Compared: 2021 16-inch MacBook Pro vs Dell XPS 17

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  • Reply 21 of 33
    GeorgeBMacGeorgeBMac Posts: 11,421member
    One runs Windows and the other runs MacOS, a far bigger difference and reason for buying than hardware details. If you like Windows, or the stuff that runs on Windows, well, you do you.
    Fixed that for you.
    But don't blame Microsoft for that.   Apple uses all the great iPhone apps as a reason to buy iPhone -- and the lack of them was a major reason for the failure of the Windows phone.

    techaccidentwatto_cobra
  • Reply 22 of 33
    One runs Windows and the other runs MacOS, a far bigger difference and reason for buying than hardware details. If you like Windows, or the stuff that runs on Windows, well, you do you.
    Fixed that for you.
    But don't blame Microsoft for that.   Apple uses all the great iPhone apps as a reason to buy iPhone -- and the lack of them was a major reason for the failure of the Windows phone.

    What’s good for the goose snd all that. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 23 of 33
    One runs Windows and the other runs MacOS, a far bigger difference and reason for buying than hardware details. If you like Windows, or the stuff that runs on Windows, well, you do you.
    Fixed that for you.
    But don't blame Microsoft for that.   Apple uses all the great iPhone apps as a reason to buy iPhone -- and the lack of them was a major reason for the failure of the Windows phone.


    I am most fortunate, I have no requirements to run any Windows apps at all and find none the least bit appealing. They were once a big part of my world, but those days are long past.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 24 of 33
    darkvader said:
    For me, it is neither because neither machine has the left and right cursor buttons that facilitate scrolling, text selection and so on.

    I understand that many high end machines are eliminating those buttons -- probably so they can look sleek, clean and modern.  But, I don't care if it looks old fashioned and clunky and I don't care if it's possible to do those things without the buttons -- they make my life easier.

    [My grandson disagrees with me.  He thinks they're worthless dinosaurs -- and he does fine without them.   Me?  I struggle without them.  I could be because his fine motor skills are much better than mine (which pretty much suck).]

    Huh?  The new MBP appears to have the same left and right arrow keys that we've had for years.  What buttons are you talking about?

    The same that you find on a regular mouse.
    "Click & drag", select, etc...
    There are multiple ways to accomplish that with an Apple Trackpad.  I turn on three-finger drag in Accessibility (it used to be in the track pad preference).

    The other thing I do, that most people don't think of is use multiple digits on track pad to click & drag - (right handed) them clicks down on the track pad & I use my index finger to drag/move the cursor.  Some people use two fingers on different hands if they can't coordinate or hadn't considered using their thumb to click & hold.

    For me, the three-finger drag, and the thumb click/hold & index drag work very well, and probably as good as any mouse I've tried.
    watto_cobracrowley
  • Reply 25 of 33
    DuhSesameDuhSesame Posts: 1,278member
    darkvader said:
    KITA said:

    That's not to fault this review, which is, as always, a good one. 
    Agree to disagree I suppose... The article does essentially nothing to "review" either device beyond a light spec sheet comparison.
    This is just a straight specs compare, which we get a large volume of requests for. Reviews will follow.

    Can the review include a look at hardware compatibility with Mac OS?  This Dell hardware actually sounds REALLY good compared to the Mac, which means a "Will it Hackintosh?" article would be pretty helpful.

    (Yes, replaceable RAM and SSD are a MASSIVE plus for many of us, as is the lack of idiotic screen notch, and having an Intel chip is also a nice thing.)
    Didn't know 10875H beats M1 Max by a margin, which is about the same as the 16-inch in 2019.

    :)
    Detnator
  • Reply 26 of 33
    cpsrocpsro Posts: 3,212member
    I've never had an Intel laptop that didn't throttle under load. Even the 12th generation Intel line looks like it will continue the trend.
    The MBP M1 Max doesn't throttle and barely gets warm. It's simply amazing.
    edited December 2021 williamlondon
  • Reply 27 of 33
    AI is in desperate need of a proofreader. The typos are a little amazing, even by AI standards. Woof.
    williamlondon
  • Reply 28 of 33
    dewmedewme Posts: 5,534member
    If I was on the fence about whether to go with a new Mac versus a new PC the latest versions of these two models would be high on my list. I do have to say that Dell’s pricing structure on the XPS line has drastically narrowed the delta between Mac and PC pricing. I’ve had generally good experiences with the Dell Latitude line in terms of reliability, but their specs were never as leading edge as what the XPS seems to carry.

    Prior to Apple Silicon there would be no choice at all between which top tier machine to buy. I’d buy the Mac with a lot of memory and storage and install VMWare Fusion to run Windows VMs - end of story, eazy peazy, zero decision anxiety. Unfortunately this is no longer an option which means having to make a hard commitment to go with a Mac or a PC or Both based on my total set of requirements. The Apple Silicon chips may be the second coming of computing nirvana, but the inability to run x86 VMs under VMWare Fusion massively changes the entire decision making process from what it used to be.
  • Reply 29 of 33
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    nicholfd said:
    darkvader said:
    For me, it is neither because neither machine has the left and right cursor buttons that facilitate scrolling, text selection and so on.

    I understand that many high end machines are eliminating those buttons -- probably so they can look sleek, clean and modern.  But, I don't care if it looks old fashioned and clunky and I don't care if it's possible to do those things without the buttons -- they make my life easier.

    [My grandson disagrees with me.  He thinks they're worthless dinosaurs -- and he does fine without them.   Me?  I struggle without them.  I could be because his fine motor skills are much better than mine (which pretty much suck).]

    Huh?  The new MBP appears to have the same left and right arrow keys that we've had for years.  What buttons are you talking about?

    The same that you find on a regular mouse.
    "Click & drag", select, etc...
    There are multiple ways to accomplish that with an Apple Trackpad.  I turn on three-finger drag in Accessibility (it used to be in the track pad preference).

    The other thing I do, that most people don't think of is use multiple digits on track pad to click & drag - (right handed) them clicks down on the track pad & I use my index finger to drag/move the cursor.  Some people use two fingers on different hands if they can't coordinate or hadn't considered using their thumb to click & hold.

    For me, the three-finger drag, and the thumb click/hold & index drag work very well, and probably as good as any mouse I've tried.
    I didn't know about three-finger drag, and now I've turned it on I can't believe I went so long without it.  Click and dragging was always the more awkward part of using a trackpad, but it just leapfrogged a mouse, it's so easy and intuitive.  Why isn't this switched on by default?  Brilliant tip, thanks!

    (and an additional thanks to those that bumped the thread, as otherwise I wouldn't have seen the tip :smile: )

    EDIT: I am legit overjoyed with this. Am doing a dive into my folders just to find files that need to be moved so I can use it. A bleak autumn day has been made much brighter.
    edited December 2021 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 30 of 33
    For me, it is neither because neither machine has the left and right cursor buttons that facilitate scrolling, text selection and so on.

    I understand that many high end machines are eliminating those buttons -- probably so they can look sleek, clean and modern.  But, I don't care if it looks old fashioned and clunky and I don't care if it's possible to do those things without the buttons -- they make my life easier.

    [My grandson disagrees with me.  He thinks they're worthless dinosaurs -- and he does fine without them.   Me?  I struggle without them.  I could be because his fine motor skills are much better than mine (which pretty much suck).]
    Actually, the Mac trackpad doesn't have a button - the whole trackpad is the button.

    You can get a right click by pressing down with two fingers, or alternately hold down Control and click.

    If you're talking an external mouse, an Apple mouse can be configured for left and right clicks. Probably similar for OEM mice.
    edited December 2021 williamlondon
  • Reply 31 of 33
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    For me, it is neither because neither machine has the left and right cursor buttons that facilitate scrolling, text selection and so on.

    I understand that many high end machines are eliminating those buttons -- probably so they can look sleek, clean and modern.  But, I don't care if it looks old fashioned and clunky and I don't care if it's possible to do those things without the buttons -- they make my life easier.

    [My grandson disagrees with me.  He thinks they're worthless dinosaurs -- and he does fine without them.   Me?  I struggle without them.  I could be because his fine motor skills are much better than mine (which pretty much suck).]
    Actually, the Mac trackpad doesn't have a button - the whole trackpad is the button.

    You can get a right click by pressing down with two fingers, or alternately hold down Control and click.
    I'm pretty sure he gets that, he just doesn't like the lack of dedicated buttons.

    Absolutely no way Apple are going back on that though, so may as well work out a way to live with it rather than grumping on the internet.
  • Reply 32 of 33
    Really for price, the best metric is what it's going to cost you to use the computer - and more importantly the time it's going to save you.

    Take the purchase price and subtract the resale value (unless you're going to drive it into the ground) and that's your total cost of ownership. Divide TCO by the number of hours the MacBook Pro will save you over the period of ownership - your time is worth something, right? - and compare that to what you think your time is worth.

    Slicing off minutes, seconds, or even fractions of seconds can help you get your work done more quickly, and you can use that time for other tasks or reallocate it to leisure activities. People see big numbers when it comes time to purchase a new computer, but fail to value their own time (which is the one commodity which can never be recovered).

    I'm retired now, but even then my time has value (to me).

    I expect these new Apple Silicon MacBook Pros to retain a lot of resale value because of their amazing performance, which brings down TCO. I also expect that Apple Silicon has given AMD and Intel a significant nudge, so now we're seeing them introduce things like big/little architectures, breaking whatever torpor they may have been suffering from. Once kernel writers adapt to these more complex microarchitectures (Intel and AMD have left dispatching to the OS kernel) we should see a performance increase on the x86 front for the new generation of computers - which may well lead to a depreciation of current x86 models when it comes time to unload them. This will, of course, increase their TCOs respectively.

    Any way - just my thoughts. There are (I think) better metrics to consider than simple purchase price.
    muthuk_vanalingamdewmewilliamlondon
  • Reply 33 of 33
    Actually the Apple track pads have no "buttons" - not even the trackpad surface.  There is a pressure sensor sensor under the glass surface, and a haptic feedback device in the trackpad.  When the surface feels enough pressure (no actual movement down, though), it makes the clicking "sound" & provides the haptic feedback.  Try "clicking" the trackpad while it's powered off...  Nothing - just a smooth, dead, non-moving surface.
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