I think he's lost it. (Manson's new record)

Posted:
in General Discussion edited January 2014
Well I'm home with my copy of Marilyn Manson's new record, The Golden Age of Grotesque, and I think my good friend MM has finally lost "it".



The first song is "This is the New Shit", but he couldn't be more wrong. This is the old shit, Marilyn, the guitar-synth death crunch you've been doing for the last 5 years.



Is it a baby of his last two albums as one would expect from him? Of course.



It tries to combine the bombastic synth-glam of Mechanical Animals with the dark and almost-disturbing Holy Wood without reaching the artistic heights of either.



The songs on Grotesque are essentially interchangeable, or at least that's how it seems on the first few listens.



While I listen to it I want to listen to his older stuff to find out why he became so predictable and... repetetive. Of course the sex, death, drugs and religion are the themes, they have been since he kicked it with the Spooky Kids, but it's just so... forgettable.



The loud songs built on simple guitar and beats have their requisite kick and punch ("Doll-Dagga Buzz-Buzz Ziggety-Zag" being a standout), but the slower and more brooding tracks take you nowhere emotionally or even themeatically, it's just like his synthesizer went down in volume and someone unplugged the lead guitar. Holy Wood kicked off tracks with the sound of a jail cell continually locking or a revolver cycling through chambers, every freaking song on this album starts off with a synth-beat.



Do I like it? You bet your ass, he's still the same melodramatic psycho fun he's always been, but there's something almost workmanlike about this album; like the freak has a press in his workshop that he churns this stuff out with.



I remember listening to Antichrist Superstar for the first time, I had seen a picture of him and dismissed it as shock value, but that album always reminded me of Sgt Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band and I've been his most mellow and Average Joe fan ever since.



I think he's lost "it". Hopefully he can find it again, because there's not a damned musician out there like him. Not his best work in the 21st century, but I'll take it over 99% of the rock Big Music churns out these days.



I don't think his girlfriend is doing him any good on the music front. Gotta dump her, man, and get that edge back!



Fellowship, I'd like to hear your thoughts on this latest record.
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Comments

  • Reply 2 of 35
    discocowdiscocow Posts: 603member
    Quote:



  • Reply 3 of 35
    709709 Posts: 2,016member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by groverat

    It tries to combine the bombastic synth-glam of Mechanical Animals with the dark and almost-disturbing Holy Wood without reaching the artistic heights of either.



    I respectfully disagree. I think that MM is actually 're-finding' his roots ala 'Smells like & Portait". Those, IMO were his best.



    Quote:

    The songs on Grotesque are essentially interchangeable, or at least that's how it seems on the first few listens.



    Welcome to psuedo-pop.



    Quote:

    I think he's lost "it". Hopefully he can find it again, because there's not a damned musician out there like him. Not his best work in the 21st century, but I'll take it over 99% of the rock Big Music churns out these days.



    Again, I disagree (on everything except your comment about his status). MM has tired of what he was supposed to be, and IMO has gone back to the days of what made him what he is now. Subtle Mind-F*cking.



    Quote:

    I don't think his girlfriend is doing him any good on the music front.



    Sure, she ain't Rose, but she's a fetish model.....and she's hot.



    All in all, I feel like this is MM's final album, I think he's a bit tired of the same old thing. Too bad for all of us who actually respect performers.
  • Reply 4 of 35
    groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    709:



    Quote:

    I respectfully disagree. I think that MM is actually 're-finding' his roots ala 'Smells like & Portait". Those, IMO were his best.



    We have different tastes, then.



    IMO Smells Like Children is far-and-away his worst. Never trust Trent Reznor, there's a reason NIN sucks mightily.



    Do not let him touch your music.



    As far as roots go, I don't see Grotesque doing the hard-ass metal rock that Portrait of an American Family pulled off. It may be more like Smells Like Children, but I wouldn't know off-hand because I can't stand listening to that fetid pile of waste.



    Portrait of an American Family was an ass-kicker, though, without a doubt. His 2nd best in my book.



    Quote:

    MM has tired of what he was supposed to be, and IMO has gone back to the days of what made him what he is now. Subtle Mind-F*cking.



    There ain't a damned thing subtle about The Golden Age of Grotesque.



    Quote:

    Sure, she ain't Rose, but she's a fetish model.....and she's hot.



    That she is. That she is.



    Quote:

    All in all, I feel like this is MM's final album, I think he's a bit tired of the same old thing. Too bad for all of us who actually respect performers.



    I thought Mechanical Animals would be his last because it came completely out of left field (to me) and I thought he was essentially going nuts. So Holy Wood really surprised me with how strong it was.



    Antichrist Superstar is still the best, an absolute masterpiece of hard rock. One of the Top 10 albums of the 90s.



    -



    Another problem I have with Grotesque is that I don't see a uniting theme. In Antichrist he was The Fallen Angel, in Mechanical Animals he was Omega and in Holy Wood he was Adam.



    So has he dropped the rock opera thing? Is he not looking to tell a story with the album anymore?



    Is what you take to mean "going back to his roots" merely making an album that is a group of songs rather than an integrated idea?



    That's disappointing to me because it made his stuff unique.
  • Reply 5 of 35
    pfflampfflam Posts: 5,053member
    he never had "it" . . . his music was always terrible and uninventive . . . recycled 70s guitar riffs turned up loud with synths and trum tracks at times . . . lame and seriously mediocre



    the only thing that made him anything was his schtick . . . and judging by the Onion article (very hilarious!!) that schtick is old hat and tired....
  • Reply 6 of 35
    groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    Quote:

    recycled 70s guitar riffs turned up loud with synths and trum tracks at times



    eh... wassatnow?



    Keep in mind, pfflam, I'm to your stereotypical Manson fan what Bob Dylan is to Ella Fitzgerald. Or something.



    But that really doesn't make sense to me. Loud synths and drum tracks, yes, but recycled 70s guitar riffs?



    If there's any thievery in the guitar aspect it's from industrial music. Maybe they had that in the 70s and that's what you're talking about.
  • Reply 7 of 35
    pfflampfflam Posts: 5,053member
    His guitar riffs . . . at least from the albums that I heard . . . sounded like they were taken out of context from T Rex, or worse . . . from Meatloaf!! and then put on his industrial-ish noise and turned up the distort to add more noise . . . like sample T Rex in a mud soup
  • Reply 8 of 35
    709709 Posts: 2,016member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by groverat

    We have different tastes, then.



    Yes we do. But not that much.



    'Portrait' was a swift kick to music's nether-regions. Welcomed by few, rejected by most. I loved it. Then came 'Smells". I liked it. A couple covers of my favorite songs and a 5 minute eaves-dropping on Mom & GrandMom made me smile.



    'Superstar' was, admitingly, fast and furious, and had the ups and downs that an opus should have, but just didn't live up to what I needed it to be. Too contrived. Too controlled. But utterly awesome.



    I used to talk with Scott (Daisy) about the direction MM (as a band) was going after Smells, and he was really frustrated. He wanted clean, cool Rock N' Roll and everyone else seemed to be really focused on the glam-gods persona that they created. He eventualy quit, of course, and MM went on to record more schtick than dick records. Still amazing for what they were, but all penis and no balls IMO.



    I think 'Grotesque' is MM's final foray into the realm of fantasy. In a world where lyrics like 'I am The God of F*ck" raise nary an eyebrow, it's time for him to do something more.
  • Reply 9 of 35
    pfflampfflam Posts: 5,053member
    MM is a poser . . . literally . . .his music has always sucked . . . people who loke him don't see that his music is NOT original and neither is his schtick . . . most likely they just don't know about the hords of precursors that never got the press he did . . .



    The Birthday Party fer instance . . . excellent band, very dark songs with smart lyrics. . . unlike manson's silly shockers
  • Reply 10 of 35
    groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    Quote:

    people who loke him don't see that his music is NOT original and neither is his schtick . . . most likely they just don't know about the hords of precursors that never got the press he did . . .



    Who the hell IS original?



    Funny, I own a cassette of Prayers on Fire and two Nick Cave CDs (Murder Ballads and From Her to Eternity).



    The Birthday Party isn't original if you want to look at it that way. Nick Cave is just Leonard Cohen with louder guitars and a post-punk death roll.



    I don't feel as strongly as you do about Manson, maybe he worked on you after all.
  • Reply 11 of 35
    mrmistermrmister Posts: 1,095member
    Manson bores me, but I liked Dita even before she was dating that 'tard.
  • Reply 12 of 35
    burningwheelburningwheel Posts: 1,827member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by groverat



    I remember listening to Antichrist Superstar for the first time, I had seen a picture of him and dismissed it as shock value, but that album always reminded me of Sgt Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band and I've been his most mellow and Average Joe fan ever since.





    maybe you've lost it
  • Reply 13 of 35
    groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by burningwheel

    maybe you've lost it



    I'm serious, the way the story moves and the tempo of the music progresses.



    It's there, you just have to do a lot of drugs to see it properly.
  • Reply 14 of 35
    kraig911kraig911 Posts: 912member
    I don't know groverat I listened to a couple of tracks but I have just grown deaf to his music I guess. Maybe he is getting back to his roots, some could say that, but the tit has run dry on his creative boob.
  • Reply 15 of 35
    burningwheelburningwheel Posts: 1,827member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by groverat

    I'm serious, the way the story moves and the tempo of the music progresses.



    It's there, you just have to do a lot of drugs to see it properly.




    oh \
  • Reply 16 of 35
    pfflampfflam Posts: 5,053member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by groverat

    I don't feel as strongly as you do about Manson, maybe he worked on you after all.



    welll . . . .



    harumph!



    the only way to respond to that is to not respond







    but anyway . . . no he is mediocre at best. The Birthday Party as Cohen . . . . that is funny!! nail on the head with that album

    but they have some very good songs (and some not so very) but at least their musical inventions are creative



    . . . and nick cave is actually a good novelist too . . .



    whereas MM merely lies about having read a lot of Nietzsche . . .



    um . . . . shoulda not responded i guess
  • Reply 17 of 35
    fellowshipfellowship Posts: 5,038member
    Quote:

    Originally posted by groverat



    Fellowship, I'd like to hear your thoughts on this latest record.




    LOL Take a wild guess....



    I place him as I do Jerry Springer and Cops....



    How many Jerry Springer Shows do you have to watch before they pulled hair and threw chairs. Cops. How many drunks and drug addicts do you have to watch get arrested after beating their wives.



    MM same kind of drift....



    He was for kids since the begining. I grew up thank God and never did care for what he pumps out. Notice I am not calling him a freak or anything just that his shock value is antique and not even warmed over any more. Just plain luke warm.



    Sorry for some reason I just don't even have one of his albums. hahaha



    Fellows
  • Reply 18 of 35
    moogsmoogs Posts: 4,296member
    Maryln Manson is a waste product. I wonder if any of his fans would've made him the star he is, had he worn jeans and a t-shirt his whole career. Would the music still be good if he looked like Opie Taylor? Actually, that would be kind of funny - anyone really good with Photoshop and Final Cut? - but that's not my point.



    My point is, he should give his instruments and equipment to a couple of good garage bands somewhere who have something original to say / write and leave the toiling, tax paying parents of America alone. Who does he think he is anyway, Trent Reznor?



  • Reply 19 of 35
    groveratgroverat Posts: 10,872member
    Quote:

    Maryln Manson is a waste product. I wonder if any of his fans would've made him the star he is, had he worn jeans and a t-shirt his whole career.



    As I mentioned above, his persona turned me off at first and it wasn't until I listened (trapped at a friend's house in HS w/ no ride home for the time being) to his music that I liked it.



    Jeans and a t-shirt probably would've had me listening faster.



    Whether or not I'm a "fan", though, I don't know.



    Quote:

    Would the music still be good if he looked like Opie Taylor?



    Have you seen him? He looks like Paul from "The Wonder Years" at 6'5" and 140lbs. He is no imposing figure.



    Quote:

    Who does he think he is anyway, Trent Reznor?



    No, he makes listenable music.



    -



    Again, such anger. Don't let Manson win!
  • Reply 20 of 35
    liquidrliquidr Posts: 884member
    I've never been a big fan of MM, but did enjoy his schtick for whatever it was worth. I enjoyed the fact that it got a bunch of Middle-america tighta$$es all worked up over a crazy theatrical production. My hat off to him for that. As for the originality of his music, I don't care. There is a difference between art and entertainment, and to me MM was never art, just entertainment.
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