Can you buy 100% juice no preservatives added apple juice from stores?
What sort of stores? Home brewing speciality stores that I have been in don't seem to have this - they concentrate on wine and beer. I have seen apple concentrate in these stores, but I have never tried that. Some of the local grocery stores around here do sell this (separte from their regular apple juice), but it is relatively high in price for a small container ($2.99-$3.99 CDN for 4 litres). If you can get it, your best and cheapest source would be directly from a farm or a farmers' market. I don't have a lot of experience with purchasing juice, however, as I have been lucky enough to make my own juice from apples and a cider press on my father-in-law's farm. I bring it back to the city for fermentation, however (which led, on one occaision, to five gallons of sticky apple juice on the floor of our car after a container broke).
I still gotta find the time to post my full 'Chinney' recipe.
Would Motts 100% juice no preservative wouldn't work?
I guess if that doesn't work I can look around, I mean I do live in amish country with a large...I guess somewhat popular farmers market (The Green Dragon)
Would Motts 100% juice no preservative wouldn't work?
I guess if that doesn't work I can look around, I mean I do live in amish country with a large...I guess somewhat popular farmers market (The Green Dragon)
You could try the Motts...
Incidentally, I know someone who tried with the clarifed, processed juice, and had terrible results.
One of the reasons I am so interested in trying to make it is because 5 minutes from my house there's a huge apple farm with a store there and they have the best cider ever. The kid who told us the original recipe (the really bad one) used powdered apple cider mix, so I guess Motts would be better than that.
Good god, he may as well have tried to make it out of Kool-Aid.
By any chance, does this person (and I use that term loosely) have a congenital cerebral deformity or seven?
POWDERED???
*sigh*
Avoid *any* clear apple juice. You don't want juice, you want cider. Cider is unfiltered (cloudy). Clear simply won't give you good results at all.
If you have an apple orchard (farm? hee) 5 minutes from your house, ask them if you can pick the leftovers. They may be required by law to pasteurize the cider before selling it, which is doable, but unfortunate. Unpasteurized raw unfiltered cider is best if you can't get post-picking apples.
man, you guys are getting me interested in making cider. i picked up about 4 5gallon glass jugs. perfect for making beer/cider. people at work were throwing them out.
Hehe sorry, I call it an apple farm instead of an orchard because the name of the store is The Apple Farm. Their cider is not pasteurized, that's why we chose their cider, it has that pure appley taste, they have warnings on the cider to not drink it if you're sick because it's not pasteurized... I never knew why but at least I know it's not pasteurized.
Ok...two years later I finally ordered my supplies to make cider
Just a couple questions for some more knowledgeable people.
I've been doing some reading, but I am mostly sticking to the text from the 2nd post in this thread. So bear with me here for a couple questions.
Will 100% cider that doesn't have preservatives, but was pasteurized work? (I am adding yeast to it.
It says to syphon the cider after fermenting (bubbling stops) into another container, THEN into bottles. Why is that, why can't I just go directly into bottles from my main carboy.
That said, to carbonate, it says add corn sugar to it once it's in the second container, and then bottle. Do I let that sit for a while, or do I just mix it in and then bottle it, and the C02 is produced in the bottles then?
If I don't carbonate, can I go right to the fridge from bottling?
Edit: No idea why this thread ever was, or still is in GD, but uh, oh well.
As long as it's REAL cider (the brownish cloudy liquid) and not just apple juice labeled as cider you'll be fine. Pasteurized is ok too (in fact I think in some areas it's required by law to pasteurize it after a problem with e.coli contamination ).
It is advised to syphon the cider into another container before bottling simply to help reduce the amount of sludge that can get into the bottles. After fermentation there can be quite a lot of sediment that just isn't very tasty in the original fermentation container.
As for adding the corn sugar for fermentation here is what I'd suggest:
1. Prepare another container to syphon your cider into (but do not sypon the cider into it yet).
2. Get a small saucepan and heat up the required amount of corn sugar (I think 1/4 cup) with a cup of water until it's all dissolved.
3. Pour the saucepan into the fresh container.
4. Now, syphon your cider into the container with the sugar water.
5. Syphon your cider from the fresh bucket into bottles and cap.
6. I'm not exactly certain how long the cider should condition once bottled but I recall that my beers were drinkable within 2 weeks but tasted much better if allowed to sit for a month or so (sometimes several months depending on the recipe).
PS - I can't stress enough how important cleanliness is during this entire process. You can get runaway fermentaion that *can* make bottles explode. I have had this happen and the mess is scary (amusing too but just scary to clean).
Quote:
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Ok...two years later I finally ordered my supplies to make cider
Just a couple questions for some more knowledgeable people.
I've been doing some reading, but I am mostly sticking to the text from the 2nd post in this thread. So bear with me here for a couple questions.
Will 100% cider that doesn't have preservatives, but was pasteurized work? (I am adding yeast to it.
It says to syphon the cider after fermenting (bubbling stops) into another container, THEN into bottles. Why is that, why can't I just go directly into bottles from my main carboy.
That said, to carbonate, it says add corn sugar to it once it's in the second container, and then bottle. Do I let that sit for a while, or do I just mix it in and then bottle it, and the C02 is produced in the bottles then?
If I don't carbonate, can I go right to the fridge from bottling?
Edit: No idea why this thread ever was, or still is in GD, but uh, oh well.
Will 100% cider that doesn't have preservatives, but was pasteurized work? (I am adding yeast to it.
Certainly, you will have no problems using a pasteurized product. When starting from fresh juice when you'll be adding your own yeast it is common to kill off the wild yeast first with metabisulfate. The pasteurization process simply does this for you with heat rather than chemicals.
Quote:
Originally posted by ast3r3x
It says to syphon the cider after fermenting (bubbling stops) into another container, THEN into bottles. Why is that, why can't I just go directly into bottles from my main carboy.
You can but there are a number of reasons why it's usually not done. First, the process of racking (siphoning) often will reinvigorate a fermentation that has slowed to the point you may not notice bubbling. If fermentation renews you will want to wait before bottling. Second, racking aides in clarification of the cider. It gets the cider off the lees (sediment) and the agitation encourages fine particles in suspension to clump and drop. Third, if you did want to carbonate you'll have to mix the sugar you're adding. If you did this in the fermenter with the lees you would no longer have clear cider as the sediment would be kicked back up.
Quote:
Originally posted by ast3r3x
That said, to carbonate, it says add corn sugar to it once it's in the second container, and then bottle. Do I let that sit for a while, or do I just mix it in and then bottle it, and the C02 is produced in the bottles then?
If I don't carbonate, can I go right to the fridge from bottling?
Once the sugar solution is mixed through you can then bottle. No need to wait. After bottling place the bottles aside in a warm location. Residual yeast in solution will eat the sugar and CO2 will be produced in the bottles.
Yes, if you don't carbonate you can refrigerate right after bottling.
A note on mixing, racking, and bottling. You don't want to do these vigorously. By that I mean you don't want the froth or splash. You want to be gentle. Frothing and splashing puts oxygen into solution. Oxygen will oxidize compounds in the cider and produce off flavors. You'll also want to fill bottles you want to carbonate within an inch of the top to reduce the air space above the liquid. Bottles you don't intend to carbonate should be filled within an inch or higher of the top.
You can but there are a number of reasons why it's usually not done. First, the process of racking (siphoning) often will reinvigorate a fermentation that has slowed to the point you may not notice bubbling. If fermentation renews you will want to wait before bottling. Second, racking aides in clarification of the cider. It gets the cider off the lees (sediment) and the agitation encourages fine particles in suspension to clump and drop.
How will I know if the fermentation has started back up again after transferring to my second container? Also how long should I let it sit in there and let the sediment settle before I start using that to bottle?
Are there any precautions I could take so that my bottles don't explode? I have to say this is somewhat of a concern considering it would be a hell of a clean up in my basement.
Hauntedmaster: Thanks for replying, I hadn't even put together that you were participating in this thread until you replied to my post. I have to say I was pleasantly surprised to see that the web page that I am getting the basis for my process off of is talking to me
I guess there is no reason not to, so here's my plan...
Sanitize my 6.5 gallon carboy and put the cider in it. Should I be adding sugar, and if so how much? The more sugar I put in the more alcoholic it is? Does this greatly effect the amount of time it takes to ferment? Prep (if I have to) and add the yeast to the mix.
Seal the top and put on my air lock and wait for it to stop fermenting (bubbling). Then syphon it into my 6.5 gallon bucket that has a bottling spigot and?I'll probably bottle half then and try and make the rest carbonated. I think I only have (24) 16oz. bottles, so I'll have to either order more (not a problem) or...is it possible to put them in 2litre bottles, or will that ruin it? That might be more convenient for an overnight drunk
So...that's the plan, hope I didn't leave anything out or forget to say anything I am planning. Oh, by the way, I'm using White Labs Sweet Mead because I want a sweeter tasting cider. I also bought yeast nutrient to hopefully help along the process.
How will I know if the fermentation has started back up again after transferring to my second container? Also how long should I let it sit in there and let the sediment settle before I start using that to bottle?
You'll know by renewed bubbling in the airlock usually within hours of the transfer. I usually wait a week in secondary before bottling.
Quote:
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Are there any precautions I could take so that my bottles don't explode? I have to say this is somewhat of a concern considering it would be a hell of a clean up in my basement.
Don't bottle before the fermentation is over and don't over-prime. Those are the two main reasons for bottle bombs. Also, you want to make sure everything the cider comes into contact with is clean and sanitized. Bacterial infections, while they don't produce bottle bombs, do create gushers (over carbonation that shoots out when you open the bottle) and off flavors.
Quote:
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Sanitize my 6.5 gallon carboy and put the cider in it. Should I be adding sugar, and if so how much? The more sugar I put in the more alcoholic it is? Does this greatly effect the amount of time it takes to ferment? Prep (if I have to) and add the yeast to the mix.
Seal the top and put on my air lock and wait for it to stop fermenting (bubbling). Then syphon it into my 6.5 gallon bucket that has a bottling spigot and?I'll probably bottle half then and try and make the rest carbonated. I think I only have (24) 16oz. bottles, so I'll have to either order more (not a problem) or...is it possible to put them in 2litre bottles, or will that ruin it? That might be more convenient for an overnight drunk
So...that's the plan, hope I didn't leave anything out or forget to say anything I am planning. Oh, by the way, I'm using White Labs Sweet Mead because I want a sweeter tasting cider. I also bought yeast nutrient to hopefully help along the process.
Sounds good. I personally don't usually add sugar to my ciders. Adding sugar will increase the alcohol content but for me a high alcohol content isn't what I'm after. Different sugars can add different flavors and color. For example adding brown sugar, depending on the quantity added, will produce a more orangey-brown color and a slightly rustic flavor. A rule of thumb is 1 lb of sugar will raise the alcohol content of 5 gallons of cider by ~1%.
Size of bottle isn't important. The permeability of the material it's made of and the ability to seal it are. Regular, non-twist-off beer bottles are used because glass is impermeable to oxygen and you can seal them with new caps. Grolsch-style swing top bottles are also good and come in larger sizes up to 1 liter. 2 liter plastic soda bottles can be used for short term storage. They are semi-permeable to oxygen and should be stored in the fridge if you're going to use them.
You mentioned ordering bottles. Unless you're ordering special bottles it's more cost effective to just throw a party and wash and sanitize the empties.
Final note, if you do split the batch remember to split the priming sugar as well. If only half are to be carbonated only use half the priming sugar.
I ended up not adding sugar because I wanted to have it without to so I'd know what it tastes like without strengthening it at all. Maybe I won't want to.
I'm excited that I got it going now I just have to wait forever How long would you say it takes to ferment? I've seen lots of different estimates, from 1?8 weeks. I'm sure it depends on temperature and some other factors, but do you have an estimate?
In a fermentation where you're adding yeast, primary fermentation is usually over within 10 days. In a particularly vigorous fermentation, warm weather, etc. it could be over in as little as three days.
Comments
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Can you buy 100% juice no preservatives added apple juice from stores?
What sort of stores? Home brewing speciality stores that I have been in don't seem to have this - they concentrate on wine and beer. I have seen apple concentrate in these stores, but I have never tried that. Some of the local grocery stores around here do sell this (separte from their regular apple juice), but it is relatively high in price for a small container ($2.99-$3.99 CDN for 4 litres). If you can get it, your best and cheapest source would be directly from a farm or a farmers' market. I don't have a lot of experience with purchasing juice, however, as I have been lucky enough to make my own juice from apples and a cider press on my father-in-law's farm. I bring it back to the city for fermentation, however (which led, on one occaision, to five gallons of sticky apple juice on the floor of our car after a container broke).
I still gotta find the time to post my full 'Chinney' recipe.
I guess if that doesn't work I can look around, I mean I do live in amish country with a large...I guess somewhat popular farmers market (The Green Dragon)
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Would Motts 100% juice no preservative wouldn't work?
I guess if that doesn't work I can look around, I mean I do live in amish country with a large...I guess somewhat popular farmers market (The Green Dragon)
You could try the Motts...
Incidentally, I know someone who tried with the clarifed, processed juice, and had terrible results.
Good god, he may as well have tried to make it out of Kool-Aid.
By any chance, does this person (and I use that term loosely) have a congenital cerebral deformity or seven?
POWDERED???
*sigh*
Avoid *any* clear apple juice. You don't want juice, you want cider. Cider is unfiltered (cloudy). Clear simply won't give you good results at all.
If you have an apple orchard (farm? hee) 5 minutes from your house, ask them if you can pick the leftovers. They may be required by law to pasteurize the cider before selling it, which is doable, but unfortunate. Unpasteurized raw unfiltered cider is best if you can't get post-picking apples.
Originally posted by iBrowse
I have a general idea of what has to be done because my parents used to make wine a long time ago,
Your parents made wine? Ah, now I know why your parents and my parents used to always hang out...
Originally posted by Matt Danger
Your parents made wine? Ah, now I know why your parents and my parents used to always hang out...
Yeah, I guess you weren't around back when I was in my stealing a bottle for on the school bus phase...
Originally posted by iBrowse
Yeah, I guess you weren't around back when I was in my stealing a bottle for on the school bus phase...
Nope, wasn't around for that.
But I do remember you telling me about it after my sneaking alcohol in water bottles on the high school field trip. incident.
Actually, I think it was middle school,
memories.
Just a couple questions for some more knowledgeable people.
I've been doing some reading, but I am mostly sticking to the text from the 2nd post in this thread. So bear with me here for a couple questions.
Will 100% cider that doesn't have preservatives, but was pasteurized work? (I am adding yeast to it.
It says to syphon the cider after fermenting (bubbling stops) into another container, THEN into bottles. Why is that, why can't I just go directly into bottles from my main carboy.
That said, to carbonate, it says add corn sugar to it once it's in the second container, and then bottle. Do I let that sit for a while, or do I just mix it in and then bottle it, and the C02 is produced in the bottles then?
If I don't carbonate, can I go right to the fridge from bottling?
Edit: No idea why this thread ever was, or still is in GD, but uh, oh well.
Originally posted by Aquafire
Alcoholic Cider ( Scrumpy ) is so cheap to make....
Hours of fun.....
Scrumpy. . . . Best (or, perhaps worst) when found in plastic jugs in Western England.
As long as it's REAL cider (the brownish cloudy liquid) and not just apple juice labeled as cider you'll be fine. Pasteurized is ok too (in fact I think in some areas it's required by law to pasteurize it after a problem with e.coli contamination
It is advised to syphon the cider into another container before bottling simply to help reduce the amount of sludge that can get into the bottles. After fermentation there can be quite a lot of sediment that just isn't very tasty in the original fermentation container.
As for adding the corn sugar for fermentation here is what I'd suggest:
1. Prepare another container to syphon your cider into (but do not sypon the cider into it yet).
2. Get a small saucepan and heat up the required amount of corn sugar (I think 1/4 cup) with a cup of water until it's all dissolved.
3. Pour the saucepan into the fresh container.
4. Now, syphon your cider into the container with the sugar water.
5. Syphon your cider from the fresh bucket into bottles and cap.
6. I'm not exactly certain how long the cider should condition once bottled but I recall that my beers were drinkable within 2 weeks but tasted much better if allowed to sit for a month or so (sometimes several months depending on the recipe).
PS - I can't stress enough how important cleanliness is during this entire process. You can get runaway fermentaion that *can* make bottles explode. I have had this happen and the mess is scary (amusing too but just scary to clean).
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Ok...two years later I finally ordered my supplies to make cider
Just a couple questions for some more knowledgeable people.
I've been doing some reading, but I am mostly sticking to the text from the 2nd post in this thread. So bear with me here for a couple questions.
Will 100% cider that doesn't have preservatives, but was pasteurized work? (I am adding yeast to it.
It says to syphon the cider after fermenting (bubbling stops) into another container, THEN into bottles. Why is that, why can't I just go directly into bottles from my main carboy.
That said, to carbonate, it says add corn sugar to it once it's in the second container, and then bottle. Do I let that sit for a while, or do I just mix it in and then bottle it, and the C02 is produced in the bottles then?
If I don't carbonate, can I go right to the fridge from bottling?
Edit: No idea why this thread ever was, or still is in GD, but uh, oh well.
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Will 100% cider that doesn't have preservatives, but was pasteurized work? (I am adding yeast to it.
Certainly, you will have no problems using a pasteurized product. When starting from fresh juice when you'll be adding your own yeast it is common to kill off the wild yeast first with metabisulfate. The pasteurization process simply does this for you with heat rather than chemicals.
Originally posted by ast3r3x
It says to syphon the cider after fermenting (bubbling stops) into another container, THEN into bottles. Why is that, why can't I just go directly into bottles from my main carboy.
You can but there are a number of reasons why it's usually not done. First, the process of racking (siphoning) often will reinvigorate a fermentation that has slowed to the point you may not notice bubbling. If fermentation renews you will want to wait before bottling. Second, racking aides in clarification of the cider. It gets the cider off the lees (sediment) and the agitation encourages fine particles in suspension to clump and drop. Third, if you did want to carbonate you'll have to mix the sugar you're adding. If you did this in the fermenter with the lees you would no longer have clear cider as the sediment would be kicked back up.
Originally posted by ast3r3x
That said, to carbonate, it says add corn sugar to it once it's in the second container, and then bottle. Do I let that sit for a while, or do I just mix it in and then bottle it, and the C02 is produced in the bottles then?
If I don't carbonate, can I go right to the fridge from bottling?
Once the sugar solution is mixed through you can then bottle. No need to wait. After bottling place the bottles aside in a warm location. Residual yeast in solution will eat the sugar and CO2 will be produced in the bottles.
Yes, if you don't carbonate you can refrigerate right after bottling.
A note on mixing, racking, and bottling. You don't want to do these vigorously. By that I mean you don't want the froth or splash. You want to be gentle. Frothing and splashing puts oxygen into solution. Oxygen will oxidize compounds in the cider and produce off flavors. You'll also want to fill bottles you want to carbonate within an inch of the top to reduce the air space above the liquid. Bottles you don't intend to carbonate should be filled within an inch or higher of the top.
Originally posted by Bancho
Thanks for the reply
Originally posted by Hauntmaster
You can but there are a number of reasons why it's usually not done. First, the process of racking (siphoning) often will reinvigorate a fermentation that has slowed to the point you may not notice bubbling. If fermentation renews you will want to wait before bottling. Second, racking aides in clarification of the cider. It gets the cider off the lees (sediment) and the agitation encourages fine particles in suspension to clump and drop.
How will I know if the fermentation has started back up again after transferring to my second container? Also how long should I let it sit in there and let the sediment settle before I start using that to bottle?
Are there any precautions I could take so that my bottles don't explode? I have to say this is somewhat of a concern considering it would be a hell of a clean up in my basement.
Hauntedmaster: Thanks for replying, I hadn't even put together that you were participating in this thread until you replied to my post. I have to say I was pleasantly surprised to see that the web page that I am getting the basis for my process off of is talking to me
I guess there is no reason not to, so here's my plan...
Sanitize my 6.5 gallon carboy and put the cider in it. Should I be adding sugar, and if so how much? The more sugar I put in the more alcoholic it is? Does this greatly effect the amount of time it takes to ferment? Prep (if I have to) and add the yeast to the mix.
Seal the top and put on my air lock and wait for it to stop fermenting (bubbling). Then syphon it into my 6.5 gallon bucket that has a bottling spigot and?I'll probably bottle half then and try and make the rest carbonated. I think I only have (24) 16oz. bottles, so I'll have to either order more (not a problem) or...is it possible to put them in 2litre bottles, or will that ruin it? That might be more convenient for an overnight drunk
So...that's the plan, hope I didn't leave anything out or forget to say anything I am planning. Oh, by the way, I'm using White Labs Sweet Mead because I want a sweeter tasting cider. I also bought yeast nutrient to hopefully help along the process.
Originally posted by ast3r3x
How will I know if the fermentation has started back up again after transferring to my second container? Also how long should I let it sit in there and let the sediment settle before I start using that to bottle?
You'll know by renewed bubbling in the airlock usually within hours of the transfer. I usually wait a week in secondary before bottling.
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Are there any precautions I could take so that my bottles don't explode? I have to say this is somewhat of a concern considering it would be a hell of a clean up in my basement.
Don't bottle before the fermentation is over and don't over-prime. Those are the two main reasons for bottle bombs. Also, you want to make sure everything the cider comes into contact with is clean and sanitized. Bacterial infections, while they don't produce bottle bombs, do create gushers (over carbonation that shoots out when you open the bottle) and off flavors.
Originally posted by ast3r3x
Sanitize my 6.5 gallon carboy and put the cider in it. Should I be adding sugar, and if so how much? The more sugar I put in the more alcoholic it is? Does this greatly effect the amount of time it takes to ferment? Prep (if I have to) and add the yeast to the mix.
Seal the top and put on my air lock and wait for it to stop fermenting (bubbling). Then syphon it into my 6.5 gallon bucket that has a bottling spigot and?I'll probably bottle half then and try and make the rest carbonated. I think I only have (24) 16oz. bottles, so I'll have to either order more (not a problem) or...is it possible to put them in 2litre bottles, or will that ruin it? That might be more convenient for an overnight drunk
So...that's the plan, hope I didn't leave anything out or forget to say anything I am planning. Oh, by the way, I'm using White Labs Sweet Mead because I want a sweeter tasting cider. I also bought yeast nutrient to hopefully help along the process.
Sounds good. I personally don't usually add sugar to my ciders. Adding sugar will increase the alcohol content but for me a high alcohol content isn't what I'm after. Different sugars can add different flavors and color. For example adding brown sugar, depending on the quantity added, will produce a more orangey-brown color and a slightly rustic flavor. A rule of thumb is 1 lb of sugar will raise the alcohol content of 5 gallons of cider by ~1%.
Size of bottle isn't important. The permeability of the material it's made of and the ability to seal it are. Regular, non-twist-off beer bottles are used because glass is impermeable to oxygen and you can seal them with new caps. Grolsch-style swing top bottles are also good and come in larger sizes up to 1 liter. 2 liter plastic soda bottles can be used for short term storage. They are semi-permeable to oxygen and should be stored in the fridge if you're going to use them.
You mentioned ordering bottles. Unless you're ordering special bottles it's more cost effective to just throw a party and wash and sanitize the empties.
Final note, if you do split the batch remember to split the priming sugar as well. If only half are to be carbonated only use half the priming sugar.
I'm excited that I got it going now I just have to wait forever