Out of all the desktop/laptop OEMs out there Apple was the only one with the balls to strike out on its own. As the article points, with tremendous risk and challenges. The rest remain locked down to whatever Intel or AMD does or does not have to offer. But since the debut of the M1 suddenly other OEMs are investigating producing their own SOCs.
One thing is certain for those of us who keep riding the Apple log flume, it’s a thrilling ride and you never know what’s around the corner, just like an Indiana Jones movie.
Just a toe dip as that design was aimed at business customers in China but Apple wasn't alone in its thinking here.
Pray tell, where is Huawei going to fab its 5nm designs? I see a lot of propaganda about China building its own 5nm lithography machines, which I don't believe exist at all in production, so color me more than skeptical.
More to the point, nothing that Huawei has done is anything close to the disruptive architecture that Apple has created for M series silicon. It is just more of the same PC main board architecture, but now with more SOC!
The first is that Kirin 9006C is a chip previously produced by TSMC ;
There is one thing to say that the appearance of the Kirin 9006C at this time is really a bit abrupt. After all, after the Huawei 9000 chip, Huawei has not launched a new Kirin chip, and there is currently no foundry that can produce 5nm chips for Huawei.
Given that Huawei's current chip inventory is still a mystery, it is not clear how many Kirin chips Huawei has, and how many Kirin chips are in stock. Therefore, the Kirin 9006C is likely to be a chip produced by TSMC and Huawei during the cooperation.
Barking up distant trees as usual.
I was challenging the OP's notion that only Apple was doing the homegrown thing on desktops and laptops.
I wasn't talking about fabrication.
Two clearly different things.
I could have gone further but refrained from doing so and then you go and blow it with your 'disruptive Apple Silicon architecture claims'. So allow me to put your feet back on the ground.
There is zero disruptive going on here. Zero.
Apple has moved back to a non-Intel solution to processing. That is it. The only real difference with the old days is that they can pull all the strings now and don't have to depend on the likes of IBM or Motorola for product road maps. That is it at the moment.
So much for disruption!
Is it producing communications hardware or developing the technologies that go into that? Nope.
Is it producing high end cluster inference systems? Nope.
Laptops and desktops. That is it. There is no disruption to be found there. Zero.
Maybe Huawei should actually focus on a few niches, instead of attempting to be all things to all industries, after they got whacked in the handset market.
From the looks of it Huawei is making great strides in the surveillance industry, so there's that.
Oh, and as far as Apple Silicon being disruptive, yeah, it actually is.
Never before has a company’s entire product range, from tablet to all-in-one, been spread across a single processor. It is simply unimaginable in the PC market, which has instead built its complexity on a million different variations and declinations. Every year when Intel presents new versions of its processors, it does so with dozens and dozens of variations, designed on the basis of the activations of different areas of the chip, the number of cores and cores, the range of memory. An incredible puzzle made up of extremely articulated price lists, and with product ranges (i3, i5, i7, i9) with different consumption and frequencies, of which one wonders what actually are the differences that justify different price points and which should guide consumer choice on the basis of presumed differences in performance.
You found another tree!
Can't you see anything wrong with that quote? What is Apple's 'entire' product range?
Why would companies want all their products on one Soc (which is untrue anyway) if they already have successful business lines using varied SoCs?
But seeing as you bring the subject up, do you have any idea at all of the Ascend line of processors and how they scale from earbuds up to AI inference clusters? Passing through wearables, data centers etc. Do you know what part Mindspore or CANN play in the whole thing? This is years before Apple announced Apple Silicon.
As for Huawei as a business, well, nothing new to see, is there? It is moving ahead with its product goals in many fields and none of them are 'niches'. The cloud business is booming. The handset market is just one of them and obviously SoC fabrication is a problem - at the moment.
Surveillance industry? HiSilicon has been a leading player in camera SoCs for many years. At one point, it was claimed that as much as 70% of camera SoCs were HiSilicon. Yes. All over the US too.
That's right, basically everywhere you go, there are cameras watching you. London, New York, Paris, Milan, Barcelona and many smaller towns and cities. Government installed. Then there are private homes, business etc. Transportation. This isn't limited to China but you label it surveillance.
Fine, but surveillance is basically everywhere.
IoT. Is that in Apple's 'entire' product range? Another nope. Yet again, HiSilicon is there and offering solutions to industry partners with built in Open Harmony support.
So now you can look up Ascend Max, Mini, Tiny, Nano plus CANN/Mindspore etc and see how true the OP's statement was.
He’s absolutely right, Apple wasn’t the first company to take CPU production in-house (though arguably they’d been doing just that for years previously with their iphone/iPad/Watch SoC’s).
Apple are the first to do so for traditional PCs in a successful fashion (like, way successful), but they’re also one of the four or five biggest computer manufacturers — and the richest company in the industry.
Still, I wasn’t aware of those other efforts. Thanks, Avon, for pointing them out.
It seems strange that one of few people on these forums with enough insight into the industry beyond the Apple bubble be met with such antagonism merely for offering perspective to a discussion.
I’m surprised that some people apparently can’t accept even the suggestion that others may have had similar impulses to Apple’s, as though their personal identity hinged upon the Biggest Fukcing Company in the History of Everything also being the sole arbiter of everything worthy…?
I mean, I was a pretty rabid fanboy in the 90s, but Apple really, really no longer needs that bullshit. Their critical success speaks plenty to the quality of their products.
He’s absolutely right, Apple wasn’t the first company to take CPU production in-house (though arguably they’d been doing just that for years previously with their iphone/iPad/Watch SoC’s).
Apple are the first to do so for traditional PCs in a successful fashion (like, way successful), but they’re also one of the four or five biggest computer manufacturers — and the richest company in the industry.
Still, I wasn’t aware of those other efforts. Thanks, Avon, for pointing them out.
It seems strange that one of few people on these forums with enough insight into the industry beyond the Apple bubble be met with such antagonism merely for offering perspective to a discussion.
I’m surprised that some people apparently can’t accept even the suggestion that others may have had similar impulses to Apple’s, as though their personal identity hinged upon the Biggest Fukcing Company in the History of Everything also being the sole arbiter of everything worthy…?
I mean, I was a pretty rabid fanboy in the 90s, but Apple really, really no longer needs that bullshit. Their critical success speaks plenty to the quality of their products.
What gives?
You stepped in poo.
Huawei doesn't have any processors that are competitive in PC's with Intel, AMD, or Apple, nor are they competitive in SOC's in smartphones. You're free to find me one, or any, for that matter, but I'll expect a linkI(s).
HiSilicon, which is Huawei's design house, does not have access to leading edge fabs. Again, you are free to find a Fab in China that is 7nm or smaller, or even a fab in Taiwan or South Korea, that is producing SOC's for Huawei/HiSilicon.
That article says the strategy was announced in 2018. No mention of shipping products (that I saw). The article at aibusiness.com is dated July 2021 and says that Huawei has built its cloud using the Ascend series chips and uses that to power its AI services. So, maybe the timeline is the same as Apple's? We just don't know, since Apple doesn't announce anything until it's shipping.
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
That article says the strategy was announced in 2018. No mention of shipping products (that I saw). The article at aibusiness.com is dated July 2021 and says that Huawei has built its cloud using the Ascend series chips and uses that to power its AI services. So, maybe the timeline is the same as Apple's? We just don't know, since Apple doesn't announce anything until it's shipping.
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
Uhm, that's exactly what Nvidia has been doing for the last decade;
But of course, avon b7 moves the goalpost to favorably compare Huawei with Apple, as if Apple competes with Huawei in anything at all anymore, excepting maybe earbuds.
That article says the strategy was announced in 2018. No mention of shipping products (that I saw). The article at aibusiness.com is dated July 2021 and says that Huawei has built its cloud using the Ascend series chips and uses that to power its AI services. So, maybe the timeline is the same as Apple's? We just don't know, since Apple doesn't announce anything until it's shipping.
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
The official product availability was announced on schedule in August 2019.
Ascend isn't limited to Cloud based hardware either. It is used throughout a wide swathe of Huawei products that stretch from headphones to data centers.
The cluster systems are used for cloud based tasks but also in investigation, science, health, mining...
That article says the strategy was announced in 2018. No mention of shipping products (that I saw). The article at aibusiness.com is dated July 2021 and says that Huawei has built its cloud using the Ascend series chips and uses that to power its AI services. So, maybe the timeline is the same as Apple's? We just don't know, since Apple doesn't announce anything until it's shipping.
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
Uhm, that's exactly what Nvidia has been doing for the last decade;
But of course, avon b7 moves the goalpost to favorably compare Huawei with Apple, as if Apple competes with Huawei in anything at all anymore, excepting maybe earbuds.
Where were any goalposts moved?
The post I was replying to was incorrect. I pointed that out with examples. That was it.
You then jumped in with your usual off topic counterpoint (which had nothing to do with my point) and quoted something that doesn't make too much sense.
Let me ask you again. What exactly is Apple's entire product range?
nVidia references are wacky too. What is your point?
I could have mentioned nVidia, Qualcomm and but I stuck to what I know. I think that's reasonable.
I even let all that go and didn't bring it up in my reply - until you jumped in feet first with your irrelevant comments.
Do you now at least understand what 'all scenario' means?
That article says the strategy was announced in 2018. No mention of shipping products (that I saw). The article at aibusiness.com is dated July 2021 and says that Huawei has built its cloud using the Ascend series chips and uses that to power its AI services. So, maybe the timeline is the same as Apple's? We just don't know, since Apple doesn't announce anything until it's shipping.
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
Uhm, that's exactly what Nvidia has been doing for the last decade;
But of course, avon b7 moves the goalpost to favorably compare Huawei with Apple, as if Apple competes with Huawei in anything at all anymore, excepting maybe earbuds.
Where were any goalposts moved?
The post I was replying to was incorrect. I pointed that out with examples. That was it.
You then jumped in with your usual off topic counterpoint (which had nothing to do with my point) and quoted something that doesn't make too much sense.
Let me ask you again. What exactly is Apple's entire product range?
nVidia references are wacky too. What is your point?
I could have mentioned nVidia, Qualcomm and but I stuck to what I know. I think that's reasonable.
I even let all that go and didn't bring it up in my reply - until you jumped in feet first with your irrelevant comments.
Do you now at least understand what 'all scenario' means?
You pointed out examples of Huawei Silicon that don't exist in the marketplace, and I provided links to that effect. Then you followed up with a scattershot portrait of all of the wonderful technologies that Huawei is dabbling in, in markets that Apple chooses not to enter. You are posting misinformation, and more to the point, you are unable or unwilling to admit that Apple has been extremely successful, and disruptive, with Apple Silicon.
My point with Nvidia is that they are massively ahead of Huawei in AI hardware in the marketplace, and it isn't even close.
Graphics-chip maker Nvidia (NVDA) leads the market for artificial intelligence chips today, but rising competition means it can't rest on its laurels, a Wall Street analyst says. Nvidia stock surged on Monday.
No mention in that article of anything Huawei...
Really tired of your bias against all things Apple on this very Apple centric site, and your bias for all things Huawei, to the point that you have again today overtly demonstrated the very bias that I have called you out for over and over for all of the years you have been posting here.
One would think that Huawei would have massive fan sites that you could camp out in, no?
That article says the strategy was announced in 2018. No mention of shipping products (that I saw). The article at aibusiness.com is dated July 2021 and says that Huawei has built its cloud using the Ascend series chips and uses that to power its AI services. So, maybe the timeline is the same as Apple's? We just don't know, since Apple doesn't announce anything until it's shipping.
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
Uhm, that's exactly what Nvidia has been doing for the last decade;
But of course, avon b7 moves the goalpost to favorably compare Huawei with Apple, as if Apple competes with Huawei in anything at all anymore, excepting maybe earbuds.
Where were any goalposts moved?
The post I was replying to was incorrect. I pointed that out with examples. That was it.
You then jumped in with your usual off topic counterpoint (which had nothing to do with my point) and quoted something that doesn't make too much sense.
Let me ask you again. What exactly is Apple's entire product range?
nVidia references are wacky too. What is your point?
I could have mentioned nVidia, Qualcomm and but I stuck to what I know. I think that's reasonable.
I even let all that go and didn't bring it up in my reply - until you jumped in feet first with your irrelevant comments.
Do you now at least understand what 'all scenario' means?
You pointed out examples of Huawei Silicon that don't exist in the marketplace, and I provided links to that effect. You are posting misinformation, and more to the point, you are unable or unwilling to admit that Apple has been extremely successful, and disruptive, with Apple Silicon.
My point with Nvidia is that they are massively ahead of Huawei in AI hardware in the marketplace, and it isn't even close.
Really tired of your bias against all things Apple on this very Apple centric site, and your bias for all things Huawei, to the point that you have again today overtly demonstrated the very bias that I have called you out for over and over for all of the years you have been posting here.
One would think that Huawei would have massive fan sites that you could camp out in, no?
Just a toe dip as that design was aimed at business customers in China but Apple wasn't alone in its thinking here. "
Short and to the point and with supporting links.
That was it. The OP was incorrect.
No goalposts were ever moved.
My other post was in reply to your own post (not the OP) where you simply thrashed around off topic.
If you hadn't jumped in feet first, you wouldn't find yourself in this situation (an ever deeper hole you are digging for yourself) and I wouldn't be needing to correct you.
Let me ask you yet again (seeing as it is from something you chose to quote):
What is Apple's entire product range?
Why aren't you answering that?
I gave you examples from a wide range of Huawei products.
Neither nVidia nor Qualcomm (or Google) have the same breadth so Huawei was a decent example.
But then again, neither does Apple, does it?
And that was part of what I was saying and just serves to highlight how incorrect the OP was.
He’s absolutely right, Apple wasn’t the first company to take CPU production in-house (though arguably they’d been doing just that for years previously with their iphone/iPad/Watch SoC’s).
Apple are the first to do so for traditional PCs in a successful fashion (like, way successful), but they’re also one of the four or five biggest computer manufacturers — and the richest company in the industry.
Still, I wasn’t aware of those other efforts. Thanks, Avon, for pointing them out.
It seems strange that one of few people on these forums with enough insight into the industry beyond the Apple bubble be met with such antagonism merely for offering perspective to a discussion.
I’m surprised that some people apparently can’t accept even the suggestion that others may have had similar impulses to Apple’s, as though their personal identity hinged upon the Biggest Fukcing Company in the History of Everything also being the sole arbiter of everything worthy…?
I mean, I was a pretty rabid fanboy in the 90s, but Apple really, really no longer needs that bullshit. Their critical success speaks plenty to the quality of their products.
What gives?
You stepped in poo.
Huawei doesn't have any processors that are competitive in PC's with Intel, AMD, or Apple, nor are they competitive in SOC's in smartphones. You're free to find me one, or any, for that matter, but I'll expect a linkI(s).
HiSilicon, which is Huawei's design house, does not have access to leading edge fabs. Again, you are free to find a Fab in China that is 7nm or smaller, or even a fab in Taiwan or South Korea, that is producing SOC's for Huawei/HiSilicon.
Good luck!
Oh dear!
Not competitive!?
I have spent the last few years providing you with many links to show how Huawei SoCs have been very competitive.
You know, with things like dual frequency GPS, dual ISPs, WiFi, 5G...
You must be kidding?
As far back as 2017 I was giving you examples of how bad iPhones were when using satellite navigation in tricky situations. Bad because they lacked dual frequency GPS and Huawei was pitting its SoCs against Apple in its demos.
Remember Wi-Fi? Huawei shipped its on-Soc, homegrown Wi-Fi chipset which was the world's fastest Wi-Fi chipset at the time.
Then it said in an interview that its own Wi-Fi 5 was actually faster than Apple's WiFi 6!
Huawei shipped WiFi 6+ for its own ecosystem taking advantage of its 5G developments.
Remember low light photography? Huawei"s ISPs were doing the heavy lifting on-SoC and blowing Apple literally into the dark shadows of the night. Once again, Huawei pitted it's results directly against Apple's in product presentations.
Remember 5G? Once again Huawei plunked its (again, homegrown) 5G modem on-SoC while Apple had to make do with an old third party modem and not even on Soc! Bolted on!
Huawei even managed to cram in a far higher transistor count to the competing Apple product.
Process nodes? Huawei has been right up there with Apple until politics got in the way. Their 3nm designs are long completed.
Remember the NPU? Apple severely underused it out of the gate but Huawei was using it all over the product! Even for some fun stuff!
Really tired of your bias against all things Apple on this very Apple centric site, and your bias for all things Huawei, to the point that you have again today overtly demonstrated the very bias that I have called you out for over and over for all of the years you have been posting here.
One would think that Huawei would have massive fan sites that you could camp out in, no?
Jeez man, LAY OFF ALREADY.
The basis of a discussion is not that one side has to be completely wrong and destroyed — that's war.
In a discussion, both sides may be right, one's argument may be less applicable or make more sense depending upon the viewpoint.
I do have to wonder why the hell you're so utterly terrified that someone other than Apple may have had an idea that everyone's been floating for a decade, and then unsuccessfully followed through on it?
Why can't you just write that others' attempts don't appear to have been successful, and that they couldn't compete with existing PC CPU platforms? Are you simply unable to formulate a position without pegging an "enemy" that you need to prove utterly wrong and destroy?
Did you know that others had previously unsuccessfully tried in-house CPU architectures for their PCs?
I didn't.
Do you not find it interesting? Move on, then. Write "that's not relevant" and a brief explanation of why you think so.
But your current approach makes it look like you just shat your pants and are holding hostages to distract from it.
Really tired of your bias against all things Apple on this very Apple centric site, and your bias for all things Huawei, to the point that you have again today overtly demonstrated the very bias that I have called you out for over and over for all of the years you have been posting here.
One would think that Huawei would have massive fan sites that you could camp out in, no?
Jeez man, LAY OFF ALREADY.
The basis of a discussion is not that one side has to be completely wrong and destroyed — that's war.
In a discussion, both sides may be right, one's argument may be less applicable or make more sense depending upon the viewpoint.
I do have to wonder why the hell you're so utterly terrified that someone other than Apple may have had an idea that everyone's been floating for a decade, and then unsuccessfully followed through on it?
Why can't you just write that others' attempts don't appear to have been successful, and that they couldn't compete with existing PC CPU platforms? Are you simply unable to formulate a position without pegging an "enemy" that you need to prove utterly wrong and destroy?
Did you know that others had previously unsuccessfully tried in-house CPU architectures for their PCs?
I didn't.
Do you not find it interesting? Move on, then. Write "that's not relevant" and a brief explanation of why you think so.
But your current approach makes it look like you just shat your pants and are holding hostages to distract from it.
Apple is far from established and is coming up light on its promises. It has a significant problem & it isn’t the ISA. Until product managers allow significant forks for macOS-specific frameworks (Accelerate & Metal/TBDR) and commit to UMA architecture, as Serif has, Apple Silicon will struggle to demonstrate its value. It demands a mindset shift away from CPU OR GPU benchmarks to APU or Application benchmarks & preferably not those from an x86 vendor like Puget Systems.
What are you talking about? Accelerate is tuned to each OS and each instance of hardware/chip. Metal and the Apple Silicon hardware have been codeveloped all along.
Comments
Can't you see anything wrong with that quote? What is Apple's 'entire' product range?
Why would companies want all their products on one Soc (which is untrue anyway) if they already have successful business lines using varied SoCs?
But seeing as you bring the subject up, do you have any idea at all of the Ascend line of processors and how they scale from earbuds up to AI inference clusters? Passing through wearables, data centers etc. Do you know what part Mindspore or CANN play in the whole thing? This is years before Apple announced Apple Silicon.
As for Huawei as a business, well, nothing new to see, is there? It is moving ahead with its product goals in many fields and none of them are 'niches'. The cloud business is booming. The handset market is just one of them and obviously SoC fabrication is a problem - at the moment.
Surveillance industry? HiSilicon has been a leading player in camera SoCs for many years. At one point, it was claimed that as much as 70% of camera SoCs were HiSilicon. Yes. All over the US too.
That's right, basically everywhere you go, there are cameras watching you. London, New York, Paris, Milan, Barcelona and many smaller towns and cities. Government installed. Then there are private homes, business etc. Transportation. This isn't limited to China but you label it surveillance.
Fine, but surveillance is basically everywhere.
IoT. Is that in Apple's 'entire' product range? Another nope. Yet again, HiSilicon is there and offering solutions to industry partners with built in Open Harmony support.
So now you can look up Ascend Max, Mini, Tiny, Nano plus CANN/Mindspore etc and see how true the OP's statement was.
https://aibusiness.com/document.asp?doc_id=769053
That was the point. Not the craziness you are attempting to inject here.
Do you know what year all this became reality?
https://www.huawei.com/en/technology-insights/publications/huawei-tech/86/driving-ai-to-new-horizons
It seems strange that one of few people on these forums with enough insight into the industry beyond the Apple bubble be met with such antagonism merely for offering perspective to a discussion.
Huawei doesn't have any processors that are competitive in PC's with Intel, AMD, or Apple, nor are they competitive in SOC's in smartphones. You're free to find me one, or any, for that matter, but I'll expect a linkI(s).
HiSilicon, which is Huawei's design house, does not have access to leading edge fabs. Again, you are free to find a Fab in China that is 7nm or smaller, or even a fab in Taiwan or South Korea, that is producing SOC's for Huawei/HiSilicon.
Good luck!
Plus, if all Huawei has is its cloud service (a big if, but I'm short of time to research) then we don't really have a comparison for their hardware vs Apple's. And with the trade restrictions in place on Huawei it's unlikely we'll get hardware performance analysis that won't be derided as untrustworthy because of its source.
But it's good to see more than one company trying to control the whole stack - it is at least some validation that the approach is worthwhile.
https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/data-center/products/ai-enterprise-suite/trial/?ncid=pa-srch-goog-359879&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIy-qq9s-e9wIVzsLCBB0_xgIuEAAYASAAEgIL8_D_BwE#cid=hpc09_pa-srch-goog_en-us
But of course, avon b7 moves the goalpost to favorably compare Huawei with Apple, as if Apple competes with Huawei in anything at all anymore, excepting maybe earbuds.
https://www.cio.com/article/217662/worlds-most-powerful-ai-processor-meets-the-market-here-is-how-to-buy-it.html
Ascend isn't limited to Cloud based hardware either. It is used throughout a wide swathe of Huawei products that stretch from headphones to data centers.
The cluster systems are used for cloud based tasks but also in investigation, science, health, mining...
The post I was replying to was incorrect. I pointed that out with examples. That was it.
You then jumped in with your usual off topic counterpoint (which had nothing to do with my point) and quoted something that doesn't make too much sense.
Let me ask you again. What exactly is Apple's entire product range?
nVidia references are wacky too. What is your point?
I could have mentioned nVidia, Qualcomm and but I stuck to what I know. I think that's reasonable.
I even let all that go and didn't bring it up in my reply - until you jumped in feet first with your irrelevant comments.
Do you now at least understand what 'all scenario' means?
My point with Nvidia is that they are massively ahead of Huawei in AI hardware in the marketplace, and it isn't even close.
https://www.investors.com/news/technology/nvidia-stock-is-undisputed-leader-in-ai-chips-but-competition-rising/
No mention in that article of anything Huawei...
Really tired of your bias against all things Apple on this very Apple centric site, and your bias for all things Huawei, to the point that you have again today overtly demonstrated the very bias that I have called you out for over and over for all of the years you have been posting here.
One would think that Huawei would have massive fan sites that you could camp out in, no?
Here it is again, in full:
"From September 2019:
https://e.huawei.com/en/products/servers/kunpeng/kunpeng-desktop-board
And later from 2021:
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/huawei-dyna-cloud-kirin-9006c
Just a toe dip as that design was aimed at business customers in China but Apple wasn't alone in its thinking here. "
Short and to the point and with supporting links.
That was it. The OP was incorrect.
No goalposts were ever moved.
My other post was in reply to your own post (not the OP) where you simply thrashed around off topic.
If you hadn't jumped in feet first, you wouldn't find yourself in this situation (an ever deeper hole you are digging for yourself) and I wouldn't be needing to correct you.
Let me ask you yet again (seeing as it is from something you chose to quote):
What is Apple's entire product range?
Why aren't you answering that?
I gave you examples from a wide range of Huawei products.
Neither nVidia nor Qualcomm (or Google) have the same breadth so Huawei was a decent example.
But then again, neither does Apple, does it?
And that was part of what I was saying and just serves to highlight how incorrect the OP was.
Not competitive!?
I have spent the last few years providing you with many links to show how Huawei SoCs have been very competitive.
You know, with things like dual frequency GPS, dual ISPs, WiFi, 5G...
You must be kidding?
As far back as 2017 I was giving you examples of how bad iPhones were when using satellite navigation in tricky situations. Bad because they lacked dual frequency GPS and Huawei was pitting its SoCs against Apple in its demos.
Remember Wi-Fi? Huawei shipped its on-Soc, homegrown Wi-Fi chipset which was the world's fastest Wi-Fi chipset at the time.
Then it said in an interview that its own Wi-Fi 5 was actually faster than Apple's WiFi 6!
Huawei shipped WiFi 6+ for its own ecosystem taking advantage of its 5G developments.
Remember low light photography? Huawei"s ISPs were doing the heavy lifting on-SoC and blowing Apple literally into the dark shadows of the night. Once again, Huawei pitted it's results directly against Apple's in product presentations.
Remember 5G? Once again Huawei plunked its (again, homegrown) 5G modem on-SoC while Apple had to make do with an old third party modem and not even on Soc! Bolted on!
Huawei even managed to cram in a far higher transistor count to the competing Apple product.
Process nodes? Huawei has been right up there with Apple until politics got in the way. Their 3nm designs are long completed.
Remember the NPU? Apple severely underused it out of the gate but Huawei was using it all over the product! Even for some fun stuff!
The basis of a discussion is not that one side has to be completely wrong and destroyed — that's war.
In a discussion, both sides may be right, one's argument may be less applicable or make more sense depending upon the viewpoint.
I do have to wonder why the hell you're so utterly terrified that someone other than Apple may have had an idea that everyone's been floating for a decade, and then unsuccessfully followed through on it?
Why can't you just write that others' attempts don't appear to have been successful, and that they couldn't compete with existing PC CPU platforms? Are you simply unable to formulate a position without pegging an "enemy" that you need to prove utterly wrong and destroy?
But your current approach makes it look like you just shat your pants and are holding hostages to distract from it.
Here's a teardown of the M1 Ultra
Looks uncommon for a PC..