If a $300.00 rebate on PowerMac's until July 7th at Apple.com/store say's anything I would have to agree that PowerMac's will be getting an upgrade, but Apple has been giving things away in mass quantities lately, iPods, Display Rebates - people are loving it, so I can't stand behind that as a reason for it. But the PowerMac is Due so that;'s what I'm thinking will be the main course. I am not buying one, though I tried to buy the Dual GHz w/TI, and my delay was Sooo long that I retracted my order after 2 months with no real word on it. It was Bull Sh*?! Unless Apple pulls a completely gutted G4, or 5 out of it's ass at MWNY with a fantastic new UMA, I'll wait until Jan MWSF. I think I'll wait for FW2, USB 2.0, and DDR. **** , - Maybe even Serial ATA Drives (Standard) by then, and hopefully a G5, but I'm not counting on it.
1: The pumped up G4s (1gig & up) are applied to the imac & PwrBook line.
2: Jaguar, FireWire2, and SHAKE will be demonstrated on the all new PwrMacs featuring a new processor, Mobo, and Nvidia/Raycer graphics. Dual and quad versions a must. As a result they won't ship until Aug/Sept.
3: the new icam DEVICE will show off FireWire2 capabilities as well as video conferencing. Mpeg4 is a no-brainer here.
<strong>Have you seen the data on peecee sales? I believe I recently saw that year on year sales were down again. Intel stock just dropped 18% in a day as they forecast lower sales in the near future.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I took a look at Apple's 10-Q report up to March 30 2002. Power Mac sales are down 19% on the same quarter 2001, which seems in line with the rest of the industry.
What's more interesting is that PowerBook sales are down 34%(!!!) from last year.
Perhaps a major revision is required, even so soon after a minor one?
<strong>What's more interesting is that PowerBook sales are down 34%(!!!) from last year.
Perhaps a major revision is required, even so soon after a minor one?</strong><hr></blockquote>
maybe the 600 mhz don't go down well in the public eye? I see many mac users being happy with it around me, but most pc users I talk to say "600 mhz? what do you want to do with TAHT?!? play tetris?"
P4 most certainly can run in DP configs, you just need the Xeon variety. Expensive, yes, but not out of line with PowermacG4 pricing. The Xeon is not as expensive as people think, the 4-way+ capable XeonMP is the prohibitively expensive Xeon part. You can build a dual P4 for the cost of a DP 1Ghz PM.
Believe what you want, but the P4 is the fastest chip going for a desktop machine. Not just Mhz either, but real performance. We recently saw that a dual Athlon is roughly 60% faster than a DP PowermacG4 under Premiere, and other test have returned similar numbers for 3-d rendering apps as well. Not benchmarks, timed tests. When you consider that a P4 2.4Ghz is faster than any Athlon, and a Xeon is faster still (and DP capable) well, you get the picture.
There are somethings for which altivec shines, but overall Intel has the fastest chips.
IF Apple had a faster bus, or even a hack that allowed each G4 to talk to RAM at the full 133Mhz speed (not shared) then Apple would be in a position to do something that no other vendor can do -- offer a quad machine at an accessible pro price point. 4-way (not 2-way) capable x86 COSTS a LOT of MONEY. 4-way capable PPC is much cheaper, and in it's SOI form, has energy and heat requirements that would allow 4 CPU's to live confortably on a fairly conventional motherboard-case-PS combination. No such thing could happen when you look at the power/cooling requirements of x86 (at the moment)
But Apple still doesn't have the appropriate memory hack, or true fast memory implementation needed.
<strong>a 1.8 Ghz P4 with a 400Mhz FSB (800 mhz Ram) is slower as
a 1 Ghz G4 with a 133mhz FSB (133mhz Ram)</strong><hr></blockquote>
You're completely missing the point here. Any P4 clocked below 2 GHz is pitiful. The 2.53 with the 533 FSB and 1066 RDRAM is MUCH faster than the latest and fastest Athlon. You may want to check THG. And since the 1.8 GHz is now the entry-level P4 you're effectively saying that Apple's current top performer is as slow as a one-year-old hi-performance PC or as slow as a current entry-level PC, while costing a couple of thousands of ? more...
A while back (Pre MWNY 01) wasn't there a poster who referred to a plan inside apple called D-Year? It basically said that Apple would scaled down upgrades and bumps during the "recession" then
near the end Apple would launch down PC companies throats with new hardware (read: buttocks prodding) with better pricing points? With apple buying all these high end software companies
it suggests that a vastly more powerful system is coming, but the Xserve rules out the G5.
But looking back at the Pro line over the past
several years you see that there are basically processor bumps no MB, or I/O tech improvements,
What does the Xserve have to do with the G5? Apple can release a G5 and still release the Xserve. I don't get that ideology. Also, keep in kind, whatever towers are announced they won't ship till August/September, by then the Xserve will be due an upgrade.
We Want : 2.5Ghz Dual and Quad G5s with all the trimmings
We'll get : 1.0, 1.2 and 1.3 Ghz G4s with a faster FSB
We want : 2 and 2.5Ghz G5 Powerbook
We'll get : nothing new
We want : A killer graphics architecture
We'll get : Geforce 4 Titanium
ad nauseum . . .
Those people inclined to shout "Jeez go buy a peecee" at anyone who criticises apple will yell "Oh my god, sooo much power - I must have died and gone to heaven". Everyone else will be drowning their sorrows.
Matsu is the only one in this thread talking any sense rather than RDF.
It's obvious that Apple has "cleared the decks" by upgrading every under the sun EXCEPT the PowerMac.
To get the kind of press Apple wants from such a major investment as MacWorld, they can't and won't dilute the message by announcing significant upgrades to anything other than the PowerMac.
This is the way almost all Summer Macworlds have been in the last few years.
We'll get a major announcement (new Power Mac), a few minor tweaks the papers won't care about - and a One More Thing iDevice.
maybe the 600 mhz don't go down well in the public eye? I see many mac users being happy with it around me, but most pc users I talk to say "600 mhz? what do you want to do with TAHT?!? play tetris?"
as sad as it is.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Can't quite follow this. The current TiBook is 800Mhz and according to Bare Feats it is wicked fast.
What's more interesting is that PowerBook sales are down 34%(!!!) from last year.
(snip)</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's a surprise. I wonder if it is really a drop in the market or just that last year's quarter was a high spike after the introduction of the TiBook?
Comments
Retroactive $300 price increases for anyone who previously bought a Mac above 500 Mhz.
Oh, and one more thing, an Apple branded blender
Dreeemer... nothi'n but a Dreeeemer...
-onlooker
2: Jaguar, FireWire2, and SHAKE will be demonstrated on the all new PwrMacs featuring a new processor, Mobo, and Nvidia/Raycer graphics. Dual and quad versions a must. As a result they won't ship until Aug/Sept.
3: the new icam DEVICE will show off FireWire2 capabilities as well as video conferencing. Mpeg4 is a no-brainer here.
2. Lots of talk about Jaguar. (well deserved) "OS X now constitutes (or soon will constitute) the largest installed base of UNIX users.
3. Lots of talk about QT 6. (well deserved) Great demo by Phil.
4. New in-your-face ads enticing peecee users.
5. Talk of the new Apple super stores.
6. Some revision to iPod. Maybe a new 20GB version. At least software upgrades to handle the new audio format provided by MPEG 4.
7. Revision to iTunes to match MPEG 4.
8. Possibly new LCD displays.
9. Possibly some discussion of Bluetooth.
10. Some discussion of new and existing products that got bumped up this year - Xserve, eMac, iMac, TiBook, iBook.
11. Some discussion of video related things -
New superdrive, recently acquired video apps, upgrades to FCP, iMovie, iDVD.
12. Kickass Applescript demo by Sal.
13. Short presentations by Adobe, Quark, etc. showing off new software for OS X. Count of how many thousand apps now run on OS X.
14. Maybe the release of OS X 10.1.6.
<strong>Have you seen the data on peecee sales? I believe I recently saw that year on year sales were down again. Intel stock just dropped 18% in a day as they forecast lower sales in the near future.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I took a look at Apple's 10-Q report up to March 30 2002. Power Mac sales are down 19% on the same quarter 2001, which seems in line with the rest of the industry.
What's more interesting is that PowerBook sales are down 34%(!!!) from last year.
Perhaps a major revision is required, even so soon after a minor one?
<strong>What's more interesting is that PowerBook sales are down 34%(!!!) from last year.
Perhaps a major revision is required, even so soon after a minor one?</strong><hr></blockquote>
maybe the 600 mhz don't go down well in the public eye? I see many mac users being happy with it around me, but most pc users I talk to say "600 mhz? what do you want to do with TAHT?!? play tetris?"
as sad as it is.
Also they'll intro iRemote, and iTunes and Quicktime Kiosk modes where you can browse using the remote from far away (nice large text etc.)
hmmm a 1.8 Ghz P4 with a 400Mhz FSB (800 mhz Ram) is slower as
a 1 Ghz G4 with a 133mhz FSB (133mhz Ram)
my point is:
next G4 will have faster FSB and faster Ram and a faster processor you'll see.
P4 Can't be used in a dual-processor config. That's why all servers use P3's
When G5 comes out (I hope with Altivec) It'll kick ass (even faster FSB, faster architecture, higher clock rates...)
Apple's comeback is coming
Believe what you want, but the P4 is the fastest chip going for a desktop machine. Not just Mhz either, but real performance. We recently saw that a dual Athlon is roughly 60% faster than a DP PowermacG4 under Premiere, and other test have returned similar numbers for 3-d rendering apps as well. Not benchmarks, timed tests. When you consider that a P4 2.4Ghz is faster than any Athlon, and a Xeon is faster still (and DP capable) well, you get the picture.
There are somethings for which altivec shines, but overall Intel has the fastest chips.
IF Apple had a faster bus, or even a hack that allowed each G4 to talk to RAM at the full 133Mhz speed (not shared) then Apple would be in a position to do something that no other vendor can do -- offer a quad machine at an accessible pro price point. 4-way (not 2-way) capable x86 COSTS a LOT of MONEY. 4-way capable PPC is much cheaper, and in it's SOI form, has energy and heat requirements that would allow 4 CPU's to live confortably on a fairly conventional motherboard-case-PS combination. No such thing could happen when you look at the power/cooling requirements of x86 (at the moment)
But Apple still doesn't have the appropriate memory hack, or true fast memory implementation needed.
We'll see what happens.
<strong>a 1.8 Ghz P4 with a 400Mhz FSB (800 mhz Ram) is slower as
a 1 Ghz G4 with a 133mhz FSB (133mhz Ram)</strong><hr></blockquote>
You're completely missing the point here. Any P4 clocked below 2 GHz is pitiful. The 2.53 with the 533 FSB and 1066 RDRAM is MUCH faster than the latest and fastest Athlon. You may want to check THG. And since the 1.8 GHz is now the entry-level P4 you're effectively saying that Apple's current top performer is as slow as a one-year-old hi-performance PC or as slow as a current entry-level PC, while costing a couple of thousands of ? more...
ZoSo
[ 06-12-2002: Message edited by: ZoSo ]</p>
<strong>"One more thing?</strong><hr></blockquote>
[quote]Please join me in a round of applause to thank the ex-wives and dysfunctional families of the Jagwire team members.<hr></blockquote>
(....................moment of silence....................)
[quote]Their personal lives are ruined, but we think the results were well worth it."<hr></blockquote>
'hope so!
near the end Apple would launch down PC companies throats with new hardware (read: buttocks prodding) with better pricing points? With apple buying all these high end software companies
it suggests that a vastly more powerful system is coming, but the Xserve rules out the G5.
But looking back at the Pro line over the past
several years you see that there are basically processor bumps no MB, or I/O tech improvements,
that should have already happened.
WTF is going on?
G4 Special Edition iMac 17" LCD <img src="graemlins/smokin.gif" border="0" alt="[Chilling]" />
G4 iMac 15" speedbump
eMac as is (maybe a Combo option added)
iMac CRT dropped (due to eMac)
G4 Powerbook as is (maybe a speedbump with Bluetooth?)
G4 Special Edition iBook
G3 iBook as is
I know, it's too much for one show! Just wishing!
[ 06-12-2002: Message edited by: Donavan ]</p>
We'll get : 1.0, 1.2 and 1.3 Ghz G4s with a faster FSB
We want : 2 and 2.5Ghz G5 Powerbook
We'll get : nothing new
We want : A killer graphics architecture
We'll get : Geforce 4 Titanium
ad nauseum . . .
Those people inclined to shout "Jeez go buy a peecee" at anyone who criticises apple will yell "Oh my god, sooo much power - I must have died and gone to heaven". Everyone else will be drowning their sorrows.
Matsu is the only one in this thread talking any sense rather than RDF.
Way beyond . . .
Anyway I love my 9500/200
To get the kind of press Apple wants from such a major investment as MacWorld, they can't and won't dilute the message by announcing significant upgrades to anything other than the PowerMac.
This is the way almost all Summer Macworlds have been in the last few years.
We'll get a major announcement (new Power Mac), a few minor tweaks the papers won't care about - and a One More Thing iDevice.
Not a PDA, for now.
Maybe someday Apple will bring back the option of switching themes...
<strong>
maybe the 600 mhz don't go down well in the public eye? I see many mac users being happy with it around me, but most pc users I talk to say "600 mhz? what do you want to do with TAHT?!? play tetris?"
as sad as it is.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Can't quite follow this. The current TiBook is 800Mhz and according to Bare Feats it is wicked fast.
<strong>(snip)
What's more interesting is that PowerBook sales are down 34%(!!!) from last year.
(snip)</strong><hr></blockquote>
That's a surprise. I wonder if it is really a drop in the market or just that last year's quarter was a high spike after the introduction of the TiBook?