How Apple Silicon on a M1 Mac changes monitor support and what you can connect

Comments

• Reply 1 of 54

  neilm Posts: 987member

  November 11, 2020 5:02PM

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  
• Reply 2 of 54

  Mike Wuerthele Posts: 6,861administrator

  November 11, 2020 5:08PM

  neilm said:

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  So can the M1 in the MBP or MBA. The internal display just counts as one of the two.
  
  It is absolutely a limitation of the M1.

  edited November 2020
• Reply 3 of 54

  randominternetperson Posts: 3,089member

  November 11, 2020 5:13PM

  Thanks for this article.  Personally I find these mare targeted pieces (in this case about monitor support) a very useful addition to the more general (much longer) articles.

  
• Reply 4 of 54

  Hap Posts: 17member

  November 11, 2020 5:15PM

  To be clear. The ports are still USB3/TB3. They are not USB 4.
  
  USB 4 would mean USB data rates of 40Gbps regardless of TB support. That is not the case for these ports.
  
  According to Apple, the ports support this:
  

  • Thunderbolt 3 (up to 40Gb/s)
  • USB 3.1 Gen 2 (up to 10Gb/s)

  
  Yes, they have TB3, but USB4 does not require TB to operate at those speeds.

  
• Reply 5 of 54

  Mike Wuerthele Posts: 6,861administrator

  November 11, 2020 5:19PM

  Hap said:

  To be clear. The ports are still USB3/TB3. They are not USB 4.
  
  USB 4 would mean USB data rates of 40Gbps regardless of TB support. That is not the case for these ports.
  
  According to Apple, the ports support this:
  

  • Thunderbolt 3 (up to 40Gb/s)
  • USB 3.1 Gen 2 (up to 10Gb/s)

  
  Yes, they have TB3, but USB4 does not require TB to operate at those speeds.

  They are USB4. 
  
  While the TB3 thing is correct, Apple has told us that they support full USB4 speeds, and use a USB 4 controller, making them beyond a shadow of a doubt, USB4. Because a port supports a speed, does not mean it is limited to those speeds.
  
  For the time being, though, there isn't very much around in regards to peripherals that support USB4.

  edited November 2020
• Reply 6 of 54

  neilm Posts: 987member

  November 11, 2020 5:39PM

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  neilm said:

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  So can the M1 in the MBP or MBA. The internal display just counts as one of the two.
  
  It is absolutely a limitation of the M1.

  Duh! Of course you’re right. 

  
  

  Then it’s a surprising limitation of the M1’s GPU. Guess we may have to wait for an M2 for that.

  
• Reply 7 of 54

  Mike Wuerthele Posts: 6,861administrator

  November 11, 2020 5:39PM

  neilm said:

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  neilm said:

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  So can the M1 in the MBP or MBA. The internal display just counts as one of the two.
  
  It is absolutely a limitation of the M1.

  Duh! Of course you’re right. 

  
  

  Then it’s a surprising limitation of the M1’s GPU. Guess we may have to wait for an M2 for that.

  I think you've got it exactly right about the M2.

  
• Reply 8 of 54

  paul pattison Posts: 5member

  November 11, 2020 5:45PM

  Does an iPad connected via Sidecar count as an external display? In other words, can I have my monitor connected AND my iPad via Sidecar?

  
• Reply 9 of 54

  Hap Posts: 17member

  November 11, 2020 5:50PM

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  Hap said:

  To be clear. The ports are still USB3/TB3. They are not USB 4.
  
  USB 4 would mean USB data rates of 40Gbps regardless of TB support. That is not the case for these ports.
  
  According to Apple, the ports support this:
  

  • Thunderbolt 3 (up to 40Gb/s)
  • USB 3.1 Gen 2 (up to 10Gb/s)

  
  Yes, they have TB3, but USB4 does not require TB to operate at those speeds.

  They are USB4. 
  
  While the TB3 thing is correct, Apple has told us that they support full USB4 speeds, and use a USB 4 controller, making them beyond a shadow of a doubt, USB4. Because a port supports a speed, does not mean it is limited to those speeds.
  
  For the time being, though, there isn't very much around in regards to peripherals that support USB4.

  You're right. I missed that Apple called them USB4 above. I think was is somewhat deceiving about them though is that they don't support a lot of USB4 speeds - only 10Gb/s and not the 20Gb/s or 40Gb/s. Note I'm talking about USB speeds and not TB speeds.
  
  Would be nice if they actually said it support DisplayPort 2.0 which is part of the USB4 spec as well.

  
• Reply 10 of 54

  Mike Wuerthele Posts: 6,861administrator

  November 11, 2020 5:55PM

  Hap said:

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  Hap said:

  To be clear. The ports are still USB3/TB3. They are not USB 4.
  
  USB 4 would mean USB data rates of 40Gbps regardless of TB support. That is not the case for these ports.
  
  According to Apple, the ports support this:
  

  • Thunderbolt 3 (up to 40Gb/s)
  • USB 3.1 Gen 2 (up to 10Gb/s)

  
  Yes, they have TB3, but USB4 does not require TB to operate at those speeds.

  They are USB4. 
  
  While the TB3 thing is correct, Apple has told us that they support full USB4 speeds, and use a USB 4 controller, making them beyond a shadow of a doubt, USB4. Because a port supports a speed, does not mean it is limited to those speeds.
  
  For the time being, though, there isn't very much around in regards to peripherals that support USB4.

  You're right. I missed that Apple called them USB4 above. I think was is somewhat deceiving about them though is that they don't support a lot of USB4 speeds - only 10Gb/s and not the 20Gb/s or 40Gb/s. Note I'm talking about USB speeds and not TB speeds.
  
  Would be nice if they actually said it support DisplayPort 2.0 which is part of the USB4 spec as well.

  We're not happy about how Apple has labeled this either. We shouldn't have had to hammer on PR folks to find out.

  
• Reply 11 of 54

  Mike Wuerthele Posts: 6,861administrator

  November 11, 2020 5:56PM

  
  

  paul pattison said:

  Does an iPad connected via Sidecar count as an external display? In other words, can I have my monitor connected AND my iPad via Sidecar?

  It counts against Intel Mac monitor max counts, so it probably counts here as well. We'll see when we get our hands on hardware, though.

  
• Reply 12 of 54

  shibuya Posts: 3member

  November 11, 2020 6:41PM

  Thanks for the article!
  
  Since everything is slightly less mobile these days I would get the new Mac mini in a heartbeat if it supported connecting two LG UltraFine 5K displays.
  
  Even with only 16GB of RAM.
  
  It’s unfortunate really

  
• Reply 13 of 54

  roundaboutnow Posts: 735member

  November 11, 2020 6:44PM

  If two or three 1920x1080 monitors are desired, I figured the Matrox QuadHead2Go might work. But then I looked up price, and unfortunately it's expensive (>$1K).
  
  Matrox spec says it will accept up to 8Kx8K on its DisplayPort input, so it should be possible to give it a single 6K signal, and let the Matrox "split" it across multiple monitors. (I've used the TripleHead2Go a few years ago, but don't have experience with the QuadHead2Go, so best to contact Matrox for details if you really have to have it). Too bad about that price.

  
• Reply 14 of 54

  shibuya Posts: 3member

  November 11, 2020 7:06PM

  roundaboutnow said:

  If two or three 1920x1080 monitors are desired, I figured the Matrox QuadHead2Go might work. But then I looked up price, and unfortunately it's expensive (>$1K).
  
  Matrox spec says it will accept up to 8Kx8K on its DisplayPort input, so it should be possible to give it a single 6K signal, and let the Matrox "split" it across multiple monitors. (I've used the TripleHead2Go a few years ago, but don't have experience with the QuadHead2Go, so best to contact Matrox for details if you really have to have it). Too bad about that price.

  Interesting, wasn’t aware of that option. It is a bit of an overkill though...
  
  Combining a 5K and a 4K via HDMI would work natively but that would also be a compromise.
  
  Probably best to just wait a bit.

  
• Reply 15 of 54

  anome Posts: 1,533member

  November 11, 2020 8:01PM

  neilm said:

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  I expect, although I have no information either way, that when we finally see an Apple Silicon 16" MBP, it will have support for two external monitors. Whether that will be through having an additional GPU, or an improved SoC GPU remains to be seen (I think they're pushing for all Apple Silicon inside the box, but there might be a transition period). This is for the reason you specify - two external monitors is a common configuration, even for just boring administrative work.
  
  I also hope it will come with more than 2 TB ports. I'm all in on TB3 and USB-C connectors, but only two of them isn't enough. The mini does have two additional USB-A ports and HDMI, but it's still a bit annoying to only have the two TB ports.

  
• Reply 16 of 54

  HeliBum Posts: 129member

  November 11, 2020 9:35PM

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  neilm said:

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  neilm said:

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  So can the M1 in the MBP or MBA. The internal display just counts as one of the two.
  
  It is absolutely a limitation of the M1.

  Duh! Of course you’re right. 

  
  

  Then it’s a surprising limitation of the M1’s GPU. Guess we may have to wait for an M2 for that.

  I think you've got it exactly right about the M2.

  Or an M1X.

  
• Reply 17 of 54

  mr lizard Posts: 354member

  November 11, 2020 10:38PM

  I can’t work out what planet Apple are on with that photo of the six thousand dollar display connected to a $700 machine. 
  
  The stand for that display costs more than the computer in the same photograph. 
  

  
  

  Is this seriously a combination Apple expects people to buy? Do they really think that customers in the market for a $6000 display are going to buy a $700 computer to go with it?
  

  
• Reply 18 of 54

  jdb8167 Posts: 626member

  November 11, 2020 11:02PM

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  neilm said:

  Mike Wuerthele said:

  neilm said:

  Very surprised the M1 MBP can only support a single external monitor. Probably half our current MBP users have a dual monitor setup, usually a pair of 4K, in addition to the built in display. This limitation takes the M1 off my list.
  
  

  Clearly it’s not an inherent limitation of the M1 GPU, since the M1 mini can drive dual monitors.

  So can the M1 in the MBP or MBA. The internal display just counts as one of the two.
  
  It is absolutely a limitation of the M1.

  Duh! Of course you’re right. 

  
  

  Then it’s a surprising limitation of the M1’s GPU. Guess we may have to wait for an M2 for that.

  I think you've got it exactly right about the M2.

  Outside of speed, these are low end CPUs. They obviously don't have enough PCIe lanes to match the current higher end Intel Macs. Apple will want to replace the Intel Macs with at least equivalent IO so it is very likely when it comes to the 14" and 16" MacBook Pros next year, they will have 4 TB3/USB4 ports and enough bandwidth to meet the specs.

  
• Reply 19 of 54

  williamlondon Posts: 1,324member

  November 11, 2020 11:04PM

  mr lizard said:

  I can’t work out what planet Apple are on with that photo of the six thousand dollar display connected to a $700 machine. 
  
  The stand for that display costs more than the computer in the same photograph. 
  

  
  

  Is this seriously a combination Apple expects people to buy? Do they really think that customers in the market for a $6000 display are going to buy a $700 computer to go with it?
  

  Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
  
  They could photograph it with what other monitor in their line-up? The fact they're showing it can connect to the top of the line bothers you? If they showed it with a cheaper monitor then people would say, "yeah I bet it can't drive the expensive Apple monitor."
  
  FFS, the lengths some will go to in order to criticise always boggles but never surprises in this world of Negative Nellies.
  

  edited November 2020
• Reply 20 of 54

  flydog Posts: 1,124member

  November 11, 2020 11:04PM

  mr lizard said:

  I can’t work out what planet Apple are on with that photo of the six thousand dollar display connected to a $700 machine. 
  
  The stand for that display costs more than the computer in the same photograph. 
  

  
  

  Is this seriously a combination Apple expects people to buy? Do they really think that customers in the market for a $6000 display are going to buy a $700 computer to go with it?
  

  People on the forums are already whining that it only supports one.