Mini LED coming to 11-inch iPad Pro in 2022, Kuo says

AppleInsiderAppleInsider
Posted:
in Future Apple Hardware edited July 2021
Apple is predicted to introduce a Mini LED version of its 11-inch iPad Pro in 2022, with the company looking to expand deployment of the screen technology through its mobile device lineups.

Liquid Retina XDR


In a note to investors on Friday, analyst Ming-Chi Kuo said he expects the 12.9-inch iPad Pro's Mini LED tech, marketed by Apple as Liquid Retina XDR, to trickle down to the smaller 11-inch model next year.

"We predict that new products equipped with Mini LED displays in 2022 include 11-inch and 12.9-inch iPad Pro, and newly designed MacBook Air," Kuo writes (machine translated).

Apple's first product to sport a Mini LED panel was this year's 12.9-inch iPad Pro that debuted in April. The screen utilizes 10,000 Mini LEDs arranged into 2,596 local dimming zones to achieve extremely high contrast ratios that rival those of OLED panels. Interestingly, Kuo previously predicted Apple to introduce OLED to the iPad line in 2022 with an all new iPad Air.

Kuo in today's note said Apple has tapped Luxshare as its latest Mini LED surface-mount technology provider. The new addition could alleviate reported manufacturing woes and future bottlenecks associated with the advanced screen tech, which Kuo says are related to the SMT production process.

Along with the two iPad Pro models and MacBook Air, Kuo believes Apple will build Mini LED screens into redesigned 14- and 16-inch MacBook Pros. Those laptops are anticipated to enter mass production in the third quarter of 2021.

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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 17
    doozydozendoozydozen Posts: 539member
    For the uninitiated: why does Apple choose Mini LED over OLED?
  • Reply 2 of 17
    iOS_Guy80iOS_Guy80 Posts: 813member
    repressthis said:
    For the uninitiated: why does Apple choose Mini LED over OLED?
    From what I have read it’s a question of cost and yield productivity. The mini LED on the 12.9” is very impressive.
    twokatmewdoozydozen
  • Reply 3 of 17
    jellybellyjellybelly Posts: 111member
    Simple:  OLED can experience burn-in of graphics that appear for long periods of time. Also, and related, the”O” stands for organic.  Organic compounds usually don’t have the lifespan of inorganic compounds. In OLED, blue has a much shorter lifespan than Red and Green. This could lead to color fading and inaccurate color over time—YMMV.  
    The biggest advantage of Mini and Micro LED can be in brightness. OLED can achieve up to 1,000 nits of brightness, while inorganic Mini and Micro LEDs can emit up to 5,000 nits of brightness Mini LEDs can approach the blacks of OLED depending on the resolution used for backlighting ( which is getting higher all the time). Micro LEDs match OLEDs in blackness values. So, contrast ratios can be much higher with Mini and Micro LEDs, compared to OLED due to the higher brightness. 

    They’re getting really good results with Mini-LED. Plus it’s a run-up to Micro-LED, in a not obvious way—more in manufacturing than in as a back light for a group of pixels vs. a light for each subpixel of R,B,G,G respectively. 
    edited July 2021 StrangeDaysapplguydoozydozenfastasleepdewmeFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 4 of 17
    robabarobaba Posts: 228member
    MiniLED also doesn’t experience the color shifting that comes from display angle or the color drifting which happens over the lifetime of the device.  I will definitely be buying a miniLED iPad when this one breaths it’s last.
    doozydozen
  • Reply 5 of 17
    WgkruegerWgkrueger Posts: 352member
    That helps. If true I’ll be replacing my 2018 iPad Pro 11” in 2022.
  • Reply 6 of 17
    HeliBumHeliBum Posts: 129member
    And I'll probably replace my iPad Air 4 with a 2022 11" iPad Pro.
  • Reply 7 of 17
    MplsPMplsP Posts: 3,921member
    I’m curious what the comparison of Apple’s LCD vs miniLED vs OLED screens is. A few years ago when they came out with the iPhone Xr I compared the Xs with the Xr side by side in a store and was hard pressed to tell the difference for general use. 

    In a dark room with a dark screen you can tell the difference, but for the general consumer I don’t think it matters that much. 
    edited July 2021
  • Reply 8 of 17
    fastasleepfastasleep Posts: 6,417member
    robaba said:
    MiniLED also doesn’t experience the color shifting that comes from display angle or the color drifting which happens over the lifetime of the device.  I will definitely be buying a miniLED iPad when this one breaths it’s last.
    You mean the LCD screen doesn't. miniLEDs are the backlight for the LCD.

    MplsP said:
    I’m curious what the comparison of Apple’s LCD vs miniLED vs OLED screens is. 
    It's LCD vs LED backlight vs LCD with mini-LED backlight vs OLED.

    Non mini-LED backlit LCDs are edge-lit by LEDs instead of having a grid of smaller LEDs behind the screen.
    dewmeFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 9 of 17
    eriamjheriamjh Posts: 1,642member
    jellybelly said:
    Simple:  OLED can experience burn-in of graphics that appear for long periods of time. Also, and related, the”O” stands for organic.  Organic compounds usually don’t have the lifespan of inorganic compounds. In OLED, blue has a much shorter lifespan than Red and Green. This could lead to color fading and inaccurate color over time—YMMV. 
    Tell that to my first Apple Watch.   Dimmer than heck and screen-burned to boot.
  • Reply 10 of 17
    OutdoorAppDeveloperOutdoorAppDeveloper Posts: 1,293member
    OK but so what? Do you look at your iPad screen and think "Wow that looks terrible! I wish it had micro LED." You know what would make a difference? A REAL OPERATING SYSTEM!!!!! One that lets you install any app you want. One powerful enough to let you develop real software right on the iPad. One which lets you easily browse or list files. One which lets you share files with other computers easily (including Windows computers). One which does not have any stupid corporate restrictions on what you can use it for.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 11 of 17
    robabarobaba Posts: 228member
    OutdoorAppDeveloper said:
    OK but so what? Do you look at your iPad screen and think "Wow that looks terrible! I wish it had micro LED." You know what would make a difference? A REAL OPERATING SYSTEM!!!!! One that lets you install any app you want. One powerful enough to let you develop real software right on the iPad. One which lets you easily browse or list files. One which lets you share files with other computers easily (including Windows computers). One which does not have any stupid corporate restrictions on what you can use it for.
    Sounds like the iPad isn’t for you.  Try something else and then let us know what you find, k?
    FileMakerFeller
  • Reply 12 of 17
    mangakattenmangakatten Posts: 99member
    While as an artist I alway like when apple gives me even better screens, I must admit that I compared the new 13” pro to the 11” watching the same pictures from apples stock images, and I hardly couldn’t see any difference. It was quite surprising actually! Anyone who have them both the new ones and can compare? 
  • Reply 13 of 17
    mpantonempantone Posts: 2,040member
    jellybelly said:
    Simple:  OLED can experience burn-in of graphics that appear for long periods of time. Also, and related, the”O” stands for organic.  Organic compounds usually don’t have the lifespan of inorganic compounds. In OLED, blue has a much shorter lifespan than Red and Green. This could lead to color fading and inaccurate color over time—YMMV.  
    The biggest advantage of Mini and Micro LED can be in brightness. OLED can achieve up to 1,000 nits of brightness, while inorganic Mini and Micro LEDs can emit up to 5,000 nits of brightness Mini LEDs can approach the blacks of OLED depending on the resolution used for backlighting ( which is getting higher all the time). Micro LEDs match OLEDs in blackness values. So, contrast ratios can be much higher with Mini and Micro LEDs, compared to OLED due to the higher brightness. 
    OLED burn-in has been well documented. As the Fortune 500 company with the largest market valuation and one that has serious R&D, one should expect that Apple tests every single commercially viable video display on the planet in their labs.

    Burn-in is not exclusive to OLEDs anyhow. It was a problem with CRTs as well. It's not a new phenomenon.

    For sure, Apple knows that their various visual operating systems all have elements that display frequently in the same place: menu bars, docks, desktop icons, etc. Without a doubt, Apple has tested panels that repeatedly display the same graphics in the same location.
  • Reply 14 of 17
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 1,336member
    Simple:  OLED can experience burn-in of graphics that appear for long periods of time. Also, and related, the”O” stands for organic.  Organic compounds usually don’t have the lifespan of inorganic compounds. In OLED, blue has a much shorter lifespan than Red and Green. This could lead to color fading and inaccurate color over time—YMMV.  
    The biggest advantage of Mini and Micro LED can be in brightness. OLED can achieve up to 1,000 nits of brightness, while inorganic Mini and Micro LEDs can emit up to 5,000 nits of brightness Mini LEDs can approach the blacks of OLED depending on the resolution used for backlighting ( which is getting higher all the time). Micro LEDs match OLEDs in blackness values. So, contrast ratios can be much higher with Mini and Micro LEDs, compared to OLED due to the higher brightness. 

    They’re getting really good results with Mini-LED. Plus it’s a run-up to Micro-LED, in a not obvious way—more in manufacturing than in as a back light for a group of pixels vs. a light for each subpixel of R,B,G,G respectively. 
    With the current OLED displays I do not think that burn in is a nearly the issue it was a few years ago.  That was everyone's big fear with Plasma's once upon a time also. They developed pixel orbiting and an all white screen wipe that took care of any ghosting or image retention. I owned 3 Panasonic plasma purchased  through the years of 2009 - 2013 and all three are still being used today by family members with no burn in issues. With my P50s60 from 2013 being used for pretty heavy gaming on a daily basis by 2 teenagers still no burn in and colors and picture look fantastic. Plasma was also supposed to lose color and brightness through use as well and I haven't seen any of that with these displays. 

    I also think the biggest advantage of ANY LED tv is brightness vs OLED not just Mini LED.  This was the what LG tried to address this year with it's new Evo Panels.. increased brightness. LG G1, C1 and Sony's A90j and A80j have gotten great reviews this year with the noticeable increased brightness I believe they claim a 20% increase. Also the nit #'s you give are peak brightness meaning this brightness level is only achievable for a very short time period over a small portion of the panel. . On average pre Evo planes OLED do around 200 nits of sustained brightness with LED being able to do around 800 nits sustained. 

    Coming from Plasma my biggest issue with Mini LED or any LED is ghosting/blooming in very dark scenes. I love the brightness and color pop of HDR on my LCD tv's for sure, but the ghosting during dark scenes is distracting and takes away from a very nice picture IMHO.  B)  
    muthuk_vanalingamjellybelly
  • Reply 15 of 17
    dewmedewme Posts: 5,356member
    The biggest challenge I face with iPads is convincing myself that I really need to upgrade. For what I use my iPads for, even my nearly 5 year old original iPad Pro 12.9” seems more than capable of handling anything without breaking a sweat. I did max out the storage, which partially explains its staying power. Say what you want about iPadOS, but it doesn’t put a lot of stress on the hardware even on relatively older hardware.

    I sometimes feel that some folks want Apple to throw a big bloated OS on iPad just so they can justify having all that horsepower under the hood. Even if I could run XCode on an iPad Pro, why would I want to? It doesn’t have dual 27’ plus monitors or even support display/workspace extension. A 13” MacBook Pro, or better yet the 16” version, absolutely crushes the iPad Pro as a dev machine, especially with a second monitor added to extend the workspace. The MacBook Pro also come with a great keyboard, trackpad, and at least one more peripheral expansion bus than any iPad has to offer - all in one cohesive package that folds up nicely and works on your lap. No flimsy or claptrap add-ons.   

    With the Mini, I don’t have a concern because my only Mini suffered battery bloat and popped its lid in what appears to be an apparent suicide. It didn’t leave a note so I don’t know what it was feeling at the time. My hope is that the new Mini, whether it comes this year or on the Mini’s typical 2-5 year refresh cycle, will have worked through all of its personal issues prior to me bringing it home. Maybe some of the lithium from the battery will be siphoned off into the processing logic to keep it on an even keel so its lid stays on.
    dope_ahmineFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 16 of 17
    dope_ahminedope_ahmine Posts: 253member
    OK but so what? Do you look at your iPad screen and think "Wow that looks terrible! I wish it had micro LED." You know what would make a difference? A REAL OPERATING SYSTEM!!!!! One that lets you install any app you want. One powerful enough to let you develop real software right on the iPad. One which lets you easily browse or list files. One which lets you share files with other computers easily (including Windows computers). One which does not have any stupid corporate restrictions on what you can use it for.
    Wow! You’re the exact opposite of me …and I’m also a developer.

    1) I wish my iPad Pro was brighter and wasn’t so grey in the “black” areas.

    2) iPadOS is such a great and reliable OS. I hope Apple never caves before all the pressure to open it up more — especially to wild and evil apps from untrusted sources. It would totally ruin the trust that my customers and myself feel.

    3) My iPad is so great at exactly all my use cases. And I wouldn’t dream of doing things like writing code on it all day. Should I ever change my mind on that, I would rather screen stream to a professional developer environment. Since that performance is good enough for gamers, it would definitely be good enough for my coding.

    4) I share documents (“files” in yester-lingo) all day, but would never dream of serving them from my own device. Github, iCloud, and Google Drive rocks. But of course, the people I share them with need to have at least some compatibility to the open and modern world. Windows user? Well, it’s all up to them.

    5) And thanx Apple for not inviting corporations to put all their backwards-thinking restrictions on our i-devices. We already have Microsoft if we wanted that.
    edited July 2021 dewmeFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 17 of 17
    dope_ahminedope_ahmine Posts: 253member
    jcs2305 said:
    Simple:  OLED can experience burn-in of graphics that appear for long periods of time. Also, and related, the”O” stands for organic.  Organic compounds usually don’t have the lifespan of inorganic compounds. In OLED, blue has a much shorter lifespan than Red and Green. This could lead to color fading and inaccurate color over time—YMMV.  
    The biggest advantage of Mini and Micro LED can be in brightness. OLED can achieve up to 1,000 nits of brightness, while inorganic Mini and Micro LEDs can emit up to 5,000 nits of brightness Mini LEDs can approach the blacks of OLED depending on the resolution used for backlighting ( which is getting higher all the time). Micro LEDs match OLEDs in blackness values. So, contrast ratios can be much higher with Mini and Micro LEDs, compared to OLED due to the higher brightness. 

    They’re getting really good results with Mini-LED. Plus it’s a run-up to Micro-LED, in a not obvious way—more in manufacturing than in as a back light for a group of pixels vs. a light for each subpixel of R,B,G,G respectively. 
    With the current OLED displays I do not think that burn in is a nearly the issue it was a few years ago.  That was everyone's big fear with Plasma's once upon a time also. They developed pixel orbiting and an all white screen wipe that took care of any ghosting or image retention. I owned 3 Panasonic plasma purchased  through the years of 2009 - 2013 and all three are still being used today by family members with no burn in issues. With my P50s60 from 2013 being used for pretty heavy gaming on a daily basis by 2 teenagers still no burn in and colors and picture look fantastic. Plasma was also supposed to lose color and brightness through use as well and I haven't seen any of that with these displays. 

    I also think the biggest advantage of ANY LED tv is brightness vs OLED not just Mini LED.  This was the what LG tried to address this year with it's new Evo Panels.. increased brightness. LG G1, C1 and Sony's A90j and A80j have gotten great reviews this year with the noticeable increased brightness I believe they claim a 20% increase. Also the nit #'s you give are peak brightness meaning this brightness level is only achievable for a very short time period over a small portion of the panel. . On average pre Evo planes OLED do around 200 nits of sustained brightness with LED being able to do around 800 nits sustained. 

    Coming from Plasma my biggest issue with Mini LED or any LED is ghosting/blooming in very dark scenes. I love the brightness and color pop of HDR on my LCD tv's for sure, but the ghosting during dark scenes is distracting and takes away from a very nice picture IMHO.  B)  
    Don’t agree on the burn-in parts on modern OLED displays. I’ve got an iPhone X with severe burn-ins, and it got them already after 1.5 years.
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