Microsoft Windows 11 revealed with dramatic increase in system requirements

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  • Reply 21 of 103
    cpsro said:
    macOS has a dock for 20+ years. 2021, Microsoft announces whiz-bang dock, where nothing stays where you put it.
    June 7, 2021, iPadOS 15 multitasking gets panned. June 24, 2021, Microsoft announces iPadOS 15-like multitasking.
    Apple lowers commissions. Microsoft lowers them further, in all-out effort to coerce more malware to the Mac.
    2020, Apple brings iOS apps to the Mac. 2021, Microsoft brings Android malware to Windows.

    You can actually pin programs on the task bar, and launch them, since win 10, the taskbar was already a dock.
    Windows had panned multitasking since win 7, they merely changed in the interface
    mike54
  • Reply 22 of 103
    Rayz2016Rayz2016 Posts: 6,957member
    KITA said:
    rob53 said:
    KITA said:

    Microsoft also says that it wants to encourage open commerce on its operating system. It will allow apps downloaded from the Windows Store to have independent commerce systems within the app. This differs from Apple's requirements to tie in-app purchases from App Store apps to Apple's commerce system.

    That's quite the contrast to Apple. Microsoft will collect 0% if a developer brings their own commerce system.
    I'll believe it when I see it. Microsoft has always locked apps into their OS. I don't see it changing anytime soon. What they say doesn't always mean what ends up happening. Microsoft server and its client licenses are absolutely not free so they can say they have a free open commerce system but they will charge you somewhere along the road.
    This is what they've stated so far:
    Starting today, Windows developers can publish any kind of app, regardless of app framework and packaging technology – such as Win32, .NET, UWP, Xamarin, Electron, React Native, Java and even Progressive Web Apps. Developers can sign-up here to publish desktop apps, or build and package PWAs using our latest open-source tool PWABuilder 3.

    Many developers love the Microsoft Commerce platform because of its simplicity, global distribution, platform integration and its competitive revenue share terms at 85/15 for apps and 88/12 for games.

    Starting July 28, app developers will also have an option to bring their own or a third party commerce platform in their apps, and if they do so they don’t need to pay Microsoft any fee. They can keep 100% of their revenue.

    https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2021/06/24/building-a-new-open-microsoft-store-on-windows-11/

    So Microsoft release a new desktop/laptop operating system with an App Store, but with the option of setting up your own App Store without paying a dime to Microsoft. 

    So how’s that different to MacOS?

    https://setapp.com/

    Comparing Windows 11 with iOS is a false equivalence. Microsoft doesn’t have a mobile OS because it crashed and burned. 

    edited June 24 hydrogenqwerty52dewmeBeatstmayKTRmagman1979macxpressfastasleepwilliamlondon
  • Reply 23 of 103
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,397member
    rob53 said:
    tmonline said:
    TPM chip requirement! Well, that may be a bummer for bootcamp/dual boot mac owners who like to have windows for work or other reasons.

    Not sure if VMs can get around that, anyone? 
    Check out https://kb.parallels.com/en/122702. Not the same as bootcamp. 

    from Parallels--Note: this article applies only to the virtual machines running on Intel-based Mac computers. The use of TPM modules in Parallels Desktop virtual machines running on a Mac computer with Apple M1 chip will be introduced in future updates. --so there is the potential for it running sometime in the future. As for VMware/Fusion, not sure if VMWare will ever run on M1 platform.
    That's cool but VMs on INtel Macs won't be of any real use for serious gaming which is the only reason many Mac users have a PC or BootCamp. I can run GTAV or RDR2 at 2.5K on a 2103 Mac Pro with parallel GPUs in BootCamp for example.  In a VM they won't even start.  That said I use a PC and a GTX 1080 and run 4K, the Map Pro just got too hot.

    As to M1s, I am running Windows 10 on my M1 test Mac using Parallels and I will go see now what that says about Windows 11 in the insider program test.
    GeorgeBMacelijahg
  • Reply 24 of 103
    ajmasajmas Posts: 579member
    MacPro said:
    tmonline said:
    TPM chip requirement! Well, that may be a bummer for bootcamp/dual boot mac owners who like to have windows for work or other reasons.

    Not sure if VMs can get around that, anyone? 
    That would be a bummer. I have several older Macs running Windows 10 Pro as servers for MySQL.
    Did you mean MySQL or SQL Server? If you mean the former, then moving to a Linux would make much more sense, especially due to reduced license cost and the fact Linux does run both natively and in VM form on Mac hardware. If you mean the latter, then you may be better off running it on a dedicated Windows host.

    One article describing installing Linux on a Mac: https://www.macworld.co.uk/how-to/how-install-linux-on-mac-3637265/
    edited June 24 watto_cobra
  • Reply 25 of 103
    MisterKitMisterKit Posts: 440member
    I walked away from Windows about 15 years ago and have been Mac ever since. I wouldn't take a Windows computer if someone gave it to me. Good luck Microsoft.
    cpsropscooter63BeatsJosephAUmagman1979d_2williamlondonseanjgenovellenarwhal
  • Reply 26 of 103
    dewmedewme Posts: 3,875member
    Windows 10 retirement date is 10/14/2025. 

    Maybe I’ll start to think about what to do with the last few Windows-only apps I have around that date. Or not. 

    The preferred solution is to move completely off Windows by that date, so the retirement of Windows 10 may be a moot point for me. None of my personal Windows dependencies are business critical, just hobbies. 

    For businesses that are dependent on Windows, the transition to Windows 11 is not really a big deal. They’ll do it as part of their normal PC refresh cycle. Windows 10 isn’t going anywhere any time soon. 

    This is a big Nothingburger with a side of Yawn coated with Meh. 
    edited June 24 pscooter63Beatsseanjkillroywatto_cobra
  • Reply 27 of 103
    genovellegenovelle Posts: 1,279member
    KITA said:

    Microsoft also says that it wants to encourage open commerce on its operating system. It will allow apps downloaded from the Windows Store to have independent commerce systems within the app. This differs from Apple's requirements to tie in-app purchases from App Store apps to Apple's commerce system.

    That's quite the contrast to Apple. Microsoft will collect 0% if a developer brings their own commerce system.
    Sounds like they will be a breeding ground for malware once more. 
    Beatscrossladmagman1979williamlondonkillroywatto_cobra
  • Reply 28 of 103
    cpsrocpsro Posts: 2,904member
    Hah! Apple released macOS 11 last fall and already has macOS 12 in beta.
    williamlondonkillroywatto_cobra
  • Reply 29 of 103
    darkvaderdarkvader Posts: 630member
    tmonline said:
    TPM chip requirement! Well, that may be a bummer for bootcamp/dual boot mac owners who like to have windows for work or other reasons.

    Not sure if VMs can get around that, anyone? 

    There's a workaround.


    killroy
  • Reply 30 of 103
    MacProMacPro Posts: 19,397member
    ajmas said:
    MacPro said:
    tmonline said:
    TPM chip requirement! Well, that may be a bummer for bootcamp/dual boot mac owners who like to have windows for work or other reasons.

    Not sure if VMs can get around that, anyone? 
    That would be a bummer. I have several older Macs running Windows 10 Pro as servers for MySQL.
    Did you mean MySQL or SQL Server? If you mean the former, then moving to a Linux would make much more sense, especially due to reduced license cost and the fact Linux does run both natively and in VM form on Mac hardware. If you mean the latter, then you may be better off running it on a dedicated Windows host.

    One article describing installing Linux on a Mac: https://www.macworld.co.uk/how-to/how-install-linux-on-mac-3637265/
    As explained several times, but thanks for the input, it's MySQL but that's only the back-end database, there are a few other things in use that require Windows.
  • Reply 31 of 103
    BeatsBeats Posts: 2,550member
    So iPad knockoffs and MacBook knockoffs will be running this copycat OS that looks even more like Mac?

    That’s pathetic and I can’t believe Apple haters ironically defend this mess.
    magman1979williamlondongenovelle
  • Reply 32 of 103
    Looks like a nice upgrade copying the Mac OS dock.
    4GB of RAM requirement is is pretty good; plus a JVM to run Android apps.
    Congrats to Microsoft, but it should be free to all Windows version users.

    The independent commerce systems within the app is BS.  MS could not control it otherwise because the cat is already out of the bag.


    watto_cobra
  • Reply 33 of 103
    MisterKitMisterKit Posts: 440member
    The only way that a computer company can make money giving away the OS for free is when they have a lock on selling the hardware. Again, good luck Microsoft.
    d_2watto_cobra
  • Reply 34 of 103
    citpekscitpeks Posts: 161member
    In my experience Windows 10 doesn't run great with its minimum 2GB requirement (yeah,a cheap boss), so it will be interesting to see if the new 4GB requirement will be more of the same.  Adding RAM resulted in a palpable improvement.

    One of the Mac things I really miss when using Windows is Exposé, and it doesn't appear they've added anything like that, but the Snap layout feature might be handy.

    I still wish Apple did a better job with window management, even something simple like remembering size and position, which sometimes goes awry, but after all these years of OS X, the FTFF dream is probably dead.
    d_2CelticPaddyMplsPwatto_cobra
  • Reply 35 of 103
    dewmedewme Posts: 3,875member
    citpeks said:
    In my experience Windows 10 doesn't run great with its minimum 2GB requirement (yeah,a cheap boss), so it will be interesting to see if the new 4GB requirement will be more of the same.  Adding RAM resulted in a palpable improvement.

    One of the Mac things I really miss when using Windows is Exposé, and it doesn't appear they've added anything like that, but the Snap layout feature might be handy.

    I still wish Apple did a better job with window management, even something simple like remembering size and position, which sometimes goes awry, but after all these years of OS X, the FTFF dream is probably dead.
    Totally agree that the memory and storage minimums for Windows 11 should have been imposed on Windows 10 years ago. Some of the minimum storage level systems are terrible when it comes to installing upgrades. 

    I only half agree about the window size and positioning issues are a shortcoming of macOS. Individual applications have always been able to implement the ability to retain their window positions and sizes themselves. I’ve implemented such behaviors in apps myself and most drawing apps with floating pallets and toolboxes do this. 

    I suppose the operating system could provide additional support for this capability, beyond what is already provided in terms of making screen metrics available to query and firing events for things like screen resolution changes, but each application is much more aware of what its own needs are and how to move its controls around to make sure that the UI still functions correctly when the operating system enacts changes in the overall UI. I still see it at least as a shared responsibility between the OS and apps. 
    edited June 24 fastasleepwilliamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 36 of 103
    magman1979magman1979 Posts: 1,231member
    Microsoft also says that it wants to encourage open commerce on its operating system. It will allow apps downloaded from the Windows Store to have independent commerce systems within the app.

    FUCK NO THANK YOU!!! That's an ATROCIOUS system for end-users, who will now have to deal with MULTIPLE payment processors, MULTIPLE billing points, MULTIPLE billing systems PASSWORDS, FUCK THAT!!!
    Xedgenovelledewmewatto_cobra
  • Reply 37 of 103
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 5,774member
    citpeks said:

    I still wish Apple did a better job with window management, even something simple like remembering size and position, which sometimes goes awry, but after all these years of OS X, the FTFF dream is probably dead.
    Remembering size and position, even when changing between multiple different monitor sets:
    https://cordlessdog.com/stay/

    Window snapping/custom resizing:
    https://www.folivora.ai/bettersnaptool/

    Both of those things:
    https://manytricks.com/moom/

    I've been using the top two for years now, recently downloaded Moom to try out as it has a few niceties that the others don't have. But regardless, it's kinda silly to complain about Apple not doing something when there are great third party solutions. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see Apple Sherlock these guys at some point.

    One feature I desperately want that you cannot do (without disabling SIP) is be able to NAME MY SPACES in Mission Control. I actually emailed Craig Federighi about this once. If I ever see this come up in a WWDC, I'll probably actually yell "Finally!" at the screen. :)
    williamlondonwatto_cobra
  • Reply 38 of 103
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 5,774member
    Microsoft also says that it wants to encourage open commerce on its operating system. It will allow apps downloaded from the Windows Store to have independent commerce systems within the app.
    FUCK NO THANK YOU!!! That's an ATROCIOUS system for end-users, who will now have to deal with MULTIPLE payment processors, MULTIPLE billing points, MULTIPLE billing systems PASSWORDS, FUCK THAT!!!
    Geez. 99% of the time I buy something outside of the Mac App Store, which is the bulk of the software I own, I just autofill my contact and credit card shit in Safari which takes like three seconds. But get real mad about it!
    elijahgPeza
  • Reply 39 of 103
    XedXed Posts: 1,053member
    citpeks said:

    I still wish Apple did a better job with window management, even something simple like remembering size and position, which sometimes goes awry, but after all these years of OS X, the FTFF dream is probably dead.
    Remembering size and position, even when changing between multiple different monitor sets:
    https://cordlessdog.com/stay/

    Window snapping/custom resizing:
    https://www.folivora.ai/bettersnaptool/

    Both of those things:
    https://manytricks.com/moom/

    I've been using the top two for years now, recently downloaded Moom to try out as it has a few niceties that the others don't have. But regardless, it's kinda silly to complain about Apple not doing something when there are great third party solutions. That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see Apple Sherlock these guys at some point.

    One feature I desperately want that you cannot do (without disabling SIP) is be able to NAME MY SPACES in Mission Control. I actually emailed Craig Federighi about this once. If I ever see this come up in a WWDC, I'll probably actually yell "Finally!" at the screen. :)
    His issue with a window not keeping a resize or location is entirely valid. For the most part I like macOS because it saves time over other OSes for the same task, but this area is both not of them and an egregious mark against macOS. There are certainly excellent 3rd-party solutions, but that's because Apple isn't doing it and I doubt it's because the programming chops needed are beyond Apple's capabilities.
    citpeksCelticPaddyPeza
  • Reply 40 of 103
    jgutherjguther Posts: 97member
    Microsoft + Windows + Amazon + Android = bye, bye, privacy!
    williamlondonapplesauce007magman1979mike54watto_cobra
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