I wouldn't install 10.2.8. Many people have reported the keyboard backlighting isn't working well after updating (and a flurry of other problems). Apple has pulled the update from their website and Software Update. I have had no issues on my G3 Laptop, but if I had my Albook, 10.2.8 wouldn't be allowed near it.
I was going to start a thread about this yesterday! I went to the Apple store in Memphis, and was very disappointed with the staff. They were very nice, but didn't seem to know very many specifics about the products.
that might be true that they are incompetent, but i do believe i was lied to outright as well. some of the things they were "incorrect" about include: the expiration date on various apple discount promos, that i couldnt connect a powerbook to a tv or monitor unless i bought the most expensive model, that a backlit keyboard could not be ordered as an option on the 1Ghz 15" model, shipping dates, etc. basically, they said i had to buy something right there on the spot, and it had to be what they already had in inventory, or else i'd never get any of the advertised promos after 9pm that night (but i knew all the expiration dates for the stuff i wanted). i said i'd go home and order online, and they told me i'd have to wait months to get a PB that way and i'd be sorry. they must have thought i was an uninformed female customer that they could easily manipulate.
Nope, I just turned on the laptop and let it drain. I thought my way was the correct procedure.
It is REALLY hot on the backside, and the wrist area is warmer than when I wrote earlier. Much more so than the Ti which was barely warm to the touch. This would, during the hot summer months, make my hands sweat I think. Perhaps the 10.2.8 would fix this?
Thanks for your posts DHagan4755; nothing like a first hand experience to help the others decide.
Seems like Apple admitted that the lack of L3 may cause concern among members of the video editing community because video encoding to MPEG-2 made use of it. There not the only ones.
Putting in the 7457 with L3 would have made this one irresistible. It seems to me that the only plausible reason for this (pro-user insulting decision making) is that Apple after they concluded the 7457 wouldn't be ready in time, just decided to put in the 7447 and up the L2. There can be no other.
Please do not respond to this post, it's just no use...
I originally orded the 1 GHz model but after some serious second guessing and a little calculating, I realized the price difference between the 1 Ghz and 1.25 GHz w/out superdrive was only about $85. I decided to go for the 1.25 model. Here is what i ordered:
1.25Ghz, everything stock except no superdrive
20g Ipod
Applecare
USB drive
Everything is scheduled to ship by the 30th and I really hope thats true. This is my FIRST MAC and I'm very excited
PS. I just wanted to say I had a bad experience with the sales guys at the Apple Store in Los Angeles. Like Pandoering's experience, they just wanted to sell me what they had in stock instead of helping me decide what I needed. They were pretty rude too.
However, I am still a very happy camper with my order
I unplugged it and got 1:20 remaining charge. of course, I'm copying a DVD, copying some movie files from the other laptop, which is attached via target disk mode, and writing this message. I mean you can do so many things simulateneously in OS X now, so why not, right? The heat is getting slightly concerning. I don't want my new computer to melt! Could it be the desk I'm on. I want to lay down in bed soon, and surf the net. Then hopefully get to sleep. I'm tired, physically and emotionally (exciting times).
"I've run into some issues with the battery, though. I ran it down to 0 to begin with, and then recharged, but upon pulling the plug to check the battery life, it registered little more than an hour of time, and turning down all the settings got it up to about 2:25 - well short of the advertised 4.5 hours. This might have been my fault though as I later read in the instructions, you're supposed to charge all the way, then drain all the way, then recharge. So always RTFM, kiddies."
For anyone who ordered a 1.25GHz, Super Drive, 5400rpm HD, 512MB, how long did it take from your original order date to shipped status ?
Also, I played with the 15" powerbook system at the Apple Store and it never got above warm, even underneath...but I was only playing with some of the applications, not burning a CD/DVD or compressing MP3's...\
"I've run into some issues with the battery, though. I ran it down to 0 to begin with, and then recharged, but upon pulling the plug to check the battery life, it registered little more than an hour of time, and turning down all the settings got it up to about 2:25 - well short of the advertised 4.5 hours. This might have been my fault though as I later read in the instructions, you're supposed to charge all the way, then drain all the way, then recharge. So always RTFM, kiddies."
FYI
On the apple website in the PDF manuals it says to fully charge the battery first, before draining it.
"You should plug in the power adapter in case the battery has been drained during shipping or storage."
For anyone who ordered a 1.25GHz, Super Drive, 5400rpm HD, 512MB, how long did it take from your original order date to shipped status ?
I ordered a 1.25ghz 15", 80gig(5400rpm), 1-512MB stick, SD, on the 16th at 5:00am CST. It shipped on monday the 22nd, but has yet to arrive.
Like many others I have found out that Airborne is crap. Using my tracking number online is useless. I called and they said that it is "in transit and we will know more in 48 hours". I take this to mean that they haven't got a clue where their crap is after it has left, and sometimes they forget that it has left at all. Well it was two day shipping and it has already been one day so hopefully I'll be playing on it in 48 hours and not waiting on Airborne.
UPS never faltered on the other part of my shipment. So many thanks to UPS!
I ordered a 1.25ghz 15", 80gig(5400rpm), 1-512MB stick, SD, on the 16th at 5:00am CST. It shipped on monday the 22nd, but has yet to arrive.
Thanks for the info...please let us know your impressions regarding the 5400rpm...overall system response, battery life and noise...hopefully the extra $125 for the drive will payoff in the short term (of course it will depend upon the apps and memory config too as to what type of benefit the extra rotational speed will provide).
Seems like Apple admitted that the lack of L3 may cause concern among members of the video editing community because video encoding to MPEG-2 made use of it. There not the only ones.
Putting in the 7457 with L3 would have made this one irresistible. It seems to me that the only plausible reason for this (pro-user insulting decision making) is that Apple after they concluded the 7457 wouldn't be ready in time, just decided to put in the 7447 and up the L2. There can be no other.
[/B]
Well I'm going to respond anyway. I have a Bachelor's Degree in Computer Engineering (currently working on a Master's in Computer Science), which makes me somewhat qualified to comment on the differences between various cache levels.
While your speculation that the 7457 was not used because it was not yet available is certainly possible, I rather doubt that the 7457 or the 7447 would be available significantly before the other. There is no major difference between either chip that would cause manufacturing delays.
I speculate that instead Apple decided to forgo L3 cache for the notebook series for two reasons, L3 cache provides little benefit for *most* users, it is mostly used to compensate for slow memory bus speeds. The second reason is cost. Performance per dollar, L3 cache doesn't usually make a lot of sense, except in very specific instances.
Processor designers have been studying the optimum amounts and associativity of cache levels for many years. L3 cache is rarely used in modern systems, because doubling the size of L2 cache provides better performance (in the general case) than adding an L3 cache that is 4 times as large as L2. Since Motorola doubled the size of the L2 cache in the 74*7 models, it makes sense to drop the L3 cache even though the size of the cache *looks* smaller, it will provide equal or likely *better* performance. This is somewhat counter intuitive.
There are specific application types (those with high memory bandwith requirement) that may benefit from the tradeoff between more L2 cache and more L3 cache (obviously more of both would be best, but prohibitively expensive). This is what Apple is acknowledging with their statement. However, it needs to be added that they made the choice that benefits the *most* users, which when designing a general computing system is the right decision.
If you would like any more clarification on any of the points I raised, please feel free to ask
-Spyky
PS I'd like to add that it really isn't entirely up to Apple to increase the L2 cache or not, the L2 cache is on the processor die which is manufactured by Motorola. It is fixed in the design process, and can thus not be added later. L3 Cache is off-chip (on the motherboard or processor card or whatever) and can be changed in size by modifying the board.
Also, in the case of a notebook, it does make sense to not even have an L3 cache controller if not using L3 cache. In most designs, the L3 cache controller occupies a portion of the die, and the SRAM is off-chip. So if not making use of an L3 cache, it is preferable to not even have the controller (reducing the size of the die = smaller, less-heat and cheaper). Hence, Motorola is manufacturing both the 7447 and the 7457.
There was also an additional rumor (at the time when the 12-inch was released and people were complaining about the heat from them) that the L3 cache was removed because it made the notebook run even hotter. True or not? It's probably, more of, like you said, cost.
Thanks for your take on the L3 Spyky. I don't know enough to agree or not, but some of the specs I saw months ago confirm that L3 is useful for only certain circumstances and most of them would be taken care of in the desktop environment of the G5. Of course not the deskstop is so far ahead of the laptop, that in some respects even the newest Pbooks aren't really G5 replacements. They are G4 replacements. That's okay since to me the G5 is really a prosumer workstation anyway and the iMac is the desktop that most non-gamers, non-pros need.
I just bought a *new-ish* PowerBook yesterday. It was the OLD Titanium PowerBook 1 GHz/512 MB/60 GB/SuperDrive etc... model from the UK Refurb Store. It cost me £300 less than the current low-end PowerBook, and to me seemed like an amazing deal.
This is the third Apple that I have bought (although the fifth that I have owned). The first was a Pismo, and I loved that machine to death. The second a 600 MHz iBook, and unfortunately I had to sell it to pay off some postgraduate student debt. Finally, a year after finishing my degrees, I have ordered my third Apple laptop.
I know that the graphics card on the Titanium is only a Radeon 9000 compared to the amazing 9600 on the new machines, but I have a PC at home that I use for computer gaming, so I am not too worried about that aspect. In every other respect I think the machine I got is a much better deal than the new AlBook (taking my budget into account). It is almost identical speed in all except games, has a wireless card, more RAM, same HD, same excellent screen, and a SuperDrive.
Oh boy, am I excited. I have been Mac-less for three months (I gifted my old iMac 350 to my mother to get her online), and it has been very painful
i want one, i want one bad.....fingers itching, hovering over the mouse button....the machine configured..15", it is...ready to click the buy button..wait..let's check the wallet first..EMPTY!!!! .. dejected..rejected.. clicks on cancel button instead..
Desparately looking around the house, trying to find some money, drawers pulled open, cloths strewn all over the place, couches overturned. Finally..yes, yes, enough spare change to get one.. placed order for a 15" with 512 mb single DIMM..should be here over the weekend..had to live with the slower drive..
Well my stock 1.25 15" shipped on the 17th Sep, arrived in Luxembourg on 18th and............ nothing. The tracking just said it was in Lux. A few people ordering to the UK have said that their tracking just stopped there and it wrrived a few days later so I assumed this was the case. I spoke to Apple on Tuesday (23rd) and was told that both items (I ordered a case as well) would definitely arrive together and should be with me in a few days. Coming home yesterday I found that, not only had my case been delivered seperately, it wasn't even couriered. In fact, the post lady left it in my bin
So I phone Apple to find out where the book is and it is actually still in Luxembourg (apprantly) "seems to have been a bit of a delay" he said
Thius is the first time I've ordered from the Apple Store online and I'm really REALLY not impressed. He's put on the system that I'm going away and given me a reference number to chase it up but it's now been sat in Luxembourg doing nothing for a full 7 days!
Ok, so I speak to them again this morning and finally speak to someone who seems to know what they're talking about. Apparantly the reason the powerbook has been sat in Luxembourg is because they were waiting for the case to arrive so they could stick the two together and send it out. As the case has now found it's way to me seemingly of it's own accord, they can now send out the powerbook and it should be here with me tomorrow.
I'd be excited but I'm finding it difficult to believe it'll be that easy. Here's hoping anyway..... I've only been waiting for about 9 months so I don't suppose it realy matters.
Comments
Originally posted by machem
I wouldn't install 10.2.8.
Phew, I was just going to, too! I then read the headline on MacNN. I will hold off.
Originally posted by Beakee
I was going to start a thread about this yesterday! I went to the Apple store in Memphis, and was very disappointed with the staff. They were very nice, but didn't seem to know very many specifics about the products.
that might be true that they are incompetent, but i do believe i was lied to outright as well. some of the things they were "incorrect" about include: the expiration date on various apple discount promos, that i couldnt connect a powerbook to a tv or monitor unless i bought the most expensive model, that a backlit keyboard could not be ordered as an option on the 1Ghz 15" model, shipping dates, etc. basically, they said i had to buy something right there on the spot, and it had to be what they already had in inventory, or else i'd never get any of the advertised promos after 9pm that night (but i knew all the expiration dates for the stuff i wanted). i said i'd go home and order online, and they told me i'd have to wait months to get a PB that way and i'd be sorry. they must have thought i was an uninformed female customer that they could easily manipulate.
Originally posted by DHagan4755
Nope, I just turned on the laptop and let it drain. I thought my way was the correct procedure.
It is REALLY hot on the backside, and the wrist area is warmer than when I wrote earlier. Much more so than the Ti which was barely warm to the touch. This would, during the hot summer months, make my hands sweat I think. Perhaps the 10.2.8 would fix this?
Thanks for your posts DHagan4755; nothing like a first hand experience to help the others decide.
Seems like Apple admitted that the lack of L3 may cause concern among members of the video editing community because video encoding to MPEG-2 made use of it. There not the only ones.
Thinksecret
Putting in the 7457 with L3 would have made this one irresistible. It seems to me that the only plausible reason for this
Please do not respond to this post, it's just no use...
1.25Ghz, everything stock except no superdrive
20g Ipod
Applecare
USB drive
Everything is scheduled to ship by the 30th and I really hope thats true. This is my FIRST MAC and I'm very excited
PS. I just wanted to say I had a bad experience with the sales guys at the Apple Store in Los Angeles. Like Pandoering's experience, they just wanted to sell me what they had in stock instead of helping me decide what I needed. They were pretty rude too.
However, I am still a very happy camper with my order
I found what the article that I mention earlier:
http://www.powerpage.org/cgi-bin/Web...y?newsID=11420
"I've run into some issues with the battery, though. I ran it down to 0 to begin with, and then recharged, but upon pulling the plug to check the battery life, it registered little more than an hour of time, and turning down all the settings got it up to about 2:25 - well short of the advertised 4.5 hours. This might have been my fault though as I later read in the instructions, you're supposed to charge all the way, then drain all the way, then recharge. So always RTFM, kiddies."
FYI
Also, I played with the 15" powerbook system at the Apple Store and it never got above warm, even underneath...but I was only playing with some of the applications, not burning a CD/DVD or compressing MP3's...
Originally posted by Carson O'Genic
Dave,
I found what the article that I mention earlier:
http://www.powerpage.org/cgi-bin/Web...y?newsID=11420
"I've run into some issues with the battery, though. I ran it down to 0 to begin with, and then recharged, but upon pulling the plug to check the battery life, it registered little more than an hour of time, and turning down all the settings got it up to about 2:25 - well short of the advertised 4.5 hours. This might have been my fault though as I later read in the instructions, you're supposed to charge all the way, then drain all the way, then recharge. So always RTFM, kiddies."
FYI
On the apple website in the PDF manuals it says to fully charge the battery first, before draining it.
"You should plug in the power adapter in case the battery has been drained during shipping or storage."
see pages 8-9
http://manuals.info.apple.com/Apple_...Book17inch.PDF
Originally posted by Infoseeker
For anyone who ordered a 1.25GHz, Super Drive, 5400rpm HD, 512MB, how long did it take from your original order date to shipped status
I ordered a 1.25ghz 15", 80gig(5400rpm), 1-512MB stick, SD, on the 16th at 5:00am CST. It shipped on monday the 22nd, but has yet to arrive.
Like many others I have found out that Airborne is crap. Using my tracking number online is useless. I called and they said that it is "in transit and we will know more in 48 hours". I take this to mean that they haven't got a clue where their crap is after it has left, and sometimes they forget that it has left at all. Well it was two day shipping and it has already been one day so hopefully I'll be playing on it in 48 hours and not waiting on Airborne.
UPS never faltered on the other part of my shipment. So many thanks to UPS!
Originally posted by sergem
I ordered a 1.25ghz 15", 80gig(5400rpm), 1-512MB stick, SD, on the 16th at 5:00am CST. It shipped on monday the 22nd, but has yet to arrive.
Thanks for the info...please let us know your impressions regarding the 5400rpm...overall system response, battery life and noise...hopefully the extra $125 for the drive will payoff in the short term
Tim
Originally posted by Pandoering
Seems like Apple admitted that the lack of L3 may cause concern among members of the video editing community because video encoding to MPEG-2 made use of it. There not the only ones.
Thinksecret
Putting in the 7457 with L3 would have made this one irresistible. It seems to me that the only plausible reason for this
[/B]
Well I'm going to respond anyway. I have a Bachelor's Degree in Computer Engineering (currently working on a Master's in Computer Science), which makes me somewhat qualified to comment on the differences between various cache levels.
While your speculation that the 7457 was not used because it was not yet available is certainly possible, I rather doubt that the 7457 or the 7447 would be available significantly before the other. There is no major difference between either chip that would cause manufacturing delays.
I speculate that instead Apple decided to forgo L3 cache for the notebook series for two reasons, L3 cache provides little benefit for *most* users, it is mostly used to compensate for slow memory bus speeds. The second reason is cost. Performance per dollar, L3 cache doesn't usually make a lot of sense, except in very specific instances.
Processor designers have been studying the optimum amounts and associativity of cache levels for many years. L3 cache is rarely used in modern systems, because doubling the size of L2 cache provides better performance (in the general case) than adding an L3 cache that is 4 times as large as L2. Since Motorola doubled the size of the L2 cache in the 74*7 models, it makes sense to drop the L3 cache even though the size of the cache *looks* smaller, it will provide equal or likely *better* performance. This is somewhat counter intuitive.
There are specific application types (those with high memory bandwith requirement) that may benefit from the tradeoff between more L2 cache and more L3 cache (obviously more of both would be best, but prohibitively expensive). This is what Apple is acknowledging with their statement. However, it needs to be added that they made the choice that benefits the *most* users, which when designing a general computing system is the right decision.
If you would like any more clarification on any of the points I raised, please feel free to ask
-Spyky
PS I'd like to add that it really isn't entirely up to Apple to increase the L2 cache or not, the L2 cache is on the processor die which is manufactured by Motorola. It is fixed in the design process, and can thus not be added later. L3 Cache is off-chip (on the motherboard or processor card or whatever) and can be changed in size by modifying the board.
Also, in the case of a notebook, it does make sense to not even have an L3 cache controller if not using L3 cache. In most designs, the L3 cache controller occupies a portion of the die, and the SRAM is off-chip. So if not making use of an L3 cache, it is preferable to not even have the controller (reducing the size of the die = smaller, less-heat and cheaper). Hence, Motorola is manufacturing both the 7447 and the 7457.
This is the third Apple that I have bought (although the fifth that I have owned). The first was a Pismo, and I loved that machine to death. The second a 600 MHz iBook, and unfortunately I had to sell it to pay off some postgraduate student debt. Finally, a year after finishing my degrees, I have ordered my third Apple laptop.
I know that the graphics card on the Titanium is only a Radeon 9000 compared to the amazing 9600 on the new machines, but I have a PC at home that I use for computer gaming, so I am not too worried about that aspect. In every other respect I think the machine I got is a much better deal than the new AlBook (taking my budget into account). It is almost identical speed in all except games, has a wireless card, more RAM, same HD, same excellent screen, and a SuperDrive.
Oh boy, am I excited. I have been Mac-less for three months (I gifted my old iMac 350 to my mother to get her online), and it has been very painful
Hewligan
Originally posted by Jamil
i want one, i want one bad.....fingers itching, hovering over the mouse button....the machine configured..15", it is...ready to click the buy button..wait..let's check the wallet first..EMPTY!!!!
Desparately looking around the house, trying to find some money, drawers pulled open, cloths strewn all over the place, couches overturned. Finally..yes, yes, enough spare change to get one..
Airport networking next.
So I phone Apple to find out where the book is and it is actually still in Luxembourg (apprantly) "seems to have been a bit of a delay" he said
Thius is the first time I've ordered from the Apple Store online and I'm really REALLY not impressed. He's put on the system that I'm going away and given me a reference number to chase it up but it's now been sat in Luxembourg doing nothing for a full 7 days!
I'd be excited but I'm finding it difficult to believe it'll be that easy. Here's hoping anyway..... I've only been waiting for about 9 months so I don't suppose it realy matters.
/me patiently waits for a friend to get back to him