply 38 of 64
    red oak said:
    It’s a matter of time before Apple pulls out of China.   And all that manufacturing, developer, retail, and R&D investments can find a new home 

    And it will signal to the rest of the world that China is now closed for business
    That last sentence is so important.

    Of course it won't be a definite "sign on the door" closed; but it will send such a strong signal that there will be extra board meetings with confused people in panic preparing their business' for surviving the same. Not being able to just do the same, but actually having their business survive when they must do the same.

    Which is why personally don't believe it will actually completely come to that. Unless Winnie Xi overestimates his power and makes a short-term (less say within a decade) international power move against the US, then US companies will one way or another be encouraged to stay at least partially tied to China.
  • Reply 39 of 64
    macguimacgui Posts: 2,191member
    xiao-zhi said:
    Rayz2016 said:
    I don’t like Trump, but I also don’t like all the grovelling Apple has to do to stay in China. 
    Apple lives the money it makes from it’s second largest market and largest manufacturing base. It has been making billions for years.

    That should not be hard to understand.
    He didn't say he didn't understand. He said he didn't like it.
    svanstromwatto_cobra
  • Reply 40 of 64
    macguimacgui Posts: 2,191member

    svanstrom said:
    red oak said:
    And it will signal to the rest of the world that China is now closed for business
    That last sentence is so important.
    No, it's not, not until it actually happens. However "quickly" it happens, it will be longer then most people think.

    Beyond losing China as one of it's biggest markets for Apple Products, losing manufacturing in China also drastically affects it's bottom line everywhere except maybe India. Only when Apple has production capacity equal to or better than that of China will their bottom line be shored. There's no telling how long if ever it would take from them to recoup their losses.

    They would no doubt prefer to keep manufacturing in China until Viet Nam or some other location can equal the manufacturing capacity of their facilities there. Of course, it wouldn't actually have to match current production if they lost the Chinese market because of a ban on WeChat. I'm not sure that will happen.
    GeorgeBMacwatto_cobra
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