Apple says Epic can return to App Store only if it follows the rules

Posted:
in General Discussion edited September 11
Apple in a statement said Epic is welcome to return to the App Store when it agrees to "play by the same rules as everyone else," terms to which the developer has not yet agreed.




Epic on Thursday asked Apple to reinstate its developer account in light of the passage of a South Korean law that will require app store operators like Apple and Google to offer third-party payment systems for in-app purchases.

"As we've said all along, we would welcome Epic's return to the App Store if they agree to play by the same rules as everyone else," Apple said in a statement to AppleInsider. "Epic has admitted to breach of contract and as of now, there's no legitimate basis for the reinstatement of their developer account."

Accepting the App Store's guidelines is the minimum requirement for any developer to gain entry to the marketplace, but Epic has refused to agree to Apple's terms. Epic's request on Thursday does not demonstrate a willingness to change that stance and Apple is not prepared to consider a request for reinstatement until the developer agrees to comply with App Store rules, Apple says.

The "Fortnite" developer was hanging its hopes on a change of heart following the passage of South Korea's Telecommunications Business Act, which will require app stores to accept alternative payment methods for in-app purchases. Passed late last month, the legislation is not yet in effect.

Interestingly, Epic in its letter to Apple on Thursday said it plans to use Apple SDKs, software and testing services. Why Epic is attempting to access to those tools is unknown, but it can't legally do so without a license.

"Fortnite" was booted off the App Store more than a year ago after Epic sidestepped Apple's commission mechanism by secretly including and later activating a third-party payment option in an app update. Apple consequently deactivated the company's account, an action that triggered a prepared legal barrage and corresponding PR campaign.

Read on AppleInsider

Comments

  • Reply 1 of 16
    Really tired of Apple playing nice with A*holes like this. Epic could be said to have caused irreparable damage to Apple in their campaign to debase them. Fartnite is incredibly popular thanks to the likes of Apple and Google, yet the billions Epic made on these platforms was just not quite enough. But, I can't see Epic throwing in the towel to abide by the App Store rules, particularly since they are still litigating. Their begging needs to be front page news if for no other reason than to show everyone who follows this mini-series what lunatics they are! 

    UnReal Engine, on the other hand, is truly amazing, and needs to be available for all the game developers who depend on them. I wonder how much Epic charges them - is it a one time licencing fee or do they pay a percentage of income? 
    watto_cobradanox
  • Reply 2 of 16
    Epic: We want you to host our free app on your platform. But we want all the income. Cool?
    Apple: Well, no.
    Epic: Waaaaah We’re being repressed! Greedy Apple!
    Apple: You’re welcome back if you follow the same rules as the others.
    Epic: Waaaaaaaaah
    williamlondonhlee1169Fidonet127watto_cobran2itivguy
  • Reply 3 of 16
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 1,222member
    Really tired of Apple playing nice with A*holes like this. Epic could be said to have caused irreparable damage to Apple in their campaign to debase them. Fartnite is incredibly popular thanks to the likes of Apple and Google, yet the billions Epic made on these platforms was just not quite enough. But, I can't see Epic throwing in the towel to abide by the App Store rules, particularly since they are still litigating. Their begging needs to be front page news if for no other reason than to show everyone who follows this mini-series what lunatics they are! 

    UnReal Engine, on the other hand, is truly amazing, and needs to be available for all the game developers who depend on them. I wonder how much Epic charges them - is it a one time licencing fee or do they pay a percentage of income? 

    Another aspect that has evolved drastically over the years is its pricing model. Up until Unreal Engine 3, Epic's licensing costs were high, starting at $99 for its Unreal Development Kit but usually going much higher as most licences were custom. When UE4 was released, Epic Games tested a subscription model at $19 a month, which resulted in its userbase growing ten times larger in a single year. At that point, the company decided to make UE4 free.

    Epic then switched to a royalties system -- initially, if your game made more than $3,000 per calendar quarter, Epic would take a 5% royalty. When announcing Unreal Engine 5, the company also changed this system and removed all royalties on the first $1 million in revenue for all games made in Unreal Engine. This took effect on May 13, 2020, but is retroactive to January 1, 2020.









    edited September 10 fastasleep
  • Reply 4 of 16
    Really tired of Apple playing nice with A*holes like this. Epic could be said to have caused irreparable damage to Apple in their campaign to debase them. Fartnite is incredibly popular thanks to the likes of Apple and Google, yet the billions Epic made on these platforms was just not quite enough. But, I can't see Epic throwing in the towel to abide by the App Store rules, particularly since they are still litigating. Their begging needs to be front page news if for no other reason than to show everyone who follows this mini-series what lunatics they are! 

    UnReal Engine, on the other hand, is truly amazing, and needs to be available for all the game developers who depend on them. I wonder how much Epic charges them - is it a one time licencing fee or do they pay a percentage of income? 
    According to this, after first 1 million dollars of gross *revenue* it’s a 5% royalty.

    edit: this being their site
    https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/download
    edited September 10
  • Reply 5 of 16
    epic is just a bully kid that doesn't know how to play by the rules, law, or signed contracts. warning anyone who do business with epic, since they don't convey by their own sign contracts, they could just overtake you at anytime if they feel like it. I don't think they got enough love while growing up from their parents. this why they turn out such a spoil brat bully kids that only want things their way. I mean they doing worse things to their customers, someone should go complain about that with their royalty points system.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 6 of 16
    jungmarkjungmark Posts: 6,882member
    Suck it, Epic. 
    williamlondonwatto_cobran2itivguy
  • Reply 7 of 16
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
  • Reply 8 of 16
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    LOL what? Apple needs to pay itself a commission and go through app review? What are you smoking?
    williamlondonwatto_cobran2itivguymuthuk_vanalingamsconosciuto
  • Reply 9 of 16
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    Are you saying that companies with storefronts cannot sell products they manufacture in their storefront? That's a radical opinion. So Walmart cannot sell anything it manufactures in their own stores? And McD's cannot sell any food that they manufacture in their stores? And console game manufacturers cannot sell their own software on their own app stores? You are brave to be saying that. You've got guts.
    watto_cobran2itivguyMisterKit
  • Reply 10 of 16
    danoxdanox Posts: 676member
    Really tired of Apple playing nice with A*holes like this. Epic could be said to have caused irreparable damage to Apple in their campaign to debase them. Fartnite is incredibly popular thanks to the likes of Apple and Google, yet the billions Epic made on these platforms was just not quite enough. But, I can't see Epic throwing in the towel to abide by the App Store rules, particularly since they are still litigating. Their begging needs to be front page news if for no other reason than to show everyone who follows this mini-series what lunatics they are! 

    UnReal Engine, on the other hand, is truly amazing, and needs to be available for all the game developers who depend on them. I wonder how much Epic charges them - is it a one time licencing fee or do they pay a percentage of income? 
    Apple needs to move on like moving away from Adobe Flash or a bad marriage….
    MisterKit
  • Reply 11 of 16
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    Sweeney, is it you skulking around in here in the forum pages?
    You really shouldn’t post things when you’ve been smoking on. Didnt your mama teach you that?
    edited September 11 williamlondon
  • Reply 12 of 16
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    Your sense of entitlement is ginormous. 
    fastasleepwilliamlondon
  • Reply 13 of 16
    sflocalsflocal Posts: 5,816member
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    That you're on here this long spewing your BS and believing it is beyond me.

    Buzz off.
    williamlondonfastasleep
  • Reply 14 of 16
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    LOL what? Apple needs to pay itself a commission and go through app review? What are you smoking?

    Spotify has this issue and can’t compete with Apple due to the 30% commission which Apple Music does not pay to use the same sales channel. Apple Music business unit should pay 30% commission to Apple Store business unit to create a fair market place for all competing business, including Apple. 
    williamlondon
  • Reply 15 of 16
    crowleycrowley Posts: 9,093member
    jmaximus said:
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    LOL what? Apple needs to pay itself a commission and go through app review? What are you smoking?
    Spotify has this issue and can’t compete with Apple due to the 30% commission which Apple Music does not pay to use the same sales channel. Apple Music business unit should pay 30% commission to Apple Store business unit to create a fair market place for all competing business, including Apple. 
    It wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference, Apple still gets the 30% either way.  Your solution only works if Apple Music is deemed to need to turn a profit and be independently economically competitive with Spotify.  But it isn't, because it's all part of the Apple group.  If it makes a 15% loss the management board know that 30% of its revenue is going to the App Store and form part of the profit of another Apple business unit, so it's not a problem. 

    And what such a solution might actually end up doing instead is open up a transfer pricing opportunity for Apple to avoid paying corporation tax.
    fastasleep
  • Reply 16 of 16
    jmaximus said:
    Epic can return to the App Store if they play by the same rules as everyone else ... except Apple. While Apple has apps on the App Store, pays no commission and does not have the same app review process to go through, it can never be fair to developers. While Apple protects itself and its own interests over those of their customers and developers, it can never be fair to anyone. Let's hope these are only the first changes to come to the App Store. Third party App Stores should be a thing as should all the other amazing apps that no one has seen because Apple won't allow them to exist.
    LOL what? Apple needs to pay itself a commission and go through app review? What are you smoking?

    Spotify has this issue and can’t compete with Apple due to the 30% commission which Apple Music does not pay to use the same sales channel. Apple Music business unit should pay 30% commission to Apple Store business unit to create a fair market place for all competing business, including Apple. 
    That makes absolutely zero sense. Apple Music isn't in the App Store. Apple moving 30% of your subscription fee to another department doesn't change anything for Apple — why would it?
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