I'm not getting my hopes up at all. In fact I'd rather have a G4 'cause I figure it would be shipping sooner.
But "soon" is a very big ball park and if they did release a G5, then Joswiak could explain the comment away almost any way he wants. "Soon" offers alot of wiggle room.
Just saying that nothing can be concluded from that remark.
What do you expect him to say? Almost anything that would acknowledge a G5 Powerbook would kill sales ( not that they aren't dead from lack of supply ) and even a no-comment would be interpreted as they will be available next week. "Soon" he can say and be safe either way...
On the topic of Apple "abandoning" the G4, the following occurs to me:
"G4" was invented by Apple as an umbrella moniker, and has been used as such for many incarnations of Motorola PPCs. So while Apple may (will? hopefully will?) abandon Motorola's chip line, I doubt they will abandon the name.
I'm guessing that Apple waits until IBM's PPC 750GX (IBM G3 core + Altivec) is introduced, labels this IBM chip a "G4", and then drops or phases out its use of Motorola parts.
I'm guessing that Apple waits until IBM's PPC 750GX (IBM G3 core + Altivec) is introduced, labels this IBM chip a "G4", and then drops or phases out its use of Motorola parts.
The IBM 750GX is a G3, not a G4, by any measure: There's no vector unit on board. The GX is a better, and pin-compatible, version of the existing 750FX G3.
You're thinking of the 750VX, about which there are many rumors and few concrete facts. The 'V' is for vector capabilities, though. But if the rumors are right, it starts sampling at the end of this year, which means production no earlier than next summer (and probably later).
You're thinking of the 750VX, about which there are many rumors and few concrete facts. The 'V' is for vector capabilities, though. But if the rumors are right, it starts sampling at the end of this year, which means production no earlier than next summer (and probably later).
Yes, that's the one I'm referring to - thanks, Amorph, for correcting me on the name!
To my point, though, do you think Apple can/will abandon Motorola without abandoning the 'G4' moniker? That seems to be the value in Apple's naming strategy...
Example: Motorola calls it Altivec, IBM calls it VMX, but Apple can keep saying 'Velocity Engine' whether they're speaking of a G5 or G4, and whether it's built by IBM or Motorola.
The same flexibility could apply to the (rumored) Power5-derived PPC, the 980. If it wanted, Apple could call this chip a G5 as well.
(And why not? Apple syncs their 'G's with IBM's 'Power's... so G6 = Power6! )
1. MW Expo could have the following announcements:
iTunes Win availiable now, iTMS Euro by end of Sep, Panther demos ('Availible in October'), PB 'casual' update (see 3rd post or so.)
2. Some people talk about bigger HD's. IMHO we don't need bigger as much as we need better. 4200RPM is slow, now they're up to 7200RPM (yes, in notebooks.) They should at least put a 5400RPM HD in they high-end models, after all Mac OS X is a virtural mem and HD pig.
here's my twopence - I assume two main issues are currently preventing G5 powerbooks from showing up
1. heat dissipation and power consumption - apple doesn't tend to do the Dell thing of sticking a desktop CPU into mofo hugh laptops with a battery life of a dead elephant and fan noise of an 8 way SGI workstation - they need to get low power G5s for the PBs - one interesting option they might go for until a G5-M becomes available early next year is do down clock existing G5s to 1.2-1.4 ghz which would potentially make them suitable for PBs.
2. the whole PB architecture needs to be redesigned for the G5 - mobo, bus, memory etc.... this takes ages to get right and my guess is that they haven't finished this job yet.
However two facts kinda make me think that maybe, just maybe G5 PBs are not such a far fetched idea for Paris - well at least in the 17 incher...
this is because:
1. its really big and could easily accommodate the cooling space and larger battery for powering/venting a down-clocked version of the G5.
2. its taken apple a while now to come up with this PB update - so this could mean one of two things - that they were just stuck waiting on Moto to get its act together (been there, done that, seen it all before...) or it could be because they were redesigning the PB architecture to work with the G5...
Lord of the Rings characters (Smeagol/Deagol/etc) = G5-enabling system updates.
wasn't the powerbook 10.2.7 called 'Blackrider'.
I think the LoTR names are bad puns: Smeagol wants the precious (G5) but won't be its master for long. The nine riders were great kings of old (G3 and G4 reference).
My point is that if the G4 was just added to the filename, a G5 powerbook must be on the way.
Again....this is only if my failing memory is correct that the filenames have changed.
I've been noticing this all over actually.
resellers and stuff, used to just say powerbook, or titanium powerbook, or whatever, but lately(I think since the 12, 17" were released) they have been starting to say "powerbook g4" or "g4 powerbook"
resellers and stuff, used to just say powerbook, or titanium powerbook, or whatever, but lately(I think since the 12, 17" were released) they have been starting to say "powerbook g4" or "g4 powerbook"
\
Well, resellers know nothing... so that observation is irrelevant as far as the next chip for a PB is concerned. ( I used to manage a large reseller for 3 years... )
Still...
I have my finger on the order button almost literally. Nine (9) months of growing need for a new laptop has finally reached critical mass. I have to buy no matter the revision. The last 3 months were painful in waiting and i do not think I can handle another quarter without it.... way too much road time + away time for the holidays... (and clients get pissy when work isn't getting done.)
The next powerbook upgrade will either be a G5 or a 7457 G4.
Apple has always recieved Motorolas new chips 3-6 months ahead of Motorolas other customers (they also recieved a custom G4 speed grade, 1.42GHz most recently, for the powermacs). So if Motorola is producing 7457s and the supply agreements are still in effect, the 7457 may be next. Motorola may be unwilling to assist Apple like in the past, given the recent defection to IBM.
My bet is on G5 Powerbooks at Paris. The .09 G5s are expected anytime from now to sometime next year. I will be very suprized if the powerbooks aren't upgraded at Paris. And i agree with the argument that the updated FP imacs were released early to allow the spotlight to shine on some big announcement at Paris. I don't count a 7457 powerbook as a big announcement.
Now a 7457 in an ibook, that would be a big annoucement, and a healthy update. Just drop the 12" powerbook motherboard in the ibook with the 7457. No engineering costs, and a damn fine upgrade; improved bus, improved MHz, AltiVec....
The following upgrade to the ibooks would probably be an upgrade 750 from IBM (not calling it a G3) or a variant of the G5 family. Added the Vector processor, a bus based on the 970 (not the actual 970 bus) and IBM could call this new 750 processor G4, G5...whatever.
I expect a G5 Powerbook and a G4 ibook within 6 months (maybe early as Paris) followed by another substantial update to the ibook and FP imacs next year. The FP imacs will get either a G5 or this much improved 750.
" MacRumors has received further confirmation that Apple will be updating PowerBooks on Tuesday. Details are scarce, but rumors suggest 3 models with a price range from $1999 to $2999. Specific sizes were not specified."
" MacRumors has received further confirmation that Apple will be updating PowerBooks on Tuesday. Details are scarce, but rumors suggest 3 models with a price range from $1999 to $2999. Specific sizes were not specified."
ok, so the $1999-$2999 price range leads me to believe we're going to see G5 powerbooks. or maybe just updated 15" and 17" with 12" following in a couple months as suggested elsewhere. there's no way a 12" G4-based powerbook is going to cost $1999, unless it's a 15", and/or G5.
it wouldn't surprise me at all to see a 12-15-17 G4 line, along with 15-17 G5 line. think about it, a lot of people have complained about the somewhat limited options in apple's lines. having iBooks, G4 powerbooks, and G5 powerbooks could open up a lot of options for appealing to the various types of buyers.
for instance, the 15 and 17" G5 powerbooks could have higher res screens (maybe as an option) while the G4 powerbooks keep the current res.
i've always been a supporter of the consumer / prosumer / professional breakup. in reality, much of the "consumer" design is done with education and/or children in mind. many compromises are made to keep prices as low as possible, and to idiot-proof the machines. truly meant as intro machines. the next step up has (since the return of steve) been "professional". well, there's always that tradeoff between making a machine that really offers what a professional needs, and simply offering something for the average adult that has a little more power than an iBook can offer (due to the cost-cutting needed in the low end stuff).
ok, rambling a bit, i'm tired. but i think you guys should get what i'm saying. in many cases the current professional offerings are really meant to appease the average consumer wanting something more than an iBook. offer three levels across the board, make everyone (except JYD) happy.
Comments
Joswiak made his statement purely because there was massive speculation about PB G5s at MWNY - he was just making sure sales of 'Books kept going.
3 months later, probably more like 4, I think anything is possible although it's more likely we'll be surprised at MWSF.
12 months? No way.
But "soon" is a very big ball park and if they did release a G5, then Joswiak could explain the comment away almost any way he wants. "Soon" offers alot of wiggle room.
Just saying that nothing can be concluded from that remark.
What do you expect him to say? Almost anything that would acknowledge a G5 Powerbook would kill sales ( not that they aren't dead from lack of supply ) and even a no-comment would be interpreted as they will be available next week. "Soon" he can say and be safe either way...
"G4" was invented by Apple as an umbrella moniker, and has been used as such for many incarnations of Motorola PPCs. So while Apple may (will? hopefully will?) abandon Motorola's chip line, I doubt they will abandon the name.
I'm guessing that Apple waits until IBM's PPC 750GX (IBM G3 core + Altivec) is introduced, labels this IBM chip a "G4", and then drops or phases out its use of Motorola parts.
...then I woke up.
It would be nice anyway.
Actually, I don't care, it will just be wonderful being able to work on battery for more than 20 minutes (fried Pismo battery).
Originally posted by machem Those "missing" 1.2 GHZ G5 chips are for powerbooks. The 7457 chips are for iBooks, announced at the same time...
In a perfect world, my friend. In a perfect world.
Sigh...
Originally posted by dglow
I'm guessing that Apple waits until IBM's PPC 750GX (IBM G3 core + Altivec) is introduced, labels this IBM chip a "G4", and then drops or phases out its use of Motorola parts.
The IBM 750GX is a G3, not a G4, by any measure: There's no vector unit on board. The GX is a better, and pin-compatible, version of the existing 750FX G3.
You're thinking of the 750VX, about which there are many rumors and few concrete facts. The 'V' is for vector capabilities, though. But if the rumors are right, it starts sampling at the end of this year, which means production no earlier than next summer (and probably later).
Originally posted by Amorph
You're thinking of the 750VX, about which there are many rumors and few concrete facts. The 'V' is for vector capabilities, though. But if the rumors are right, it starts sampling at the end of this year, which means production no earlier than next summer (and probably later).
Yes, that's the one I'm referring to - thanks, Amorph, for correcting me on the name!
To my point, though, do you think Apple can/will abandon Motorola without abandoning the 'G4' moniker? That seems to be the value in Apple's naming strategy...
Example: Motorola calls it Altivec, IBM calls it VMX, but Apple can keep saying 'Velocity Engine' whether they're speaking of a G5 or G4, and whether it's built by IBM or Motorola.
The same flexibility could apply to the (rumored) Power5-derived PPC, the 980. If it wanted, Apple could call this chip a G5 as well.
(And why not? Apple syncs their 'G's with IBM's 'Power's... so G6 = Power6!
1. MW Expo could have the following announcements:
iTunes Win availiable now, iTMS Euro by end of Sep, Panther demos ('Availible in October'), PB 'casual' update (see 3rd post or so.)
2. Some people talk about bigger HD's. IMHO we don't need bigger as much as we need better. 4200RPM is slow, now they're up to 7200RPM (yes, in notebooks.) They should at least put a 5400RPM HD in they high-end models, after all Mac OS X is a virtural mem and HD pig.
here's my twopence - I assume two main issues are currently preventing G5 powerbooks from showing up
1. heat dissipation and power consumption - apple doesn't tend to do the Dell thing of sticking a desktop CPU into mofo hugh laptops with a battery life of a dead elephant and fan noise of an 8 way SGI workstation - they need to get low power G5s for the PBs - one interesting option they might go for until a G5-M becomes available early next year is do down clock existing G5s to 1.2-1.4 ghz which would potentially make them suitable for PBs.
2. the whole PB architecture needs to be redesigned for the G5 - mobo, bus, memory etc.... this takes ages to get right and my guess is that they haven't finished this job yet.
However two facts kinda make me think that maybe, just maybe G5 PBs are not such a far fetched idea for Paris - well at least in the 17 incher...
this is because:
1. its really big and could easily accommodate the cooling space and larger battery for powering/venting a down-clocked version of the G5.
2. its taken apple a while now to come up with this PB update - so this could mean one of two things - that they were just stuck waiting on Moto to get its act together (been there, done that, seen it all before...) or it could be because they were redesigning the PB architecture to work with the G5...
whatever it is we shall know soon
"powerbook G4 12", "Powerbook G4 15" and Poerbook G4 17"
http://www.apple.com/powerbook/specs.html
I think this is a recent change. Someone in one of these threads posted that the pdfs were blank when they recently downloaded them.
Well, what the hell did they say before? "Magnesium Slip & Slide"? I thought it always said G4 PowerBook. I'm confused.
As for the PDF thing, I just downloaded all three and they're not blank at all. They're current info/specs.
12" powerbook
15" powerbook
17" powerbook
Yes I just looked at them also...current specs.
My point is that if the G4 was just added to the filename, a G5 powerbook must be on the way.
Again....this is only if my failing memory is correct that the filenames have changed.
Originally posted by BIgFella
Lord of the Rings characters (Smeagol/Deagol/etc) = G5-enabling system updates.
wasn't the powerbook 10.2.7 called 'Blackrider'.
I think the LoTR names are bad puns: Smeagol wants the precious (G5) but won't be its master for long. The nine riders were great kings of old (G3 and G4 reference).
Originally posted by tate
I believe they said
12" powerbook
15" powerbook
17" powerbook
Yes I just looked at them also...current specs.
My point is that if the G4 was just added to the filename, a G5 powerbook must be on the way.
Again....this is only if my failing memory is correct that the filenames have changed.
I've been noticing this all over actually.
resellers and stuff, used to just say powerbook, or titanium powerbook, or whatever, but lately(I think since the 12, 17" were released) they have been starting to say "powerbook g4" or "g4 powerbook"
Originally posted by Wrong Robust
I've been noticing this all over actually.
resellers and stuff, used to just say powerbook, or titanium powerbook, or whatever, but lately(I think since the 12, 17" were released) they have been starting to say "powerbook g4" or "g4 powerbook"
Well, resellers know nothing... so that observation is irrelevant as far as the next chip for a PB is concerned. ( I used to manage a large reseller for 3 years... )
Still...
I have my finger on the order button almost literally. Nine (9) months of growing need for a new laptop has finally reached critical mass. I have to buy no matter the revision. The last 3 months were painful in waiting and i do not think I can handle another quarter without it.... way too much road time + away time for the holidays... (and clients get pissy when work isn't getting done.)
T
Apple has always recieved Motorolas new chips 3-6 months ahead of Motorolas other customers (they also recieved a custom G4 speed grade, 1.42GHz most recently, for the powermacs). So if Motorola is producing 7457s and the supply agreements are still in effect, the 7457 may be next. Motorola may be unwilling to assist Apple like in the past, given the recent defection to IBM.
My bet is on G5 Powerbooks at Paris. The .09 G5s are expected anytime from now to sometime next year. I will be very suprized if the powerbooks aren't upgraded at Paris. And i agree with the argument that the updated FP imacs were released early to allow the spotlight to shine on some big announcement at Paris. I don't count a 7457 powerbook as a big announcement.
Now a 7457 in an ibook, that would be a big annoucement, and a healthy update. Just drop the 12" powerbook motherboard in the ibook with the 7457. No engineering costs, and a damn fine upgrade; improved bus, improved MHz, AltiVec....
The following upgrade to the ibooks would probably be an upgrade 750 from IBM (not calling it a G3) or a variant of the G5 family. Added the Vector processor, a bus based on the 970 (not the actual 970 bus) and IBM could call this new 750 processor G4, G5...whatever.
I expect a G5 Powerbook and a G4 ibook within 6 months (maybe early as Paris) followed by another substantial update to the ibook and FP imacs next year. The FP imacs will get either a G5 or this much improved 750.
" MacRumors has received further confirmation that Apple will be updating PowerBooks on Tuesday. Details are scarce, but rumors suggest 3 models with a price range from $1999 to $2999. Specific sizes were not specified."
Originally posted by macmike
MacRumors says Powerbooks are definetly coming:
" MacRumors has received further confirmation that Apple will be updating PowerBooks on Tuesday. Details are scarce, but rumors suggest 3 models with a price range from $1999 to $2999. Specific sizes were not specified."
ok, so the $1999-$2999 price range leads me to believe we're going to see G5 powerbooks. or maybe just updated 15" and 17" with 12" following in a couple months as suggested elsewhere. there's no way a 12" G4-based powerbook is going to cost $1999, unless it's a 15", and/or G5.
it wouldn't surprise me at all to see a 12-15-17 G4 line, along with 15-17 G5 line. think about it, a lot of people have complained about the somewhat limited options in apple's lines. having iBooks, G4 powerbooks, and G5 powerbooks could open up a lot of options for appealing to the various types of buyers.
for instance, the 15 and 17" G5 powerbooks could have higher res screens (maybe as an option) while the G4 powerbooks keep the current res.
i've always been a supporter of the consumer / prosumer / professional breakup. in reality, much of the "consumer" design is done with education and/or children in mind. many compromises are made to keep prices as low as possible, and to idiot-proof the machines. truly meant as intro machines. the next step up has (since the return of steve) been "professional". well, there's always that tradeoff between making a machine that really offers what a professional needs, and simply offering something for the average adult that has a little more power than an iBook can offer (due to the cost-cutting needed in the low end stuff).
ok, rambling a bit, i'm tired. but i think you guys should get what i'm saying. in many cases the current professional offerings are really meant to appease the average consumer wanting something more than an iBook. offer three levels across the board, make everyone (except JYD) happy.