It’s been like this for 5 years. When Apple introduced the 4th gen MBP models in 2016. There were the 4 port Thunderbolt models with Touchbar above $1800. Apple offered a lower end MBP13 with only 2 Thunderbolt ports, and no Touch Bar for $1500.
Schiller even said it was a “replacement” for a MBA13, which at the time was offered starting $1000, but wasn’t updated and didn’t have a Retina display.
The Mac product lineup then was in a really strange place. The MBP13 with 2 TB ports coexisted with the rMB12 for basically the same price, and the low end MBA13 with low resolution display overlapped them, but crucially could be had for $1000.
Things didn’t become cleaner until the MB12 was retired and the 2018 MBA13 came out. Even after that, Apple still keep the 2 TB port MBP13 in the lineup to fill the 1300 and 1500 price points. It’s like this model as an upsell tool for the 1800+ models.
With it being a 14” display, I think it finally becomes a great laptop option for a lot of people at 1500 to 1800.
Both of those links are about the same model — the first shows it is still available, the second is AI’s review. So no, they only have one 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro for sale.
But, yes, they do have two 13-inch M1 MacBooks for sale, the Air and the Pro. I don’t understand what you find so confusing. You claimed they didn’t have a 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro for sale, only the Air. That’s just wrong, as proven by the first link.
Both of those links are about the same model — the first shows it is still available, the second is AI’s review. So no, they only have one 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro for sale.
But, yes, they do have two 13-inch M1 MacBooks for sale, the Air and the Pro. I don’t understand what you find so confusing. You claimed they didn’t have a 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro for sale, only the Air. That’s just wrong, as proven by the first link.
OK I was wrong. I checked MacBook Air link. I did not check the MacBook Pro link because i saw the 13" MacBook Air first.
Both of those links are about the same model — the first shows it is still available, the second is AI’s review. So no, they only have one 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro for sale.
But, yes, they do have two 13-inch M1 MacBooks for sale, the Air and the Pro. I don’t understand what you find so confusing. You claimed they didn’t have a 13-inch M1 MacBook Pro for sale, only the Air. That’s just wrong, as proven by the first link.
OK I was wrong. I checked MacBook Air link. I did not check the MacBook Pro link because i saw the 13" MacBook Air first.
You literally spent three times the effort on telling people they’re wrong than it would have taken to check.
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
The 13" MBP seems very much like a stopgap solution intended to get M-series chips out there while the proper 14" MBPs were still cooking. Seems obvious to me it's going to get dropped as soon as Apple feel they can. It is odd that they'd even have a MacBook Pro, with a sub-Pro (i.e. vanilla M1/M2) chip, but Apple's approach to taxonomy has always been a little loosey goosey.
A machine to sit in between the MBA M# (starts at $999) and the MBP M# Pro/Max (starts at $1999) might make sense, but I'd just call it a MacBook M#, even if it does have a similar chassis to the MBP. If they insist on calling it a MBP... well it's not really a surprise, just a bit of an eye-roller.
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
I mean, if the goal is to have a base model, that makes sense. I would think it would need to be as you said, though: M2, M2 Pro, M2 Max. What wouldn't make sense is M2, M1 Pro, M1 Max. But honestly, I don't see why three lines are needed, especially if they keep the Air.
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
The current M1 MBP13 actually has a Touch Bar and a hardware escape key. 🤪
This could be the line up by Summer:
$1000 M1 MBA13 with old industrial design $1200 M2 MBA13 with new industrial design $1400 M2 MBA13 higher end SKU $1600 M2 MBP14 base SKU, 2 TB4 ports, HDMI, miniLED $1800 M2 MBP14 higher end SKU, 2 TB4 ports, HDMI, miniLED $2000 M1 Pro MBP14 current model
Odds are pretty good that the new MBA will use the MBP14/16 keyboard with full height FN row imo.
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
I mean, if the goal is to have a base model, that makes sense. I would think it would need to be as you said, though: M2, M2 Pro, M2 Max. What wouldn't make sense is M2, M1 Pro, M1 Max. But honestly, I don't see why three lines are needed, especially if they keep the Air.
Nonetheless, it’s likely that there will be a period in which M2, M1Pro, and M1Max is the MBP lineup. This is just the reality of the science of making Apple Silicon. Delaying availability of the basic M2 in order to wait for the more advanced SoCs, the fabrication of which learns from the earlier efforts and takes longer to perfect, is not a good idea. It’s better to allow the marketing to reflect the scientific process, rather than doing what Intel does, ultimately making promises it can’t keep.
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
I mean, if the goal is to have a base model, that makes sense. I would think it would need to be as you said, though: M2, M2 Pro, M2 Max. What wouldn't make sense is M2, M1 Pro, M1 Max. But honestly, I don't see why three lines are needed, especially if they keep the Air.
Nonetheless, it’s likely that there will be a period in which M2, M1Pro, and M1Max is the MBP lineup. This is just the reality of the science of making Apple Silicon. Delaying availability of the basic M2 in order to wait for the more advanced SoCs, the fabrication of which learns from the earlier efforts and takes longer to perfect, is not a good idea. It’s better to allow the marketing to reflect the scientific process, rather than doing what Intel does, ultimately making promises it can’t keep.
That's possible, though from a marketing perspective, I'd think the M2 would be the highest end chip. If it wasn't, it would be confusing to consumers. How can an M1 Pro be more powerful than an M2? That's what many will think (present company excluded...we follow these things closely).
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
I mean, if the goal is to have a base model, that makes sense. I would think it would need to be as you said, though: M2, M2 Pro, M2 Max. What wouldn't make sense is M2, M1 Pro, M1 Max. But honestly, I don't see why three lines are needed, especially if they keep the Air.
Nonetheless, it’s likely that there will be a period in which M2, M1Pro, and M1Max is the MBP lineup. This is just the reality of the science of making Apple Silicon. Delaying availability of the basic M2 in order to wait for the more advanced SoCs, the fabrication of which learns from the earlier efforts and takes longer to perfect, is not a good idea. It’s better to allow the marketing to reflect the scientific process, rather than doing what Intel does, ultimately making promises it can’t keep.
That's possible, though from a marketing perspective, I'd think the M2 would be the highest end chip. If it wasn't, it would be confusing to consumers. How can an M1 Pro be more powerful than an M2? That's what many will think (present company excluded...we follow these things closely).
Therein lies the challenge for Apple’s marketing then — how to convey that message!
I think probably how to do that depends, again, on reality. How will the M2 compare to the M1 Pro/Max? At this point we’re just waiting to see. But regardless it’s going to interesting — it might make sense for some current M1 Pro users to “downgrade” to the M2, while others will have to wait to “upgrade” to the M2 Pro. Thus, I think we can see why this rumor/leak makes sense — it allows people who want an XDR display and more ports to adjust their SoC to their needs, and more importantly it shakes up the traditional refresh cycle of the PC industry, giving Apple more flexibility and balance—not all of their customers will be holding out for new hardware at the same time…
This has nothing to do with laptops, but I want to add that it’s possible the highest-end won’t be refreshed every generation. I think there will always be a Mx, Mx Pro, and Mx Max, because the MacBook Pro is the flagship, but the highest-end silicon for the iMac Pro and Mac Pro could go from M1 to M3 and skip M2. So those customers, who are spending tens of thousands on each configuration, would refresh every three years, instead of every 18 months.
This news doesn't make any sense to me. What do they mean by replacing? Apple already sells a 14" MacBook Pro. So to me this is just a discontinuation of the MacBook Pro 13". I have waited years for a MacBook 14" but this new model is a complete disappointment. It's ugly, I'll never buy a 2k+ laptop with screen that has a lego brick size dent right in front of your eyes, it's ugly as hell and it's the most ridiculous design decision Apple ever made, it's heavy and clumsy. If the upcoming air is with a 13" screen and dent I'll be perfectly happy with the latest Intel 16" MBP for the next 10 years.
Agreed. The notch makes sense in phones, possibly tablets, but for a laptop size screen and up, it’s absurd to have a gd notch rather than just maintaining a small bezel. It’s really strange Apple did this. Is like they started with a specific goal in mind (eg ‘let’s make a 14” with the same footprint as the previous 13”), rather than looking at the device holistically (like they usually do).
Honestly, this makes zero sense. If we're talking about the MBA, I get it. But why would Apple come out with a 14" MBP after they just updated the 14" to M1 Pro and Max? Are we saying the M2 will replace all of them? Or are we talking about a lineup with two different models of 14" MBP? M2 and M1 Pro/Max variants? That seems silly and convoluted. I find it hard to believe they will update the current MacBook Pros (14/16) before the end of the year. I could obviously see a MacBook Air with M2.
Just now they have 3 MBP models that have different manufacturing lines. The current entry 13" Pro is a holdover from the old design with touchbar, no XDR and with the M1 chip. To update that entry Pro model, they'd either leave it with a lower quality display or have to source 13" XDR displays and make a new manufacturing line for the chassis. Instead they can remove the 13" model and reduce some of the spec of the $1999 14" model and have a lot of the same manufacturing. This brings the entry price for a model with XDR display down.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
If they want to align product and supply then MacBookAir and iPadPro seem to be the better partners in crime. Both fanless, same processors, similar storage and memory options. Could be both the same ports. So why not have them both share screen suppliers and even factory lines.
If they make the next iPadPro landscape and screen bump them by maybe expanding the screen to edges and notch it that would give them a 11.9inch and 13.6inch options. That would look like a good line up to take to the market of both machines.
Drop the 13inch MacBookPro model.
If apple can hole-punch screens instead of notching them why not make the hole Apple shaped. On the mac make the hole the Apple menu.
I hope Apple can make the pricing work to have just two MacBooks aesthetics: the slim, redesigned regular/air model (MacBook), and the MacBook Pro. Maybe have a 13” model with lesser all around specs to hit an entry level price point.
I'm amazed by how many people just accept that the most expensive laptop lineup in the world now has a big, ugly, rectangular dent in the screen. An ALL screens. Only Apple can get away with such a crippled design, it's really an inverse emperor's new clothes:
"I can't see a big black square, can you see a big black square?" "Square, what square. I don't see any square".
I'm amazed by how many people just accept that the most expensive laptop lineup in the world now has a big, ugly, rectangular dent in the screen. An ALL screens. Only Apple can get away with such a crippled design, it's really an inverse emperor's new clothes:
"I can't see a big black square, can you see a big black square?" "Square, what square. I don't see any square".
LOL
I see it, it just doesn't bother me. That centre top area is a dead part of the screen for anything I do on my MBP. Meanwhile I get a gorgeous 14" screen in a form factor that shouldn't really be able to support it. Or if another manufacturer were to try it they'd do something even more dumb like put the webcam in the keyboard.
No, I'm very much a fan of what Apple has done. No notch would certainly be better, all other things being equal, but all other things being equal isn't an option, compromise is necessary. What you call cripple I call compromise.
I'm amazed by how many people just accept that the most expensive laptop lineup in the world now has a big, ugly, rectangular dent in the screen. An ALL screens. Only Apple can get away with such a crippled design, it's really an inverse emperor's new clothes:
"I can't see a big black square, can you see a big black square?" "Square, what square. I don't see any square".
LOL
No doubt there’s some truth to that, minus the outrage—the idea that people quickly no longer see it. My experience with the notch on my phone has been twofold—[1] I no longer see it, but [2] I’ve also trained myself to look at it when I’m talking while using FaceTime or Zoom or whatever. I suppose the MBP notch will be the same…
Comments
wow.
I think they'd be best to have every Pro model with 16GB unified memory so starting price can be $1499.
Then there would be 14" Pro with options for M2/M2 Pro/M2 Max from $1499+. They could offer M2 in the 16" too with 256GB to have an entry price of $1999. Hollywood script writers use these models, they don't need the best spec or a lot of storage.
The entry models can have a much slimmer/lighter bottom part if they are fanless.
A machine to sit in between the MBA M# (starts at $999) and the MBP M# Pro/Max (starts at $1999) might make sense, but I'd just call it a MacBook M#, even if it does have a similar chassis to the MBP. If they insist on calling it a MBP... well it's not really a surprise, just a bit of an eye-roller.
I mean, if the goal is to have a base model, that makes sense. I would think it would need to be as you said, though: M2, M2 Pro, M2 Max. What wouldn't make sense is M2, M1 Pro, M1 Max. But honestly, I don't see why three lines are needed, especially if they keep the Air.
This could be the line up by Summer:
$1000 M1 MBA13 with old industrial design
$1200 M2 MBA13 with new industrial design
$1400 M2 MBA13 higher end SKU
$1600 M2 MBP14 base SKU, 2 TB4 ports, HDMI, miniLED
$1800 M2 MBP14 higher end SKU, 2 TB4 ports, HDMI, miniLED
$2000 M1 Pro MBP14 current model
Odds are pretty good that the new MBA will use the MBP14/16 keyboard with full height FN row imo.
That's possible, though from a marketing perspective, I'd think the M2 would be the highest end chip. If it wasn't, it would be confusing to consumers. How can an M1 Pro be more powerful than an M2? That's what many will think (present company excluded...we follow these things closely).
I think probably how to do that depends, again, on reality. How will the M2 compare to the M1 Pro/Max? At this point we’re just waiting to see. But regardless it’s going to interesting — it might make sense for some current M1 Pro users to “downgrade” to the M2, while others will have to wait to “upgrade” to the M2 Pro. Thus, I think we can see why this rumor/leak makes sense — it allows people who want an XDR display and more ports to adjust their SoC to their needs, and more importantly it shakes up the traditional refresh cycle of the PC industry, giving Apple more flexibility and balance—not all of their customers will be holding out for new hardware at the same time…
If they make the next iPadPro landscape and screen bump them by maybe expanding the screen to edges and notch it that would give them a 11.9inch and 13.6inch options. That would look like a good line up to take to the market of both machines.
Drop the 13inch MacBookPro model.
If apple can hole-punch screens instead of notching them why not make the hole Apple shaped. On the mac make the hole the Apple menu.
Macbook 14”
MBP 14”
MBP 16”
(I’m such a nerd.)
"I can't see a big black square, can you see a big black square?"
"Square, what square. I don't see any square".
LOL
No, I'm very much a fan of what Apple has done. No notch would certainly be better, all other things being equal, but all other things being equal isn't an option, compromise is necessary. What you call cripple I call compromise.