Apple considers dropping face mask mandate for Apple Store staff

2

Comments

  • Reply 21 of 53
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    phonephreak
  • Reply 22 of 53
    cgWerkscgWerks Posts: 2,843member
    Bad move for the staff.  They face infection everyday.  They need protection.
    Would you tell a nurse to not bother masking in the face of a patient spewing disease?
    It is a different situation. A patient in the hospital is likely quite sick and coughing, etc. The mask will stop a good portion of droplet based transmission. However, since Covid-19 spreads via aerosol as well, the mask won't help much there. The store worker is mostly going to be exposed to aerosol spread, not droplet like the nurse.

    That said, most of the real-world evidence - primarily done in hospital settings, with influenza - shows masks haven't helped much. A lot of that likely applies to Covid-19 as well. If you want to see how easily Covid-19 spreads even with the use of full PPE, this Israeli study is quite telling:
    https://www.eurosurveillance.org/content/10.2807/1560-7917.ES.2021.26.39.2100822#html_fulltext
    (it also shows how useless vaccination was, as well)
    edited February 27 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 23 of 53
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?
  • Reply 24 of 53
    cgWerks said:
    Bad move for the staff.  They face infection everyday.  They need protection.
    Would you tell a nurse to not bother masking in the face of a patient spewing disease?
    It is a different situation. A patient in the hospital is likely quite sick and coughing, etc. The mask will stop a good portion of droplet based transmission. However, since Covid-19 spreads via aerosol as well, the mask won't help much there.....
    Bullshit

  • Reply 25 of 53
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    So that's your best argument?   Thanks for proving my point.
  • Reply 26 of 53
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
  • Reply 27 of 53
    For all you anti maskers.  Next time you have a surgical procedure.  Please tell the surgical team to remove their masks as they don’t do anything. 

    I’m willing to bet not one person would do that.  Lol

    some people are incredibly dumb. 
    spheric
  • Reply 28 of 53
    LeoMCLeoMC Posts: 84member
    For all you anti maskers.  Next time you have a surgical procedure.  Please tell the surgical team to remove their masks as they don’t do anything. 

    I’m willing to bet not one person would do that.  Lol

    some people are incredibly dumb. 
    Surgeons wear masks to protect the patient from bacterias (which are a totally different pathogen than the viruses) and they wear it when they spend lots of hours indoors.
    Please tell me you've just started the school and you don't have the right to vote :)!
    edited March 2 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 29 of 53
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
    Have you heard about Sweden?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-23/swedish-prime-minister-admits-strategy-to-stop-virus-fell-short
    spheric
  • Reply 30 of 53
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 1,307member
    I despise masks.

    They make me feel like I’m about to pass out.

    I strongly suspect that for me and many others, it will be far less harmful to get Covid-19 than to wear a mask.

    As a result I welcome the relaxation, or, better yet, the elimination of all mask mandates.
    This is the silliest thing I have ever read.... Hopefully it was sarcasm and I just missed it.

    sphericphonephreak
  • Reply 31 of 53
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 1,307member
    cgWerks said:
    Bad move for the staff.  They face infection everyday.  They need protection.
    Would you tell a nurse to not bother masking in the face of a patient spewing disease?
    It is a different situation. A patient in the hospital is likely quite sick and coughing, etc. The mask will stop a good portion of droplet based transmission. However, since Covid-19 spreads via aerosol as well, the mask won't help much there. The store worker is mostly going to be exposed to aerosol spread, not droplet like the nurse.

    That said, most of the real-world evidence - primarily done in hospital settings, with influenza - shows masks haven't helped much. A lot of that likely applies to Covid-19 as well. If you want to see how easily Covid-19 spreads even with the use of full PPE, this Israeli study is quite telling:
    https://www.eurosurveillance.org/content/10.2807/1560-7917.ES.2021.26.39.2100822#html_fulltext
    (it also shows how useless vaccination was, as well)
    Meir Medical Center has 780 beds, most rooms accommodate three to four patients, 1 m apart with separation curtain partitions between beds. Starting in March 2020, patients have been encouraged to wear surgical masks. Although use was inconsistent, it was enforced during patient–staff encounters for both sides. On the dedicated COVID-19 ward, dedicated staff members worked with full personal protective equipment (PPE): N-95 mask, face shield, gown, gloves and hair cover.

    So the setting of this study you provide is in close quarters ( 1m = 3.28 ft ) and admits that the actual use of masks was inconsistent. Close quarters for extended periods of time and not using a masks consistently is the very example of how to spread COVID. wow... :|
    spheric
  • Reply 32 of 53
    jcs2305jcs2305 Posts: 1,307member
    lkrupp said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Again, fine. But don’t try to enforce your paranoia and hypochondria on the rest of us. We won’t be offended, really we won’t . We’ll just being laughing hysterically at you and your psychosis.
    Did you feel as strongly when hippies were discriminated against in the 1960 & 1970's with “No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service”? There has never been any state or federal law supporting this, yet businesses still do it to this very day. Time to rally the patriots! People's rights are being infringed upon! Haha

    It's cool to know that you and other's like you would laugh " hysterically" and mock someone for wanting to protect their health in the way they want in a free country? Classy group you must run with.. my goodness the immaturity and silliness over wearing masks never ceases to amaze me.


    spheric
  • Reply 33 of 53
    LeoMCLeoMC Posts: 84member
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
    Have you heard about Sweden?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-23/swedish-prime-minister-admits-strategy-to-stop-virus-fell-short
    I know Sweden like the back of my hand.
    Sweden had one of the best strategies in the WORLD: since feb 2021 its mortality has fallen to its regular values and remained there. They manage to do that with no masks, no mandates (prof of vaccination), no mandatory measures with school opened, with shops, restaurants, parks opened, with freedom of speech and movement unaltered.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 34 of 53
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    LeoMC said:
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
    Have you heard about Sweden?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-23/swedish-prime-minister-admits-strategy-to-stop-virus-fell-short
    I know Sweden like the back of my hand.
    Sweden had one of the best strategies in the WORLD: since feb 2021 its mortality has fallen to its regular values and remained there. They manage to do that with no masks, no mandates (prof of vaccination), no mandatory measures with school opened, with shops, restaurants, parks opened, with freedom of speech and movement unaltered.
    There were definitely masks being used in Sweden, even if it was lacklustre and there was no mandate, and there were definitely  widespread closures even if there were no formal lockdowns.  And even so, Sweden's results have been very questionable (including by their own prime minister and their monarch), certainly not the best, even if not the worst either.  But over twice* the deaths per capita as either Norway or Denmark, which are the closest geographical and demographic comparisons.  And the failure to protect people was particularly felt in the elderly population**.

    You're letting your ideology rule your analysis.


    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/
    ** https://ltccovid.org/2020/12/16/report-of-the-swedish-corona-commission-on-care-of-older-people-during-the-pandemic/
    edited March 2 spheric
  • Reply 35 of 53
    christophbchristophb Posts: 1,482member
    Everyone stop breathing NOW.  Problem solved in less than 360 seconds.   I read it somewhere….





    “I wrote it down and then I read it” — GC (RIP)
    edited March 2
  • Reply 36 of 53
    LeoMCLeoMC Posts: 84member
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
    Have you heard about Sweden?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-23/swedish-prime-minister-admits-strategy-to-stop-virus-fell-short
    I know Sweden like the back of my hand.
    Sweden had one of the best strategies in the WORLD: since feb 2021 its mortality has fallen to its regular values and remained there. They manage to do that with no masks, no mandates (prof of vaccination), no mandatory measures with school opened, with shops, restaurants, parks opened, with freedom of speech and movement unaltered.
    There were definitely masks being used in Sweden, even if it was lacklustre and there was no mandate, and there were definitely  widespread closures even if there were no formal lockdowns.  And even so, Sweden's results have been very questionable (including by their own prime minister and their monarch), certainly not the best, even if not the worst either.  But over twice* the deaths per capita as either Norway or Denmark, which are the closest geographical and demographic comparisons.  And the failure to protect people was particularly felt in the elderly population**.

    You're letting your ideology rule your analysis.


    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/
    ** https://ltccovid.org/2020/12/16/report-of-the-swedish-corona-commission-on-care-of-older-people-during-the-pandemic/
    There were hardly any mask use in Sweden - I know, I've been there when the cases peaked; I have seen just as many people wearing mask as they were wearing Balenciaga or Gucci (you have to know the Swedish people in order to get the comparison).
    Nothing was ever restricted (maybe alcohol access, which in Sweden has always been restricted) - they had a limited no of people in closed spaces and that was about the only mandatory measure; they respected some recommendations but nobody was offended by those who ignored them (even their state epidemiologist was seen in public ignoring some of them).
    In 2021 Sweden had a 75% increase of covid related deaths while Denmark had +147% and Norway +199% and in the last 12 mo SW had +35%, DK +98% and NO +167%.
    Most deaths in elderly occurred in institutions (which is where old people go in SW and are very rare in both DK and NO).
    The king spoke (in 2021) about what happened at the beginning of the pandemic (in 2020), following an investigation.

    The pandemic is about to end and we start to see the effects: SW has one of the biggest economic growths in EU, behind only to Ireland (where all tech companies are) and some of the poorest countries in CE like HU or RO.

    How's that for "ideology"?
    edited March 3 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 37 of 53
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    LeoMC said:
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
    Have you heard about Sweden?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-23/swedish-prime-minister-admits-strategy-to-stop-virus-fell-short
    I know Sweden like the back of my hand.
    Sweden had one of the best strategies in the WORLD: since feb 2021 its mortality has fallen to its regular values and remained there. They manage to do that with no masks, no mandates (prof of vaccination), no mandatory measures with school opened, with shops, restaurants, parks opened, with freedom of speech and movement unaltered.
    There were definitely masks being used in Sweden, even if it was lacklustre and there was no mandate, and there were definitely  widespread closures even if there were no formal lockdowns.  And even so, Sweden's results have been very questionable (including by their own prime minister and their monarch), certainly not the best, even if not the worst either.  But over twice* the deaths per capita as either Norway or Denmark, which are the closest geographical and demographic comparisons.  And the failure to protect people was particularly felt in the elderly population**.

    You're letting your ideology rule your analysis.


    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/
    ** https://ltccovid.org/2020/12/16/report-of-the-swedish-corona-commission-on-care-of-older-people-during-the-pandemic/
    There were hardly any mask use in Sweden - I know, I've been there when the cases peaked; I have seen just as many people wearing mask as they were wearing Balenciaga or Gucci (you have to know the Swedish people in order to get the comparison).
    Nothing was ever restricted (maybe alcohol access, which in Sweden has always been restricted) - they had a limited no of people in closed spaces and that was about the only mandatory measure; they respected some recommendations but nobody was offended by those who ignored them (even their state epidemiologist was seen in public ignoring some of them).
    In 2021 Sweden had a 75% increase of covid related deaths while Denmark had +147% and Norway +199% and in the last 12 mo SW had +35%, DK +98% and NO +167%.
    Most deaths in elderly occurred in institutions (which is where old people go in SW and are very rare in both DK and NO).
    The king spoke (in 2021) about what happened at the beginning of the pandemic (in 2020), following an investigation.

    The pandemic is about to end and we start to see the effects: SW has one of the biggest economic growths in EU, behind only to Ireland (where all tech companies are) and some of the poorest countries in CE like HU or RO.

    How's that for "ideology"?
    Nothing was ever restricted (except for all the restrictions) :smiley: 
    There were no masks (except for the masks that I saw) :smiley: 
    Older people dying is ok because it was in institutions :smiley: 
    And here's some unsourced numbers 
    :smiley: 

    Yep, ideology shining bright.


    I know Sweden quite well, and I know that there are opinions in Sweden that the approach taken was reckless and cost a lot of lives.  It certainly isn't true that the "
    country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2"
    spheric
  • Reply 38 of 53
    LeoMCLeoMC Posts: 84member
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    crowley said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    LeoMC said:
    Without masks, there will be no store policy to physically distance. 'If' I go into a store, I will wear a mask and treat those without masks like I do people with bad breath by politely backing away from them. No doubt some will be offended but my health is more important than their feelings.
    Maybe you should consider a Hazmat suit...

    No, a mask, especially a good one, is fine.
    I'm sure it is, but a Hazmat suit would be safer - don't you wanna be safe?

    my point.
    You have no point, dude; there are plenty of studies that show masks are pretty much useless and none that show they have any effect on containing the spread of viruses (have you heard about Sweden? that country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2 even though practically nobody wore a face covering).
    Have you heard about Sweden?

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-23/swedish-prime-minister-admits-strategy-to-stop-virus-fell-short
    I know Sweden like the back of my hand.
    Sweden had one of the best strategies in the WORLD: since feb 2021 its mortality has fallen to its regular values and remained there. They manage to do that with no masks, no mandates (prof of vaccination), no mandatory measures with school opened, with shops, restaurants, parks opened, with freedom of speech and movement unaltered.
    There were definitely masks being used in Sweden, even if it was lacklustre and there was no mandate, and there were definitely  widespread closures even if there were no formal lockdowns.  And even so, Sweden's results have been very questionable (including by their own prime minister and their monarch), certainly not the best, even if not the worst either.  But over twice* the deaths per capita as either Norway or Denmark, which are the closest geographical and demographic comparisons.  And the failure to protect people was particularly felt in the elderly population**.

    You're letting your ideology rule your analysis.


    https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/
    ** https://ltccovid.org/2020/12/16/report-of-the-swedish-corona-commission-on-care-of-older-people-during-the-pandemic/
    There were hardly any mask use in Sweden - I know, I've been there when the cases peaked; I have seen just as many people wearing mask as they were wearing Balenciaga or Gucci (you have to know the Swedish people in order to get the comparison).
    Nothing was ever restricted (maybe alcohol access, which in Sweden has always been restricted) - they had a limited no of people in closed spaces and that was about the only mandatory measure; they respected some recommendations but nobody was offended by those who ignored them (even their state epidemiologist was seen in public ignoring some of them).
    In 2021 Sweden had a 75% increase of covid related deaths while Denmark had +147% and Norway +199% and in the last 12 mo SW had +35%, DK +98% and NO +167%.
    Most deaths in elderly occurred in institutions (which is where old people go in SW and are very rare in both DK and NO).
    The king spoke (in 2021) about what happened at the beginning of the pandemic (in 2020), following an investigation.

    The pandemic is about to end and we start to see the effects: SW has one of the biggest economic growths in EU, behind only to Ireland (where all tech companies are) and some of the poorest countries in CE like HU or RO.

    How's that for "ideology"?
    Nothing was ever restricted (except for all the restrictions) :smiley: 
    There were no masks (except for the masks that I saw) :smiley: 
    Older people dying is ok because it was in institutions :smiley: 
    And here's some unsourced numbers :smiley: 

    Yep, ideology shining bright.


    I know Sweden quite well, and I know that there are opinions in Sweden that the approach taken was reckless and cost a lot of lives.  It certainly isn't true that the "country was hardly affected by sars-cov-2"
    I repeat: nothing was restricted in Sweden, except the things that Swedish people have always restricted.
    In this pandemic I've seen people wilfully wearing Darth Vader like helms - does that means it was mandatory to wear a DV like helm?
    I never said it was ok, I said Sweden had a surge of deaths in the first 2-3 months of the pandemic because the virus spread through elderly people institutionalised; after they realised what was happening and protected those people, the went back to normal. Norway didn't had that problem, because there are hardly any care centres.
    Don't you have access to the internet? Go fact-check those numbers, you lazy mo... :smiley: 
    edited March 3
  • Reply 39 of 53
    lkrupp said:
    Appleish said:
    I haven't had as much as a cold since January of 2020. I will be masking in stores for the rest of my life.
    Which is perfectly okay and your personal prerogative. Just don’t try to force me to do the same.
    But you force other people to be exposed to your viruses. You think that people who don’t believe in modern medicine and science are the only ones who have rights.

    There’s an old saying, “Your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins.” Your “right” to damage or destroy other people’s lives and property is not a right, it’s a wrong.

    It’s not all about you, 


  • Reply 40 of 53
    LeoMC said:
    I know Sweden like the back of my hand.
    That may be true, but what you “know” about Sweden does not accord with reality. 

    “Sweden currently has the highest per-capita death of any European country, making it difficult to imagine their policies will be remembered as anything short of disastrous.”


    As Will Roger’s said, it’s not what you don’t know that hurts you, it’s all the things you do know that ain’t so.

    You want the “right” to do whatever you like, regardless of how much damage you do to other people. So, do I have to punch you in the nose? To break your leg? To dump garbage on your property? To put poison into your water supply? 

    I remember when Covid deniers used to say, “We don’t object to voluntary measures. We’re just against government mandates.” Now, we see that isn’t true, You aren’t just against government mandates. You’re against companies voluntarily doing anything to protect their customers and employees. 

    But at the same time, if you get sick, you’ll suddenly want the doctors who you scoffed at and ignored to do everything they can to save your life and restore you to health. In Texas, Governor Abbott told hospitals to stop performing “unnecessary procedures” to preserve scarce resources for Covid patients — primarily vaccine deniers. That affected cataract removal, cancer surgeries, and children awaiting reconstructive surgery, among others. They were told to go to the back of the line, because Abbott’s core constituency, with its self-inflicted condition was more important. Hypocrites like you never protested *that* mandate. You didn’t care about *their* medical freedom. All that matters is you, and if anyone else is damaged by your actions, so what, it’s their own fault for getting in your way.  
     
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