I do think not upgrading the imac soon after the powermacs and pbooks are upgraded would be a death wish for the line. Any consumer who does a bit of research will realize their computer is heading to a path of obselesence in the near futre, and they will realize they have wasted quite a bit of money in the process. So they will wait , or if they were a potential switcher, just buy a new PC. Apple will not gain or sustain marketshare with that route. In fact i believe Apple might have a hard time with the ibooks @ g3 speed when the 970 arrives.
I do think not upgrading the imac soon after the powermacs and pbooks are upgraded would be a death wish for the line. Any consumer who does a bit of research will realize their computer is heading to a path of obselesence in the near futre, and they will realize they have wasted quite a bit of money in the process. So they will wait , or if they were a potential switcher, just buy a new PC. Apple will not gain or sustain marketshare with that route. In fact i believe Apple might have a hard time with the ibooks @ g3 speed when the 970 arrives.
All computers are essentially obsolete as soon as they are purchased; another better-faster machine is on the drawing boards while one is being built.
Personally, I think the iMac will sit right where it is until either the 7457 or the 90nm 970 arrives.
For those of you who doubt that the G4 still has legs left for the future just take a look at what has happenned to the Pentium 3 (P3).
At 180 nm it topped out at 1.0 GHz after Intel recalled the 1.13 GHz partly due to errors when compiling Linux. They then released the 130 nm Tualatin core which still powers a lot of blades and notebooks at up to 1.33 GHz. Not a lot you might say but it's 33% better at 130 nm.
So lets say the 7457 can make it 33% better than the 7455 @ 1.42 GHz => 1.89 GHz. Still not up to par (with x86) I hear you say?
Examine the info about the Pentium M. (say, here: http://www.anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.html?i=1800 ) They took a P3, and added some features of the P4 like the bus and SSE2, doubled the cache to 1 MB (yes 1MB) and increase the pipeline slightly. And you know what? They increased the instructions per cycle (IPC) over the original P3! So now the processor runs at 1.6 GHz on 130 nm and performs about the same as a 2.7 GHz P4!
Lets hypothesise some more. The Pentium M is 60% higher clock on 130 nm than the P3 on 180 nm. This implies the 7457-RM might get to 2.27 GHz (with some other tweaks than just the RIO bus and 130 nm) right off the bat.
The performance of this processor will scream compared to similarly clocked x86 processors and hence would provide a great little addition to the iMac and iBook lines. It would give them great performance and still allow room for the 970 to show Dell hows it's done in the PM and PB.
Motorola has had problems. They might still in the future. But they can certainly design good processors and then build 1 or two of them. Lets see how they go.
MM
[edit - realised all my sized were out by an order of magnitude... :-( ]
I hope your right about the 7457 chip - its specs look good - IBM shipping details for the 970 in volume in June looks like it will come sooner than the 7457.
But I disagree with the comments that the 970 would NEED to go to the 0.09um process for it to be considered for the iMac?. At 19W for 1.2G - it will be a no brainer (even for the PB).
It just makes things a little greyer, when its entirely possible to have a situation just like we have right now with the product range, whereby the chip is adopted by both iMac & PM but product dynamics reflect the market category.
As Ive said before, to avoid confusion and in reality the general consumer that I could describe as the 32bit customer does not need, nor will likely appreciate 64bit computing, and most importantly, Apple does not need to incorporate more expensive chip sets for the 970 (thereby maintaining its margins).
I hope they can get the 7457's or even IBM get its G4 class 32 bit CPU out (and up to 2G), because there is most likely only 1 or 2 speed bumps left in the current G4, so we can get a decent performance upgrade for the iMac for such a beautiful machine. \
Well, if Apple waits as long for the next update as they waited for the last one, they'll have a lot of options: The Mot 7570, the IBM 990...
That's the spirit...
I think Esoniq and Dr.Boar and others have made excellent rebuttals to the arguments against the 970 appearing in other Apple lines.
It's IBM. The 970 is, by all accounts, arriving early. Probably means good yields (hi Moto!) and with reasonable heat requirements on the lower end of the clock...why wouldn't Apple use it in everything from the Powerbooks to the iMacs? At least the very top models (which I think tend to look very expensive with a mere 1 gig G4 stuck in both. A 970 in top end models would be better marketing and a significant boost to sales and justify, more so, their current steep premium prices for top end iMac and 17 inch Powerbook.)
There are so many arguments in blitzing the 970 and an 850 in Apple's product lines that it aint funny. Performance. Yield. A roadmap. FPU performance. Mhz marketing etc. A clean break from Moto' and the whole mhz myth thing. Getting 'power'Mac sales back on the map and building on the impact of the 12 and 17 Powerbooks by getting 970s into them as soon as possible. Not to mention boosting mediocre iMac sales.
It's all performance and price related. And finally, Apple acknowledges this.
The 970 changes all the rules as defined by the ball and chain Moto and G4 relationship.
I'm expecting Apple to play things a little differently over the next year. Both in hardware and software.
Panther and a 970 will put some real distance between Apples and Wintels. That's where I'm putting my spart money.
'But I disagree with the comments that the 970 would NEED to go to the 0.09um process for it to be considered for the iMac?. At 19W for 1.2G - it will be a no brainer (even for the PB).'
You'd have to be nuts not to consider putting that in the top Powerbooks and iMacs!
one thing is for sure, if the ppc970 is introduced in the pm apple will take some time to introduce (even) slower versions in the imac. the fact is apple has to drain this milkcow as efficient and good as possible. so they will wait as long as possible (a year or so) before they introduce it in the imac.
especially since these ppc970 processors are 2 times as fast as the G4 at the same clock speed, small internet and design companies will think twice to shell out their money for a powermac if they can get a almost as fast imac for much less at the same time.
they will shell out the money if the imac is not a option in speed at that current time. so a 1.2ghz or 1.4ghz ppc970 imac at the same time as a 1.4ghz ppc powermac will not happen... imo
or is it possible to squeeze the busspeed so there is a speed disadvantage for the imac with the same clocked processor?
the powerbook and powermac is a different story, so they actually can be introduced in the same time (if apple could, offcourse)
The obvious solution to getting the tower and the iMac to close in performance is having dual CPus in the towers and single in the iMac.
A 1 GHz 970 in the top end iMac would be an enormous boost and you culd still have the a low end tower at 1.4 GHz or so single processor and still have room for the other tower CPUs.
Intel is cranking out some really good CPUs so the sooner Apple has something from IBM the better
I hope your right about the 7457 chip - its specs look good - IBM shipping details for the 970 in volume in June looks like it will come sooner than the 7457.
But I disagree with the comments that the 970 would NEED to go to the 0.09um process for it to be considered for the iMac?. At 19W for 1.2G - it will be a no brainer (even for the PB).
Any statement absolute enough to talk about "NEED" suffers from the problem that we really don't have a lot of information about Apple's CPU situation. Even the G4 in the current PowerMacs is some freak hybrid whose publicly available documentation is thin on the ground.
There are several variables here: We don't know how many 970s will be available to Apple, and we don't know how much they'll cost. Heat issues aside, the 7457 will almost certainly be cheaper than the 130nm 970, and the 90nm 970+ will as well. Since the iMac is a consumer machine, there's more downward price pressure on it than there is for the professional machines (a professional machine, by definition, is a tax-deductible tool that pays for itself through usage, while a consumer machine is a luxury item that's a pure expense), and that makes a cheaper processor more appealing.
Also, there aren't many consumer tasks that a G4 can't handle ably. The high-end iMac already has DDR; with the release of the 970 in the professional line they could put a 1.3 or 1.5GHz 7457 with a 167 or 200MHz bus and appropriate DDR RAM and have a nice little performer.
Quote:
I hope they can get the 7457's or even IBM get its G4 class 32 bit CPU out (and up to 2G), because there is most likely only 1 or 2 speed bumps left in the current G4, so we can get a decent performance upgrade for the iMac for such a beautiful machine. \
1 or 2 speedbumps is enough to buy time for the 90nm (.09 micron) version of the 970.
Hmm... Just thinking... The last words we heard from APPLE were that a) they had no plans of using the PowerPC 970 from IBM and b) that the G4 still had quite some life in it.
Now, I'm also all hyped up about that new-religion G5-replacing PowerPC 970 and the rumours that we'll see those holy machines at WWDC already. Sure, I mean, it's not like we've been talking G5 for years now, is it?
So... Here's one we would get upset about, I guess:
August 2003: PowerMacs all-dual at 1.4, 1.5 and 1.6 GHz. PowerPC G4 7457.
January 2003: PowerMacs all-dual at 1.6, 1.7 and 1.8 GHz. PowerPC 7457.
And we'll be discussing about something like rumours about AMD Opteron processors that might make it to Apple. Someday.
Would we still buy PowerMacs in the Summer of '05 when they're released as 'PowerMacintosh G5' but would actually contain Motorola's refined PowerPC 7470?
Okay, now back on topic. Yeh, PowerPC 970 in iMacs it is, right? When... July? ;-)
970 in iMacs? Somehow it just doesn't seem to fit yet. I think we will see it first in the PowerMacs /X-Serves, followed shortly by PowerBooks. iMacs will probably wait until at least next winter. It is more then just a matter of the CPU, the iMac motherboards have some very special design parameters. I think Apple will want to prove their technology first in the lower volume, high end pro machines, before they attempt to bring it down to the higher volume, low end machines.
It has less to do with what Apple wants, or even marketing needs, and more to do with just the practical cycles of product development. You need to have a stable, relatively bug-free basic platform before you try to move it to high volume, low cost production.
970 PowerMacs this summer. July or August availability with maybe a late June announcement. Initially they will run with a "Patched" version of 10.2.5 (or whatever is current) but Panther will expand their capabilities in late August or September when it becomes available with improved 64bit capabilities for the core system, and ready to begin using 64 bit applications, as they become available. (Don't hold your breath)
970 PowerBooks, not right away, but very shortly after the PowerMacs. Sooner then some people expect, but not as soon as many people hope.
970 iMacs? Not before January other then just speed bumps By then, the core supporting technology for the 970's should be stable and there will have been time to design and ramp up volume production for iMacs. Motorola, might eak out one more surprise for the iMacs, but who knows?
iBooks? Love my iBook 600, but frankly I don't have a clue about their future. It seems kind of murky right now, depending on how other things develop. I expect they will follow along with the iMac cycle for the most part, and will probably utilize faster G3's and faster FSB, mostly due to heat and battery life issues. Don't really see that 970's in the PowerBooks, will automatically make the iBooks a candidate for G4's, unless the G4 power consumption and heat problems can be dramatically improved.
77 days until June 30th. Figure I need to set aside $25 a day just in case.
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
I was thinking a fix on the CRT and use of the B iMac in a location where it won't get used to death might be wise if I did get the new iMac. Any advice on where to find a CRT for it at a reasonable price or would it just be better to place it on my credenza next to my old original Mac box as an art display?
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
I was thinking a fix on the CRT and use of the B iMac in a location where it won't get used to death might be wise if I did get the new iMac. Any advice on where to find a CRT for it at a reasonable price or would it just be better to place it on my credenza next to my old original Mac box as an art display?
Decisions. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
NB
It may be not be your CRT, but your card.
My iMac SE DV goes off after 2 years of use, I brought it back to Apple, changed a card(vedio broad), and cost me us$300.
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
Predicting the 970's arrival in the iMac is very difficult and depend on several different factors. I guess we can be reasonably certain that the 970 will not be introduced in the iMac at the same time as in the iMac.
The new powermac will probably be introduced at the WWDC in SF, but is not likely to ship before sometime in Aug/Sept. At the same time we'll probably see the iMac being bumped to either 1.25 or 1.42 ghz.
As for the introduction of the 970 in the iMac line, I don't expect it to happend before MWSF in Jan 04 at the earliest, and maybe even later in the year. It all depends on yields of the 970 and at what speeds IBM manage to churn out. The right time for the 970 iMac probably will be when IBM introducec the 970+ and that is probably not going to happen in the first quarter of 2004.
So all in all. If you need a computer now, buy one. Eventually wait for the powermac and buy one of those when they are released. Replacing the crt is not a very cost-effective solution I'm afraid.
And another thing; you may also consider buying a laptop. They are the most attractive macs in Apples hardware line-up right now, but you may wait until the new 15" is released to make up your mind about that.
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
NB
I disagree with you that the G4 is not a smart buy, do yourself a favour and go into an apple store and check out those new 17" iMacs!, they are positively awesome!, great value and performance. A PC friend of mine went ahead and bought one. He is driving me nuts about how good his Mac is compared to the Dell he has now collecting dust!, long time Mac users think duh....
The problem for the G4 is that there does not appear to be much life left in it, it is stuck at 1.42G until either the 7457 is released, which should help with speed bumps in the iMac enclosure. And the reason this thread was proposed, was for the fact that the iMacs enclosure (heat related issues) is unlikely to support the current 7450.
Whilst I doubt we will see a 970 iMac @ MWSF, this will be mandatory if Moto cannot ship the 7457 in volume by that time.
Only time will tell, IMO if you can afford one get a 17" iMac now - you wont regret it.
Comments
Originally posted by jade
I do think not upgrading the imac soon after the powermacs and pbooks are upgraded would be a death wish for the line. Any consumer who does a bit of research will realize their computer is heading to a path of obselesence in the near futre, and they will realize they have wasted quite a bit of money in the process. So they will wait , or if they were a potential switcher, just buy a new PC. Apple will not gain or sustain marketshare with that route. In fact i believe Apple might have a hard time with the ibooks @ g3 speed when the 970 arrives.
All computers are essentially obsolete as soon as they are purchased; another better-faster machine is on the drawing boards while one is being built.
Originally posted by Amorph
Personally, I think the iMac will sit right where it is until either the 7457 or the 90nm 970 arrives.
For those of you who doubt that the G4 still has legs left for the future just take a look at what has happenned to the Pentium 3 (P3).
At 180 nm it topped out at 1.0 GHz after Intel recalled the 1.13 GHz partly due to errors when compiling Linux. They then released the 130 nm Tualatin core which still powers a lot of blades and notebooks at up to 1.33 GHz. Not a lot you might say but it's 33% better at 130 nm.
So lets say the 7457 can make it 33% better than the 7455 @ 1.42 GHz => 1.89 GHz. Still not up to par (with x86) I hear you say?
Examine the info about the Pentium M. (say, here: http://www.anandtech.com/mobile/showdoc.html?i=1800 ) They took a P3, and added some features of the P4 like the bus and SSE2, doubled the cache to 1 MB (yes 1MB) and increase the pipeline slightly. And you know what? They increased the instructions per cycle (IPC) over the original P3! So now the processor runs at 1.6 GHz on 130 nm and performs about the same as a 2.7 GHz P4!
Lets hypothesise some more. The Pentium M is 60% higher clock on 130 nm than the P3 on 180 nm. This implies the 7457-RM might get to 2.27 GHz (with some other tweaks than just the RIO bus and 130 nm) right off the bat.
The performance of this processor will scream compared to similarly clocked x86 processors and hence would provide a great little addition to the iMac and iBook lines. It would give them great performance and still allow room for the 970 to show Dell hows it's done in the PM and PB.
Motorola has had problems. They might still in the future. But they can certainly design good processors and then build 1 or two of them. Lets see how they go.
MM
[edit - realised all my sized were out by an order of magnitude... :-( ]
But I disagree with the comments that the 970 would NEED to go to the 0.09um process for it to be considered for the iMac?. At 19W for 1.2G - it will be a no brainer (even for the PB).
It just makes things a little greyer, when its entirely possible to have a situation just like we have right now with the product range, whereby the chip is adopted by both iMac & PM but product dynamics reflect the market category.
As Ive said before, to avoid confusion and in reality the general consumer that I could describe as the 32bit customer does not need, nor will likely appreciate 64bit computing, and most importantly, Apple does not need to incorporate more expensive chip sets for the 970 (thereby maintaining its margins).
I hope they can get the 7457's or even IBM get its G4 class 32 bit CPU out (and up to 2G), because there is most likely only 1 or 2 speed bumps left in the current G4, so we can get a decent performance upgrade for the iMac for such a beautiful machine.
Well, if Apple waits as long for the next update as they waited for the last one, they'll have a lot of options: The Mot 7570, the IBM 990...
That's the spirit...
I think Esoniq and Dr.Boar and others have made excellent rebuttals to the arguments against the 970 appearing in other Apple lines.
It's IBM. The 970 is, by all accounts, arriving early. Probably means good yields (hi Moto!) and with reasonable heat requirements on the lower end of the clock...why wouldn't Apple use it in everything from the Powerbooks to the iMacs? At least the very top models (which I think tend to look very expensive with a mere 1 gig G4 stuck in both. A 970 in top end models would be better marketing and a significant boost to sales and justify, more so, their current steep premium prices for top end iMac and 17 inch Powerbook.)
There are so many arguments in blitzing the 970 and an 850 in Apple's product lines that it aint funny. Performance. Yield. A roadmap. FPU performance. Mhz marketing etc. A clean break from Moto' and the whole mhz myth thing. Getting 'power'Mac sales back on the map and building on the impact of the 12 and 17 Powerbooks by getting 970s into them as soon as possible. Not to mention boosting mediocre iMac sales.
It's all performance and price related. And finally, Apple acknowledges this.
The 970 changes all the rules as defined by the ball and chain Moto and G4 relationship.
I'm expecting Apple to play things a little differently over the next year. Both in hardware and software.
Panther and a 970 will put some real distance between Apples and Wintels. That's where I'm putting my spart money.
Lemon Bon Bon
You'd have to be nuts not to consider putting that in the top Powerbooks and iMacs!
Lemon Bon Bon
especially since these ppc970 processors are 2 times as fast as the G4 at the same clock speed, small internet and design companies will think twice to shell out their money for a powermac if they can get a almost as fast imac for much less at the same time.
they will shell out the money if the imac is not a option in speed at that current time. so a 1.2ghz or 1.4ghz ppc970 imac at the same time as a 1.4ghz ppc powermac will not happen... imo
or is it possible to squeeze the busspeed so there is a speed disadvantage for the imac with the same clocked processor?
the powerbook and powermac is a different story, so they actually can be introduced in the same time (if apple could, offcourse)
A 1 GHz 970 in the top end iMac would be an enormous boost and you culd still have the a low end tower at 1.4 GHz or so single processor and still have room for the other tower CPUs.
Intel is cranking out some really good CPUs so the sooner Apple has something from IBM the better
Originally posted by hasapi
I hope your right about the 7457 chip - its specs look good - IBM shipping details for the 970 in volume in June looks like it will come sooner than the 7457.
But I disagree with the comments that the 970 would NEED to go to the 0.09um process for it to be considered for the iMac?. At 19W for 1.2G - it will be a no brainer (even for the PB).
Any statement absolute enough to talk about "NEED" suffers from the problem that we really don't have a lot of information about Apple's CPU situation. Even the G4 in the current PowerMacs is some freak hybrid whose publicly available documentation is thin on the ground.
There are several variables here: We don't know how many 970s will be available to Apple, and we don't know how much they'll cost. Heat issues aside, the 7457 will almost certainly be cheaper than the 130nm 970, and the 90nm 970+ will as well. Since the iMac is a consumer machine, there's more downward price pressure on it than there is for the professional machines (a professional machine, by definition, is a tax-deductible tool that pays for itself through usage, while a consumer machine is a luxury item that's a pure expense), and that makes a cheaper processor more appealing.
Also, there aren't many consumer tasks that a G4 can't handle ably. The high-end iMac already has DDR; with the release of the 970 in the professional line they could put a 1.3 or 1.5GHz 7457 with a 167 or 200MHz bus and appropriate DDR RAM and have a nice little performer.
I hope they can get the 7457's or even IBM get its G4 class 32 bit CPU out (and up to 2G), because there is most likely only 1 or 2 speed bumps left in the current G4, so we can get a decent performance upgrade for the iMac for such a beautiful machine.
1 or 2 speedbumps is enough to buy time for the 90nm (.09 micron) version of the 970.
Now, I'm also all hyped up about that new-religion G5-replacing PowerPC 970 and the rumours that we'll see those holy machines at WWDC already. Sure, I mean, it's not like we've been talking G5 for years now, is it?
So... Here's one we would get upset about, I guess:
August 2003: PowerMacs all-dual at 1.4, 1.5 and 1.6 GHz. PowerPC G4 7457.
January 2003: PowerMacs all-dual at 1.6, 1.7 and 1.8 GHz. PowerPC 7457.
And we'll be discussing about something like rumours about AMD Opteron processors that might make it to Apple. Someday.
Would we still buy PowerMacs in the Summer of '05 when they're released as 'PowerMacintosh G5' but would actually contain Motorola's refined PowerPC 7470?
Okay, now back on topic. Yeh, PowerPC 970 in iMacs it is, right? When... July? ;-)
apple said this?
It has less to do with what Apple wants, or even marketing needs, and more to do with just the practical cycles of product development. You need to have a stable, relatively bug-free basic platform before you try to move it to high volume, low cost production.
970 PowerMacs this summer. July or August availability with maybe a late June announcement. Initially they will run with a "Patched" version of 10.2.5 (or whatever is current) but Panther will expand their capabilities in late August or September when it becomes available with improved 64bit capabilities for the core system, and ready to begin using 64 bit applications, as they become available. (Don't hold your breath)
970 PowerBooks, not right away, but very shortly after the PowerMacs. Sooner then some people expect, but not as soon as many people hope.
970 iMacs? Not before January other then just speed bumps By then, the core supporting technology for the 970's should be stable and there will have been time to design and ramp up volume production for iMacs. Motorola, might eak out one more surprise for the iMacs, but who knows?
iBooks? Love my iBook 600, but frankly I don't have a clue about their future. It seems kind of murky right now, depending on how other things develop. I expect they will follow along with the iMac cycle for the most part, and will probably utilize faster G3's and faster FSB, mostly due to heat and battery life issues. Don't really see that 970's in the PowerBooks, will automatically make the iBooks a candidate for G4's, unless the G4 power consumption and heat problems can be dramatically improved.
77 days until June 30th. Figure I need to set aside $25 a day just in case.
I was thinking a fix on the CRT and use of the B iMac in a location where it won't get used to death might be wise if I did get the new iMac. Any advice on where to find a CRT for it at a reasonable price or would it just be better to place it on my credenza next to my old original Mac box as an art display?
Decisions. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
NB
Originally posted by nathanberkowicz
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
I was thinking a fix on the CRT and use of the B iMac in a location where it won't get used to death might be wise if I did get the new iMac. Any advice on where to find a CRT for it at a reasonable price or would it just be better to place it on my credenza next to my old original Mac box as an art display?
Decisions. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
NB
It may be not be your CRT, but your card.
My iMac SE DV goes off after 2 years of use, I brought it back to Apple, changed a card(vedio broad), and cost me us$300.
Originally posted by nathanberkowicz
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
Predicting the 970's arrival in the iMac is very difficult and depend on several different factors. I guess we can be reasonably certain that the 970 will not be introduced in the iMac at the same time as in the iMac.
The new powermac will probably be introduced at the WWDC in SF, but is not likely to ship before sometime in Aug/Sept. At the same time we'll probably see the iMac being bumped to either 1.25 or 1.42 ghz.
As for the introduction of the 970 in the iMac line, I don't expect it to happend before MWSF in Jan 04 at the earliest, and maybe even later in the year. It all depends on yields of the 970 and at what speeds IBM manage to churn out. The right time for the 970 iMac probably will be when IBM introducec the 970+ and that is probably not going to happen in the first quarter of 2004.
So all in all. If you need a computer now, buy one. Eventually wait for the powermac and buy one of those when they are released. Replacing the crt is not a very cost-effective solution I'm afraid.
And another thing; you may also consider buying a laptop. They are the most attractive macs in Apples hardware line-up right now, but you may wait until the new 15" is released to make up your mind about that.
Originally posted by nathanberkowicz
I have enjoyed this thread immensely. My poor little B Series iMac blew a CRT and I am contemplating a new iMac but obviously do not want to buy foolishly. It seems the consensus is that the G4 is not a smart buy and if the 970 is to appear sometime soon I will wait. But for how long?
NB
I disagree with you that the G4 is not a smart buy, do yourself a favour and go into an apple store and check out those new 17" iMacs!, they are positively awesome!, great value and performance. A PC friend of mine went ahead and bought one. He is driving me nuts about how good his Mac is compared to the Dell he has now collecting dust!, long time Mac users think duh....
The problem for the G4 is that there does not appear to be much life left in it, it is stuck at 1.42G until either the 7457 is released, which should help with speed bumps in the iMac enclosure. And the reason this thread was proposed, was for the fact that the iMacs enclosure (heat related issues) is unlikely to support the current 7450.
Whilst I doubt we will see a 970 iMac @ MWSF, this will be mandatory if Moto cannot ship the 7457 in volume by that time.
Only time will tell, IMO if you can afford one get a 17" iMac now - you wont regret it.