Apple employee petition demands flexibility against return-to-office policy

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Apple employees are continuing to object to Apple's order to return to working from its offices, with a petition demanding the iPhone maker continues to offer "location flexible work" to its staff.




Like other companies that put in place work-from-home schemes during the pandemic, Apple is struggling to get employees to agree to return to working from within its offices. The latest salvo in the battle of wills between employees and employer is a new petition, demanding Apple continues to be flexible in its working practices.

The worker group Apple Together started to internally circulate a petition on Sunday, reports the Financial Times. The petition has a series of demands to keep allowing employees to work from home, or wherever they want.

The petition is allegedly in response to an Apple management order from August 15 increasing the number of in-office days from two to three by September 5, as part of its hybrid work program.

According to the petition, Apple Together believes the "uniform mandate from senior leadership" doesn't respect the many "compelling reasons" for why employees are "happier and more productive" under the WFH measures.

In its demands, the group wants Apple employees to be able to work with their "immediate manager" on their working arrangements, instead of dealing with "high-level approvals" and "complex procedures."

The petition will reportedly be collecting signatures for a week before verification and delivery to executives. An employee involved with organizing the effort doesn't plan to release individual names publicly nor to executives "in light of retail union busting and recent reports of allegations of retaliation from HR."

While it is unclear how the petition will affect the decisions of executives, it seems that workers generally would prefer to maintain the flexibility. In one survey of Apple employees from April, 56% were actively seeking employment outside of Apple, with the return-to-office policy being the biggest driving force.

There's also been a high-profile departure, as director of machine learning Ian Goodfellow resigned in May after three years on the job. Goodfellow cited the return-to-office policy as one of the reasons for leaving.

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Comments

  • Reply 1 of 26
    JFC_PAJFC_PA Posts: 932member
    Spoiled brats. 
    iOS_Guy80Cesar Battistini Mazierodavgregdocno42williamlondonJapheyentropyspulseimages
  • Reply 2 of 26
    JFC_PA said:
    Spoiled brats. 

    Yes, definitely.  That's the only possible explanation. /s
    iOS_Guy80cornchipmuthuk_vanalingamgrandact73elijahgFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 3 of 26
    jibjib Posts: 56member
    Not included in the story is information such as what percentage of Apple employees belong to Apple Together, nor information about who/how many were surveyed in the 56% are seeking other employment.

    I suspect only a small number are included. Apple remains a company that many would like to work for. 

    Just my opinion, of course.
    Cesar Battistini Mazierodocno42entropys
  • Reply 4 of 26
    mac_dogmac_dog Posts: 1,069member
    Spoiled brats? I don’t know about this, as I don’t know the particular people involved. I’m glad some of you do. 

    I agree this should be handled with immediate managers. They would take the responsibility if their division fails to meet productivity requirements. 

    They should be required to prove their increased productivity from home vs office. Simple enough to do and it’s measurable. 

    Both sides should be open to the scrutiny that’s required to make this a fair arrangement. 
    Cesar Battistini Mazieromuthuk_vanalingamkurai_kagegrandact73dewmeelijahgFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 5 of 26
    JFC_PA said:
    Spoiled brats. 
    yes
    davgregwilliamlondonpulseimages
  • Reply 6 of 26
    maestro64maestro64 Posts: 5,043member
    I suspect the ones complaining no longer live near the office and they cannot or will not commute.

    No sure if anyone remembers but when every company in the valley were trying to hire anyone and everyone, Apple and the like had buses brings people from the far reaches of valley just to get people to work. Those buses all had Wi-Fi so they could do work on the ride. Now no one wants to leave their homes just think about how anti social all these people will become, they think because they have twitter or a Facebook page they are connected to people. 

    I use to love taking pictures of my kids playing sports then one day my wife pointed out just because I’m viewing the game through the lens does not mean I’m actually experiencing the game. After that I put down the camera and became more engaged. The best advice I was ever given. 
    prolinedocno42elijahgdewmeFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 7 of 26
    sbdudesbdude Posts: 261member
    The pandemic has become nothing more than an excuse to change the rules, mostly for the worse. If these employees can prove their worth working at home, so be it. But the pandemic doesn't mean you get carte blanche to make demands of your employer. Don't like it, work somewhere else.
    williamlondonapplejakes
  • Reply 8 of 26
    omasouomasou Posts: 575member
    If they want Silicon Valley pay, then they need to deal w/Silicon Valley costs, e.g. traffic + sitting in traffic

    Wonder how it will fly if Apple says OK, but your salary is decreasing by $X
    edited August 2022 docno42williamlondondewmeapplejakes
  • Reply 9 of 26
    mac_dog said:
    Spoiled brats? I don’t know about this, as I don’t know the particular people involved. I’m glad some of you do. 

    I agree this should be handled with immediate managers. They would take the responsibility if their division fails to meet productivity requirements. 

    They should be required to prove their increased productivity from home vs office. Simple enough to do and it’s measurable. 

    Both sides should be open to the scrutiny that’s required to make this a fair arrangement. 
    Not everything is measurable and companies that reply too much on measuring usually don't do anything creative. A lot of the benefits of being in person in groups are the random conversations that spark the ideas that changes things. KPIs (key performance indicators) are overrated.
    prolinedocno42kurai_kagedewmeapplejakesFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 10 of 26
    prolineproline Posts: 222member
    mac_dog said:
    Spoiled brats? I don’t know about this, as I don’t know the particular people involved. I’m glad some of you do. 
    If you want to be paid but don't want to do your job, then yes, you are a spoiled brat. That's enough info to make that determination. And yes, showing up is part of your job if your boss says it's part of your job. You don't get to pick and choose what your job is. Unless, of course, you are a spoiled brat.
    I agree this should be handled with immediate managers. They would take the responsibility if their division fails to meet productivity requirements. They should be required to prove their increased productivity from home vs office. Simple enough to do and it’s measurable. 
    Doing a good job is about more than how many lines of code you write. It's also about the effect you have on your team. If you get your project finished and then spend your free time on slack organizing mobs to attack colleagues you've never met in real life over stuff they wrote 10 years ago, then you are dragging your team down no matter what your performance metrics say. That also goes for people making petitions. 
    Both sides should be open to the scrutiny that’s required to make this a fair arrangement. 
    Apple is open to you finding work elsewhere. There is plenty. Totally fair that that if you don't want to do a job you should quit that job.

    Ultimately, Ventura and iPad OS 14 are likely the most lackluster updates ever for the respective platforms. The laziness lack of group cohesion caused by WFH is on full display. Apple couldn't even be bothered finding a picture of Monterrey or Ventura for the wallpaper. That's called calling it in and its emblematic of the whole Ventura release.
    docno42williamlondon
  • Reply 11 of 26
    prolineproline Posts: 222member
    rcomeau said:

    Not everything is measurable and companies that reply too much on measuring usually don't do anything creative. A lot of the benefits of being in person in groups are the random conversations that spark the ideas that changes things. KPIs (key performance indicators) are overrated.
    Yeah. It's incredible that people don't understand that WFH arrangements will quickly descend into a dystopia of automated performance metrics where your boss is an algorithm and you can't even talk to a human. It would basically turn programming for Apple into working in a call center or Amazon warehouse. Gross.
    williamlondondewme
  • Reply 12 of 26
    Unless you were hired as a remote-only employee, either get to work or resign. SIMPLE. 
    williamlondondewme
  • Reply 13 of 26
    davgregdavgreg Posts: 1,037member
    Sounds like it is time for a set of targeted layoffs. Can anyone who smells of a union or "worker group".
    Then put everyone on a contract that mandates on site work unless approved individually.


    williamlondon
  • Reply 14 of 26
    docno42docno42 Posts: 3,755member
    I've been working remotely on and off for over a decade now - and if I was at the start of my career I can't think of anything more dangerous to my long term success than the allure of working from home.  As others touched on, you simply can't replace the serendipity of unplanned interactions that can only happen in person.  Every significant promotion or job opportunity I have had came from direct, physical interactions that simply would not have happened if I had been working full time remote.  Now that I'm near the end I don't mind working 100% remote full time. Indeed it's let me move closer to my parents, who are older and need my support.  But I think many, especially those who are younger/just starting out, grossly underestimate and are far more ready to write off the value of in-person interactions - it's rather tragic.  
    Yet another reason I count my blessings for starting out in the late 80's/early 90's and not picking up bad habits that are so easy today.  
    williamlondonentropysprolinedewme
  • Reply 15 of 26
    JFC_PAJFC_PA Posts: 932member
    The petition has 270 names. Apple has 165,000 employees…
    williamlondonentropysprolinedewmeFileMakerFeller
  • Reply 16 of 26
    elijahgelijahg Posts: 2,759member
    proline said:
    mac_dog said:
    Spoiled brats? I don’t know about this, as I don’t know the particular people involved. I’m glad some of you do. 
    If you want to be paid but don't want to do your job, then yes, you are a spoiled brat. That's enough info to make that determination. And yes, showing up is part of your job if your boss says it's part of your job. You don't get to pick and choose what your job is. Unless, of course, you are a spoiled brat.
    You think the top-tier engineers working for Apple don't get to pick and choose their jobs? And as such by your definition almost all of Apple's employees are brats. Hmm sounds like a great place to work for, so perhaps Apple does need to be more lenient with working. Everyone else in SV is, so these highly sought after engineers will just switch to Microsoft, IBM, Uber, etc, etc. It's Apple's loss.

    Doing a good job is about more than how many lines of code you write. It's also about the effect you have on your team. If you get your project finished and then spend your free time on slack organizing mobs to attack colleagues you've never met in real life over stuff they wrote 10 years ago, then you are dragging your team down no matter what your performance metrics say. That also goes for people making petitions. 
    It's about the quality of code. And considering there have been numerous employees speaking out about how Apple's open plan glass offices are distracting, WFH could well be much more productive for those people who are coding - no incessant distractions. Hell, I get much better code written WFH than at work where there's an unnecessary distraction every 10 minutes.

    edited August 2022 sunman42muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 17 of 26
    entropysentropys Posts: 4,168member
    docno42 said:
    I've been working remotely on and off for over a decade now - and if I was at the start of my career I can't think of anything more dangerous to my long term success than the allure of working from home.  As others touched on, you simply can't replace the serendipity of unplanned interactions that can only happen in person.  Every significant promotion or job opportunity I have had came from direct, physical interactions that simply would not have happened if I had been working full time remote.  Now that I'm near the end I don't mind working 100% remote full time. Indeed it's let me move closer to my parents, who are older and need my support.  But I think many, especially those who are younger/just starting out, grossly underestimate and are far more ready to write off the value of in-person interactions - it's rather tragic.  
    Yet another reason I count my blessings for starting out in the late 80's/early 90's and not picking up bad habits that are so easy today.  
    Totally agree. WFH will not be good for peoples’ promotion prospects. I look forward to the articles of people complaining that Joe Bloggs got the job over me just because he is at work all the time sucking up to the boss! 
    I must say the problem is reduced in these days of Zoom and Teams, but that depends on how strong a relationship the team already has, and that is not developed remotely. You can tell when you have a face to face meeting with people you have only interacted with on Teams. You sort of know them, but you don’t, and everyone is looking a bit weird.
    And then the idea of graduates spending substantial time working at home does not fill me with confidence, in fact it is appalling.  I observe it takes three years of heavy hand holding before they can be trusted to do the job on their own. I would feel I have failed them.

    Anyway, edicts like this are basically saying they want people in the office sixty percent of the time. How you actually organise it would be dependent on the work unit I expect. That is certainly how I have organised my teams where we have had a three day a week target for the office for over a year. While managers and aspiring managers mostly work full time in the office, some people work three days, some work two days, and I even have some that work at home full time (mostly justifiable reasons). Some hate WFH and it is hard to keep them out of the office. But for my three teams overall we are currently a bit over 70%.
    I would also note that I recently shed a couple of staff as there was a reduction in work in one team. The ones that had to be asked to leave were among those who work at home full time. I was a lot less confident of their work rate.
    edited August 2022
  • Reply 18 of 26
    danoxdanox Posts: 2,869member
    entropys said:
    docno42 said:
    I've been working remotely on and off for over a decade now - and if I was at the start of my career I can't think of anything more dangerous to my long term success than the allure of working from home.  As others touched on, you simply can't replace the serendipity of unplanned interactions that can only happen in person.  Every significant promotion or job opportunity I have had came from direct, physical interactions that simply would not have happened if I had been working full time remote.  Now that I'm near the end I don't mind working 100% remote full time. Indeed it's let me move closer to my parents, who are older and need my support.  But I think many, especially those who are younger/just starting out, grossly underestimate and are far more ready to write off the value of in-person interactions - it's rather tragic.  
    Yet another reason I count my blessings for starting out in the late 80's/early 90's and not picking up bad habits that are so easy today.  
    Totally agree. WFH will not be good for peoples’ promotion prospects. I look forward to the articles of people complaining that Joe Bloggs got the job over me just because he is at work all the time sucking up to the boss! 
    I must say the problem is reduced in these days of Zoom and Teams, but that depends on how strong a relationship the team already has, and that is not developed remotely. You can tell when you have a face to face meeting with people you have only interacted with on Teams. You sort of know them, but you don’t, and everyone is looking a bit weird.
    And then the idea of graduates spending substantial time working at home does not fill me with confidence, in fact it is appalling.  I observe it takes three years of heavy hand holding before they can be trusted to do the job on their own. I would feel I have failed them.

    Anyway, edicts like this are basically saying they want people in the office sixty percent of the time. How you actually organise it would be dependent on the work unit I expect. That is certainly how I have organised my teams where we have had a three day a week target for the office for over a year. While managers and aspiring managers mostly work full time in the office, some people work three days, some work two days, and I even have some that work at home full time (mostly justifiable reasons). Some hate WFH and it is hard to keep them out of the office. But for my three teams overall we are currently a bit over 70%.
    I would also note that I recently shed a couple of staff as there was a reduction in work in one team. The ones that had to be asked to leave were among those who work at home full time. I was a lot less confident of their work rate.
    White collar workers in Silicon Valley replacing themselves by opening up competition with a larger pool of English speaking workers across the world Western Europe, Korea, Japan, Australia, and New Zealand. Work at home will drop their wages long term not increase them. Once companies discover the possibilities for their profit margins. 
    edited August 2022 proline
  • Reply 19 of 26
    MrMcLovin said:
    Unless you were hired as a remote-only employee, either get to work or resign. SIMPLE. 
    Anger at the world, much?
    muthuk_vanalingamelijahgbeowulfschmidtgrandact73
  • Reply 20 of 26
    Only 12,000 of those employees work at Apple Park.
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