Apple unveils iPhone 14 Pro & iPhone 14 Pro Max with always-on display

13

Comments

  • Reply 41 of 62
    chadbagchadbag Posts: 1,803member
    mike1 said:
    eightzero said:
    We're on the right track, and I'd be interested...but for the lightning port. I don't need this upgrade, so I'll likely be waiting another cycle. Maybe the iP15 comes with USB-C (or no port at all) and the always on lockscreen and dynamic island. 

    In your attempt to claim you won't upgrade because of the Lightning connector, you hurt your own argument by saying that "no port at all" would also be acceptable.
    If you really wanted the supposed benefits of a USB-C port, then having no port at all certainly wouldn't provide them. Therefore, if you were really considering an upgrade, the port would not be part of your decision process.
    @mike1 ;
    Well I’m still on iPhone6s+ and do have lightening port issues.  I finally read a blog by an electrical engineer that explained the carbon build up on the plug.  I’ve had the battery replaced twice by Apple.  Apple refused to replace the lightening port, Apple employee at Genius Bar said it wasn’t possible. Drove 10 minutes down the street to a strip mall with the cell phone repair shop; he said it wasn’t the lightning port but he was willing to do it for 40 US dollars.  Guess what it was the lightning port. Been working just fine now for three years. I get about 6 months out of my Apple lightening plug wires before the carbon builds up.  I do love my iPad Pro with the M1 chip. I love the USB-C plug on it. So if my iPhone 6s+ can last another year I’ll wait. I thought the European Union was kind of forcing Apple to use the USB-C port; I could be wrong.
    What carbon build-up?  I'm still rocking an XS Max from 4 years ago and have never had any sort of carbon build-up.  I did have to clean out lint once from the lightning port.  SIM changing tool makes that easy.  I learned that problem and solution from an Apple Genius on an earlier iPhone. 

    Lightning Port is more reliable than USB-C, which tends to become unreliable (see recent AI article on USB-C cabling and the comments section for details).  Problem with lightning is the data speed. 
    Alex1Nanantksundaramwatto_cobra
  • Reply 42 of 62
    roakeroake Posts: 790member
    WTF, Apple!?!

    Taken directly from the FAQ at the bottom of the official Apple iPhone 14 Pro page:

         "iPhone 14 and iPhone 14 Pro models will arrive ready to activate with eSIM.* Note, these models cannot activate with a physical SIM."

         and

         "*Not all carriers support eSIM. Use of eSIM in iPhone may be disabled when purchased from some carriers."

    Someone stated elsewhere that there may be an "international version" that would have a physical SIM tray and not be limited to eSIM only.  Is that true?  If so, how do I get THAT version of the phone?  I travel and need to be able to use eSIM.  I also sometimes give the phone I replace to family in the Philippines.  As far as I know, their carriers do not offer an option for eSIM.
  • Reply 43 of 62
    One more thing about Dynamic Island: Apple all but admitted that this is likely to be here for a while.

    Of course, they would love to hide all of that behind the screen (heck there are patent applications going back even before the iPhone I think about mechanisms for embedding a camera into the LCD screen). But they are likely having trouble making it work.

    Once they figure it out it will be an awesome upgrade for video calls (phone and computer) though. Can you imagine calls where you are looking straight into the camera creating eye contact (vs. just above where you are looking)?

    But it appears that's still a ways away. I think Apple just admitted that this is here for another few years (though they also bought themselves some flexibility on size and position...gotta love those software engineers). Not surprising.

    watto_cobra
  • Reply 44 of 62
    hogman said:
    I find the “need” to move away from Lightning hilarious. The only thing usb-c would do is force me to go buy new cables when I have plenty of lightning cables from over the years. 
    You mean you don't have an iPad and or Macbook and have been collecting USB-C for years?
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 45 of 62
    Worthy upgrade 

    removal of SIM tray is concerning, that's a bit like the removal of the audio jack.

    We still miss the audio jack, and now we're using these silly lightning port dongles... wondering how this has been "progress" as we dongle about our day. 

    My experience with eSim was terrible - I was excited and jumped right in, and got an eSim. Works! But then I got a new phone. There's an eSim transfer fucntion in the iPhone but apparently the operator gets to override it - I got a message saying my eSim can't be transferred and I need to go to a customer service center. I couldn't do that since I was in another country. That's a very big step back in usability from a SIM card - pop it out, pop it back in, no drama, no dialogs, no customer centers. It just works. 

    Here in Asia everyone is using SIM cards on a daily basis, it's common to switch them while traveling, or to get a new one - also why phones have 2 or more SIM trays and even Apple sold iPhones here with dual SIM slots. 

    So why remove that from the US models? Given that they can't remove it from Asian models for probably a very long time to come? It makes the USA iPhones useless in Asia. So... that's a very strange decision. 
    edited September 7 muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 46 of 62
    mattinozmattinoz Posts: 1,950member
    “Dynamic island?”

    what… they didn’t want to go with… “lozenge?”

    there’s just no way to win this one. 

    Still, preferable to the notch. 
    lozenge = sucking
    Marketing = avoiding obvious negative references. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 47 of 62
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,419member
    rumpels said:
    Here we go again with the sharp edges, and now a pill. Apple, you can do better than this! You have known for years that we all want round edges and no notch, no pill, NOTHING but screen. And you CAN build it. You did it many years ago with the MacBook Pro front camera. You can do it with the iPhone now. Stop playing with camera sensors and other crap, and making customers buy worthless devices for years before you complete what we all really want.

    Again… ROUND EDGES & TOTAL SCREEN. No holes, no pill, no notches!!!!!! When you build that iPhone, THEN I’ll upgrade my weak SE. Well be waiting. 
    Most people are gonna put it in the case so sharp edges are a very non-issue. I prefer the "sharp edge" design as you call it better over the rounded off edges which make the phone hard to hold. 
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 48 of 62
    rumpels said:
    Here we go again with the sharp edges, and now a pill. Apple, you can do better than this! You have known for years that we all want round edges and no notch, no pill, NOTHING but screen. And you CAN build it. You did it many years ago with the MacBook Pro front camera. You can do it with the iPhone now. Stop playing with camera sensors and other crap, and making customers buy worthless devices for years before you complete what we all really want.

    Again… ROUND EDGES & TOTAL SCREEN. No holes, no pill, no notches!!!!!! When you build that iPhone, THEN I’ll upgrade my weak SE. Well be waiting. 
    Dear Mr rumpels, please note we have all decided to cancel your representative position of expressing what we want effective immediately
    edited September 7 watto_cobra
  • Reply 49 of 62
    netroxnetrox Posts: 1,266member
    I noticed when Apple said they developed A16 on a "4 nm process" - it is likely that the M2 Pro/Max will be based on 4nm as opposed to current M1/M2 which is based on 5nm process. 




    watto_cobra
  • Reply 50 of 62
    bluefire1bluefire1 Posts: 1,237member
    Having watched the entire presentation, I've decided to upgrade from the 13 Pro to the 14 Pro. The upgrades were, in my opinion, worth the change. However, I decided against upgrading from AW7 to AW8. Crash detection is coming to both models with WatchOS9, so I'll wait until next year's AW9. 
    See you 8am EST Friday morning.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 51 of 62
    jdwjdw Posts: 1,130member
    removal of SIM tray is concerning, that's a bit like the removal of the audio jack.
    WRONG!  It's a very big issue because the headphone jack had nothing to do with being able to get wireless connectivity.  The absence of a SIMM tray DOES affect that!  It's a major deal.

    Here in Japan, Apple has chosen to foolishly implement a loud shutter sound when photos are taken. (Don't argue with me about why, it's stupid!)  When my daughter moved to the US for college, she took her phone to Apple and asked to get that horrid sound removed, but they said they can't do anything because the Japanese iPhone hardware locks that feature into place!  The only workaround is to buy a US iPhone.  But now if you do that, it only comes with an eSIM and if a carrier overseas won't support that, you are in a real world of HURT!

    So we need to hear from AppleInsider about whether Apple will sell "international versions" of the iPhone in the USA to US buyers.  This isn't just for people who prefer to live overseas, but it pertains to anyone who travels outside the US often.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 52 of 62
    dewmedewme Posts: 4,547member
    jdw said:
    removal of SIM tray is concerning, that's a bit like the removal of the audio jack.
    WRONG!  It's a very big issue because the headphone jack had nothing to do with being able to get wireless connectivity.  The absence of a SIMM tray DOES affect that!  It's a major deal.

    Here in Japan, Apple has chosen to foolishly implement a loud shutter sound when photos are taken. (Don't argue with me about why, it's stupid!)  When my daughter moved to the US for college, she took her phone to Apple and asked to get that horrid sound removed, but they said they can't do anything because the Japanese iPhone hardware locks that feature into place!  The only workaround is to buy a US iPhone.  But now if you do that, it only comes with an eSIM and if a carrier overseas won't support that, you are in a real world of HURT!

    So we need to hear from AppleInsider about whether Apple will sell "international versions" of the iPhone in the USA to US buyers.  This isn't just for people who prefer to live overseas, but it pertains to anyone who travels outside the US often.
    I’m sure you know the shutter sound on Japanese versions of all brand smartphones has nothing to do with Apple at all. They are simply complying with the carriers demands in that country. They don’t really have a choice if they want to comply with the accepted standards in that country. If Apple provided a way to circumvent carrier rules, even if it was legal to do so, they’d be viewed very unfavorably compared to their competitors.

    Laws, rules, conventions, and logic don’t always get along very well.

    The eSIM-only thing is a legitimate concern. I know from traveling and working for extended periods of time in Asia that having the ability to pop in a SIM card for local carriers is a big deal. There are even kiosks within a number of airports that sell prepaid SIM cards that you can activate with the local carriers. The main reason my very first iPad and iPhone were GSM rather than CDMA was because I needed to be able to swap in SIM cards in other countries that were supported by the iPhone’s GSM radios. It worked very well, especially in Singapore where unlimited or high limit service was very affordable. 

    Likewise, phones with dual SIM cards are very useful in areas where people need to regularly travel between two countries and don’t want to get whacked with high roaming fees. 

    We’ll have to see what happens with the lack of physical SIM cards. My gut feeling is that Apple is very aware of the concerns and use cases that require physical SIM cards and already has a solution in-place to deal with it. Apple has made other controversial changes to products that initially appear as impediments only to see most other vendors follow Apple’s lead. If the removal of the physical SIM card tray puts Apple at a disadvantage versus their competitors they will pay a high price in lost sales. But in all likelihood every other smartphone vendor will copy Apple once they see that Apple does not suffer any significant negative consequences from their product design decisions. The industry will adapt to Apple’s lead.


    edited September 8
  • Reply 53 of 62
    eightzeroeightzero Posts: 2,751member
    eightzero said:
    We're on the right track, and I'd be interested...but for the lightning port. I don't need this upgrade, so I'll likely be waiting another cycle. Maybe the iP15 comes with USB-C (or no port at all) and the always on lockscreen and dynamic island. 

    Maybe shop a deal in a few months, and weigh vs. trade in value. But it isn't an immediate press the buy button kind of day. Kinda disappointed.
    Really? Sounds a bit.... unconvincing.

    Just buy a $4 USBCF-to-LightningM dongle left connected to whatever USBC charger you use at home/work/car (not sure why you don't bring up MagSafe which obviates the need for any of this), and get on with life...
    Because the lightning port on my Xr is failing. It isn't the charging so much as using the wired headphones I prefer and the necessary wired connection to Carplay. 
    edited September 8
  • Reply 54 of 62
    jdwjdw Posts: 1,130member
    dewme said:
    I’m sure you know the shutter sound on Japanese versions of all brand smartphones has nothing to do with Apple at all. They are simply complying with the carriers demands in that country. 
    You should be aware you just contradicted yourself by saying that shutter sound compliance in Japan "has NOTHING to do with Apple at all" while in your very next sentence you state the truth that it DOES have to do with Apple "complying with the carriers"!  Regardless of the reason for it, making certain iPhone functionality permanent for a given market VERY MUCH has something "to do with Apple."  Some people try to rationalize such capitulation, while folks like myself who have lived in Japan continuously since 1994 don't need to rationalize such "do like others do" craziness, especially when one has been able to just buy a US model iPhone and use it here without such ridiculous and bothersome features. Might as well start defending the Great Firewall of China next.  Not every convention and custom is great one, even if it was done with noble intentions in mind.  As you can see, I'm not fan of the nanny state, and I don't hide that fact when give the opportunity.

    But I am very glad and thrilled to the core that we agree that the eSIM thing is "a legitimate concern" because it absolutely is for people who travel internationally.  Again, we need to know if US based iPhone buyers can order an "international version" of the iPhone 14 which has the SIM tray.  If not, that is a huge mistake on Apple's part.
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 55 of 62
    chadbag said:
    mike1 said:
    eightzero said:
    We're on the right track, and I'd be interested...but for the lightning port. I don't need this upgrade, so I'll likely be waiting another cycle. Maybe the iP15 comes with USB-C (or no port at all) and the always on lockscreen and dynamic island. 

    In your attempt to claim you won't upgrade because of the Lightning connector, you hurt your own argument by saying that "no port at all" would also be acceptable.
    If you really wanted the supposed benefits of a USB-C port, then having no port at all certainly wouldn't provide them. Therefore, if you were really considering an upgrade, the port would not be part of your decision process.
    @mike1 ;
    Well I’m still on iPhone6s+ and do have lightening port issues.  I finally read a blog by an electrical engineer that explained the carbon build up on the plug.  I’ve had the battery replaced twice by Apple.  Apple refused to replace the lightening port, Apple employee at Genius Bar said it wasn’t possible. Drove 10 minutes down the street to a strip mall with the cell phone repair shop; he said it wasn’t the lightning port but he was willing to do it for 40 US dollars.  Guess what it was the lightning port. Been working just fine now for three years. I get about 6 months out of my Apple lightening plug wires before the carbon builds up.  I do love my iPad Pro with the M1 chip. I love the USB-C plug on it. So if my iPhone 6s+ can last another year I’ll wait. I thought the European Union was kind of forcing Apple to use the USB-C port; I could be wrong.
    What carbon build-up?  I'm still rocking an XS Max from 4 years ago and have never had any sort of carbon build-up.  I did have to clean out lint once from the lightning port.  SIM changing tool makes that easy.  I learned that problem and solution from an Apple Genius on an earlier iPhone. 

    Lightning Port is more reliable than USB-C, which tends to become unreliable (see recent AI article on USB-C cabling and the comments section for details).  Problem with lightning is the data speed. 
    It’s not in the lighting port.  It’s the cable connection.  One gold pin eventually gets black carbon build up on it.  I’m a design professional which is why I kept looking for a solution.  I do remember the engineer commenting that if the port and plug was just a bit tighter it would not happen.  Maybe Apple fixed the issue in later models of iPhones.  Now that I’m no longer excited (as I was Wednesday) I think I’ll just wait until my iPhone6s+ dies.  

    When I consider how much money I have spent over the years on Apple Hardware I have to say it’s probably the best return for length of use/life (vs other hardware, Windows, Specific Land Surveying Robotics, GNSS, certainly surveying hardware allows me to earn an income).   Apple hardware is updated for a long time and continues to work (although slow).  So I’ll probably buy the top of the line iPhone again with the expectations that it’ll last 7+ years.  Buy new hardware when it does something that is ‘game changing’ or when your old hardware dies.   For example I’m carefully monitoring how the LiDAR camera on the iPhone is being used as a handheld survey grade accurate scanner.  It’s amazing to me what can be done in the university lab and under controlled outdoor conditions.   I expects that when Apple next upgrades the LiDAR camera on the iPhone I (and many other surveyors) will purchase it immediately — provided they work out (finish) the survey grade LiDAR software before the LiDAR camera is upgraded.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 56 of 62
    jdw said:
    dewme said:
    I’m sure you know the shutter sound on Japanese versions of all brand smartphones has nothing to do with Apple at all. They are simply complying with the carriers demands in that country. 
    You should be aware you just contradicted yourself by saying that shutter sound compliance in Japan "has NOTHING to do with Apple at all" while in your very next sentence you state the truth that it DOES have to do with Apple "complying with the carriers"!  Regardless of the reason for it, making certain iPhone functionality permanent for a given market VERY MUCH has something "to do with Apple."  Some people try to rationalize such capitulation, while folks like myself who have lived in Japan continuously since 1994 don't need to rationalize such "do like others do" craziness, especially when one has been able to just buy a US model iPhone and use it here without such ridiculous and bothersome features. Might as well start defending the Great Firewall of China next.  Not every convention and custom is great one, even if it was done with noble intentions in mind.  As you can see, I'm not fan of the nanny state, and I don't hide that fact when give the opportunity.

    But I am very glad and thrilled to the core that we agree that the eSIM thing is "a legitimate concern" because it absolutely is for people who travel internationally.  Again, we need to know if US based iPhone buyers can order an "international version" of the iPhone 14 which has the SIM tray.  If not, that is a huge mistake on Apple's part.
    Do you suppose there's any chance that the reason Japanese carriers require that sound is because of creeps taking stealth pictures of women?  Blaming Apple for complying with carriers' demands in this case is insane.
    watto_cobra
  • Reply 57 of 62
    rumpels said:
    Here we go again with the sharp edges, and now a pill. Apple, you can do better than this! You have known for years that we all want round edges and no notch, no pill, NOTHING but screen. And you CAN build it. You did it many years ago with the MacBook Pro front camera. You can do it with the iPhone now. Stop playing with camera sensors and other crap, and making customers buy worthless devices for years before you complete what we all really want.

    Again… ROUND EDGES & TOTAL SCREEN. No holes, no pill, no notches!!!!!! When you build that iPhone, THEN I’ll upgrade my weak SE. Well be waiting. 
    no... that's what YOU want... not what EVERYBODY wants.  I hated the round edged phone (-6 era)... but I certainly wouldn't try to claim that EVERYbody hated it.

    And hiding a camera behind a generic LCD screen is not the same as putting various lighting and face-ID sensors behind an OLED TOUCH SCREEN... I'm not saying it can't be done, but just because you can do one, doesn't mean you can de facto do the other.

    Apple seems to be doing what hundreds of millions of people want, based on sales. (Just not what YOU want.)

    watto_cobra
  • Reply 58 of 62
    jdwjdw Posts: 1,130member
    jdw said:
    dewme said:
    I’m sure you know the shutter sound on Japanese versions of all brand smartphones has nothing to do with Apple at all. They are simply complying with the carriers demands in that country. 
    You should be aware you just contradicted yourself by saying that shutter sound compliance in Japan "has NOTHING to do with Apple at all" while in your very next sentence you state the truth that it DOES have to do with Apple "complying with the carriers"!  Regardless of the reason for it, making certain iPhone functionality permanent for a given market VERY MUCH has something "to do with Apple."  Some people try to rationalize such capitulation, while folks like myself who have lived in Japan continuously since 1994 don't need to rationalize such "do like others do" craziness, especially when one has been able to just buy a US model iPhone and use it here without such ridiculous and bothersome features. Might as well start defending the Great Firewall of China next.  Not every convention and custom is great one, even if it was done with noble intentions in mind.  As you can see, I'm not fan of the nanny state, and I don't hide that fact when give the opportunity.

    But I am very glad and thrilled to the core that we agree that the eSIM thing is "a legitimate concern" because it absolutely is for people who travel internationally.  Again, we need to know if US based iPhone buyers can order an "international version" of the iPhone 14 which has the SIM tray.  If not, that is a huge mistake on Apple's part.
    Do you suppose there's any chance that the reason Japanese carriers require that sound is because of creeps taking stealth pictures of women?  Blaming Apple for complying with carriers' demands in this case is insane.
    Do you suppose that a person like myself who has lived continuously in Japan since 1994 would know that the reason is INDEED creepy idiots taking stealth photos of women?  The answer is, naturally, that I AM AWARE.  But I don't care.  No, not even one tiny bit.  I hate idiots do idiotic things, but I don't care enough to limit your freedom so as to limit the freedom of those idiots.

    Why in THE WORLD is it that every INDIVIDUAL SIN of mankind needs to be made in to a new law, rule, regulation or cultural issue?  With each new rule, the freedoms of the MAJORITY of good people (I'm talking about the 99.9%+ who do NOT take such wicked photos) are limited by those fancy dancy rules.  That means a greater wrong is done to society at large by that do-gooder mentality.  

    If someone commits a crime like taking photos of a woman secretly, let the cops nail that person and handle it that way.   But don't take my freedom or your freedom away using cultural laws that have the aim of catching a teensy tiny few handful of dirty mind nuts in this world. 

    Sheesh.  The way people think today (outside Japan) in terms of ruling the lives of others, while not exclusively focusing on keeping their own heart pure, is truly insane and scary.
  • Reply 59 of 62
    crowleycrowley Posts: 10,453member
    jdw said:
    jdw said:
    dewme said:
    I’m sure you know the shutter sound on Japanese versions of all brand smartphones has nothing to do with Apple at all. They are simply complying with the carriers demands in that country. 
    You should be aware you just contradicted yourself by saying that shutter sound compliance in Japan "has NOTHING to do with Apple at all" while in your very next sentence you state the truth that it DOES have to do with Apple "complying with the carriers"!  Regardless of the reason for it, making certain iPhone functionality permanent for a given market VERY MUCH has something "to do with Apple."  Some people try to rationalize such capitulation, while folks like myself who have lived in Japan continuously since 1994 don't need to rationalize such "do like others do" craziness, especially when one has been able to just buy a US model iPhone and use it here without such ridiculous and bothersome features. Might as well start defending the Great Firewall of China next.  Not every convention and custom is great one, even if it was done with noble intentions in mind.  As you can see, I'm not fan of the nanny state, and I don't hide that fact when give the opportunity.

    But I am very glad and thrilled to the core that we agree that the eSIM thing is "a legitimate concern" because it absolutely is for people who travel internationally.  Again, we need to know if US based iPhone buyers can order an "international version" of the iPhone 14 which has the SIM tray.  If not, that is a huge mistake on Apple's part.
    Do you suppose there's any chance that the reason Japanese carriers require that sound is because of creeps taking stealth pictures of women?  Blaming Apple for complying with carriers' demands in this case is insane.
    Do you suppose that a person like myself who has lived continuously in Japan since 1994 would know that the reason is INDEED creepy idiots taking stealth photos of women?  The answer is, naturally, that I AM AWARE.  But I don't care.  No, not even one tiny bit.  I hate idiots do idiotic things, but I don't care enough to limit your freedom so as to limit the freedom of those idiots.

    Why in THE WORLD is it that every INDIVIDUAL SIN of mankind needs to be made in to a new law, rule, regulation or cultural issue?  With each new rule, the freedoms of the MAJORITY of good people (I'm talking about the 99.9%+ who do NOT take such wicked photos) are limited by those fancy dancy rules.  That means a greater wrong is done to society at large by that do-gooder mentality.  

    If someone commits a crime like taking photos of a woman secretly, let the cops nail that person and handle it that way.   But don't take my freedom or your freedom away using cultural laws that have the aim of catching a teensy tiny few handful of dirty mind nuts in this world. 

    Sheesh.  The way people think today (outside Japan) in terms of ruling the lives of others, while not exclusively focusing on keeping their own heart pure, is truly insane and scary.
    Jfc, the self-pitying weeping over a shutter sound.  No one feels for you.
    watto_cobrabeowulfschmidt
  • Reply 60 of 62
    jdwjdw Posts: 1,130member
    crowley said:
    jdw said:
    jdw said:
    dewme said:
    I’m sure you know the shutter sound on Japanese versions of all brand smartphones has nothing to do with Apple at all. They are simply complying with the carriers demands in that country. 
    You should be aware you just contradicted yourself by saying that shutter sound compliance in Japan "has NOTHING to do with Apple at all" while in your very next sentence you state the truth that it DOES have to do with Apple "complying with the carriers"!  Regardless of the reason for it, making certain iPhone functionality permanent for a given market VERY MUCH has something "to do with Apple."  Some people try to rationalize such capitulation, while folks like myself who have lived in Japan continuously since 1994 don't need to rationalize such "do like others do" craziness, especially when one has been able to just buy a US model iPhone and use it here without such ridiculous and bothersome features. Might as well start defending the Great Firewall of China next.  Not every convention and custom is great one, even if it was done with noble intentions in mind.  As you can see, I'm not fan of the nanny state, and I don't hide that fact when give the opportunity.

    But I am very glad and thrilled to the core that we agree that the eSIM thing is "a legitimate concern" because it absolutely is for people who travel internationally.  Again, we need to know if US based iPhone buyers can order an "international version" of the iPhone 14 which has the SIM tray.  If not, that is a huge mistake on Apple's part.
    Do you suppose there's any chance that the reason Japanese carriers require that sound is because of creeps taking stealth pictures of women?  Blaming Apple for complying with carriers' demands in this case is insane.
    Do you suppose that a person like myself who has lived continuously in Japan since 1994 would know that the reason is INDEED creepy idiots taking stealth photos of women?  The answer is, naturally, that I AM AWARE.  But I don't care.  No, not even one tiny bit.  I hate idiots do idiotic things, but I don't care enough to limit your freedom so as to limit the freedom of those idiots.

    Why in THE WORLD is it that every INDIVIDUAL SIN of mankind needs to be made in to a new law, rule, regulation or cultural issue?  With each new rule, the freedoms of the MAJORITY of good people (I'm talking about the 99.9%+ who do NOT take such wicked photos) are limited by those fancy dancy rules.  That means a greater wrong is done to society at large by that do-gooder mentality.  

    If someone commits a crime like taking photos of a woman secretly, let the cops nail that person and handle it that way.   But don't take my freedom or your freedom away using cultural laws that have the aim of catching a teensy tiny few handful of dirty mind nuts in this world. 

    Sheesh.  The way people think today (outside Japan) in terms of ruling the lives of others, while not exclusively focusing on keeping their own heart pure, is truly insane and scary.
    Jfc, the self-pitying weeping over a shutter sound.  No one feels for you.
    LOL.  You lambast most people in this forum.  I honestly don't care what you think on this point.
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