Unionized Apple Store seeks pay raises, customer tips

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Comments

  • Reply 21 of 43
    sdw2001sdw2001 Posts: 18,020member
    I’m 100% for unionizing, and for higher wages. But offering customers tipping options on checkout would be an overall negative experience. It’s not like food services where it’s a couple dollars, at Apple Stores you’re rarely buying something that costs less than a hundred. Also all tips if collected should go to the employee who earned them, rather than a pool. Which means sales would earn the majority of tips despite often being less responsible for the store’s overall exceptional experiences. 

    I think employees should be allowed to accept cash tips if offered or gifts, but I don’t think they should be permitted to bring it up to customers, too great of a chance of somebody thinking they can make extra money by dropping hints to impressionable seniors. 

    Realistically, most Apple Store employees should be making significantly more than they do in all regions. Apple’s stores make more money square foot than basically anyone else in retail.

    Apple should be cutting back on payouts to investors (I say that as somebody with apple shares.) The people in their stores work hard and deal with some of the most ridiculous people and their bonkers expectations of how products should behave.

    At the bare minimum every store’s wages should be arrived at based on a number of factors, how much does a 2 bedroom apartment cost in the area they work in. How does the employee’s customer satisfaction scores stack up. (They should also completely overhaul the way they collect this data, customers should have to type in the name of the person they’re reviewing and if it doesn’t match the employee it should be disregarded (feel free to show them the person’s name on the survey, but if they are giving feedback that will affect someone’s pay you should at least have to write their name and possibly figure out that Cindy is not the name of the six foot four guy who told you his name was Jeff.) this would also filter out negative feedback from people who are just mad that they talked with someone who had an accent or who they thought they should be legally allowed to own. 

    Hopefully this is a union tactic to get Apple’s lawyers to simply say, “yes tips are a dumb idea we’ll boost pay by 2%”


    "Realistically, most Apple Store employees should be making significantly more than they do in all regions. Apple’s stores make more money square foot than basically anyone else in retail."

    The reality is that Apple Store employees make much more than just about any other retail employee.  They are making $20+ an hour to start, plus many get benefits.  And that's just the base pay.  They already get overtime, bonuses, etc.  Employees who have been there for a few years routinely make $30+ an hour base.  You have Apple Sales associates making $50-75K total before benefits.  
  • Reply 22 of 43
    I wanted to go down the list but I'll just stick with tipping.
    The pressure on employees to provide over the top personalized service to customers is already extreme in Apple Stores. Whether that be quick, one on one vs group interactions when the store is packed,  requests for limited products or jump the line service at the Bar. I can see on a launch day bidding for available product through tipping. How high would the bids go to be first into a new store? Or to get someone to hold a hot product in the back room for a couple days? It would happen in a heart beat.
    edited May 2023 EsquireCats
  • Reply 23 of 43
    drdeadedrdeade Posts: 7member
    Hmmm??? Well if the cost to run the store exceeds the cost allowed and eats into profits guess what?  Another store closes!  While it’s great to have staff and apple staff does have to deal with a lot of BS I can see the service, especially in a blue town like Baltimore, go down hill.  Tips?!  Yeah, that won’t happen.  I pay for a service and now I ‘m suppose to tip on top of the service?  See ya!  Finally, after running my offices on Apple products because of their “use to be dependable”, they are not!  I ‘m now calling my IT out more often because of “settings” changes that occur with updates.  Furthermore, (since we’re speaking of tips and services.) Apple staff has no idea why when I send a pages document from my M1-Mac to an intel based Mac, running the same version of pages, that the document cannot be open!?? WTF?  This isn’t just some time it’s all the time.  Result: I had to switch to Microsoft products.  Pretty soon because of Apples neglect when another player comes into this stagnant Monopoly market they could set many of these companies on the path to “RECONSOLIDATION”.  MEANING. The space ship could be sold off for parts.  Elon are you listening? 
  • Reply 24 of 43
    EsquireCatsEsquireCats Posts: 1,268member
    "This will allow thankful patrons the ability to express gratitude for a job well done without any obligations"

    That's false. Presenting a tip-screen is not "without any obligations" - this is the USA, the social obligation of tipping is significantly large enough that even receiving a small tip is considered justification for rude behaviour from staff. Edit: Originally I felt that allowing staff to accept tips that are offered without prompting would be acceptable, except as noted from other readers: this will certainly produce bribery-like scenarios for hotly contested items, especially when online resale of launch day items is so lucrative.

    I believe in the usefulness of unions to balance staff interests against that of the company, however unions can also abuse their power and customer-experience harming proposals such as these provide justification for why companies that already provide a living wage are right to be concerned about unionisation efforts.
    edited May 2023
  • Reply 25 of 43
    Geez. I wouldn’t shop in this store. You still have to have some modicum of respect for the organization and work you’re doing, even at the bargaining table. No doubt there’s game playing on both sides, including by way of this being in the news stream, but the approach says we disrespect the customer and the nature of the retail experience that feeds us in deference to near term self serving. I would not want my name on such a maneuver, for the sake of what it says about how I look at others, and I would not shop at a location that is connected to this.   :'(
  • Reply 26 of 43
    robin huberrobin huber Posts: 3,990member
    Tipping would be tolerable IF it were completely disengaged from the transaction, and therefore completely anonymous. Customer could tip as part of the post-transaction “rate your service” email questionnaire. Accumulated tips for the period would be aggregated and shown separately on paycheck. No way to tie a particular tip to any one interaction. 

    To those who are shocked, SHOCKED that a union would ask for this, I would remind them of this. Businessmen in negotiation routinely ask for more than they expect. It’s called bargaining. But they expect workers to engage in collective begging, not bargaining. 
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 27 of 43
    eriamjheriamjh Posts: 1,686member
    RobJenk said:
    No tips!
    Tip culture is a symptom of underpaid employees.   Pay your employees fairly and don't rely on customers to subsidize their wages through charity.

    No tips.
    beowulfschmidt
  • Reply 28 of 43
    Dooofus said:
    Tips are great for rewarding a job well done. In this case however, since the money is split between all the workers, what would I be rewarding? If it doesn't go to the employee that did the good job, I won't be leaving any tips. And 45 days of bereavement leave for a pet gerbil? They're living in fantasy land. Unions are just legalized protection rackets.
    Tips are NOT for that.
  • Reply 29 of 43
    I am getting a whiff of misinformation here. The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers clearly doesn't expect tips in a retail store, but that is what every Apple fan site is focusing on and that has attracted the usual suspects - freedom-loving anti-communist keyboard rangers - exactly as planned. Sensationalism is how you get views.
    robin huber
  • Reply 30 of 43
    sbdudesbdude Posts: 276member
    Dooofus said:
    Tips are great for rewarding a job well done. In this case however, since the money is split between all the workers, what would I be rewarding? If it doesn't go to the employee that did the good job, I won't be leaving any tips. And 45 days of bereavement leave for a pet gerbil? They're living in fantasy land. Unions are just legalized protection rackets.
    Tips are NOT for that.

    Tips are exactly for that. It's that sense of entitlement that has corrupted the whole practice.

    Bet you can't wait to tip that IRS agent that does your audit.
    stompy
  • Reply 31 of 43
    sbdudesbdude Posts: 276member
    Proof positive that Gen Z will be the end of society as we know it? Hyperbolic, I know, but this nonsense has to stop. "I need 45 days to mourn my fur baby". If you think that's a bargaining "tactic", you're sorely mistaken.
  • Reply 32 of 43
    bloggerblogbloggerblog Posts: 2,480member
    Tipping culture is definitely out of control in the US.
    When you walk in to a food chain store like Panera Bread:
    • Wait in line to order a meal where they expect a tip right there and then before anything
    • You have to find your own table, often wipe it down when its dirty
    • Go back to the counter to pick up your own food tray when its ready
    • Pick up napkins
    • Fill up your own drink
    • Take everything back to your table
    • Eat
    • Take your tray to the trash
    • Separate recycling from non recycling
    • Put silverware and dishes in the right slots
    • Put the tray in the tray holder
    • If you're up for it and I always do this, wipe down your own table
    • You basically do everything except for preparing the food.
    And then they expect a tip!? For what exactly? Buying products or getting service at an Apple Store where employees expect you to tip is super awkward.
  • Reply 33 of 43
    kennmsrkennmsr Posts: 100member
    The Towson, Maryland Apple Store that unionized is entering negotiations again, with workers seeking the ability to accept customer tips.

    Finally, the customer tip change. Workers want to give customers the opportunity to tip at checkout at 3%, 5%, or a custom amount.

    "This will allow thankful patrons the ability to express gratitude for a job well done without any obligations," the union wrote Apple. "All monies collected through this manner would be dispersed to members of the bargaining unit biweekly based on any hours worked."

    Read on AppleInsider
    I’ve been supporting Apple Products for over 40 years and also moderate our Local Mac Users Group and I don’t expect any tips for my support. I do this because of my love and belief in Apple Products and it’s mission to its customers. As for the wanting pay increases they probably have no one to blame but themselves, who probably voted in this current administration, who has pushed our economy into the sewer.
    williamh
  • Reply 35 of 43
    macxpressmacxpress Posts: 5,868member
    The whole tipping thing in the US has completely gotten out of hand. Why the fuck would I ever tip someone in an Apple Store? They're already paid a decent wage to provide a service from Apple. We need to create a society where tipping isn't a thing anymore, anywhere! I think people are tired of being nickeled and dimed for every little fuckin thing. 

    If this is what unionized people are thinking they need to be in a union for then Jesus there's no help for these people. They're already paid more than a typical retail worker, have medical benefits, discounts on products, etc. What the hell else do they expect? You're still in retail. If you don't like where you work, or it's not paying enough then go get a different job. Is it really the hard to comprehend? People do it every single day. Once Apple starts seeing massive turnover then believe me, they'll change something. It costs a company a lot of money to hire someone so every time they have to it it's costing them more and more. 
    edited May 2023
  • Reply 36 of 43
    Better salary, and stat holiday pay: yes. Overtime, shift differential, and compensation for first aid responsibilities: agreed.  But 10 days of bereavement per event is already generous.  45 days a year, including friends AND PETS?! Now they’re the ones who are negotiating in bad faith.  I’m in a unionized healthcare job and we only get 3 days +2 travel days if out of town.

    And don’t get me started on tipping. 3% of a $6000 Mac is $180.  That’s insane.   I hate having to click past the tip options on screen when paying by card when I’m not even shopping at a tip-based industry.  This is a subtly coercive tactic that tells me the company is just greedy.  Even restaurants don’t even pre-populate the 15% tip option anymore, they start at 18%.  
  • Reply 37 of 43
    atomic101atomic101 Posts: 132member
    Ah yes.... tipping.  Guilting people into tipping even when they had no intent / when it was not warranted.  Those tipping prompts at checkout kiosks or socially engineered to guilt customers into unnecessary costs.  Let's bring that into all aspects of our lives.  Awesome.
  • Reply 38 of 43
    entropysentropys Posts: 4,221member
    Better salary, and stat holiday pay: yes. Overtime, shift differential, and compensation for first aid responsibilities: agreed.  But 10 days of bereavement per event is already generous.  45 days a year, including friends AND PETS?! Now they’re the ones who are negotiating in bad faith.  I’m in a unionized healthcare job and we only get 3 days +2 travel days if out of town.

    And don’t get me started on tipping. 3% of a $6000 Mac is $180.  That’s insane.   I hate having to click past the tip options on screen when paying by card when I’m not even shopping at a tip-based industry.  This is a subtly coercive tactic that tells me the company is just greedy.  Even restaurants don’t even pre-populate the 15% tip option anymore, they start at 18%.  
    Actually that is one thing happening whenever I visit in the US. Tipping isn’t really a thing in my country, although it might happen in restaurants occasionally.
    but a credit card slip prepopulated with a % tip is really off putting. Feels like a scam.  
    muthuk_vanalingam
  • Reply 39 of 43
    chasmchasm Posts: 3,410member
    No one is complaining about a corporation being asked to offer up to 45 days paid bereavement for pets and close friends? Employees can just buy a bunch of goldfish. If the standard is five work days a week that would be an extra 9 weeks off per year paid.  What insanity is this?
    You should try re-reading that sentence, because you’ve completely misinterpreted it.

    The union is proposing an extension of bereavement days from 10 days per year to 45 days, and that bereavement can also cover pets and close friends in addition to direct family members.

    When my mother died, I certainly needed more than 10 days to recover from that loss to the point when I could resume things like working. The loss of a pet likewise can be deeply devastating. But again this is just a proposal.

    Also bear in mind that 45 days covers all bereavement for the year, so most employees would like likely self-ration those days in case someone else died during the year.

    Apple will likely come back with “okay, up to 10 days for pets and close friends, and up to 20 days for direct family per year,” and then discuss it until an agreement is reached. That’s how negotiations work, and also see the union’s statement in the article about how this is essentially their opening bid from which to negotiate.
  • Reply 40 of 43
    laytechlaytech Posts: 339member
    Classic Union's getting involved with stupid ideas. So glad I won't get to experience this if it happens. Good luck America with that. What is it with Union's ,they can't help themselves with just pushing for that extra bit to ruin it for everyone. If this was just about pay increases, I'd be fine with it.
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