Does Anybody Care
Hey guys and gals, check this out:
http://www.thinksecret.com/news/directsales.html
Methinks the days of independent Apple distributors are numbered. Apple CFO Fred Andersen says Apple wants "complete control" over all sales. Service to follow. Should we be concerned? Does the word monopoly make you as squeamish as it does me?
http://www.thinksecret.com/news/directsales.html
Methinks the days of independent Apple distributors are numbered. Apple CFO Fred Andersen says Apple wants "complete control" over all sales. Service to follow. Should we be concerned? Does the word monopoly make you as squeamish as it does me?
Comments
Basically, if the Apple sales force is being paid just to cut out the middle man then that is stupid, stupid, stupid. If they are expanding the market then it is all gravy. And I certainly wouldn't want them to stop trying to grow the market just because it might step on some resellers toes.
And while I've got my economists hat on, this is an example of co-opetition , something Apple seems to be getting quite good at lately.
Apple dosen't HAVE to lie, cheat, or steal from their resellers. It only interferes with expanding their market. Bad resellers go out of business all on their own. It is the good ones, the guys that have been around since the mid-80's, that are getting screwed now. Aside from that being a bad thing to do to the PEOPLE involved, it isn't good for business either.
What can we do about it? Make some noise around here at least. This isn't going to be like having no more corner drug store to go to because Walgreen's has taken over. Or, maybe it will be JUST like that. Homogony, sucking up to the party line, because there is NO other place to go if you want to use Apple computers. The new Power books are having problems. No so, according to Apple stores. Are the people posting on various websites lying about this phenomena? Well, I can find out from my independent Apple reseller and still get the truth from them. The tech guy happens to be honest about what hardware is problematic and what hardware rocks. The Apple store folks will get CANNED if they are.
I am the only one out there who cares about this?
During the great depression of '96-'98 most of these places either expanded into other computers, went out of business or moved into a dingy little plaza shop more suited to Mom's Custom Computers, and during the '98-'00 recovery most of them didn't change a thing. I recently went back to that Apple Store and, while there were a few macs around there were just as many Compaqs and HPs and bargain basement steel shelving holding everything up. The crimson carpet was stained and barely visible and there were no plants anywhere.
Bottom line: margins are razor thin, and individual proprietors for the most part aren't willing to invest the capital needed to turn a warehouse store into an Apple Store. I can see Apple's point. But in the end, yes it's a nasty thing to do and I would have hoped it was beneath Apple (but never really believed it).
About 2 days ago, Apple deleted a 137 post thread from their G5 discussion board. That thread had posts from their retail customers complaining that their at most 3 month old machines are being discontinued and replaced by an almost twice as powerfull G5 for almost the same price. Wether they had a right to be upset about what happened is up for debade, but Apple deleting that thread yells communist dictatorship to me.
"This might be of interest.
About 2 days ago, Apple deleted a 137 post thread from their G5 discussion board. That thread had posts from their retail customers complaining that their at most 3 month old machines are being discontinued and replaced by an almost twice as powerfull G5 for almost the same price. Wether they had a right to be upset about what happened is up for debade, but Apple deleting that thread yells communist dictatorship to me."
This is exactly the kind of thing we need to start putting together to see if Apple is starting to do unto us as they have been doing unto their resellers for YEARS. Thanks Lain. Anybody else have anything to add? Bring it on if you do!
About your view from reseller, I will give you an analogy... first time ever for me to come with cars
As to buying a BMW from a reseller, Mini Coopers are sold through BMW dealerships currently. The analogy? Mini Cooper is availing themselves of the client base, overhead, etc. of established retail outlets to sell their product. They also reimburse BMW to promote their product as well. Consumers want it--BMW sells it--and everyone is happy. Next, let's say Mini Cooper wants to sell direct. Do they go about it the way Apple has, by cutting into profit margins, setting ridiculously high quotas on add ons, like extended warranties and floor mats, thus making BMW dealers either stop selling Mini Coopers or doing a bare bones job whereas previously they were able to do a top notch one? I understand the thought process here. String 'em along until we can establish ourselves in the direct market, then cut 'em loose when WE say so. There is no consideration for what the anxillary costs are, however, such as customer dissatisfaction and dealer reputation, not to mention the economics involved to both effected parties.
There is a MUCH better way to have gone about this. Check earlier in this thread for the link to co-opetition, which the poster believes Apple does a good job of. Got to be kidding with that comment when the facts get revealed.
http://www.thinksecret.com/news/g5enclosure.html
http://www.thinksecret.com/news/netflixfanatic.html
Any comments would be appreciated.
Originally posted by meilleure ami
Question. Was the thread moved, as is done here, or deleted? Big difference there.
Where would it have been moved to? I don't think the support discussion pages contain a forum for Hardware value opinions and bitching.
Originally posted by meilleure ami
Question. Was the thread moved, as is done here, or deleted? Big difference there.
Like iBrowse say...
As to buying a BMW from a reseller, Mini Coopers are sold through BMW dealerships currently. The analogy? Mini Cooper is availing themselves of the client base, overhead, etc.
You didn't respond to my simple question.
Did YOU want to buy your Z4 from a BMW reseller ONLY or did you want to buy it from "SuperPromoPriceCar?" (who buy the way sell also Toyota, Chrysler, etc.) ?
Which one can have the better service and all the options ?
I think the first one.
Apple is all about image and like all star who care about his/her image, they want to control it from top to bottom.
As to image, did you check out these sites? If so, I'd be curious what your impressions are.
Originally posted by meilleure ami
Question. Was the thread moved, as is done here, or deleted? Big difference there.
As to buying a BMW from a reseller, Mini Coopers are sold through BMW dealerships currently.
BMW makes them. Why wouldn't they sell them?
As for Apple, it's true that they hasn't treated many resellers well for some years now. They've had parts replacement costs and policies that range from silly to extortionist for years now, and I can remember a huge flap over a contract that gave Apple access to VARs' customer lists as well.
As far as the thread on the Apple Discussion Boards goes (and FYI, they're quite famous for deleting critical and contentious threads there), look at it from Apple's side: They have a chance to beef up a flagging product in time for the holidays, offering their customers a much better value for their 2.5 grand, and... what's this? I could tell in the analyst meeting that Apple is getting frustrated with the lag and inertia involved in their retail channel, and this flap over the dual 1.8 is probably a symptom of that.
We're still only getting one side of the reseller story, though (which, I hasten to add, is better than only getting Apple's line - kudos to Think Secret and others for getting this news out). Still, given that Apple had a lot of resellers before they opened their first Apple Store, why did they bother? There's an old-line store in Northampton, MA called the Electronics Boutique. It's been there almost as long as I can remember. Last time I was there, they had an LCD iMac proudly looking out the window. Obviously, they've survived the various cullings that Apple has done, and they've probably done it by selling a lot of Macs and supporting them well. Mac users of all stripes pull out the "LOYAL" word almost immediately, but why would Apple be so focused on overhauling its retail strategy if retail was doing its job? Anderson's said that Apple wants control, but from what I can see from following this, it's because they feel that the point-of-sale is out of control, and there are resellers up in arms about how they can't continue to sell old equipment at full price. Well... yeah. It's not about the little guys, either. Sears and Best Buy were both kicked out unceremoniously after they screwed up, too.
So, is it a good thing if Apple gains total control of retail? Well, first of all, I don't think they will. Anderson also said they were looking at 8,000 retail locations for the iPod, and there will not be 8,000 Apple retail stores any time soon. So they're continuing to work with people. (Although, even there, wasn't there some flap where people stopped carrying iPods because of some ridiculous demand of Apple's?) That notwithstanding, there is the old truth that power corrupts, and so even as Apple becomes happier with a greatly increased control over retail, it will be more crucial for the Mac media to keep an eye on what they're doing. It's not inherently bad to have a monopoly. Monopolies are watched closely because the temptation to abuse monopoly power is significant, and that's when people get ripped off and antitrust law kicks in. Nevertheless, the more control Apple gets, the more closely it will have to be watched.
Originally posted by meilleure ami
I am the only one out there who cares about this?
Yes.
What I mostly see from your postings is a rant about something you have misunderstood. I also see a good amount of FUD thrown in just to make it look like it's actually an issue. The goal is to increase market share, if the Apple distributors aren't making this a reality, then Apple damn well better do something about it. Apple needs to get their feet planted into the corporate world, and that is what I see Apple doing. ABOUT TIME!
That's what I would do given that everything else is in place. We have a superior OS, great hardware, so what gives? Some would say it's price. I know from first hand business experience that price is NOT the issue. It almost never is unless the price is just plain outrageous. Apple's current prices are very reasonable no mater what some say around here.
Personally I would like to see my favorite computer platform kick some butt and take some rightful market share away from the other side. Now, I don't get how you blow this into "Would you rather just let Apple fly, with blind support, until something happens to YOU personally and, all of a sudden, you, too begin to care?"
Are we discussing a real issue or some reality only you see? Are you an Apple reseller that has been "mistreated" by Apple?
Originally posted by iPeon
We have a superior OS, great hardware, so what gives? Some would say it's price. I know from first hand business experience that price is NOT the issue. It almost never is unless the price is just plain outrageous. Apple's current prices are very reasonable no mater what some say around here.
In our local shopping centre there are 2 video game stores - one is part of the Electronic Boutiqe franchise and the other is just a one-off. Both look nice and appealing. But why is EB more crowded than a marketplace and the other store you could swing a baseball bat in and not hit anyone? I think familiarity. People know EB, they are comforable going there and the other store from the "outside" does not seem to be offering anything new so why bother chaging?
I've thought to myself what would I do if I were the owner of the fledging business? I would drop the prices by about 5 - 10% - put discount signs up in my display windows - and maybee hire some "attractive" people (though the idea sickens me) to go out and hand out panthlets to my potential mostly male customers - untill enough customers made a habbit of coming into my store.
I found this all out BY ACCIDENT while "googling" for a reseller in your neck of the woods, as a matter of fact. I came across articles regarding reseller lawsuits that were filed in February of this year. It piqued my interest. I had believed that Apple was, indeed, something different and that was one of the major reasons the platform enjoyed such a limited following. I had believed that Apple was more interested in R&D and creating a beautiful product than all the marketing ploys and strategies of the larger, corporate machines against which they were competing.
I, too, want to see Apple users increase in numbers only because Apple products are far superior, in my experience. The real reason, in my opinion, this is not the case is that most people have grown up using Wintel machines because , among other things, Apple corporate has kept a stranglehold on how its elegant machines have been marketed. Why, I don't know, but that is the history. Now, they are eliminating those elements that have made inroads, albeit small ones, into their communities over the past 20 or so years, to be replaced with their own stores. Why not work cooperatively, as Amorph suggests?
It is a bad business move to compete with this established channel rather than bring them onboard with their aggressive marketing strategy through the use of their own retail stores. It has always been Apple's exclusivity that has kept them that way--limited and exclusive.
If you are not aware of what lawsuits I am referring to, google for Apple reseller lawsuits.
Guess what? I couldn't care less. Apple needs to be more involved, not less, if they want the consumer's experience improved. They need to cut margins to increase marketshare. In the end, small Apple resellers are doomed, but it's inevitable, not because of the "big bad Apple".
Barto